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Posted by: Constantine, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 1:18am
I notice that SWAMI asks for your MB type (ISTJ, INTP, etc.)  Is this for research purposes or does this directly go into calculating your GenoType?

If the latter, it'd be interesting to know the correlations, particularly for the Nomad type.  But I don't remember reading about anything like this in the GenoType book.  Maybe I missed something....  Anybody have any info on this?
Posted by: C_Sharp, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 1:30am; Reply: 1
When you have Myer Briggs profile that match your GenoType, you will see comments like this in the diet report:

# MBI EI(E) Attitude suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Nomad.
# MBI JP(P) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Nomad.

SWAMI does use Myers Briggs to help determine GenoType.

Look in the strength testing section of your diet report:

Quoted Text
What Makes You a GT6 Nomad:

Calculator Choice: Using Standard GenoType Calculation Tools.
Results

The six GenoTypes described by Dr. D'Adamo are very broad characterizations; no individual is purely one GenoType. Since many of the GenoType characteristics overlap, most people will have aspects of at least two or more GenoTypes. However SWAMI Xpress uses powerful statistical tools to calculate which single GenoType best captures the highest degree of your unique variation.

Your results: XX % of your epigenetic variation is encapsulated in the GT6 Nomad profile.



Interpretation: Good Association with GT6 Nomad

There is significant degree of your epigenetic variation encapsulated within this GenoType. Following the guidelines for this GenoType should have a beneficial dietary effect on healthy genetic expression

The Nomad Inventory


These are the findings which identified your GenoType as Nomad. To learn more about these tests and measurements, consult chapters 3 and 4 in The GenoType Diet book.

Calculator Points:

    * Torso to Leg Ratio /Characteristic of Nomad.
          ...

Strength Testing, First Pass

    * ....
Strength Testing, Second Pass

    * Generally Myers Briggs comments are here if you had a personality profile indicative of your GenoType

Posted by: Cristina, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 1:51am; Reply: 2
Does this mean that it is better to have a MB profile done?
Posted by: C_Sharp, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 2:14am; Reply: 3
Quoted from Cristina
Does this mean that it is better to have a MB profile done?


If you do not know Myer Briggs personality type, you should take one of the online quizzes to determine it.  Several are free and just take a little bit of time to answer the questions:

http://www.dadamo.com/personality/ei.htm
http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/JTypes2.asp

Posted by: Constantine, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 2:31am; Reply: 4
Oh, I was wondering what that line meant...

"MBI JP(P) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Nomad."

I guess my being a "P" is Nomad-like.  I wonder if a specific type has been sifted from the Nomad data, or if only <=3 dimensions correlate.

Maybe later I'll go fool around with SWAMI try to find out.
Posted by: Kristi, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 2:50am; Reply: 5
lol....I love Myers-Briggs! Depending on my Gemini mood... changes me from and E to an I... and back again... which also changes my SWAMI from Explorer to Teacher...and back again.  ;D

The lists are very similar thankfully... I'm playing with checking in... am I feeling extroverted or introverted... before I make a meal...and choose my food options accordingly. I'm sure that I'll figure out which MB I am more often than not...and land on one list.   8)

Loving playing and adventuring with SWAMI!  :K)


Kristi
A+
mama bear to
four O+ cubs
blending 5 food lists is my job!
Posted by: C_Sharp, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 2:50am; Reply: 6
These are what suggest Nomad:

# MBI EI(E) Attitude suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Nomad.
# MBI SN(S) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Nomad.
# MBI TF(F) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Nomad.
# MBI JP(P) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Nomad.
Posted by: Constantine, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 2:59am; Reply: 7
Yeah, Nomads are more often ESFPs.  Explorers tend to be INFPs I think.

Apparently the INTP isn't even common w/in the B blood type.
Posted by: glamour, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 4:15am; Reply: 8
I was waiting on my secreter test to determine my genotype. Now that I took this Briggs test is is saying I am "Hunter" no matter which way I set the secreter results. This just blows my mind~
Posted by: Cristina, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 4:43am; Reply: 9
What are ENFJ - GT wise
Posted by: Lola, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 5:05am; Reply: 10
no idea
Posted by: C_Sharp, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 5:34am; Reply: 11
Cristina: Like any other single factor personality profile does not by itself indicate GenoType.

Since you are an A, I only ran possibilities for A. For each possible GenoType you match 2 out 4 of the personality traits.

GenoType Teacher:

# MBI EI(I) Attitude suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Teacher.
# MBI SN(S) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Teacher.
# MBI TF(F) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Teacher.
# MBI JP(J) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Teacher.


GenoType Warrior

# MBI EI(E) Attitude suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Warrior.
# MBI SN(N) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Warrior.
# MBI TF(T) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Warrior.
# MBI JP(P) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Warrior.


