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BTD Forums  /  SWAMI Xpress  /  Sugar better than honey?
Posted by: Cristina, Thursday, October 15, 2009, 10:25pm
My Swami changed a bit in the last couple of days, tweaking it more towards the Warrior side of things.  I am good for changing, and I do not like dwelling too much on it, but there is a change that I find hard to understand:

Honey, which used to be a SF or diamond previously (Teacher side of things), is now a black dot, in itself that is not big deal, but I am surprise to find white and brown sugars listed in the neutrals.

What makes my beautiful, unadulterated, home grown honey, produced from hard working bees by collecting pollen from Tea tree forest across the road or the many herbs and wild booms around the place, rate less than processed, chemically produced cane products like white and brown sugar?

:-/ ??) :'( :)
Posted by: geminisue, Thursday, October 15, 2009, 10:45pm; Reply: 1
black dot is a temporary halt for about three months, to give your body a chance to heal without it, than you can add it back in and see how it affects your individual body and decide whether to keep it in or not.

So is sugar given a neutral rating actually better than a black dot you may be able to use again that will benefit your body?

A neutral does nothing good or nothing bad, yes it is surprising sugar was placed there, but it's totally up to you whether to use it or not, I try to use very few neutrals (seems like a waste of money to me) but to each it's own.

I know you know all this, but wanted to put it in prospective, sometimes that helps.
Posted by: Lola, Friday, October 16, 2009, 12:14am; Reply: 2
where did agave nectar fall?
Posted by: Lola, Friday, October 16, 2009, 12:34am; Reply: 3
Honey has Glucose, Maltose, and Galactose

while sugar is composed of Sucrose only.....
that could be a possible reason
Posted by: Cristina, Friday, October 16, 2009, 12:41am; Reply: 4
Quoted from Lola
where did agave nectar fall?


Agave Syrup is together with Fructose, Molasses, Rice Syrup, Roselle, Stevia and the sugars: Neutrals.

My SF sweet is Maple Syrup  with Barley Malt a diamond (but I do not know if that is a sweetener or condiment, have not used the stuff).

I used maple syrup in my breakfast today instead of honey.  You know me, I query things but I am a good girl and do as I am told.  I bring his up just in case it could be a functioning mistake and to satisfy my inner need to rationalise and understand things better.  

But, in saying that, I am also guided by my intuition, which today is telling me to back off honey a bit.  Posting the possible reasons under my SwamiXpress thread.  :) :)
Posted by: Ribbit, Friday, October 16, 2009, 12:56am; Reply: 5
My SWAMI says the same thing.  Honey a black dot and sugar neutral.
Posted by: Symbi, Friday, October 16, 2009, 1:26am; Reply: 6
Honey has a risk of contamination with botulism (not recommended to feed to babies before 1 yo).  Check out potential health hazards on wikipedia page (it may not be fully accurate) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honey

Like most things probably Ok in moderation.
Posted by: Lola, Friday, October 16, 2009, 1:52am; Reply: 7
barley malt was discussed the other day.

I have the impression it is powdered sprouted barley......
but others buy it in jars like a very thick molasses type paste.
Posted by: Kumar, Friday, October 16, 2009, 4:46am; Reply: 8
Cristina,

I do have the same question in mind. Though there is so far no specific answer to your (and mine too) question, Lola hints at possible problems with the different types of "sugar" found in honey. I would not here mix up the issue with the issue of contamination, as any food could be contaminated and we know that honey is a superfood for a teacher type. Let's see if someone more knowledgable shares her/his expertise on this very specific question.
Posted by: Cristina, Friday, October 16, 2009, 6:49am; Reply: 9
Quoted from Lola
Honey has Glucose, Maltose, and Galactose

while sugar is composed of Sucrose only.....
that could be a possible reason


On the right track Lola, as usual.  I searched for the composition of honey and I find this link which establishes that honey has 38.5g of fructose per 100g.  
http://www.honey-well.com/composit.html

and this other article stating the detrimental health effects of fructose in our diet:
http://wilstar.com/lowcarb/fructose.htm

My SwamiX indicates that foods high in fructose, Ghycemix index and pesticide residue get Moderate Deemphasis, hence the rating of honey.

