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BTD Forums  /  Live Right 4 Your Type  /  is fruit really good for you?
Posted by: PCUK-Positive, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 5:34pm
So , fruit is good for you yet if you are a diabetic you shouldn't eat fruit. according to mercola. plonker.

also he says wheat is bad for you due to the sugar.

surely gotta be more to it than that. either fruit is good for you or not.

perhaps generally a little fruit is good for you and fruits of a certain kind dependent on your blood type.

Posted by: MileHighRob, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 5:43pm; Reply: 1
I certainly argue the case that if you are diabetic you shouldn't eat fruit.  As a matter of fact, in his Diabetes Protocol book Dr. D recommends 3-4 servings of fruit daily for A BT secretors and 2-3 daily servings for A non-secretors.  

I battle diabetes complications and eat a 1/2 cup cherries along with another 1/2 cup of blueberries at breakfast time.  Throughout the day I'll have a grapefruit and perhaps a plum or a fig or two with nut butter.  

I say I deal with complications however my last A1c test shows I am managing my glucose levels as well as or better than most people without diabetes.  
Posted by: PCUK-Positive, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 5:58pm; Reply: 2
I have noticed that if i get a cut on my foot it heals slower than anywhere else. things like that that make me suspect a sugar problem. pre diabetic perhaps, I'm sure i have read.

i love to know what else can help this apart from cutting down on fruit and sugar both of which i am now doing. with a very complaint BTD with fairly low food map (due to copying Emily's diet) and slowly cutting down on sweets and ice cream (Goldie problem ) lol mine too.

i don't do a lot of other carbs. have almost cut out normal potatoes apart from the odd chip every couple of weelks.

exercising more but still need to up my game in this area - but this will get better as Emily gets a bit more mobile and faster. lol

I'm down to 11 and a half stone at my lowest i.e in the morning.

I find the cravings for carbs a battle at the mo, i was okay with the cravings up until a few weeks ago. if you have a little it's difficult to stop so none is best (note Goldie)
Posted by: marjorie, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 6:02pm; Reply: 3
I think fruit is highly individualized. When I workout alot, I seem to need more fruit to keep me focused or alert. On the other hand,  I can easily go a day without any fruit, and be very productive. I am still trying to find the balance as well.

I generally try 2 fruits a day, not sure if this is enough or too much.
Posted by: marjorie, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 6:03pm; Reply: 4
Quoted from PCUK-Positive
So , fruit is good for you yet if you are a diabetic you shouldn't eat fruit. according to mercola. plonker.

also he says wheat is bad for you due to the sugar.

surely gotta be more to it than that. either fruit is good for you or not.

perhaps generally a little fruit is good for you and fruits of a certain kind dependent on your blood type.



I wish it was that simple, good or bad? THen again, I think labeling any food is not healthy. I am o and I do well on pears or plums, how about you?
Posted by: MileHighRob, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 6:04pm; Reply: 5
I'd certainly looked at all the processed sugars you're consuming before trying to point fingers at the sugar in beneficial fruits.  

The only sugar content I consume is from real live food.  Nothing process and nothing added to my teas.  I'd also look at the carbs that break down into sugar more rapidly which you may be consuming.  

Fruit is not bad food for diabetics.  Trust me.  
Posted by: DenverFoodie, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 6:08pm; Reply: 6
I think it has to do with the GI (glycemic index) and the GL (glycemic load) of the particular food.  The higher the GI and GL means your body must put more insulin in your blood to counteract the sugar.  Here's a link if you are interested in reading more.  http://www.livestrong.com/article/90359-glycemic-load-list/
Posted by: ruthiegirl, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 6:42pm; Reply: 7
Fruits contain vitamins, minerals, antioxidants, enzymes, and fiber, along with fructose.

All of our bodies are unique, and even our individual needs can change over time.

For somebody with specific problems with sugar, such as fructose malabsorption, completely eliminating fruit might be a good idea. That may only be necessary until the gut has healed- and after a few months or years moderate fruit consumption might be tolerated again.

Most people probably benefit from fruit consumption, as long as they're selecting the right fruits for their type, eating them in the right quantities, and eating them at the right time. Some digest fruit better alone, according to food combining principals. Others do best when fruits are consumed with or after protein and fat, to minimize the  glycemic index (this covers diabetics and the "average" O.)

Many little kids will fill up on fruit to the exclusion of protein and fat, and have GI problems as a result. Sometimes this even affects their growth if they're taking in too few calories (filling up on fruit instead of meat., for example.) This isn't because fruit is "bad," it's because they're eating too much of it and their diets are unbalanced.