GenoType Explorer:

# MBI EI(I) Attitude suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Explorer.
# MBI SN(N) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Explorer.
# MBI TF(F) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Explorer.
# MBI JP(P) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Explorer.
Posted by: Amazone I., Sunday, September 20, 2009, 7:09am; Reply: 12
8/9 in the enneagram ;) ;D.....
Posted by: shells, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 11:21am; Reply: 13
C_sharp thank you, that is fascinating but would it be possible to run an 'O' possibility?  At the moment I am coming out like Warrior ENTP but some days I am INTP and was wondering if I show more like Hunter or Gatherer?   ::)   :)
Posted by: C_Sharp, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 1:26pm; Reply: 14
Hunter: INTJ
Gatherer ESTJ




Just to state the obvious: There are 16 Personality profiles and 6 GenoTypes. 10 out of 16 personality profile will not correspond with a GenoType.

If you match a personality profile, it does not mean you are that GenoType.  For instance an O that has a Myers Briggs profile of a Nomad, will definitely not be a Nomad.
Posted by: glamour, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 1:43pm; Reply: 15
I got ISTJ and INFJ and both changed my genotype to Hunter.
Posted by: paul clucas, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 7:13pm; Reply: 16
You would expect all 16 Personality types to be present in differing percentages in a population of any particular Genotype, or a population of any Blood type for that matter.

Gotta love the research possibilities.  

Is research on a randomly selected population being done to validate (in terms of statistics) Dr. D'Adamo's work? Perhaps this would be too expensive for the resulting benefit, since the information will be willingly ignored by most people who could make use of it.
Posted by: Cristina, Sunday, September 20, 2009, 8:47pm; Reply: 17
Quoted from paul clucas

.......
Is research on a randomly selected population being done to validate (in terms of statistics) Dr. D'Adamo's work? Perhaps this would be too expensive for the resulting benefit, since the information will be willingly ignored by most people who could make use of it.


In the GT book under the world views chapter, Dr D clearly explains the effect that our personalities can have in our bodies from a simple smile to a burst of rage (probably not in exact words).  It makes sense though, to consider these traits on our personalities in the total assessment of our lifestyle for better health.  Even, a lay person like me can see that, so you would hope that there should be many other professionals out there taking this seriously.  But then, that could be my idealistic Teacher personality coming through ...
Posted by: misspudding, Wednesday, October 29, 2014, 1:03am; Reply: 18
I'd like to see more values for Myers Briggs and Genotype. Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but anyone feel like chiming in? :)

I'm an explorer and very ENTP. My hubby's more Hunter and ISTJ/INTJ. He's an introvert, very detail-oriented, very organized. I'm extroverted, more of a big-picture thinker (but good with details...the only question I'm really on the fence with), and messy!
Posted by: san j, Wednesday, October 29, 2014, 4:55am; Reply: 19
Quoted from paul clucas
You would expect all 16 Personality types to be present in differing percentages in a population of any particular Genotype, or a population of any Blood type for that matter.

Ah, paul clucas -- Mr. Common Sense!
Thank you, Paul, for resisting the temptation to assign a Myers-Briggs type to each Genotype.  :)

Posted by: misspudding, Wednesday, October 29, 2014, 5:17am; Reply: 20
But Myers Briggs is being used for genotyping, per SWAMI, right? So obviously, some genotypes are associated with certain character traits.
Posted by: Munchkin76, Wednesday, October 29, 2014, 8:41am; Reply: 21
I just did the MBTI again and came out INFJ. When I updated SWAMI it changed my Hunter % up two points to 68% - cool. INJ are all strength test points associated with Hunters apparently.
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, October 29, 2014, 9:21am; Reply: 22
yep Munschkin76 a lot of the O's are or I or ENFP/J's = hunterlike ;) ;D....

gatherer's often correspond more to no 3 in the enneagram (no name ) or 2=ESFP/J or no 9 = isfp/j

but this also might correlate to the primair types 3-6-9 of the enneagram ;)....


and I think and observed Explorer's often are no 1 or 5ves in the Enneagram-Peter describes us merely as extraverts... so far no 1...ENTP/J ;)... but last not least we're coming up in both segments...(woot)(hehe)(smarty)
Posted by: Serenity, Wednesday, October 29, 2014, 10:00am; Reply: 23
ENTP must be typical of warriors as my profile lists my E & N as warrior traits but not my F & J.
INFP must indeed be usual for explorers as my explorer son's I & N are counted in his swami but not his T & J as characteristic of explorers.
My eldest son (probably explorer also) is an ENFP.
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, October 29, 2014, 10:56am; Reply: 24
sorry must deny... ENTP/J & intp/j typical explorers...wariors almost ESTP/J but also can go into direction ENFP/J... ;)

but when understood how the enneagram describes the desintegrative ways... so ESTP/J's are hoppeling indeed into the false direction while whooping up to ENTP/J's ;) :D... :X

the same for the ENTP/J's whooping up into direction infp/j... :o :-/....(1=4 means oops...danger )

I also often saw teachers might be infp's or isfp's ;) ;D....

Btw... the enneagram is an agreed psychological system and tool and it also is comparable to MBTI but not that much into the Prof. Keirsey's system.. but here and there are some cofactors to be found...

