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BTD Forums  /  Live Right 4 Your Type  /  Thyroid T4 / T3 - combovs  synthetic vs animal
Posted by: SandrAruba, Tuesday, December 6, 2011, 1:21am
Tomorrow I am going to visit my doctor.

While I am eating as right as I can, I am still too tired, too much and too fast. I want to exercise more but when I exercise I need 3 days to recuperate (while I feel great right after the exercise). I don't sleep too well, but even if I do, I am tired. My brain is clear, but every now and then I feel like I really need to go to bed (in the middle of the day). I am following my Swami almost to the letter, eating less fruit (because I was eating too much) and I am trying to up the veggies. But lots of times I don't really feel like eating. But I do anyway. So I am (if I say so myself) doing well on the food front.

Now it is almost time to get my new recipe for my thyrax (thyroid medication) and I was thinking asking my doctor to change my medication. I've been reading up on thyroid medication and I only take T4. Seems that your body produces the T3. However on the websites I've been reading it says even when taking T4 a lot of people still feel tired and that taking T3 separately really helps.

Then of course I have the choice of a duo tablet (T3 and T4) or taking T3 separately with the T4 I am already taking. And of course there is the choice between synthetic (novothyral is a combo) and animal hormone like Armour (also combo of T3 and T4).

Anyone have any wisdom on the subject? Any personal experiences? I would really like to know. Gutwise I am leaning toward the animal hormone variant. Somehow it makes more sense to me to take something that is as close to what your own body would produce as possible. Any wisdom on how to change from one to the other would be appreciated as well.

I just hope my doctor is willing to cooperate.
Posted by: Jane, Tuesday, December 6, 2011, 2:31am; Reply: 1
It's complicated and different for everyone.  It's really a process of finding out what works for you.   I take T4 plus a compounded T3 capsule.  I have my numbers checked every 6 months or so.  in fact, I've having them checked tomorrow.  My doctor (Dr. Kenneth Blanchard) is an endocrinologist and has a Ph'd in chemistry.  He's written one book on thyroid and has another one coming out in January I think.  My situation may be different because my thyroid was removed (near total thyroidectomy) in 1996.  I also had a parathyroidectomy.  I've been trying out a new T4 (tyrosint) but it's hard to know how I feel about it since I've been congested for weeks (don't think it's related but who knows).  

New Hampshire Girl (on this board) takes Westhroid, which I believe is a synthetic version of Armour.That's another option.
Posted by: SandrAruba, Tuesday, December 6, 2011, 12:41pm; Reply: 2
Thanks Jane. I had half of my thyroid removed and they said the other half was badly infected probably due to an autoimmune disease and in a couple of years I would no longer have that half as well. It's never been checked if that half is still there. I think my doctor will have my blood checked again as well, but I really hate going through that whole process. I feel that they look at numbers and as long as all is within their stupid ranges all is well, not considering how I may feel. "your numbers are acceptable" "but I don't feel well" "your number are acceptable" "but I don't feel well".... etc.
Posted by: Kim, Tuesday, December 6, 2011, 2:34pm; Reply: 3
I did much better on the natural thyroid drugs vs the synthetics.  I take
Nature Throid which is porcine based, but I also take generic cytomel twice a day too.  

I have lyme disease, so I am more of a challenge to fix the thyroid, but adding the cytomel to the Nature Throid is slowly bringing up my Free T3, Free T4 numbers.  I have been below the lowest lab values on both T3/T4 and after 6 months of adding the Cytomel to the Nature Throid, the numbers are slowly rising.
Posted by: Lloyd, Tuesday, December 6, 2011, 2:53pm; Reply: 4
I went from synthroid to Armour and immediately felt a difference. Overall profile of the thyroid labs improved as well.
Posted by: SandrAruba, Tuesday, December 6, 2011, 7:16pm; Reply: 5
Doc said he wanted bloodwork first, to make sure it's not something else. Sensible and he is willing to listen to the idea that perhaps a new hormone (or adding T3) may work. So that's good. I'll go for the bloodwork tomorrow morning and then I'll have the results friday. We can take it from there.