Mercola is a proponent of "one size fits all" diets.  He says "you're diabetic? Ok, low carb for you! No sugars at all!" while Dr. D says "OK, you're diabetic, so only eat the  beneficial fruit, which is a different choice for each of you, and limit yourself to X servings a day, which is also different for each of you, but still lower than I'd recomend for you if you weren't diabetic."
Posted by: Goldie, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 6:48pm; Reply: 8
The glycemic index only addresses how fast the fruit will enter into the bloodstream and kick up a fuss..

I think therefore mall pieces are better than a lot at one time... but for me when I crave (most often I am thirsty and water /tea does nothing for me)  I eat fruits or nuts.. at least when I am compliant..

Pineapple is high on the official glycemic chart, Dr D sees it as Beneficial or even Super for the byproducts next to the sugar seem to be helpful for our  (O)..  digestion OVER ruling the FAST uptake..

FOR MY Grazing it really helps to freeze one chunk in a ice cube tray section.. that way I have a few ready  frozen as I seem to like, and still feel less guilt.. the freezing leaves them intact.. as finger food or on top of some other foods if one eats such.. (I do not)

the same seems true for prunes, but they are also health giving .. as they help with liquid digestion..  

The Diab Book talks about CUPS of fruit.. well I am not certain that it really means 3 cups of fruit a day.. but as much as I allow myself nothing much else then fruit it is next to tea.. gave up all grains and rice many years ago..

I am coming to wonder if pumpkin would not make some kind of ice-cream substitute gooey sort of creamy food?? with a little pineapple??  .... adding to it if I must some nuts.. or its seeds in the chopper..

Sorry I am addressing O non only as that is what I struggle with..  

BUT P/C and M/H/R  I KNOW HAD I NOT given up sugar and for that matter fruit and carbs ----35 YEARS ago--- I would be much worse of today..  I was ill with milk problems and had enough stomach pain issues that I came upon different eating suggestions and followed them.. only to improve the list 14 or so with BTD.. so for those of you who ... eventually... have to deal with this darn diabetes and all the rest of the complications from Syndrome X ,,,,,, the sooner you are finding HAPPY ways to eat better by % tigeges.. the better you will be of when I am closer to 90 and you are my age.. ??  

FOR ME the diabetes book is my new bible.. and IF I fall of the wagon 5% I still am not poisoning myself with the foods the rest of the world thinks is good for us..

I KNOW that diabetes starts at birth.. P/C you convinced me of that...

as for onions it is most likely the same issue as they are really sugar???? when cooked? 8)
Posted by: DenverFoodie, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 6:57pm; Reply: 9
Quoted from Goldie
The glycemic index only addresses how fast the fruit will enter into the bloodstream and kick up a fuss..

"The glycemic load (GL) is a relatively new way to assess the impact of carbohydrate consumption that takes the glycemic index into account, but gives a fuller picture than does glycemic index alone. A GI value tells you only how rapidly a particular carbohydrate turns into sugar. It doesn't tell you how much of that carbohydrate is in a serving of a particular food. You need to know both things to understand a food's effect on blood sugar. That is where glycemic load comes in. The carbohydrate in watermelon, for example, has a high GI. But there isn't a lot of it, so watermelon's glycemic load is relatively low. A GL of 20 or more is high, a GL of 11 to 19 inclusive is medium, and a GL of 10 or less is low".
Posted by: PCUK-Positive, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 7:37pm; Reply: 10
I keep coming back to the same thing though some people do well without any fruit, so why do people insist it is essential. I'm not sure it is needed in anyway like the quantity we are consuming theses today day. but i wouldn't exclude it altogether also.

I have recently read more People moving away from th GI diet can't remember exactly but it's not quite as important for some people as a lot think. i think maybe the fodmap's will be the gi of the future.

as it happens Emily can't have some fruit. she is doing better without it. okay so there might be something she is missing but since she can't have them without being ill - and when she doesn't have them she seems fine. she is putting wight and height rapidly after years of being smaller than the norm.

now please note before anyone gets upset I'm not saying that is all fruit - as she is now wheat free, low fodmap and BTD. so a lot of things going on there. and I'm not even talking about low fodmap fruits today just generally. but all these she was without and it was only the fodmaps that finally helped everything work.

if you look at known vitamins and minerals and what foods they come from you can't argue that they are not required as you can get all the necessary bits or most of them from all sorts of areas of food.

