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BTD Forums  /  Eat Right 4 Your Type  /  Paleo diet for Os?
Posted by: tolondontoparis, Sunday, July 29, 2012, 10:59pm
All this talk about lectins and leaky-gut, and how grains aren't meant for human consumption, makes me wonder if even the BTD should be more extreme. I mean corn can be eaten by some and not all, but it's probably not even good, even if it doesn't bind like gluten, but it still punches holes, just like all other grains. I really don't think we should eat them at all.


http://paleoparents.com/featured/how-do-grains-legumes-and-dairy-cause-a-leaky-gut-part-1-lectins/
Posted by: ruthiegirl, Sunday, July 29, 2012, 11:08pm; Reply: 1
The WRONG grains and legumes can lead to leaky gut. The right ones provide certain nutrients we need for long-term health and can't get from just meats and veggies.

In the short term, many people do well on grain-free diets. In some situations, people need to be grain-free for years before the gut heals enough to tolerate them again. But, in the long term, the goal is to be able to have small portions of grains in the  diet.

I don't think you need to restrict your diet more than absolutely necessary on campus. Rice cakes and cooked rice can be part of your healthy diet.
Posted by: Lola, Sunday, July 29, 2012, 11:32pm; Reply: 2
I cherish the beneficial grains swami designed for me.....no way will I keep away from them

Ofcourse all forms of wheat as well as Corn and many others are outright toxins, even deep blue highly inflammatory......so those definitely do not make it into my life ;D
Posted by: tolondontoparis, Monday, July 30, 2012, 12:32am; Reply: 3
I just don't know what to do anymore. My skin is clearer, but my cheeks just started to break out, and I'm not sure if eating non-organic meat is what has been doing this?  I started to crave red meat, and bought some from Walmart...which can never be good, and if it has antibiotics and hormones, then that is killing my gut flora and hurting my intestines. I just don't know what is safe and what isn't! And an elimination diet doesn't work, cause my body doesn't get any sort of pain inside or out, I just have skin problems which signal something internal. I mean when I was little I ate candy and processed foods and had baby perfect skin. I want that back, but want to be healthy too!I eliminated dairy and gluten, and corn, and have been fallowing BTD, but it's still not tip top, and pimples are still forming. I just will never know if i'm detoxing, healing, or just being damaged because if it is leaky gut, more and more food will cause reactions, even beneficial ones. EVEN eggs scare me. I f things are fed gluten, won;t that hurt us?
Posted by: ABJoe, Monday, July 30, 2012, 1:10am; Reply: 4
Quoted from tolondontoparis
I eliminated dairy and gluten, and corn, and have been fallowing BTD, but it's still not tip top, and pimples are still forming. I just will never know if i'm detoxing, healing, or just being damaged because if it is leaky gut, more and more food will cause reactions, even beneficial ones. EVEN eggs scare me. I f things are fed gluten, won;t that hurt us?

I know you're young, so probably don't have tremendous amounts of stored garbage in the body, but I don't know that you can expect to be "clean" in 3 months.  Each time you get mostly beneficial diet and the body does detox, you are subject to additional breakout symptoms.

Gluten in an animals diet will probably bother you when eating the meat.  I doubt there will be gluten pass into milk, but I do know that different foods can change the taste of milk.  I'm definitely not worried about eggs having "gluten-contamination".
Posted by: tolondontoparis, Monday, July 30, 2012, 1:15am; Reply: 5
Quoted from ABJoe

I know you're young, so probably don't have tremendous amounts of stored garbage in the body, but I don't know that you can expect to be "clean" in 3 months.  Each time you get mostly beneficial diet and the body does detox, you are subject to additional breakout symptoms.

Gluten in an animals diet will probably bother you when eating the meat.  I doubt there will be gluten pass into milk, but I do know that different foods can change the taste of milk.  I'm definitely not worried about eggs having "gluten-contamination".