(goofy)(smarty)(whistle)
Posted by: Serenity, Wednesday, October 29, 2014, 11:20am; Reply: 25
I might remeasure my youngest son as he has grown a lot since we first got swami for him, maybe he is a warrior, he has the height (very long legs) & has large head which fits into warrior type (very serious & an excellent science/maths student which i guess is more warrior like)
Posted by: Munchkin76, Wednesday, October 29, 2014, 12:51pm; Reply: 26
Quoted from Amazone I.
yep Munschkin76 a lot of the O's are or I or ENFP/J's = hunterlike ;) ;D....

gatherer's often correspond more to no 3 in the enneagram (no name ) or 2=ESFP/J or no 9 = isfp/j

but this also might correlate to the primair types 3-6-9 of the enneagram ;)....


and I think and observed Explorer's often are no 1 or 5ves in the Enneagram-Peter describes us merely as extraverts... so far no 1...ENTP/J ;)... but last not least we're coming up in both segments...(woot)(hehe)(smarty)


Spot on Isa  ;D I'm a 9 on the enneagram too!

Andy
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, October 29, 2014, 5:36pm; Reply: 27
;) :K) :D ;D

habibi  mio please get more  informed about nf's and s...p's or j's ??`) ;).. chuckle.. ;D
Posted by: SquarePeg, Wednesday, October 29, 2014, 5:59pm; Reply: 28
I'm very much an Explorer and very much N and P, but I'm balanced on the E/I and T/F.
Posted by: jayneeo, Thursday, October 30, 2014, 1:07am; Reply: 29
gatherer-enfp-enneatype 2.
Posted by: Amazone I., Thursday, October 30, 2014, 7:42am; Reply: 30
so you seem onto the integrative  journey ;) dearest jayneeo ....ENFP =8/7 in the enneagram  and when diving direction 2 it means...bravo ;) ;D....(clap)(ok)(dance)

btw I also observed and think that our ground types are or NT,NF,SP or SJ and then must be balanced by other types...and as we're hoppeling around in the whole enneagram, so it means we're all in one...;) (angel)(happy)... it depends of our options for growth and readyness to make further paths into the right direction... meant here is...we need all to take care and being aware in not letting taking grip over us by our so called *persona* !!!(evil)(eek)(scared)(hand)(book2)
Posted by: san j, Tuesday, February 17, 2015, 8:43am; Reply: 31
Quoted from Amazone I.
a lot of the O's are or I or ENFP/J's

Keirsey estimates that approx. 2% of the population is ENFP, and approx. 5% are ENFJ.
He says that the INFJ's and INFP's comprise only approx. 1%, each, of the population.


Seeing as blood type O is found in at least 44% of the world population, it's completely incompatible with your beloved Keirsey's findings to say "a lot of the O's are I or ENFP/J's", as Keirsey believes that no more than 10% of the world population is NF. Seeing as much of that NF population does not have bloodtype O, you are saying that Keirsey's numbers are way, way off.
Which, of course, you have every right to do, if that's what you believe.
But you, on the same day, were talking about "the Prof. Keirsey's system", and I thought you respected his findings, so there seems to be a discrepancy.  ??)
Posted by: Patty H, Tuesday, February 17, 2015, 12:37pm; Reply: 32
Quoted from Amazone I.
yep Munschkin76 a lot of the O's are or I or ENFP/J's = hunterlike ;) ;D....

gatherer's often correspond more to no 3 in the enneagram (no name ) or 2=ESFP/J or no 9 = isfp/j

but this also might correlate to the primair types 3-6-9 of the enneagram ;)....


and I think and observed Explorer's often are no 1 or 5ves in the Enneagram-Peter describes us merely as extraverts... so far no 1...ENTP/J ;)... but last not least we're coming up in both segments...(woot)(hehe)(smarty)


Another Hunter who is ENFP here.

I don't know my enneagram, but am interested in figuring that out.  

One thing that is interesting to note - I ran my SwamiXP2 as both a Hunter and Explorer because my leg to torso ratio is extremely close by 1/2 in or less.  When I run it with my legs longer, I type as Hunter.  When I run it with my legs and torso equal, I type as Explorer.

When I look at the Strength Testing, Second Pass for both Genotypes, Hunter only says MBI SN(N) whereas Explorer says MBI JP(P), MBI SN(N) and MBI TF(F).  

Am I reading this incorrectly or is ENFP more strongly associated with Explorer vs. Hunter?

Just curious, Isa . . .
Posted by: Patty H, Tuesday, February 17, 2015, 7:29pm; Reply: 33
Quoted from jayneeo
gatherer-enfp-enneatype 2.


Jayneo and Amazone, I just did the test, so I am also ennetype 2 and ENFP.  
Posted by: Patty H, Tuesday, February 17, 2015, 7:36pm; Reply: 34
Quoted from paul clucas
You would expect all 16 Personality types to be present in differing percentages in a population of any particular Genotype, or a population of any Blood type for that matter.

Gotta love the research possibilities.  

Is research on a randomly selected population being done to validate (in terms of statistics) Dr. D'Adamo's work? Perhaps this would be too expensive for the resulting benefit, since the information will be willingly ignored by most people who could make use of it.