for example Ellagic Acid assists Cancer
Ellagic Acid sources
Apple
Blackberries
Cherries
Grapes LOW FODMAP
Pecans
Raspberries LOW FODMAP
Strawberries LOW FODMAP
Walnuts LOW FODMAP

lot of talk about Anti-oxidants well the sources sources are as follows
Arugula
Bok choy
Cabbage
Cauliflower
Grapes LOW FODMAP
Kale
Mushrooms
Olive oil
Potato
Pumpkin LOW FODMAP
Radish
Rhubarb LOW FODMAP
Seaweed
Sesame oil
Soy beans
Strawberries LOW FODMAP
Sunflower seeds
Tomato LOW FODMAP
Turnips LOW FODMAP
Watercress
Winter squash LOW FODMAP


MY ONLY REAL CONCERN IS ONIONS which have Germanium only sources Shiitake mushrooms and Onion

and Allium sources Leek, Onion, Chives (Emily has Chives)

but i intend to have onions back on the menu in two weeks albeit at a small level.
Posted by: ABJoe, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 8:06pm; Reply: 11
I find that I need a certain amount of fruit to provide the amount of carbs to function properly.  Not surprising, I need about the amount that Dr. D. recommends for my type.  When I eat close to the suggested portions and frequency for all of the food types, I do the best.

I don't worry about FODMAPS or GI / GL, etc...  Although, I have never been diagnosed with a sugar problem...  I had some issues that were close, but I think it was mostly due to the corn stuff that I ate.  Once in a while I still have a problem that seems like a sugar aberration, but I'm still clearing garbage out, so it could still be related.
Posted by: Goldie, Sunday, August 22, 2010, 8:20pm; Reply: 12
years ago I would double over when I drank some milk powder in a drink.. or some of those milk containers they serve with coffee..

Years after eating BTD and LOW carb for 30 years I am so much better that I can even have some protein milk shake.. the issue here is how damaged we where before and how much healing we did since..

healing we will but age may not be as kind.. it has a way of shutting certain portals down and then we have to start over again being more compliant and more aware.. each food list gives us a clue. another tool to consider..

I used to as do all Americans think bananas is ok once a day.. but have since learned that only some reasons dictate that as OK  and others most definite do not..

so as we learn about super foods or benes and neutral or even avoid foods we learn to treat us better one discovery at a time.. BUT EQUALLY I think .. THINGS change and we heal.. and then NEED TO ADJUST.. like:: lets say I need to loose weight, but once I have optimum health weight .. then I need to add foods just for better health all over again..

so each discovery here is one more piece of info and one more piece of wisdom to be absorbed.. if we dont consider all pieces we miss out..

put all the lists together and then we come closer to what DrD has already studied learned and figured out years ago.. so BTD or LOW GI or Food map they all serve the same end.. teaching and us learning and adjusting.. good luck to us all..   8)
Posted by: marjorie, Monday, August 23, 2010, 3:32am; Reply: 13
Today I had a pear for mid snack and then a plum/half a pear for night snack and I noticed that both times I felt really bloated and extremely tired. I just cant understand this except that my meals are filling me up enough that I am almost forcing the fruit in....

on the other hand, my thought process and mentality was much more alert. It was like my body telling me I needed the carbs, but I did not like the way I felt afterwards.

Still confused about the fruit.
Posted by: Possum, Monday, August 23, 2010, 3:58am; Reply: 14
Here's an alternative answer to the question...

Life without fruit:

"Most parents are reluctant to consider a low salicylate diet. ‘How can children live without fruit?’ they ask, not realising that it is possible to eat vegetables without fruit. Nearly two thousand years ago, the ancient Greek physician Galen (Claudius Galenus), considered to be the co-founder of modern medicine, wrote that his father had lived to be a hundred by avoiding fruit.

I have spent months in remote subsistence villages in the Himalayas where children eat very little fruit. These children are happy, healthy, well-spoken and eager to learn, sometimes walking up to two hours each way to school. They are mostly vegetarians living on home-grown rice, lentils, dried beans, potatoes and a range of other vegetables in season, with a few fruit trees around the house. ‘How much fruit do you eat?’ I would ask. After a lot of thought, they would generally estimate ‘about one piece a week’. As well there might be fresh milk and yoghurt in season from their own yak-buffalo cross and eggs from their own chickens. Their intake of additives is zero and their intake of high salicylate-containing foods is much lower than ours. My daughter, who had been diagnosed with ADHD and oppositional defiance disorder and had been following a low salicylate diet for years in Australia, is able to eat this Himalayan subsistence diet without ill effects.