Also called some pharmacists but none of them carry Armour or a combi (T3+T4) synthetic hormone. They do have T3.
Posted by: Jane, Tuesday, December 6, 2011, 7:22pm; Reply: 6
I take them separately so it's possible.
Posted by: Jane, Tuesday, December 6, 2011, 7:23pm; Reply: 7
Should have added that getting the right % of T3 vs T4 is sometimes the tricky part.
Posted by: mpca66, Wednesday, December 7, 2011, 12:01am; Reply: 8
I feel the same .. so tired .. my thyroid was eliminated due to graves disease and I'm on synthroid .. but not sure if it's working correctly as I am .. so .. tired.  Could also be low estrogen as well .. as I'm 'at that age'.

I read an article on three reasons why your thryoid meds don't work and one depends on medication (of course) and the other is tied to inflamation which is why I'm trying to get back on the ERFYT band wagon.  Here's the article:  http://chriskresser.com/three-reasons-why-your-thyroid-medication-isnt-working

I am one of those types that doesn't convert well .. so I think I'll be checking out Armour after my next blood test .. and hopefully a cleaner, type O diet will be helpful as well.

M.
Posted by: SandrAruba, Wednesday, December 7, 2011, 1:33pm; Reply: 9
Quoted from mpca66
I feel the same .. so tired .. my thyroid was eliminated due to graves disease and I'm on synthroid .. but not sure if it's working correctly as I am .. so .. tired.  Could also be low estrogen as well .. as I'm 'at that age'.

I read an article on three reasons why your thryoid meds don't work and one depends on medication (of course) and the other is tied to inflamation which is why I'm trying to get back on the ERFYT band wagon.  Here's the article:  http://chriskresser.com/three-reasons-why-your-thyroid-medication-isnt-working

I am one of those types that doesn't convert well .. so I think I'll be checking out Armour after my next blood test .. and hopefully a cleaner, type O diet will be helpful as well.

M.


Hi M. My doctor gave orders to test for a lot of things, kidney & liver function, of course the usual Cholesterol, tryglicerides, T4 and also for inflammation. I am hoping they won't find anything wrong. I've been so very compliant this last year, that I would be amazed if anything was out of the ordinary, but of course inflammation is a possibility.  

When they took out my thyroid, they did say the other half was inflamed, so perhaps that is still going on. I'll know friday.
Posted by: SandrAruba, Wednesday, December 7, 2011, 1:36pm; Reply: 10
Quoted from Jane
Should have added that getting the right % of T3 vs T4 is sometimes the tricky part.


Jane, I already read about that. It's a matter of trying what suits me best. I'm prepared for that.

Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, December 7, 2011, 3:13pm; Reply: 11
I only use l'tyrosine 4x daily 500mgs'...can't stand any medication but I feel great with it  :D
Posted by: Jane, Wednesday, December 7, 2011, 3:54pm; Reply: 12
Isa,
I don't have any thyroid.  What would l tyrosine do in that situation?
Jane
Posted by: angel, Wednesday, December 7, 2011, 7:06pm; Reply: 13
I am on 50 mcg c-t4 compounded and then 2 months ago my new endocrinologist put me on 5 mcg c-t3 compunded It ake both in the morning considering asking him to split the dose to and twice a day. But I also take 1000 mcg b-12 pellet and currently 10,000 iu vit d for the winter then I will transition with alternating 5,000 iu vit d until summer and extended time in the sun. I told the doctor what I was doing and he had no complaints.

My energy has come up even under the amount of stress I am under currently-deployed husband, wayward son, moving/selling and buying a new home, Starting our farm, etc
It is nice and feels good, but when I am sick I am still down. a big bummer.
Posted by: SandrAruba, Saturday, December 10, 2011, 12:50am; Reply: 14
Quoted from angel
I am on 50 mcg c-t4 compounded and then 2 months ago my new endocrinologist put me on 5 mcg c-t3 compunded It ake both in the morning considering asking him to split the dose to and twice a day. But I also take 1000 mcg b-12 pellet and currently 10,000 iu vit d for the winter then I will transition with alternating 5,000 iu vit d until summer and extended time in the sun. I told the doctor what I was doing and he had no complaints.

My energy has come up even under the amount of stress I am under currently-deployed husband, wayward son, moving/selling and buying a new home, Starting our farm, etc
It is nice and feels good, but when I am sick I am still down. a big bummer.