Paul,
Maybe you could set up a poll since many of us here know our genotype and our MB type if we are using SWAMI.  We all know our blood type, so that would be interesting since certain genotypes correlate with certain MB Types, which correlate with certain blood types.
Posted by: cajun, Tuesday, February 17, 2015, 8:38pm; Reply: 35
Any other teachers or teacher/explorers out there with ISFJ?
Just curious.
Posted by: san j, Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 12:59am; Reply: 36
Quoted from C_Sharp

SWAMI does use Myers Briggs to help determine GenoType.

Look in the strength testing section of your diet report:

...
These are what suggest Nomad:

# MBI EI(E) Attitude suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Nomad.
# MBI SN(S) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Nomad.
# MBI TF(F) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Nomad.
# MBI JP(P) Function suggestive of GenoType /Characteristic of Nomad.


Immediately after your second post, C_Sharp, the OP'er concluded:
Quoted from Constantine
Yeah, Nomads are more often ESFPs.  Explorers tend to be INFPs I think.

...which, logically, of course doesn't follow, given how genotypes are strength-tested.

A good way to understand this is to use the following from the book, The Genotype Diet:
Strength-Testing Charts for each genotype (pp.98-103) show EIGHT different items per Strength Test.
You or SWAMI may take any one of them, say, "Taster" PROP status, and say : This skews the result toward GT-3 Teacher or GT-6 Nomad.
Now - the individual may have blood type O, making that impossible. Therefore, Taster-status is rejected as relevant.
Likewise, a person may score highest for Warrior but be kept up all night by  morning drafts of caffeinated drinks; the latter strength-tests against Warrior likelihood but is irrelevant to his dominant Genotype's identity.

C_Sharp, you are naming individual - that is, separate - factors for, for instance, Nomadhood:
Extraversion is one.
Dominant Sensation Function is another, and separate, one.
etc.
But this doesn't at all imply that ALL FOUR mbti elements are therefore "the likeliest of the 16 mbti types" to be a Nomad; this ascribes way too much weight to these data.
What it does tell us is that, in Dr. D'Adamo's opinion, the "P" trait, for instance, -- all by itself -- can skew a strength-test toward a Nomad or a Warrior or an Explorer tendency.

Each type has four elements/traits/letters of the alphabet - one from each pair.
E/I, S/N, F/T, J/P.
And each letter is linked to certain strength-testing probabilities.
But each of the 16 four-letter-types is not so linked.
I'm sorry if that's difficult to understand, but suffice it to say, the four different strength-test factors cannot be bundled in such a way as to dominate computation such that Genotype can be skewed by the resultant mutable personality groupings... or vice versa. The numbers don't add up - Sorry.

Excellent example:
There's someone on this thread who says she tests very strongly on one end of the E/I spectrum but not on the T/F spectrum, where she tests right in the middle: This is a perfect example -- it renders the T/F data unusable, but permits her, due to its replicability, to enter the Extraversion into her strength-testing for Genotype. That's why the MBTI types are un-bundled:
To Make Their Components Useable as Strength-Testers.  ;)
Posted by: The Mystic, Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 1:09am; Reply: 37
My MB results 'hot off the press'

INFP

Introverted (I) 58.33% Extroverted (E) 41.67%
Intuitive (N) 62.5% Sensing (S) 37.5%
Feeling (F) 54.17% Thinking (T) 45.83%
Perceiving (P) 62.5% Judging (J) 37.5%

INFP - "Questor". High capacity for caring.
Emotional face to the world.
High sense of honor derived from internal values.
4.4% of total population.

Don't know how this relates to being a Hunter.
Being a meditator for nearly 40 years likely influenced this result.
Posted by: san j, Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 1:26am; Reply: 38
Thanks for providing us with this example, AH!

You show I and F quite weakly over their opposites - therefore they're not particularly admissible as strength-testers.

N and P are somewhat stronger, but IMO not very powerful indicators.

A 10% difference either way, when you take an MBTI test in the future, and you're a different type altogether!

When you think of Taster Status, for instance, there are Tasters and there are SUPER-Tasters --
Your MBTI elements are weakly present but not really powerful.
Maybe Dr. D'Adamo will, in future versions, standardize an MBTI questionnaire and require a statistically significant reading (or Score) of a given element to include it as a strength test.

It's kin'a like saying you're using your parent's Cancer for strength testing, but only one of your parents had only one small basal cell lesion removed from a hand in his or her youth and then went on to live another 60 years with no more cancers -- you have to question how much it can really "count"... :-/
JMO, folks.  :)
Posted by: The Mystic, Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 1:40am; Reply: 39
I agree San j. I even asked Lola if I should take it once or twice more. It didn't seem very reliable to me. For example, when I took it, I wasn't in the mood to see myself as one extreme or the other. So, I checked the inner 'boxes'. On a day when I am more honest with seeing myself, I would likely check the definitive extreme. Does that make sense?