Yes, but if chickens are eating gluten, then the eggs will be composed or contaminated with them I feel. I am going to have to avoid beef for a while, even-though it is benefical. I don't think antibiotics and gluten can get into the bone marrow, so I will just live off of bone broth and chickennnnn. I can't risk hurting my gut flora or intestines. I need a lot less protein if I have leaky gut. A Master cleans of agave and lemon for a few weeks, and then carrot juice and kombucha. No more grains, even rice may be bad.
Posted by: ABJoe, Monday, July 30, 2012, 1:21am; Reply: 6
Quoted from tolondontoparis
All this talk about lectins and leaky-gut, and how grains aren't meant for human consumption, makes me wonder if even the BTD should be more extreme.
This is one-size-fits-all information is just what we guard against once we know about BTD...  For those that the lectin or gluten doesn't bother, it isn't a problem.

Posted by: grey rabbit, Monday, July 30, 2012, 1:23am; Reply: 7
Quoted from tolondontoparis


Yes, but if chickens are eating gluten, then the eggs will be composed or contaminated with them I feel.


It doesn't work that way! Gluten is a protein and is broken down in the digestive process of the animal, all meats that are not processed will be gluten free. Lunch meats and other processed foods might have added gluten, but the meat itself will not have gluten in it.

You are right, WalMart is a poor choice for buying meat. Save your pennies and buy something of better quality.

AND, stop fretting so much, you are a beautiful young women, enjoy that!
Posted by: ABJoe, Monday, July 30, 2012, 1:24am; Reply: 8
Quoted from tolondontoparis
Yes, but if chickens are eating gluten, then the eggs will be composed or contaminated with them I feel.

Chickens digest the grains into the nutrients necessary to make eggs...  This doesn't mean that there is gluten in the egg.
Posted by: tolondontoparis, Monday, July 30, 2012, 1:55am; Reply: 9
You are all so knowledgeable and lovely! Thank You so much!
Posted by: Possum, Monday, July 30, 2012, 2:00am; Reply: 10
Quoted from ABJoe
Chickens digest the grains into the nutrients necessary to make eggs...  This doesn't mean that there is gluten in the egg.
If that is the case, I wonder why the sales rep for a farmed fish company says they cannot now label their fish a gluten free product?
Chickens (& animals) are also fed soy too... which is mostly gmo crops these days and this can cause problems on both counts?!



Posted by: ruthiegirl, Monday, July 30, 2012, 3:07am; Reply: 11
It might be different with fish, as they're swimming around in the water where their food is placed. Land animals have to digest foods before any of the proteins from their diet make it into the animal's (or bird's) muscles, milk, or eggs.

I suppose it's possible for a farm animal to have leaky gut, and for some gluten from its diet to make its way into meat or eggs, but that doesn't seem particularly likely and it's not something I'd worry too much about.

Quoted Text
A Master cleans of agave and lemon for a few weeks, and then carrot juice and kombucha. No more grains, even rice may be bad.
Your body needs nutrition for healing. What exactly is this "master cleanse"- is it JUST lemon and agave, no food, for weeks, or are you having one cup of this "cleansing drink" per day plus normal food? A liquid-only diet is NOT good long-term for an O (unless that O is an infant and the liquid is human milk.)

Any "cleanse" may pull more junk out of your body to be detoxed through your skin. What you need to focus on, especially once classes start, is good, wholesome, nourishing foods. Ample amounts of meat and veggies, modest amounts of fruit, nuts, and whole grains (brown rice and quinoa.) A grain-free diet may be OK for a semester, but it shouldn't be your long-term dietary strategy.
Posted by: tolondontoparis, Monday, July 30, 2012, 1:00pm; Reply: 12
Quoted from ruthiegirl
It might be different with fish, as they're swimming around in the water where their food is placed. Land animals have to digest foods before any of the proteins from their diet make it into the animal's (or bird's) muscles, milk, or eggs.

I suppose it's possible for a farm animal to have leaky gut, and for some gluten from its diet to make its way into meat or eggs, but that doesn't seem particularly likely and it's not something I'd worry too much about.