Since food chemicals can be addictive, it is common to find salicylate-intolerant children choosing to eat very little other than the highest salicylate foods, especially tomato sauce, orange juice, broccoli, grapes, berries, kiwi fruit, sultanas, fruit juice and fruit flavoured yoghurts, while their parents think ‘well, at least it’s healthy’"

Edemariam A, Myths of Fruit, The Guardian, 23/1/2008, about the role of the nutrition industry in fruit promotion: “The one thing that is in nobody's interest to say is this: fruit just doesn't provide that much nutrition in the first place. If you believe the nutrition industry, every week produces some new superfood, often a fruit: blueberries, pomegranates, acai berries. The fact is that fruit consists of water, sugars (normally about 10%), some vitamin C, and some potassium (thought to be good for controlling blood pressure). And that's kind of it …” http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2008/jan/23/foodanddrink.healthandwellbeing
accessed 20/6/2010
Posted by: Lola, Monday, August 23, 2010, 6:08am; Reply: 15
and no mention of BT..... :-/
Posted by: PCUK-Positive, Monday, August 23, 2010, 12:23pm; Reply: 16
Interesting Possum, think i'll steal that article from you lol
Posted by: Goldie, Monday, August 23, 2010, 12:44pm; Reply: 17
60years agoLOL in my youth we had few fruits- by comparisons but we had apples, only B mom ate them by the nightly dozen.. leaving only stems.. the cellar smelled delish..

later we had imported banana..at 16 the first watermelon.  The fruit I ate was on top of delisch pastry in small amounts, or on Fridays on a pizza slice type fruit cake.. other than that it was not considered a staple...but no one ever talked about eating it one way or the other.. we never had to talk about food.. my grandma hotel had glass after glass of home made peaches, jams and jellies.... come to think of it WE ate fruit ON bread... jellies and fruit jam..

I was the one in my fam who ate the most.. but I was also the one with a belly even though I was skinny always.. my aunt worked in a choc factory so that was nice.. but fruit.. at will ....I agree: it is most likely not needed at all .. interesting..

Today LOL I seemingly use it to substitute the IDEA of : I must have something!.. IT's on IDEA learned I guess on TV.  but in the most recent days I am actually eating pineapple frozen one chunk at a time (all day) and other fruit because I just don't get SATISFYIED from drinking water/tea.. I think I eat prunes and blueberries (Super Bene compliant) because I feel thirsty for flavorful liquid..water just does not do it.. so the fruit helps..

so now that I read all the threads I think I am able to BETTER understand the reasons for 'obsessing' and maybe find PEACE in proportions as stipulated in the BTD book..  THANKS ALL
Posted by: Goldie, Monday, August 23, 2010, 3:28pm; Reply: 18
PC LOL.. the reason I eat fruit is that I can not eat meat and veg.. alone.. tooooo restricted.. but balancing the fruit for the whole day is an answer..

and DrD says.. in the dab book..

eating plenty of fruits helps with tempering the effects of insulin. shifting the balance of water from extra cellular edema concentrations, to high intracellular concentrations.. Pineapple help reduce the inflammation and provide water balance..  :)

so for me with a relative healthy gut I can have them just not go over board as in drinking juice for the whole day in one sitting..  :o

for Em until her innards are healed by Jan next.. then she will most likely be able to eat again without to much fear ... the Super Beneficials are good medicine.. benficials are good foods .. and the rest I don't eat (unless I am out -which is my issues) so some fruit might be ok after a while..  ;)

but not like advertized in the US 8 oz glasses of milk and 8 oz glasses of orange juice in the morning!!!!!!! ---- that is enough to kill on elephant.. and there is the issue in all the over weight UNDERNEURISHED PEOPLE!!!! :X

the bigger the belly the more undernourished and intestines can't function..  :-/
Posted by: PCUK-Positive, Monday, August 23, 2010, 7:02pm; Reply: 19
I'll have to re-read that diabetic book again to make sure your not making that up, just so you can have loads of fruit conscience free there Goldie LOL
Posted by: Goldie, Monday, August 23, 2010, 7:25pm; Reply: 20
LOL LOL LOL .. PC.. bottom of page 54.. read and know that I could not be smart enough to make that up.. LOL LOL LOL

Conscience Free Eating: now that would be a diet.. //but I am on it?? BTD green leaves and meat? yes indeed.. !!

I am getting better .. I am eating little chunks of fruit instead of the whole thing.and gave up juices.

Super is the only way..  

Bene scare me.. toooo much sugar... to scared.. but could make it in slices also.. ahh?!