I took this test in graduate school and I think the letters were the same. It's hard to remember back that far though. (ondrugs)
Posted by: Patty H, Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 1:43am; Reply: 40
Quoted from san j
Thanks for providing us with this example, AH!

You show I and F quite weakly over their opposites - therefore they're not particularly admissible as strength-testers.

N and P are somewhat stronger, but IMO not very powerful indicators.

A 10% difference either way, when you take an MBTI test in the future, and you're a different type altogether!

When you think of Taster Status, for instance, there are Tasters and there are SUPER-Tasters --
Your MBTI elements are weakly present but not really powerful.
Maybe Dr. D'Adamo will, in future versions, standardize an MBTI questionnaire and require a statistically significant reading (or Score) of a given element to include it as a strength test.

It's kin'a like saying you're using your parent's Cancer for strength testing, but only one of your parents had only one small basal cell lesion removed from a hand in his or her youth and then went on to live another 60 years with no more cancers -- you have to question how much it can really "count"... :-/
JMO, folks.  :)


San J, I know you are working diligently to try to figure this out.  Dr. D has factored this into SWAMI and he has applied values to the different Meyers Briggs types, so I am not sure why you are trying to second guess the work he has already done.

Maybe you should consider purchasing a SWAMI since you already know your genotype and all of this can be figured out for you through the magic of his amazing computer program.
Posted by: The Mystic, Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 5:23am; Reply: 41
Quoted from san j
Thanks for providing us with this example, AH!

Soon I will be doing the Swami Pro. As per my instructions, I only need the four letters:

INfP

I will take the test again in about 10 days and will more realistically select 'strong' outside circles when appropriate rather than going down the middle. I assure you it will only get more percentage of INFP - not weaker.
Posted by: san j, Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 7:11am; Reply: 42
Oh, I see, AH; trying to tone yourself down, are ya? (smarty)
Be Who You Be, luv.
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 9:36am; Reply: 43
comparing MBTI-test versus the Enneagram...versus Prof.Keirsey's *pygmalion project* abd "please understand me* booklets no I and II

there are several differences in those tests and often NF or NT- traits are mingeled ...mixed or vice versa changed...
therefore I think better to go for several different testforms..incl. http://www.eclecticenergies.com   ;) here you get all the hosts and wings which seems to make up your self... ;D(smarty)(cool)(shrug)(clown)

as we're hoppeling around in the whole enneagram- so far so well we can show up with various types but we only come along with one true type describing our so called *persona* in action to deal with the world... ;) :o ::)

I don't think we're really able to fix any type to bt's in any form... we're that changeable...I jstamente tested somebody lately as an ESFJ...male Abt...but next sunday he confirmed being an ESTJ which fits him muchmore .... also a question of how we do see ourselfs in a certain form of reality... our realities!!! :X

I think also there are some tendencies but it always depends onto the situations we're confronted with...
Posted by: rosa, Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 12:02pm; Reply: 44
Like others, I'm not entirely sure how personality traits relate to genotype.
I'm more attracted to Enneagram than Myers-Briggs though.
Me - Gatherer/ I/ENFJ, enneagram 9.
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 12:39pm; Reply: 45
oops sorry can't be...EnfJ= no 8/9 in the enneagram... ;) ;D :D
infj=4/5....  
9 in the enneagram is or isfp/j...often confonded...(whistle)
Posted by: rosa, Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 12:51pm; Reply: 46
Must re-do myers-briggs then!!
I'm quite sure I'm enneagram 9 though...have done it several times over the years, same result!
Posted by: Patty H, Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 2:02pm; Reply: 47
Quoted from Cristina


In the GT book under the world views chapter, Dr D clearly explains the effect that our personalities can have in our bodies from a simple smile to a burst of rage (probably not in exact words).  It makes sense though, to consider these traits on our personalities in the total assessment of our lifestyle for better health.  Even, a lay person like me can see that, so you would hope that there should be many other professionals out there taking this seriously.  But then, that could be my idealistic Teacher personality coming through ...


Dr. D referenced personality traits in ER4YT as well.  It is the last entry for each individual blood type in Part II, Your Blood Type Plan.  Obviously, he has found a link to personality traits among the four blood types and it appears he has expanded this work to include Meyers Briggs information into SWAMI.
Posted by: The Mystic, Thursday, February 19, 2015, 4:11am; Reply: 48
Quoted from The Mystic
I agree San j. I even asked Lola if I should take it once or twice more. It didn't seem very reliable to me. For example, when I took it, I wasn't in the mood to see myself as one extreme or the other. So, I checked the inner 'boxes'. On a day when I am more honest with seeing myself, I would likely check the definitive extreme. Does that make sense?

I took this test in graduate school and I think the letters were the same. It's hard to remember back that far though. (ondrugs)

What I seem to be facing with this test is that I've changed so much even in the last few years. So, the dilemma is a struggle between who I was and who I am now. Aging and 40 years of meditation mellow a person considerably. I'm far less reactive.

