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BTD Forums  /  Live Right 4 Your Type  /  Portion size and frequencies for a B?
Posted by: ruthiegirl, Friday, January 14, 2011, 3:12pm
When I first started my kids on BTD (after I'd been on it myself for a while) I only worried about "feeding beneficials and taking out the avoids" and didn't pay much, if any, attention to the recomended portion sizes and frequencies. I don't think I even looked at the portion recomendations for Bs until last night.

But my son has been getting sick a lot, and I'm now taking a closer look at his diet. He's been eating a whole lot of dairy and grains lately, and not much of anything else. So I'm looking at the portion recomendations for Bs in the Live Right book. I'm looking for general guidelines as to the proportions of his meals, not strict limits- so it doesn't much matter if I aim for the secretor or non-secretor portions.

I don't know his secretor status but I do know he's Caucasian, and Andrea now has me wondering if he's a nonnie (based on his red hair and how awfully he responds to sugar.)

Meats and poultry: 2-5oz,2-6  (sec) or 4-7 (nonnie) servings per week- so about once per day.
Fish:2-5oz, 3(4)-5 servings per week- once per weekday?
Eggs 3-4 or 5-6 per week- he doesn't do well on eggs when eaten alone (they cause headaches) so we may just skip these and increase cheese in its place.
milk and yogurt 2-5oz  :o 2-4 times per week. (He's been drinking a gallon or more per week- looks like it should be less than a quart- I think we'll go with 1 cup a day for now.)
cheese 2oz. 3-5 (sec) pr 1-4(nonnie) times per week. That's not even every day! Even if we sub extra cheese for the egg servings, that's still only once per day, and a much smaller portion than he's used to!
beans and legumes 1 cup, dry, 5-7 or 3-5 times a week.

Here's where I get really confused. First of all, it gives a serving as 1 cup of beans for everybody, not a larger portion size for men and a smaller one  (with a range) for women and children. Secondly, 1 cup of dry beans is equivilent to about 3-4 cups of cooked beans! That's a LOT of beans! then it has the line (page 260) "Type B non-secretors should try to get most of their protein from the primary sources, such as fish and dairy." Um, how is dairy a "primary source" when you only get 1 serving of it per day, yet you get a quart of cooked beans as a "secondary" source?

nuts and seeds:
a handful, or 1-2 tbsp, 4-7 times per week. So a tablespoon or a child-sized handful every day or every other day, or a bigger portion a couple times a week.

Grains and starches: 1 cup dry , 5-9 or 3-5 times a week. I have the same confusion I had wth beans: 1 cup of dry grains is equivilent to 4 servings most other places. So 9 cups of grains comes to 5 "normal portions" a day: does that apply to a 250 lb man or a 75 lb 9yo  boy? 5 cups a day would be about 3 servings per day.

Vegetables:  (1 cup, cooked or raw) Beneficials are unlimited and neutrals are limited to 2-5 or 2-3 servings per day. What's the bare minimum I should try to get him to eat each day? And how do you calculate the "serving size" of a leaf of romaine lettuce? He hates salads, but likes eating lettuce as a finger food.

Fruits and fruit juices: 1 cup or one piece, 3-5(2-3) per day. A whole cup of juice counts as a fruit serving? I thought 1/2 cup was a serving, and my pediatrician friend says it's only 2oz. how on earth can 8oz of juice be equal to one peice of fruit?  How much apple sauce makes a portion? And, once again, I wonder what's appropriate for my 75 lb 9yo when the list doesn't differentiate between different sized people in the recomendations.

I could also use practical advice on how to incorporate these foods into his diet.   He doesn't like "mixed" foods and he much prefers raw veggies to cooked. What should I pack him for school lunches? Fish would probably be the healthiest choice, but it's "too smelly" to eat at school. Should I offer sardines as an after-school snack instead?
Posted by: RedLilac, Friday, January 14, 2011, 4:01pm; Reply: 1
I’m wondering if Dr. D could pipe in regarding portion sizes for children.  Maybe they have different requirements since they are growing.  

I’d wonder what he might be eating behind your back.  Kids exchange food at school or at last they used to many years ago.  They also visit other friends’ homes and may consume goodies there that are forbidden at home.

(think)
Posted by: C_Sharp, Friday, January 14, 2011, 4:04pm; Reply: 2
Quoted from ruthiegirl

beans and legumes 1 cup, dry, 5-7 or 3-5 times a week.

Here's where I get really confused. First of all, it gives a serving as 1 cup of beans for everybody, not a larger portion size for men and a smaller one  (with a range) for women and children. Secondly, 1 cup of dry beans is equivilent to about 3-4 cups of cooked beans!