This other article ties it all together.

http://www.healingdaily.com/detoxification-diet/sugar.htm  

My honey is raw, therefore full of enzymes and healing properties.  I agree with the article though, overindulgence makes honey detrimental to our health, eaten as a medicine, when needed and appropriate is excellent!!   :)
Posted by: Amazone I., Friday, October 16, 2009, 7:37am; Reply: 10
can't have neither nor.... :P(constipated).....
Posted by: italybound, Friday, October 16, 2009, 8:32am; Reply: 11
Quoted from geminisue
black dot is a temporary halt for about three months, to give your body a chance to heal without it, than you can add it back in and see how it affects your individual body and decide whether to keep it in or not.


aren't black dots not only supposed to be avoided for a 3 mth stretch, but then rarely used thereafter? maybe I understand this wrong. ??)
Posted by: Cristina, Friday, October 16, 2009, 9:51am; Reply: 12
Quoted from italybound


aren't black dots not only supposed to be avoided for a 3 mth stretch, but then rarely used thereafter? maybe I understand this wrong. ??)


Black dots are a flag for me to avoid all the time and only have them if desperate enough for some forceful situation. But then, I am still trying to reach my goal weight and anything with the word 'avoid' attached to it is a no no.

It is true what Gemminisue says about though, it is written all over our Swami's for each category, Black Dots can be re-introduced in the diet after a 'wash out' period of about 60 days and at our own evaluation.  If you are well enough, your health is in balanced and you do not need medication, black dots may be consumed, (in moderation) particularly those with known minerals and vitamins strengths.   :) :)

PS: I misread your post IB, and I agree with what you are saying, when introducing these black dots, you are still only consuming them very sparingly.  There will always be something in them that made them an avoid for your system.  It is just that a healthy, balanced body is able to handle the negative side of it and absorb whatever goodness that particular food offers.  It is a matter of calculated risk when you do it on your own... Not something I will choose to live with most of the time.

That is the beauty of owning a SwamiX, because as we go along getting better, we get to untick some boxes in Swami and then those black dots and avoids could move up the ratings with blessings for our consumption.
Posted by: Symbi, Friday, October 16, 2009, 9:59am; Reply: 13
Quoted from Kumar
Cristina,

I do have the same question in mind. Though there is so far no specific answer to your (and mine too) question, Lola hints at possible problems with the different types of "sugar" found in honey. I would not here mix up the issue with the issue of contamination, as any food could be contaminated and we know that honey is a superfood for a teacher type. Let's see if someone more knowledgable shares her/his expertise on this very specific question.


Good point, though I dislike the accusation that came with it of not being knowledgable.  No one will really know why it is good or bad for Warriors except Dr D, we can all only guess.  For all we know it could be an acetylation issue with one of the contaminants or the sugar type.  I was well aware of the fructose content having IBS and honey bothers me if I'm having a flare up.  Because of the contaminants it wasn't recommended to feed it to my baby.
Posted by: Kumar, Friday, October 16, 2009, 10:46am; Reply: 14
Thanks Ghee Whiz. Now we are closer towards the knowledge after your point on acetylation. Never mind my use of the word knowledgable. In the blood type diet (basefood value), we have answers to why some food are beneficial and why some are bad. May be one day we will have a similar table for GTD too.
Posted by: Plucky, Friday, October 16, 2009, 2:28pm; Reply: 15
Thinking about the contaminant/botulism side of things, isn't it possible that certain genotypes are more succeptible to those types of infections, making foods that are more likely to be contaminated an avoid?  I guess I'm thinking about O's and molds, and how some of the foods we are supposed to avoid are because of the higher mold contents and not so much the foods themselves.
Posted by: Lola, Friday, October 16, 2009, 4:28pm; Reply: 16
corn based fructose is best avoided for those susceptible
http://www.cornallergens.com/list/corn-allergen-list.php
Posted by: Agathe, Friday, October 16, 2009, 5:01pm; Reply: 17
I understand your disappointment, Cristina. I felt like you about "loosing" honey when I was a Warrior (when I genotyped myself according to the GTD book).