I like guava and mango.. messy..

Avocado is ok.. have two unripe ones.. I wonder will they ever get ripe?

but I have really made a switch to limits.. smaller portions .. way smaller.. smaller steaks to, LOL LOL LOL
Posted by: Possum, Monday, August 23, 2010, 10:00pm; Reply: 21
Quoted from Goldie
Avocado is ok.. have two unripe ones.. I wonder will they ever get ripe? ...but I have really made a switch to limits.. smaller portions .. way smaller.. smaller steaks to
I think I read that you can ripen them by putting them in a paper bag ??) :-/; but whatever you do it's not good to refrigerate them, apparently... ;) That's how the flesh develops that yucky brown veiny appearance ::)

Btw...maybe just keep the steaks to BTD portion sizes, but on the other hand I would up the amount if you are struggling with cravings?! This is just my opinion, (& I am sure I have expressed it to you before :-/ ) but I have long thought your cravings could be from not getting enough protein :-/ ??) Being a nonnie, you need more... And also you could fill up on vegs more too ;)
Posted by: Victoria, Monday, August 23, 2010, 10:06pm; Reply: 22
I agree with possum about protein, dear Goldie.  I don't think that's the direction you should go when you are reducing portions.  Reduce fruit, carbs, starch type stuff, sugars of all kinds.  Keep lots of meat, fish, vegetables.  Complex carbs that digest more slowly.  No refined starches.
Posted by: Possum, Monday, August 23, 2010, 10:39pm; Reply: 23
Quoted from PCUK-Positive
Interesting Possum, think i'll steal that article from you lol
you're welcome - I think it's a really great informative article...

From "the myth of fruit" I really like this part:

"It's a myth that fruit is packed full of vitamins and minerals," says Tom Sanders, who is director of the Nutritional Sciences Division at King's College London. "The foods packed full of micronutrients are grains, seeds and nuts, the peas and things."
Bagged salad? "It's mainly water. Dark green vegetables are a good source of some vitamins, such as vitamin A and folate, but lettuce hasn't got much going for it at all. The really sad thing is that we don't eat enough vegetables, such as cabbage, spinach and broccoli."

In May, the Observer reported that dietitians have become so worried about claims being made for so-called superfoods that they convened a debate on the subject at the Science Museum. It may be claimed that particular exotic berries boost IQ, energy and immunity, but the only science even vaguely backing this up is that they contain folic acid, which does boost brainpower, but is present in many foods. The antioxidants in pomegranate juice, which supposedly fight diseases as different as cancer and arthritis, actually only last in the body for an hour. Wheatgrass, that standby of the trendy juicebar, is said to be rich in detoxifying chlorophyll, but every green vegetable and leaf in the world contains cholorophyll - which is not, in fact, absorbable by our bodies.

"The term 'superfoods' is at best meaningless and at worst harmful," Catherine Collins, chief dietician at St George's Hospital in London, told the paper. "There are so many wrong ideas about superfoods that I don't know where best to begin to dismantle the whole concept."
Nor do dietitians have much time for the rise of the smoothie, sales of which have increased by 523% in the past five years. They are expensive, says Sanders, "and bloody holier than thou". With whole fruit, the cell structure is still intact, and you swallow pieces. They take longer to digest and the sugar in them is released slowly, rather than the rapid spike in blood glucose produced by drinking juice, or a smoothie. "If you liquidise it into goo it's just like drinking ordinary Coke. Or worse, actually," he says. "It's still a sugary drink. A lot of people on diets don't realise that if they're drinking loads of apple juice or orange juice, it's got a lot of calories in. If you drink a litre of apple juice a day, it'll be 400 calories."


Supports the idea that juicing vegs & eating the whole fruit is better!!
Posted by: PCUK-Positive, Tuesday, August 24, 2010, 12:29am; Reply: 24
Hey Goldie see if concentrating a bit more on the following fruit and veg helps - i checked them against your list and i think all are on it, but check again as that book is a bit confusing for nonnies. these are all low fodmap and on your BTD and diabetes i think, so may help.