Angel, from what I've been reading on thryroid hormones protocols is if you take both T4 and T3 a 10 : 1 ratio is a good starting point, then go from there and tweak until you feel good. So your 50 mcg T4 with 5 mcg T3 sounds good. But there's nothing so personal as thyroid hormones. If you feel that you still do not have enough energy you can consider taking the T3 in two doses. Or perhaps up your dose of T3 just a little more.  


I take 200 mcg T4, so I should be taking 20 T3. I have to see what my results are Monday then I can check with my doctor to see how he wants to proceed.
Posted by: Ribbit, Sunday, December 11, 2011, 2:44pm; Reply: 15
I've never taken anything synthetic for my thyroid.  I have taken a variety of natural supplements from the health food store. I've tried just plain L-Tyrosine and couldn't tell much of a difference, but combined with adrenal supplements it seemed to be better. I really liked L-Tyrosine complex.  Porcine-derived if memory serves.  The best thyroid supplement I ever took was made by Standard Process.  It's bovine.  And it makes you feel GOOOOOOD.  I took it for a year or so a while back (maybe 5 years ago?) and loved it, but it got to be very expensive AND I didn't like the idea of being a type A and ingesting beef anything.  So I quit.  And haven't been quite right since.  I'm taking homeopathic stuff now for my glands and it's okay, but it's not as good as Standard Process in my opinion.
Posted by: Jane, Monday, December 12, 2011, 2:08am; Reply: 16
Ribbit,
Both SandrAruba and I have had thyroid surgery.  I don't have any thyroid (maybe a few cells) and she only has half so I'm not sure that just supplements would work.
I was first diagnosed with thyroid problems when I was a freshman in college and I've been taking thyroid pills since then (early 1960s)  I had a cousin that died from a thyroid cancer that went to her brain and after that I changed thyroid docs and later discovered that I had a small thyroid cancer too.  It's most likely because I had my tonsils irradiated as a baby for recurring tonsilitis.   Lots of kids that had that done to them in the 1940s ended up with thryoid cancer 30-40 years later.  
The dose I take is "suppressive" to prevent any remaining cells from becoming cancerous. When I 'm tested it shows up as "hyperthyroid"  because of the suppressive high dose.  Getting the right amount so that I actuallly feel good is a process.  I can definitely identify with SandrAruba's frustration.
Jane
Posted by: Ribbit, Saturday, December 17, 2011, 12:57am; Reply: 17
Oh.  Wow.  Hm.
Posted by: j232, Tuesday, December 27, 2011, 12:04am; Reply: 18
check this out

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/
Posted by: NewHampshireGirl, Tuesday, December 27, 2011, 1:33am; Reply: 19
I follow "Stop the Thyroid Madness" newsletters and I also follow Mary Shoman's blogs just to keep current with the latest news about thyroid.

Just to set the record straight, the Westhroid I take is porcine based just as Armour.  It is not synthetic.  It always made sense to me to take the thyroid replacement medicine that is as natural to human thyroid as possible.  Westhroid, Naturethroid and Armour do have T1, T2, T3 and T4.  I did not do well on Synthroid which is synthetic and provides only T4 and hopes your body will provide the T3 it needs.

It is very important to connect with a doctor who will work with you.
Posted by: j232, Tuesday, December 27, 2011, 3:37am; Reply: 20
Quoted from NewHampshireGirl
It is very important to connect with a doctor who will work with you.



...and also very difficult.
Posted by: SandrAruba, Wednesday, December 28, 2011, 1:26am; Reply: 21
Well as expected all my results are within range, but I told my doctor I still want to try taking T3 together with my T4 (armour or something like that is not available on the island). And he's willing to cooperate. Obviously I know more about thyroid problems then he does. So I got a prescription, now to the pharmacy and hopefully they will have it soon.

Nice thread btw.
Posted by: NewHampshireGirl, Thursday, December 29, 2011, 12:41am; Reply: 22
Quoted from SandrAruba
Well as expected all my results are within range, but I told my doctor I still want to try taking T3 together with my T4 (armour or something like that is not available on the island). And he's willing to cooperate. Obviously I know more about thyroid problems then he does. So I got a prescription, now to the pharmacy and hopefully they will have it soon.

Nice thread btw.


After a month or two on your desiccated thyroid supplement, let us know how you are doing.  I'm certainly interested.(sunny)
Posted by: Jane, Thursday, December 29, 2011, 5:05pm; Reply: 23
Me too!
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