Quoted from Cristina
What makes my beautiful, unadulterated, home grown honey, produced from hard working bees by collecting pollen from Tea tree forest across the road or the many herbs and wild booms around the place, rate less than processed, chemically produced cane products like white and brown sugar?


You're a poet when you talk about honey !   :D

I also regard honey as a precious food and I think it's right to do so.

Since I am an Explorer (SWAMI), I have it back and I'm glad of it (SF).

When a Warrior, I tried Barley Malt. It's a sweetener, but not very sweet actually. When I first tried it I recalled it was a component of a restorative sirup my mother administrated to us children in winter. Its taste is difficult to compare with anything else but it is good, to my taste.
Posted by: Chloe, Friday, October 16, 2009, 5:51pm; Reply: 18
Go figure, honey is a "diamond" food for me.  Sugar is a black dot.  Barley malt a
diamond and barley as a grain, a black dot.

As for the portion of these sweeteners listed on my SWAMI...one teaspoon is the recommendation.  
Posted by: 815 (Guest), Friday, October 16, 2009, 5:59pm; Reply: 19
Quoted from italybound

aren't black dots not only supposed to be avoided for a 3 mth stretch, but then rarely used thereafter? maybe I understand this wrong. ??)


Quoted from my SWAMI "After that, you can then carefully reintroduce these foods back into your diet"  I don't see anywhere "rarely" on my SWAMI. You, your self knows how much black dot foods you can eat.  :)
Posted by: Symbi, Saturday, October 17, 2009, 12:46am; Reply: 20
Quoted from Kumar
Thanks Ghee Whiz. Now we are closer towards the knowledge after your point on acetylation. Never mind my use of the word knowledgable. In the blood type diet (basefood value), we have answers to why some food are beneficial and why some are bad. May be one day we will have a similar table for GTD too.


Hey no worries Kumar.  Sorry I'm not feeling too good having a flare up at the mo.  You're right, I really like in the blood type diet there was an explanation of why some foods were good in the introduction to each food group section and in the text.  Unfortunately, since Dr D has said he's not writing any more books, our chances are slim of finding out the whys behind GTD.  :(

We can guess though and have fun doing so, and all learn things.  The other day I looked up Cinnamon wondering why it's an avoid for Explorers.  It has many medicinal uses but also contains a small amount of a toxic component called coumarin which is linked with liver and kidney damage.  We don't need the damage and perhaps we wouldn't acetylate that very well as we often overact to toxins.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cinnamon

About the honey, Cristina, your honey sounds beautiful, I think you could sell alot of jars to us after your description.  
Barley malt should be yummy if it's anything like the barley lollies I used to love as a kid.  Guess it might taste a bit like the malt in beer?
Posted by: Kumar, Saturday, October 17, 2009, 4:50am; Reply: 21
Yes, I wish I could get all the honey from Cristina! (I start my morning with lime-honey water everyday.) Well, Cristina, in a matter of six months, your body weight will come about to 65KGs and then you can reintroduce honey in your life but not possibly for every day but one/twice a day. Also about sugar: though it is listed as neutral for warriors (because it does not fit into the criteria of avoids), I would rather be cautious about this particular item (because of its ability to suppress immune system, create insulin resistance and so on.) In our country, we get the unprocessed one (we call Saccar) which is made by freezing boiled sugar cane juice! Such a good substitute for sugar!
Posted by: Cristina, Saturday, October 17, 2009, 6:27am; Reply: 22
GW, cinnamon is a superfood for me, together with chocolate.  The only time I use cinnamon is sprinkle in my coffee if I use Soymilk (which is a SF for me now).  But I am planning to learn a bit more about using it in other things.

But going back to the honey vs sugar issue, yes Kumar, I trust honey more than I trust sugar, which although in my Neutrals I am chosing not to use.  I will not use honey either being an avoid now, not for the time being. So, my visitors will benefit, they usually walk out with a jar of honey and a dozen eggs ...  

Keeping in perspective we are all unique, toxins for some, medicine for others: same food.
Posted by: Fernando Boto, Saturday, October 17, 2009, 7:40am; Reply: 23
Quoted from Agathe
When a Warrior, I tried Barley Malt. It's a sweetener, but not very sweet actually. When I first tried it I recalled it was a component of a restorative sirup my mother administrated to us children in winter. Its taste is difficult to compare with anything else but it is good, to my taste.