NB - no ice cream on this list lol

Bamboo shoots
Beans, Green
Bok choy
broccoli
Capsicum (RED Peppers)
Carrot
Celery
Chives
Endive
Ginger small
Lettuce
Parsnip
Pumpkin
Spinach (caution)
Spring onion (Green bit)
Squash (Butternut)
Swede
Sweet potato
Turnip
Tomato
Zucchini (Courgette)

LOW FODMAP FRUITS
Banana
Blueberry
Grapefruit
Grapes (small amounts)
Lemon (small amounts)
Lime
Paw paw Papaya
Passionfruit ?
Pineapple (very small amounts)
Raspberry (very small amounts)

Basil
Chilli (black dot)
Coriander
Parsley
Rosemary
Salt
Thyme

notice garlic is not on my list for a time but olive oil infused with garlic is okay but don't make it your self unless you know about botulism dangers
Posted by: Goldie, Tuesday, August 24, 2010, 1:30am; Reply: 25
PC thanks and all others to..

I eat exactly:

Meat steaks, roasted thin fried or stewed - lean mostly 2x a day,
Fish seldom
Eggs for breakfast or
Broth and deep green leaves for breakfast
Olive oil.. 1 spoon - not enough.. some mayo every so often (avoid)
Nuts:Pumpkin seeds or walnuts
Beans..Green beans,
no grains (unless I am out very seldom)
Veggies, broccoli, chicory, escarole, kale, ... Kohlrabi Romain, onions cooked only, pumpkin, turnip... zuccini, may add carrots again?  
Fruit: blueberry, pineapple, plum, prunes.  Seldom banana, cherry, figs, guava, mango, avocado
Spices: Sea salt, Fenugreek, Turmeric, Cayenne,  sometimes choc 85%
Tea: Peppermint Rosehip..
water 6x 8 oz in tea or plain.
Honestly this is it...

I discovered that I am really not feeling water for liquid.. that is why I choose some other foods.. or fruit..

DOES anyone else have the feeling that water does nothing for thirst?? My brain is wierd that way. I don't really feel thirst .,..  I look for food instead to chew or swallow or whatever..  

NOW I am not learing after some foods.. I eat enough all day.. but I needed to find ways to take away the loss by finding some other thing to satisfy..like anything that would make me feel like I had coffee flavor or creamy stuff.. not with sugar just the familiar texture..

I no longer look for sweet stuff.. (other than when I am out) Small frozen fruit pieces help a lot in portion and amount..

I used to (years ago) eat 8-10 oz a meal, and many walnuts.. and I lost weight when I did that.. but I have cut to be more like 4 oz.. and less nuts more seeds..
I eat enough veggies.. and I do eat some fruit but it is now less of a fight.. much less.. like .5 -1 oz several time a day.. drinking more water does not help..

By the way I have been eating like this for years and years.. and am ok with it.. even my friends know I cook only these things for them also.. and serve mostly pineapple or blueberries with cherri juice sauce..  care to come for dinner??  I am imaginative so I don't get bored..

PC I agree maybe not enough oil.. but I dont know how to add it, as I don't like the flavor to much..
You are much more adventuroues with the foods you eat.. I am just not able to go off BTD.. but I like it as listed above.. (I went of to Gatherer foods for a previous year and blew a hole in my sugar issues..I am sure that others do well with it - but for me it did not ) the above Super and Ben BTD suits me well..

PC did you read page 54?? ,,,,,,,,,,,,,gosh my whole life here.. Hhahaha
Posted by: Goldie, Tuesday, August 24, 2010, 1:35am; Reply: 26
I think the discussion about fruit is as following.. many are full of sugar and we don't need it.

maybe 3 fruits in small portions might be ok

but fruit and starches is a no no, the same is starches and meat.. basically a no no..

veggies and protein is limitless.. veggies Juiced is good, fruit should be eaten whole always.

dairy is sugar conversion and should be seen as such.. (I am O so does not apply to others)  

onions might be a sweet food also .. in portion ok..  
Posted by: Jerome, Tuesday, August 24, 2010, 2:02am; Reply: 27
I think that Guardian article may be missing some things, as informative as it is. I think the nutritionists and dietitians they are consulting with may be overlooking that there is more to human nutritional interest than vitamins and minerals. I think saying that a fruit is nothing more than sugar, water, some potassium, and some vitamin C is a little simplistic. I think it's more complex than that. What about all the different kinds of phytochemicals, like flavonoids or proteolytic enzymes? Each fruit is a world unto itself, just like each person, I think. It may not be helpful to lump them all together like the article does at times. But it does shed some important light on some aspects of the produce industry.
Posted by: Goldie, Wednesday, August 25, 2010, 11:07am; Reply: 28
I THINK MY question comes down to : HOW MUCH fruit, or how many, carbs how often ?? versus Protein??? for perdiabetics and diabetics or sugar sensitive people??  or people who eat to stay awake or energetic??  ( like coffe drinkers drink it all day- why?? )
Posted by: Eagle Beach, Wednesday, August 25, 2010, 1:49pm; Reply: 29
When you say assist cancer with fruits like cherries, and veg like onions, are you saying they are bad for you? Or good in preventing cancer? In the food value list I always thought Onions was good to take? And for O's both says Benifical.
I only recently joined on board, so alittle confused ?
Posted by: Goldie, Wednesday, August 25, 2010, 2:19pm; Reply: 30
Quoted Text
When you say assist cancer with fruits like cherries, and veg like onions, are you saying they are bad for you? Or good in preventing cancer? In the food value list I always thought Onions was good to take? And for O's both says Benifical.
I only recently joined on board, so alittle confused ?


