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BTD Forums  /  The Encyclopedia/ D'Adamo Library  /  Setbacks are so frustrating, input welcomed!!!
Posted by: JJR, Thursday, January 9, 2014, 4:38pm
My guts have been doing very well.  I did a lot of work getting them in order.  From killing yeast, etc.  I've done probiotics of several different kinds over the years, manuke honey, candisol, candidase, oregomax, cultured veggies, etc etc.  

For a long time I was waking up in the morning without much white at all on my tongue.  

Well, 3 weeks ago I went into the hospital for a kidney stone.  It was rather large and got stuck. And I started to get a fever and they admitted me and were worried about infection. So they gave me antibiotics IV.  And then sent me home with a prescription for 6 more days.  I begged for a way to do it IV, but they said there wasn't one.  Although I had them give my first day at the hospital before I left.  So I had 3 days IV and 5 days oral.  Levaquin they called it.  I didn't want to NOT take it because of the infection, which I guess I did have because they took a culture.  I know there are other ways to deal with it.  But I had to go BACK for the procedure to take it out, and they wouldn't do the procedure if I had a fever still or an infection.  That's why they didn't take it out right away when I went in originally.  

So anyways...  At first it didn't do much but I was concerned.  Well, about 2-1/2 weeks after taking the antibiotics, my tongue is starting to be covered in white in the morning.  And I can brush a lot of it away but you can see it in the back of my tongue where I can't reach.  I don't feel any real physical affects.  My gut is still working, I'm still hungry and I'm still going to the bathroom.  But I can tell things are a little different with my BM's.  And I'm real concerned it might screw things up down the road. Or get worse.  

BUT, the big problem is when I take probiotics, I herx so bad it's hard on my system.  I have not had any probiotics in about 2-3 years and my guts were doing very well.  From all the work I did put in.  I don't eat sweets, except for a little bit of chocolate.  Or wheat.  Although through this whole kidney stone thing I did eat a few graham crackers at the hospital and I started eating a few things I don't normally.  Like applesauce.  Stuff that was easy because I was laid up some through the whole ordeal.  I was trying to eat stuff that was easy to prepare.  

I bought quaker plain instant oatmeal to make.  But that stuff has a bunch of extra stuff in it.  Even the plain stuff.  I ate it though.  But we did find some full circle plain oatmeal that is just "oats".  

Anyways....  My main question is I am interested in learning and being refreshed about how to fight yeast.  Now obviously I need probiotics and I think I'll order some from Dr. D.  But I might only be able to stand little bits at a time, so I'm trying to remember how to combat it with foods.

Now obviously cutting out sugar.  I might stop my chocolate intake for a while.  Which isn't a whole lot, but might make a difference.  I eat 1 teaspoon of honey a day with my grains, but I'm not sure I'm going to stop that.  Maybe.  But honey is so good for you in other ways.  And the only grains I eat are rice and oats.  I know some think oats can grow yeast but they are too good for me.  When I stopped eating them one time I got IBS so bad it was no fun.

For some reason thyme and oregano come to mind.  That I should start using them more.  I haven't for a while now.  After this I'm sort of at a loss.  I forget what things might be helpful.  

So, I'm all ears.  I might not do everything everyone tells me, but I'm trying to have a bag of tricks and I'm not remembering all of the ways to fight it.  

Thank you very much for listening!!!
Posted by: Chloe, Thursday, January 9, 2014, 4:42pm; Reply: 1
Sorry this happened to you JJR. :(  Antibiotics can do a lot of damage and create yeast overgrowth.

Here's the yeast fungus protocol
Posted by: ruthiegirl, Thursday, January 9, 2014, 4:48pm; Reply: 2
You've just had antibiotics to wipe out all the "good" bacteria along with the "bad" bacteria. Probiotics make you herx to the point where it might endanger you to take a huge amount, and you can't "just suffer through an unpleasant few days and get back on track." You can't afford to overwhelm other organs.

I wonder if you wouldn't do well with a small dose of an antifungal drug, just to "level the playing field" in your gut. Wipe out the excess yeast along with wiping out the excess bacteria, and then follow up with low doses of probiotics to repopulate things again, but without having to take enough probiotics to "drown out" the yeasts.

I normally wouldn't suggest strong anti-anything drugs, as they can be hard on the body, but in your specific case it might be the gentlest way to restore balance- and it's only being used to counter-balance the effects of a different anti-something drug.
Posted by: Jane, Thursday, January 9, 2014, 4:53pm; Reply: 3
How about fermented veggies?  I definitely would take Dr. D's probiotics.  Start with a smaller dose.  How about yogurt?