For As, Live Right says "1 cup" without the comma dry.  I assumed that it meant 1 cup cooked.  

The entry for Bs clearly says dry, but as you indicate this fails on a reasonableness test for your son.

I think it is possible that the entry for B should not have ", dry" instead should be "1 cup, cooked"

We have had some discussion of this issue in the past.

But a quick search did not reveal a definitive answer.
Posted by: paul clucas, Friday, January 14, 2011, 4:35pm; Reply: 3
A volume of gallons is just wrong and bad balance - secretor or not.

If you want to warn him of what damage he could do, I could post a picture of me at 18 years old with about 50 lbs of fat evenly distributed all over my body.  I drank about 4 L of milk a day - much to my mother's despair.    :o:P

Give him lots of ghee to help fill him up.  Perhaps you can find some relatively inexpensive kind of meat that will help as well.  He is 14 and is likely starting the adolescent growth spurt that requires the greatest appetite of his life.  I wish my mother had not dropped the GTD - she could tell you some stories.  The appetite is not what is wrong, it is the method of satiating it!

Also this is the time when his capability for physical work is growing rapidly as well.  What are his dental, cranial and dermatoglyphic biometrics like?
Posted by: ruthiegirl, Friday, January 14, 2011, 4:51pm; Reply: 4
Paul- my son is only 9. His adolescent growth spurt is years away (although his feet are nearly as big as mine!!!) My 14yo is a girl/woman and type O.

He doesn't share food at school. Between keeping kosher, BTD, and avoiding artificial additives, he knows better. The school supervises lunchtime to minimize food-swapping; they take food allergies seriously. And the few times he's eaten stuff he shouldn't have (not at school) he's confessed (when we asked based on his bad behavior later in the day.) Nor does he go to friends' houses after school. He'll have lunch at a friend's house maybe once a month, and I don't worry about BTD for those infrequent meals. He also gets soda and a piece or two of cake at shul once a week, and Hebrew school will offer 1 serving of pretzels or animal crackers with apple juice.

Figuring on 3 meals and 2 snacks a day, I'm in charge of 32-33 of the 35 times he eats per week.

It still looks like he needs way less dairy, more fish, and more beans. His meat requirements are easily met if he actually joins family dinners. And how do I get veggies into him?
Posted by: Lola, Friday, January 14, 2011, 5:04pm; Reply: 5
how about soup?

everybody loves soup!!! ;)
Posted by: ruthiegirl, Friday, January 14, 2011, 5:26pm; Reply: 6
Everybody except my son!

I make a veggie/bean soup almost every single day. DD2 eats it up regularly- it's her "after school meal" (essentially her lunch, since all she eats at school is cookies) and I'm not overly worried about her veggie intake because of these soups. I eat them, and DD1 eats them as well- if she's home in the afternoon (which excludes normal school days when she gets home at 7.) But DS won't touch soup. He will occasionally have a little turkey broth, sometimes with a few carrots, but if I make a hearty soup that's chock full of veggies, he won't touch it.

I need to keep washed lettuce in the house- he'll eat that as a finger food when it's readily available. Sometimes he'll eat carrot sticks too-  but that's not as reliable.
Posted by: Frosty, Friday, January 14, 2011, 6:26pm; Reply: 7
I don't know about a 9 year old child and what the recommendations are, but I know that when I followed the B diet (before the GTD) it was best for me to be in balance with all of the foods on my lists.  If I ate primarily grains and dairy I would have gained a lot of weight and not felt well at all.

It is the same with me now on the GTD.  I have to have a good balance of foods in order to feel great.  When I eat geno harmonic foods I do fantastic!  With as busy as my schedule has been this winter, eating geno harmonic has been difficult and sometimes traveling or eating out, as well as all the holiday goodies that were available, has been a challenge to even stay on the program.  Sometimes I would do well and sometimes not so well and I feel it physically when I do "not so well".

I think your son would do better with a little more balance in his diet.  I know that is hard to achieve sometimes with a 9 year old, but you are quite creative in the kitchen and I am sure you can find things he will eat more of to keep him more in balance.

And yes, he might be a nonnie.  Then you will have to adjust his diet again.  ugh!  
Posted by: Kristin, Friday, January 14, 2011, 6:37pm; Reply: 8
Quoted from Frosty

I think your son would do better with a little more balance in his diet.  I know that is hard to achieve sometimes with a 9 year old, but you are quite creative in the kitchen and I am sure you can find things he will eat more of to keep him more in balance.