Eagle Beach.. welcome.. but maybe you could give a little more info in your profile so we can better answer.. like place and fem or not?

what health issues you might have?? how long on BTD or GENO?

but to your question for some the foods are ok while for others it is not..  seems onions are a lot of sugar especially when glazed in their own juices.. so not sooo good for diabetics?? I love onions.. Cherries are good blood cleansers..

keep asking ..    
Posted by: Peppermint Twist, Wednesday, August 25, 2010, 6:17pm; Reply: 31
::) omg, omg, OMG.

One more time, with feeling, because I don't know why there is such an anti-fruit strain of thought running through this fab-n-bril community:

FRUIT is FABULOUS!  Just be sure to focus, of course, on your superfood fruits, and ENJOY!

Just my two cents but some of you guys are WAY too worried about "fruit", as a general/reduced-down group.  But as we know here in this community, foods aren't generalized groups/categories as much as they are unique, individual entities.  Each specific fruit should be judged on its own merits.  Your superfood fruits are superfoods for a reason, and I disagree with that one quoted pup who said that it is a myth that fruit is packed with nutritive value.  It depends on the fruit, of course, but many are, and even some fruits and veggies that don't get much respect from nutritionists, such as iceberg lettuce and watermelon (the latter of which SHOULD), are FABULOUS for intracellular hydration and great sources of soluable fiber ta boot.

To recap PT's stance on all this lot:  if you want some fruit, HAVE SOME FRUIT.  Make it a superfood/beneficial variety and don't worry about if you have it alone or with protein or with starch or three hours before sunset or ten minutes after another meal.  Goodness, gracious, great balls of fire, I never thought I'd be saying this because, well, I'm me and usually folks have to say this to me, but:  RELAX.

:K)
Posted by: ABJoe, Wednesday, August 25, 2010, 7:31pm; Reply: 32
Quoted from Peppermint Twist
  Goodness, gracious, great balls of fire, I never thought I'd be saying this because, well, I'm me and usually folks have to say this to me, but:  RELAX.

:K)

This whole post is phenomenal, but I really liked this line from you PT...

That said, I think some people have health issues that the sugars in the fruit are making them aware of, that are subdues when they don't eat them...  It may be due to the sugar content of the fruit allowing the body to do more cleaning...  I know this happened to me and the Practitioner had to tell me to just let the body do its work...  Now, as long as I know I am putting good stuff in, I may feel like BLAH! while it cleans and heals.  It may take a long time to clean and heal from many years of avoid eating...  Patience is required, because if you keep starving the body of what it needs to clean, it will never happen and you will always have the same issues!
Posted by: PCUK-Positive, Wednesday, August 25, 2010, 7:52pm; Reply: 33
Quoted from Goldie
PC thanks and all others to..

I eat exactly:

Meat steaks, roasted thin fried or stewed - lean mostly 2x a day,
how much and have you tried them a bit less cooked?
Fish seldom
you know you should try some fish, try cod once a week to start.
Eggs for breakfast or how many eggs?
how many eggs hopefully just one a day?

Broth and deep green leaves for breakfast
which deep green leaves?
Olive oil.. 1 spoon - not enough.. some mayo every so often (avoid)
what size spoon? stop the mayo for a month
Nuts:Pumpkin seeds or walnuts
how much try a table spoon each time and don't mix them
Beans..Green beans,
no grains (unless I am out very seldom)
Veggies, broccoli, chicory, escarole, kale, ... Kohlrabi Romain, onions cooked only, pumpkin, turnip... zuccini, may add carrots again?  
just to humour me try a slight variation - go less of chicory, kale and cut onions out for a week. and continue with the other ones medium size portions

Fruit: blueberry, pineapple, plum, prunes.  Seldom banana, cherry, figs, guava, mango, avocado
skip all frit for 3 days then stop avacado, pinneapple, plum, prunes, cherry, guava and mango for another week. and tell me how you fell. for one week! keep what fruit is left to a SMALL handfull.