Your body needs nutrition for healing. What exactly is this "master cleanse"- is it JUST lemon and agave, no food, for weeks, or are you having one cup of this "cleansing drink" per day plus normal food? A liquid-only diet is NOT good long-term for an O (unless that O is an infant and the liquid is human milk.)

Any "cleanse" may pull more junk out of your body to be detoxed through your skin. What you need to focus on, especially once classes start, is good, wholesome, nourishing foods. Ample amounts of meat and veggies, modest amounts of fruit, nuts, and whole grains (brown rice and quinoa.) A grain-free diet may be OK for a semester, but it shouldn't be your long-term dietary strategy.


I like your plan more!! I have made liquid soups, onion broccoli, and spinach onion, and have been taking zinc, fish oil, and L-glut-amine pills. I have only Walmart Beef, so I will stay away from that. I just don't fully understand Leaky gut in the terms of healing and eating food at the same time, because I just feel as if everything will leak into our bodies and cause immune responses, except water, because well, your body is built on water and can't have an immune response to it. I mean, are there foods it's impossible for our body to have intolerance to or that can't leak into our blood stream? If there are these never healing holes, then even good foods will just keep leaking and cause a vicious cycle.
Posted by: Easy E, Monday, July 30, 2012, 1:19pm; Reply: 13
Exercise makes a huge difference too!
Posted by: tolondontoparis, Monday, July 30, 2012, 1:22pm; Reply: 14
Quoted from Easy E
Exercise makes a huge difference too!


I'm very active! I'm a Division 1 Track Athlete
Posted by: 14442 (Guest), Monday, July 30, 2012, 3:23pm; Reply: 15
I haven't eaten grains in about 6 weeks; do not miss & will probably not eat in any appreciable amount the rest of my life.  No, the goal is not to eat rice.  It doesn't contain that much nutrition & isn't good for you.
Posted by: ruthiegirl, Monday, July 30, 2012, 3:38pm; Reply: 16
When you have a leaky  gut, not EVERYTHING leaks through; only some things. Some of what you eat is still digested normally, and not all the things that "leak through" cause significant damage.

If Walmart beef is the only beef you have access to, then listen carefully to your body. You may desperately need some red meat, even if it's inferior quality. If you're feeling weak or run down, you may need the beef, even though it's not the best kind of beef to get. If you find you do poorly on it, then stick with the animal proteins you tolerate better. There's no particular reason to think that conventional chicken is "safer" than conventional beef; both are fed corn and soy and are likely to have unhealthy fat profiles.

If you're able to do your own cooking, then quinoa is a good choice if you do want to include some grains in your diet. Up until you mentioned "Walmart beef" I wasn't sure if you were eating on campus or doing your own cooking.
Posted by: tolondontoparis, Monday, July 30, 2012, 4:39pm; Reply: 17
Quoted from ruthiegirl
When you have a leaky  gut, not EVERYTHING leaks through; only some things. Some of what you eat is still digested normally, and not all the things that "leak through" cause significant damage.

If Walmart beef is the only beef you have access to, then listen carefully to your body. You may desperately need some red meat, even if it's inferior quality. If you're feeling weak or run down, you may need the beef, even though it's not the best kind of beef to get. If you find you do poorly on it, then stick with the animal proteins you tolerate better. There's no particular reason to think that conventional chicken is "safer" than conventional beef; both are fed corn and soy and are likely to have unhealthy fat profiles.

If you're able to do your own cooking, then quinoa is a good choice if you do want to include some grains in your diet. Up until you mentioned "Walmart beef" I wasn't sure if you were eating on campus or doing your own cooking.


I go back to University on the 24th of August, and won't be able to cook or go to the store much if at all. I've healed the most these past few months and year with the knowledge I have gained and I'm not wishing for a magic cure, but I would like to stay on the right track to healing. People going on raw foods and vegan diets that are Os are only hurting them-selves, this is the ONLY diet with proven science that makes sense, but the world is against us, cause the majority is sick.
Posted by: Susana, Tuesday, July 31, 2012, 6:08pm; Reply: 18
When I was on the BTD grains were a big issue for me. Made me question the BTD big time. I was eating mostly spelt & rye.