The suggestion by Rosa and others to take the MB from other sites is excellent. The test I remember from the past the questions had a sentence to give them a context. But I could be remembering a different test.
Posted by: san j, Thursday, February 19, 2015, 4:31am; Reply: 49
Quoted from The Mystic

What I seem to be facing with this test is that I've changed so much even in the last few years. So, the dilemma is a struggle between who I was and who I am now. Aging and 40 years of meditation mellow a person considerably. I'm far less reactive.

The suggestion by Rosa and others to take the MB from other sites is excellent. The test I remember from the past the questions had a sentence to give them a context. But I could be remembering a different test.

AH, I actually like Myers-Briggs. There are many, many different interpretations of it, and, yes, questionnaires for it. There are many different uses made of it, too -- and not all of them are all that upstanding.
It has the potential to help an individual understand him/herself and others -- in order to make good career choices, for instance, and to help one understand interpersonal differences. The authors who focus on such uses of the test and its results are the ones I personally favor.

Most people, it seems, expect others to be like themselves. They have much trouble registering as positive or benign or even tolerable those who express themselves in ways unaccustomed to themselves. There may very well be Myers-Briggs-explainable reasons for that --  :D
But they are people who could probably most benefit from using this sort of knowledge to expose their minds to 15 other possible ways to view and live Life.  :)
Posted by: Amazone I., Thursday, February 19, 2015, 5:03pm; Reply: 50
we need to think about this very fact that the enneagram is an integrative Form of psychologcal issues...called system.. ;) and it isn't fix at all coz we do hopple around in the whole enneagram depending upon the situation but ther's on type we do use to deal with the world and this type is our *persona-shapement*...
The enneagram shows up what happens if.... meant here are or integratve ways or the desintegrative ways... so far so well this enables us to know us better and really prevents from any psychological disorders... this is it what I've observed since ^m also usng several systems to work wth clents or therapists and docs ... :D

So it isn't rigid at all and as once said... Briggs-Myers or also Myers-Briggs seem to confond NT's versus NF's...what the enneagram tries to get corrected.... viewed by my observations I think the founders of the enneagram are more right in their own observations...(smarty) but the booklet *gifts differing* shows very well what might be if some of our letters aren't well developed... here also a great gift... this booklet ... ;) ;D(clap)(ok)(woot)

Wish you all the best and have a fine time... hope spring will soon be there... it seems that the cold will leave us soon??)......
Posted by: The Mystic, Thursday, February 19, 2015, 9:30pm; Reply: 51
Amazone I., I just realized that you live in Switzerland. I gotta share something with you briefly. When LR4YT first came out, I sent a copy of the book to my friend in Brasil. She was so impressed with it that she sent a copy to her friend in Switzerland. So, now that Dr D's work has been translated into 65 languages, I feel the joy of knowing that I took part in that global process. (cool)  (smile)   (dance)  (woot)
Posted by: san j, Thursday, February 19, 2015, 9:33pm; Reply: 52
Quoted from Amazone I.
we need to think about this very fact that the enneagram is an integrative Form of psychologcal issues...called system.. ;) and it isn't fix at all coz we do hopple around in the whole enneagram depending upon the situation but ther's on type we do use to deal with the world and this type is our *persona-shapement*...
The enneagram shows up what happens if.... meant here are or integratve ways or the desintegrative ways... so far so well this enables us to know us better and really prevents from any psychological disorders... this is it what I've observed since ^m also usng several systems to work wth clents or therapists and docs ... :D

So it isn't rigid at all and as once said... Briggs-Myers or also Myers-Briggs seem to confond NT's versus NF's...what the enneagram tries to get corrected.... viewed by my observations I think the founders of the enneagram are more right in their own observations...(smarty) but the booklet *gifts differing* shows very well what might be if some of our letters aren't well developed... here also a great gift... this booklet ... ;) ;D(clap)(ok)(woot)

Wish you all the best and have a fine time... hope spring will soon be there... it seems that the cold will leave us soon??)......

I've given gifts of Gifts Differing (authors: Myers and Briggs-Myers!) and of a couple of Enneagram books*, Amazone I.
I do think there are some very positive applications of both systems.
Incidentally, I also very much like Marie-Louise von Franz's essay on The Inferior Function  -- Have your read that?

Note that there are a couple of basic differences between the classic Jungian/ Myers-Briggsian interpretive school and some of the others, especially where introversion is concerned. I am much more a fan of the Jungian/MB system -- not that the others doesn't have any uses, but they don't necessarily follow the classic teachings on Introversion, or the assumption of the Inferior Function, or the Transcendent Function, being more of a codification for use in Human Resources systems and the like. Yes, in a way this is "TMI", but if you're going to import a system, it's wise to know what's in it.  ;)

*Beginners and others interested in the Enneagram would do well to start with the very humorous cartoon-filled books of Renée Baron and Elizabeth Wagele on the Enneagram, IMO, facilitating a quick infusion of the teaching, with a lot of laughs, and plenty of diagrams where needed!
Also, in the back of a couple of the books, there are charts attempting to link the Enneagram types with MBTI-types -- not spot-on, but a few good correlations are made, IMO.
Posted by: san j, Tuesday, February 24, 2015, 3:16am; Reply: 53
Thanks, C_Sharp for showing us SWAMI's very tidy system correlating MB personality functions with D'Adamo's genotypes, as follows:

Extraversion: genotypes 2,5, and 6
Introversion: genotypes 1, 3, and 4

Sensation: genotypes 2, 3, and 6
Intuition: genotypes 1, 4, and 5

Thinking: genotypes 1, 2, and 5
Feeling: genotypes 3, 4, and 6

Judging: genotypes 1, 2, and 3
Perceiving: genotypes 4, 5, and 6

Look how perfectly balanced these are!
Even Jung, Keirsey, vonFranz and the Myers-Briggses themselves couldn't make the numbers add up like that!