I agree. I think balance is the key to all things when one is the B blood type. Yes, B's can eat a variety of dairy but as you noticed, it is not really all that much. And I would add that cultured dairy is the best to emphasize. If your son is getting frequent upper respiratory infections then I would agree that his dairy consumption is most likely too high.
Posted by: Victoria, Friday, January 14, 2011, 7:07pm; Reply: 9
Can you blender just a few B-type cooked vegetables in the turkey broth?  Not enough to overwhelm, but just a little bit to get some more in his diet.  

Remember:
Staying away from the avoid/toxins will help to avoid sickness.
Eating Neutrals is just for variety and some extra nutrients.
But only Beneficials/Superfoods will build strong health and healing.

How about for a raw munchie bowl:
raw baby carrots
slightly de-strung celery sections (I like to eat the inner stalks because they aren't so coarse and stringy)
small slices of sweet red bell pepper
peas in the pod
young, tender green beans
little cauliflowerettes
cucumber

How are his teeth?  Sometimes that can give a clue that a person is a non-secretor.  If he's a nonnie, that really is a whole different ballgame because we do not handle avoid/toxins/black dots very well.
Posted by: ruthiegirl, Friday, January 14, 2011, 7:54pm; Reply: 10
I took a look at the food lists for B in LR4YT, and there didn't seem to be all that many differences between the B secretor and the B nonnie diet. Lots of secretor beneficials become nonnie neutrals- which would have little practical difference for him. The only significan changes are that wheat goes from neutral to avoid (he only gets wheat away from home anyway) and sugar goes from neutral to avoid. Honey remains neutral, and yogurt remains beneficial.

I still have half a gallon of milk in the fridge (a half-empty gallon container) that I don't want to go to waste, but I think I may stop buying milk and only buy yogurt after this. I think I'll buy the plain and serve it to him with honey mixed in. Or maybe I'll buy baby food fruits again and mix that with the plain yogurt. He used to love that when he was a baby- I wonder if he'd eat it now?
Posted by: geminisue, Friday, January 14, 2011, 8:13pm; Reply: 11
I think 1 cup dried mean dry beans, not fresh, frozen or canned.

Children portion are smaller then adult portions like if we have 1/2 cup, they have 1/4 cup.

If we get whole sandwich, they get a half a sandwich, which also means half the meat, on it.

Not recommending use of: but for comparison sake- look at the size of the children yogurts, compared to the regular yogurts, they seem much smaller, and probably less ounces, and I will guess one is a serving, for a child.

I read that 2 T before cooking is serving for hot cereal

Remember you can use his nut portion, to make milk, for his cereal, so he could save his smaller then use to portions of milk to drink.

I never read that you can substitute more cheese, if you don't eat the eggs,can he eat egg whites with beneficial spices Maybe even a meringue. 2 whites=1 egg
Posted by: MsRubyLu, Friday, January 14, 2011, 10:36pm; Reply: 12
Speaking as a B nonnie.  I didn't like very many cooked vegetables as a kid and still prefer my veggies raw.  I think the snack bowl is a great idea.. I loved leaf lettuce as a kid.  You might want to find out his taster status too.  I think being a supertaster made me very picky, something I'm still working on. ;D
Posted by: Lola, Saturday, January 15, 2011, 2:22am; Reply: 13
you need to build up his flora asap
Posted by: paul clucas, Saturday, January 15, 2011, 7:05pm; Reply: 14
Have you tried veggies deep fried in ghee?

It would be a little extreme and it would only be suitable when you have exhausted all other possibilities.   Ghee fried veggies as an alone snack ought to be able to tempt just about anyone whose digestive system is not upset.

Veggie snack bowl works for my kids - if they are hungry enough and it is ready before they appreciate that they are hungry.  Even my boy, who would rather not eat any vegetable other than carrots and cucumbers, will fall for that trick.

Lightly fried and grill vegetables were standard in my parents household.  Now my main lunch is only sliced veggies with tuna!  If going raw is good for those who want to loose weight, is going cooked the solution for those who want to gain?
Posted by: TJ, Saturday, January 15, 2011, 10:42pm; Reply: 15
My B brother only eat raw veggies.  I didn't like them more than lightly steamed at first but my veggie tastes have grown since BTD...  Anyway, he might be a super-taster.  And kids can be picky anyway, super-tasters or not, since taste buds are more sensitive during childhood (or so I've read).

I'd think of beans first as a source of starch not of protein.  If you want to get protein into him, go for meat, fish, and nuts.  Dairy should just be a condiment for nonnies.