Hope you feel better soon.
Posted by: ABJoe, Thursday, January 9, 2014, 5:06pm; Reply: 4
I still maintain a rather low sweet/carb. diet due to constant detox which stimulates the candida growth.

Thyme, oregano and garlic are all good for helping keep candida down.  Some cinnamon in the oatmeal helps reduce the glycemic load, which may also help reduce the candida growth.

Lots of green vegetables and proteins with low sugar fruits and lower starch grains is what I always fall back to when the thrush gets out of hand.

I also blend the detox and Yeast protocols for best results.  I know my liver is my weak point, so I constantly feed it with red beets and liver, as well as Genoharmonic combinations for enhancing cellular detox.

Hope this helps...

Posted by: Chloe, Thursday, January 9, 2014, 5:35pm; Reply: 5
Quoted from Jane
How about fermented veggies?  I definitely would take Dr. D's probiotics.  Start with a smaller dose.  How about yogurt?

Hope you feel better soon.

Good suggestion, Jane :) I agree.  Sometimes getting what we need from natural foods is the best
way for our bodies to extract the most potent nutrients...  After I was on a heavy dose of abx, I found taking probiotics was causing me to herx to the point where I was getting worse.  Daily intake of cultured vegetables was a much better option. I fermented fresh garlic with ginger and grated carrots and ate some daily. A different batch contained beets, onion, garlic.  No herxing.

I understand this from the perspective of having had Lyme disease.  Our guts are fragile, our
bodies overly sensitive to shocking change....can't do too much cleansing at once.  The die off
of toxicity can become overwhelming pretty quickly.

Take it slowly...go as far as you can go and stop when you've had too much.  Rebuilding your
digestive tract after abx might take awhile......Just be careful to watch sugar intake. Those starving yeast beasties are sugar-holics!   I ate a slice of gluten free cake plus other foods
sweetened with sugar on Thanksgiving and it took me till the end of the year to get over that one meal.

Posted by: Dr. D, Thursday, January 9, 2014, 5:44pm; Reply: 6
Try to incorporate some green tea into you plan. More and more studies are indicating that the polyphenols help mitigate inflammation in the gut.
Posted by: Adam, Thursday, January 9, 2014, 7:08pm; Reply: 7
Quoted from ABJoe
Lots of green vegetables and proteins with low sugar fruits and lower starch grains is what I always fall back to when the thrush gets out of hand.

Sound advice here.  Currently what I'm doing due to the holidays.  Also making sure I'm getting plenty of soy protein, but I'm a Warrior.
Posted by: JJR, Thursday, January 9, 2014, 10:46pm; Reply: 8
I swear every time I've heard the word "green tea" or thought about it in the last few months it's like my mouth starts watering. (meaning I'm craving it) I have not drank tea in a long time and I really like that idea.  Thank you for the reminder Dr. D.  I feel very blessed to have your input.  

As far as the cultured veggies go, they do the same to me as taking a probiotic.  Herx.  Bad.  Having said that I know in the past that this "macarana" as I call it, has helped my gut.  Which is:

some form of probiotic in, herx, pain, stop probiotic, do all I can to clear with salads, water, rasbperries, time, rest and I'm better off.  And then start the process all over again.  I just wish there was an easier way.  At times it has felt like the detox was so harsh, it wasn't good for me.  Lots of inflammation.  I remember a few times ending up taking tylenol because I needed relief.  Which at that point probably screwed up some of the healing going on.  It's a delicate balance.  

Ruthie, although it might be a good idea, I highly doubt that is the route I would take.  I wouldn't even know how to get such a thing.  I don't think my Doctor would recommend it, and I'm not really sure I'd want to anyways.  I already had enough Rx with the kidney stone episode.  PH is probably too acidic as it is.  Haven't checked. But more than likely.  

Thank you Joe, I'll probably try and tweak some things to more along the lines of what you're saying.  

Adam, my detox system doesn't really like soy.  I don't usually feel all that horrible eating it, but my tests show I don't clear it very well and I don't really do soy any more.  

Chloe, thank you for understanding.  It helps when someone who has similar sensitivities chimes in.  

Great input everyone.  I'm so thankful for the help!!  I'd love to hear any other thoughts out there.  
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