It's important to bear in mind that the human distribution of the 16 MBTI types is not numerically even, by a long shot: E's far outnumber I's, and S's far outnumber N's. T's skew heavily toward males, F's toward females.
You could say, for instance, that IN's are as tiny a proportion of the world population as are those with the the B allele (B's and AB's).
Likewise, the different genotypes do not contain nearly the same numbers of individuals, simply by virtue of the fact that there are so few Bs and ABs, leaving the Nomad group quite small. And the Explorer group is supposedly made up of but a minority of each bloodtype's population.

So: Not only do the 16 MBTI types not nicely fit the six genotypes as in this model, but they wouldn't fit even if there were 16 genotypes, due to the uneven weighting of personality factors across different populations.

Unless Dr. D'Adamo devised the six genotypes specifically to so tidily correlate with the MBTI, this is, um, too "convenient" to "just fall into place" as you're showing it delineated.

Having said that, I agree that there are certain personality factors that seem to match a genotype here and there, such as P for Nomads, as "easygoing" is a keyword for each, among the few personality keywords D'Adamo has permitted himself for the genotypes. But an E/I function, an S/N function, and a T/F function are not as clearly prevalent among Nomads, so why not use only P for the strength test? I've never seen any D'Adamo literature from him naming Nomad personality traits that are pronouncedly extraverted or sensing -heavy, such as he has named empiric, objective factors like whorled fingerprints and secretor status.

MBTI -and the enneagram, too, Amazone I.  :K) - has great potential for helping the individual understand the differences between people and their behavior. But I wouldn't factor it in to my dinner recipes. Especially as I continue to grow and change and learn: Should I use more parsley on my more extraverted days?
Posted by: The Mystic, Tuesday, February 24, 2015, 4:36am; Reply: 54
I took another form of the Myers-Briggs test.
This test had a sentence with a yes or no response.
There were 72 statements to respond to.

Here are my results:

INFP

INFP
Introvert(33%)  iNtuitive(38%)  Feeling(38%)  Perceiving(11%)
You have moderate preference of Introversion over Extraversion (33%)
You have moderate preference of Intuition over Sensing (38%)
You have moderate preference of Feeling over Thinking (38%)
You have slight preference of Perceiving over Judging (11%)

http://www.humanmetrics.com/hr/JTypesResult.aspx
Posted by: Mickey, Tuesday, February 24, 2015, 7:26am; Reply: 55
Can someone tell me where on swami it asks you what your personality type is?.  I don't recall being asked about this on my swami.

Thanks!
Posted by: san j, Tuesday, February 24, 2015, 7:51am; Reply: 56
Quoted from The Mystic
My MB results 'hot off the press'

INFP

Introverted (I) 58.33% Extroverted (E) 41.67%
Intuitive (N) 62.5% Sensing (S) 37.5%
Feeling (F) 54.17% Thinking (T) 45.83%
Perceiving (P) 62.5% Judging (J) 37.5%

INFP - "Questor". High capacity for caring.
Emotional face to the world.
High sense of honor derived from internal values.
4.4% of total population.

Don't know how this relates to being a Hunter.
Being a meditator for nearly 40 years likely influenced this result.


Six days later:

Quoted from Atypical Hunter
I took another form of the Myers-Briggs test.
This test had a sentence with a yes or no response.
There were 72 statements to respond to.

Here are my results:

INFP

INFP
Introvert(33%)  iNtuitive(38%)  Feeling(38%)  Perceiving(11%)
You have moderate preference of Introversion over Extraversion (33%)
You have moderate preference of Intuition over Sensing (38%)
You have moderate preference of Feeling over Thinking (38%)
You have slight preference of Perceiving over Judging (11%)

http://www.humanmetrics.com/hr/JTypesResult.aspx


What do you make of those differences, AH?
Posted by: misspudding, Tuesday, February 24, 2015, 7:57am; Reply: 57
From my SWAMI:

MBI JP(P) function suggestive of GenoType/Characteristic of Explorer
MBI SN(N) function suggestive of GenoType/Characteristic of Explorer

I'm an ENTP, and the two things that are absolutely non-negotiable about my personality are the T and the P. The E and N are on the fence most of the time, but the other two...set in STONE.
Posted by: san j, Tuesday, February 24, 2015, 4:19pm; Reply: 58
Quoted from misspudding
From my SWAMI:

MBI JP(P) function suggestive of GenoType/Characteristic of Explorer
MBI SN(N) function suggestive of GenoType/Characteristic of Explorer

I'm an ENTP, and the two things that are absolutely non-negotiable about my personality are the T and the P. The E and N are on the fence most of the time, but the other two...set in STONE.