Do you always include beans in your soup?  If you do, and he doesn't like beans, he's not ever going to like soup!
Posted by: geminisue, Saturday, January 15, 2011, 11:11pm; Reply: 16
Have you tried making the beans like you make/use to make mashed potatoes except maybe add broth and seasonings and maybe ghee? Also to dip into like on flax crackers or whatever kind he has.  Also as a base for a taco/wrap.
Posted by: RedLilac, Sunday, January 16, 2011, 3:19pm; Reply: 17
I’ve always disliked beans.  I wouldn’t be thrilled about your soup either.  I enjoy a soup made with beef or turkey broth, rice or spelt noodles, carrots, celery, mushrooms, and herbs.   As a child they used to kid me about being a rabbit.  I’d be happy munching on lettuce and raw carrots.  As a child I was a very fussy, picky eater.   I’d rather starve than eating some things put on my plate.  

My “O” mother & I had very different tastes.  At restaurants I’d try some of my AB- father’s food and love it.  My parents had very different tastes.  Both my father & I thought my mother was a lousy cook.  Of course none of us knew about BTD back then.

Watch what your kid is naturally attracted to.  My childhood tastes were vindicated by the BTD.
Posted by: Andrea AWsec, Sunday, January 16, 2011, 3:42pm; Reply: 18
B's in balance. Someone recently told me she calls the B blood type a tightrope walker.

Just the changes in his life home schooled now in classroom school is a lot for him.
Posted by: san j, Sunday, January 16, 2011, 4:29pm; Reply: 19
Quoted from RedLilac

Watch what your kid is naturally attracted to.  My childhood tastes were vindicated by the BTD.


Perfect. This B was drawn to very hot peppers and to Indian curries when neither were popular. That's a tall order for a mom to serve up at home!
The two everyday items I hated were tomatoes and orange juice. ... Ahem. :) ;D
Posted by: ruthiegirl, Sunday, January 16, 2011, 6:29pm; Reply: 20
He enjoys beans. He'll eat kidney beans plain, room temperature or refrigerated or heated up, by themselves or with rice. Rice and beans is one of the few things he'll actualy eat "mixed"- with the bean liquid flavoring the rice. He likes black bean burgers (with ketchup,and I'm obviously no longer letting him eat either black beans or ketchup.)

I'm not going to stop making the veggie/bean soups because the other 3 family members eat it, and through these soups DD2 is consistently eating plenty of veggies. DS just doesn't like having foods mixed together.He doesn't like soup with "stuff" floating in it- but he'll eat clear broth, sometimes with carrots or turkey (never the celery.) He'll eat romaine lettuce as a finger food, but he won't eat salad with salad dressing. Occasionally I can get him to eat carrot sticks. He likes raw fruits, and tolerates apple sauce, but doesn't like dried fruits.

It's certainly possible that he's a super-taster. He likes his food very plain and "boring."  He ate GREAT when he was a toddler- spinach used to be one of his favorites, and he ate squash and spinach regularly, plus lots of fruits, and beans were a high chair tray favorite.

I've just instituted a new rule: he needs to have at least one fruit or veggie with each meal or snack, excluding breakfast (which is sometimes just a cup of milk). It doesn't have to be a large portion, but he has to at least get in the habit of eating fruits and veggies more often. I'm hoping the quantities of veggies consumed will increase over time.
Posted by: TJ, Sunday, January 16, 2011, 7:43pm; Reply: 21
Hmm, that shoots down my idea.
Posted by: Victoria, Sunday, January 16, 2011, 8:22pm; Reply: 22
I wonder if it's a B thing.  I don't like vegetables floating around in my soups either.  I'll always blend up the cooked vegetables with the stock and seasonings.  That can then be used to add in whatever meat I want to put in my soup.
Posted by: RedLilac, Monday, January 17, 2011, 2:29pm; Reply: 23
Other than the beans, he sounds a lot like me.  I prefer plain food.   I eat romaine as a finger food.  Salads were dry for years then I decided to add olive oil and lemon to them.  I wouldn’t  eat casseroles as a kid and even now as an adult I’ll take a little itty bit at a pot luck to please the maker unless it is filled with avoids then I claim allergies.  I like my food separated on my plate, not mixed.  I do like my son’s stews & soups.  Usually broth, meat, garlic, onions, carrots & herbs.  Sometimes potatoes, rice, or spelt noodles.

San J sounds like my son.  He likes peppers and hot spicy food.  He’s B+ sec taster Nomad.

So I bet your son is a super taster like me and maybe an Explorer.  
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