Spices: Sea salt, Fenugreek, Turmeric, Cayenne,  sometimes choc 85%

stop the choc for a week!

Tea: Peppermint Rosehip..
water 6x 8 oz in tea or plain.

spread the water out evenly over a day and have a bit more if you like. skip the peppermint and rose hip tea for a week. do plainold green tea - it's only a week. to see how you fell.
Honestly this is it...

I discovered that I am really not feeling water for liquid.. that is why I choose some other foods.. or fruit..

water is your friend - if you are still thirsty drink more. the carbs are making you thirsty don't blame the water! (oxo)

DOES anyone else have the feeling that water does nothing for thirst?? My brain is wierd that way. I don't really feel thirst .,..  I look for food instead to chew or swallow or whatever..  

NOW I am not learing after some foods.. I eat enough all day.. but I needed to find ways to take away the loss by finding some other thing to satisfy..like anything that would make me feel like I had coffee flavor or creamy stuff.. not with sugar just the familiar texture..

I no longer look for sweet stuff.. (other than when I am out) Small frozen fruit pieces help a lot in portion and amount..

the fruit is obvoilsy not helping you bare with me and try as above for a week and see.

I used to (years ago) eat 8-10 oz a meal, and many walnuts.. and I lost weight when I did that.. but I have cut to be more like 4 oz.. and less nuts more seeds..
I eat enough veggies.. and I do eat some fruit but it is now less of a fight.. much less.. like .5 -1 oz several time a day.. drinking more water does not help..

drink the water before you east say 20 mins if possible. not during or after for an hour or more.

By the way I have been eating like this for years and years.. and am ok with it.. even my friends know I cook only these things for them also.. and serve mostly pineapple or blueberries with cherri juice sauce..  care to come for dinner??  I am imaginative so I don't get bored..

PC I agree maybe not enough oil.. but I dont know how to add it, as I don't like the flavor to much..
You are much more adventuroues with the foods you eat.. I am just not able to go off BTD.. but I like it as listed above.. (I went of to Gatherer foods for a previous year and blew a hole in my sugar issues..I am sure that others do well with it - but for me it did not ) the above Super and Ben BTD suits me well..

i don't go of swami at all by the way. i read page 54 - left a message re that somewhere.

PC did you read page 54?? ,,,,,,,,,,,,,gosh my whole life here.. Hhahaha



We are not bashing fruit per say i'm trying something different which seems to be working for me and my family and maybe a few other- each to their own. it's a trial - and i'm keeping notes and looking at possible consequences. kind regards

By the way Goldie no small feat - well done for leaving the ice cream alone- but time to stop using fruit as a readon to cheat- I want you around here for a long time so work with me here - you have helped enough people time to help your self oxo

Posted by: Peppermint Twist, Wednesday, August 25, 2010, 7:57pm; Reply: 34
Quoted from ABJoe

This whole post is phenomenal, but I really liked this line from you PT...

;D
Quoted from ABJoe
That said, I think some people have health issues that the sugars in the fruit are making them aware of, that are subdued when they don't eat them...

Fair enough.  ...Dude, I'd write more but I have to get off line now (what else is new?).  Later!

Posted by: Peppermint Twist, Wednesday, August 25, 2010, 10:35pm; Reply: 35
Okay, A, I just realized that I posted my mini rant in the entire wrong thread (would you believe there is an entire other fruit thread that I thought I was posting in?), and, B, I came back to apologize anyway because who the heck am I to tell people what to think or not think about fruit?  I have been and tend to be the same way about "grains" as a general group:  I'm wary of "them" and tend to have a few "rules" about even my superfood grains. I do enjoy my superfood grains but I only allow myself one grain meal per day because they, as a general group, tend to slow my metabolism. So who am I to lecture you guys about generalizing about all "fruit" or having what I may deem needless rules for fruit ingestion?  One man's needless is another man's very imprtant/crucial for health. So:  I apologize. Don't know what got into me.

It may have been "vegetable protein" and "autolyzed yeast", which; if I'm lucky mean MSG and if I'm not, mean wheat or corn, but I think it's MSG. Long story (well, long by two-thumbed typing standards), but I bought something with "Spike Seasoning" on it and now it has rendered me all toxed up and chastising folks for fruit concerns. SORRY!
Posted by: PCUK-Positive, Wednesday, August 25, 2010, 10:50pm; Reply: 36
Always interesting lol
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