When The GTD came out, I immediately realized the problem. It was the gluten grains that were harming me. In my Swami they are outright avoid (not even a black dot).

I feel wonderful with brown rice, and especially quinoa.

Best of luck.

:K)
Posted by: mpolyglottos, Tuesday, July 31, 2012, 6:48pm; Reply: 19
wow, a track athlete and 19 years old. u have a bright and healthy future ahead of you.
do you know you GENOTYPE? If you are a HUNTER, then paleo is a great option for you. Not everything lines up with Dadamo's research (eg, coconut oil), but Paleo and Genotype Hunter (especially non-secretor) diets are very similar.
There's a good reason that the Crossfit community is paleo--they exercise like maniacs. as a college athlete, there HAS to be a growing anti-grain movement going on. i don't care how "young" college athletes are, they usually have the best discipline when it comes to diet.
read the "type 0's do you eat grains?" post on this site. it runs for several years, and every Hunter says they don't eat grains, and none of them really feel deprived.
just my take on things. my life would be more simple if i didn't need grains, but as a type 0 Explorer, i need rice and the ancients stuff daily. sort of inconvenient if you ask me (which you didn't : )
Posted by: mpolyglottos, Tuesday, July 31, 2012, 6:51pm; Reply: 20
"Non Secretors: Do you eat grains?
sorry it's a question for nonnies, not 0's
and it runs 6 years. i've read all of them. quite illuminating.
Posted by: Easy E, Wednesday, August 1, 2012, 12:11am; Reply: 21
Quoted from tolondontoparis


I'm very active! I'm a Division 1 Track Athlete


:) you shut me down!  That is awesome, keep at it!
Good luck finding out what works and what doesn't, it can take some time.  
Posted by: Susana, Wednesday, August 1, 2012, 10:52am; Reply: 22
This is what Dr. D said about grins and Hunters on a thread re: Paleo diet

http://www.dadamo.com/cgi-bin/Blah/Blah.pl?m-1228587567/s-43/#num43

"Grain and legumes are about the only sources of phytates, which are anti-oxidant mineral chelators. There are pros and cons to phytates (some people would argue that they block mineral absorption) but they do have fairly potent anti-cancer effects in the colon, which in the case of GT1 Hunters is a bit of an Achilles heal. Obviously we don't know much about paleolithic people dying of colon cancer, since this would not leave much of a fossil record.

The fossil record does shows weaker skeletal structure with the adoption of early Neolithic subsistence agriculture, but this is really more the starvation resulting from the exhaustion of the large game animals than any real agriculture, unless one is willing to call acorns and vetch an 'agrarian diet'. "

Best wishes,
:K)
Posted by: Easy E, Wednesday, August 1, 2012, 12:35pm; Reply: 23
The paleo diet is not recommended for endurance athletes (not in any way trying to tell you to eat any way, since it sounds like you are a top notch athlete).  Carbohydrates fuel muscle tissue with longer lasting energy.  Most endurance athletes use carbohydrates esp for long events.  I'm pretty sure those kenyan runners eat carbs and grains and fruits before their runs!

Grains are not the problem, but processed altered ones are, just as the case with meats and other foods containing hormones and antibiotics, fruits and veggies with pesticides and genetically altered, fish with pollutants.

I think that is part of the reasoning for how certain grains are allowed for every genotype.  The key is to use ones that are recommended for your type, and from what i understand, it can take awhile heal.

  
Posted by: tolondontoparis, Wednesday, August 1, 2012, 2:11pm; Reply: 24
HA! Thanks for all the support you guys! The only grain I have eaten for months is riceeee, rice cakes, rice flour pancakes! When I wake up in the morning I sort of crave carbs, but as the day goes on I want meat and veggies. Carrot juice has been a yum yum for me lately!!! I drink more than 10 cups of water a day, and can't sustain running without meat and veggies! The only thing I eat that I feel sort of guilty about are those pancakes (which to anyone else, wouldn't even be that bad!). They have eggs, agave, pure cocoa powder and rice flour. I'm still not sure if the rice and eggs are hindering my body healing, but I don't want to worry about it. I'm hoping for healing!
Posted by: ruthiegirl, Wednesday, August 1, 2012, 2:45pm; Reply: 25
Try not to get too caught up in "what if this is hindering my healing?" You can drive yourself crazy thinking like that. Perhaps the rice and agave are fueling your healing, and without them you'd be healing even more slowly than you are.