Cadbury's chocolates have a product called "whispers", a small chocolate ball with a crisp melting center. That center is barley malt. Does anyone remember a Milo type drink called Ovomaltine? That particular taste was due to barley malt.

However, as a sweetner, not very effective. If I happen to by a jar, I eat it by the teaspoon full, then it tastes nice.

Posted by: Cristina, Saturday, October 17, 2009, 8:42am; Reply: 24
FB,

yum, yum   (drool)(drool) :) :)
Posted by: Symbi, Saturday, October 17, 2009, 9:27am; Reply: 25
Cristina, I only put the cinnamon info as an example of how we can enjoy guessing what is behind the workings of the GTD.  It's good in a way that it makes us wonder and it's fun to guess and research things.  Enjoying finding out about foods I've never heard of before.  Of course Warriors would not be the same as Explorers, for one thing, being at opposite end of the scales in Acetylation.

BTW I've been researching the Custard apple family and will post on the Aussie thread in the next few days.  Like the new summary thread thanks - easy to find!

Reminds me of a part from the Monty Python Movie, The Life of Brian,

Quoted Text
Brian: Please, please, please listen! I've got one or two things to say.
The Crowd: Tell us! Tell us both of them!
Brian: Look, you've got it all wrong! You don't NEED to follow ME, You don't NEED to follow ANYBODY! You've got to think for your selves! You're ALL individuals!
The Crowd: Yes! We're all individuals!
Brian: You're all different!
The Crowd: Yes, we ARE all different!
Man in crowd: I'm not...
The Crowd: Sch!
Posted by: Cristina, Saturday, October 17, 2009, 9:47am; Reply: 26
;D ;D ;D
Posted by: Symbi, Saturday, October 17, 2009, 10:54am; Reply: 27
Quoted from Cristina
GW, cinnamon is a superfood for me, together with chocolate.  The only time I use cinnamon is sprinkle in my coffee if I use Soymilk (which is a SF for me now).  But I am planning to learn a bit more about using it in other things.


I love cinnamon and it's one of <10 spices and herbs in my cubboard - wouldn't you know, and now it's an avoid.  Not as bad as like, growing it like your honey though.  

It tastes nice with steamed apple!
Posted by: Agathe, Saturday, October 17, 2009, 6:01pm; Reply: 28
Quoted from Fernando Boto
Does anyone remember a Milo type drink called Ovomaltine? That particular taste was due to barley malt.


Oh yes, I do remember Ovomaltine. I loved it as a kid.

It is a swiss product, did you know ?

One still can purchase it in its solid form "Ovosport". I'd say it is a healthy energy bar. It is made of eggs, chocolate, sugar and barley malt. It contains a lot of vitamins : http://www.wander.ch/fr/nutritioninfo.htm?nutriTextId=9308. Maybe a good snack for those who need to gain weight. (Not my case   :'()



Posted by: Agathe, Saturday, October 17, 2009, 6:05pm; Reply: 29
Quoted from Fernando Boto
Does anyone remember a Milo type drink called Ovomaltine? That particular taste was due to barley malt.


Oh yes, I do remember Ovomaltine. I loved it as a kid. It is a swiss product, did you know ?

One still can purchase it in its solid form "Ovosport". I'd say it is a healthy energy bar. It is made of eggs, chocolate, sugar and barley malt. It contains a lot of vitamins : http://www.wander.ch/fr/nutritioninfo.htm?nutriTextId=9308. Maybe a good snack for those who need to gain weight. (Not my case   :'()



Posted by: C_Sharp, Saturday, October 17, 2009, 6:45pm; Reply: 30
Quoted from Agathe


Oh yes, I do remember Ovomaltine. I loved it as a kid.

It is a swiss product, did you know ?

One still can purchase it in its solid form "Ovosport".



In the states you can still purchase the beverage mix.  We misspell the product "Ovaltine."
Posted by: Curious, Saturday, October 17, 2009, 11:17pm; Reply: 31
I would never eat sugar, no matter what SWAMI or anything/anyone else said.
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