I personally don't do well on carbs in the morning, as it just leads to more carb cravings later in the day. I do best having my carbs in the late afternoon or evening. But since this is working for you- having your daily carbs in the morning and then none later in the day- keep on doing what's working.

I don't know what kind of cooking facilities you're going to have on campus, but if you're able to have a  toaster oven, you can bake muffins with similar ingredients as the pancakes- maybe even use the exact same batter. I did that the year I had an off-campus studio apartment. I bought a muffin tin that fit into the toaster oven, and I could bake 6 muffins at a time. I baked daily and used the muffins, snacks between meals, etc.

If you're not allowed a toaster oven in your dorm room (I wasn't) then you'll have to find some ready-made foods to provide your daily grain portion. You may do best having a rice side dish at lunchtime, since breakfast carbs are usually wheat and potatoes.
Posted by: tolondontoparis, Thursday, August 2, 2012, 12:17am; Reply: 26
I'm getting a Yo-nana machine tomorrow! Fruit ice-cream I can make in my dorm yay!!
Posted by: marjorie, Saturday, August 4, 2012, 3:17am; Reply: 27
I have been grain free for a long time and feel fine. Sometimes, I will have an occasional rice cake or a serving of quinoa, but in general, I can't imagine making grains a part of my lifestyle daily.

Maybe someday, but I am in no hurry:)
Posted by: SquarePeg, Saturday, August 4, 2012, 11:18pm; Reply: 28
Rice and agave nectar are actually "superfoods" on my customized "SWAMI" diet.  So if that works for you, stick with it!  And good luck!
Posted by: Tom Martens, Sunday, August 5, 2012, 2:08pm; Reply: 29
Quoted from tolondontoparis
HA! Thanks for all the support you guys! The only grain I have eaten for months is riceeee, rice cakes, rice flour pancakes! When I wake up in the morning I sort of crave carbs,


The "carb" craving just might be the Tyrosine found in rice and other carbs.  Red meat is loaded with Tyrosine.  Being that you are an O, small amounts of protein in the morning just might be the trick to satisfy those cravings an be much better for you.
Posted by: tolondontoparis, Monday, August 6, 2012, 3:19am; Reply: 30
I'm sort of paranoid about intestinal health. I just ate some coconut and feel great, but it's supposed to be an avoid, but I've eaten it my whole life (from Trinidad). Anyways, rice, peanuts, grains, all have anti-nutrients and supposedly upset our mucosial linings. But I wonder if that is because we have upset our intestinal balances at first. I mean I understand gluten being evil, because no one would just eat wheat wild unless it was highly processed, but corn is grown to eat, beans, coconuts. I mean certain plants create these antinutrients so that they do make us sick, but we have adapted to certain extents. And our bacteria flora keep us mucoused up, and help to break down the antinutrients
Posted by: Lola, Monday, August 6, 2012, 4:38am; Reply: 31
give the guidelines a chance to heal your gut

take it one day at a time

make sure you decide which route you wish to follow.....I highly recommend this ER-GT route not paleo, but the choice is utterly yours
Posted by: tolondontoparis, Monday, August 6, 2012, 5:04am; Reply: 32
Quoted from Lola
give the guidelines a chance to heal your gut

take it one day at a time

make sure you decide which route you wish to follow.....I highly recommend this ER-GT route not paleo, but the choice is utterly yours


I wish I could afford a swami!! But I can't and I don't have a doctor that could do it for me right now. It's hard to fallow your body, but I am finally mastering it. I understand that gluten and such are really bad, but I am not a diagnosed celiac and did enjoy eating bread until I got such skin disorders. I miss ketchup and piggg too, but I would rather be healthierrr
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