See, that makes good sense to me, and of course its JMO.

The singular function that is both, as you put it, "set in stone" and, as SWAMI puts it, "suggestive of" Explorer, is P=Perceptive.
That is what constitutes a credible element of a Strength Test (lest anyone misconstrue my beef with the assignment of finished, 4-function Types to the genotypes). :)

But note, also, that the other function you find "set in stone", T=Thinking, constitutes an equally strong negative strength test, being "suggestive of" non-Explorer!
And There y'are.  :-/
Posted by: Amazone I., Tuesday, February 24, 2015, 7:44pm; Reply: 59
oops sorry San-J but a lot of errors while implementing the enneagram and also MBTI and Kirsey tests: all are the same basics and are aproved to be seen likewise

No1 in the enneagram = ENTP/J so far extravert
No2  "       "       = ESFP/J  "  "      "
No 3 "       "       = no name but known as the so called A-shapement of a psychogram often seen in 0's...and extravert...
No 4 "       "       =infp/j so far introvert
No5  "       "       =INTP/J  "  "    "
No6  "       "       = istp/j "  "    "
No7  "       "       = ESTP/J so far extravert
No8  "       "       = ENFP/J so far extravert
No 9 "       "       = isfp/j so far introvert...

what I observed is that there are some differences in NF versus NT-types in all those systems, best explanations abot weaky type development is to be seen in Gifts differing and then Keirseys system do differ as well...I think and observed...there are several mixed-types as well coz of a not really well develped or extra-or introversion.. or perhaps coz of lacking p or j adjustments...
Here always the x can be seen and is also very well explained in the Keirsey system named:*please understand me I and II*

And also do we need to be aware that we aren't to be fixed upon only one type ...ok this might be ours to deal with the world but all is an open system and can decide to hopple into the integrative fashion or justamente the oposite...
We do have primair types and secondos...and so on...btw I also wouldn't fix any genotype onto whatever... it all might be..can be..etc...but merely seen as a form of tendencies!!!


                                  (sunny)(sunny)(sunny)
Posted by: The Mystic, Tuesday, February 24, 2015, 10:21pm; Reply: 60
Quoted from san j
Six days later:
What do you make of those differences, AH?

The obvious similarity in the results is that they're both INFP.

To compare the two tests may be like comparing apples to oranges. They both claim to be Myers-Briggs. However, in the first test each question gave a choice of two words to choose from, e.g. "linear - non-linear" on and on like that. The second test gave an entire sentence with a yes or no response.

e.g. "You are inclined to rely more on improvisation than on prior planning"
      "You are more inclined to experiment than to follow familiar approaches"
      "It's difficult to get you excited"

I could relate to the second test better, because it gave a context that I could relate to.

As I recall my Myers-Briggs test results from 40 years ago, it does seem to be the same. INFP So....


For many reasons I do strongly suspect that I AM NOT a Hunter. I did the GenoType test a couple of years ago and no longer have it. This week I received another GenoType kit in the mail and will have a friend be a 'buddy' this time to recalculate my GenoType. It would make more sense that I'm not a Hunter after all. I should know in a few days.
Posted by: The Mystic, Tuesday, February 24, 2015, 10:58pm; Reply: 61
Quoted from san j
Thanks, C_Sharp for showing us SWAMI's very tidy system correlating MB personality functions with D'Adamo's genotypes, as follows:

Extraversion: genotypes 2,5, and 6
Introversion: genotypes 1, 3, and 4

Sensation: genotypes 2, 3, and 6
Intuition: genotypes 1, 4, and 5

Thinking: genotypes 1, 2, and 5
Feeling: genotypes 3, 4, and 6

Judging: genotypes 1, 2, and 3
Perceiving: genotypes 4, 5, and 6

Look how perfectly balanced these are!
Even Jung, Keirsey, vonFranz and the Myers-Briggses themselves couldn't make the numbers add up like that!

If I go by this guideline, INFP would be GenoType 4.

If my new genotype testing comes up Explorer, then I'd still be atypical.
I am Rh+ and have tested twice as a Secretor.

Posted by: Lloyd, Tuesday, February 24, 2015, 11:33pm; Reply: 62
Quoted from The Mystic

If my new genotype testing comes up Explorer, then I'd still be atypical.


Typical only applies to the GT group as a whole. Individuals will all be atypical to some degree. Try not to focus to closely on the typical. More important is that your GT is generally correct in the sense that it is more correct than the other GT's. The rest is SWAMI (if used) narrowing down on modifications for your individuality.
Posted by: san j, Wednesday, February 25, 2015, 2:54am; Reply: 63
Quoted from Lloyd
Quoted from Atypical Hunter
Quoted from AoM
SWAMI's very tidy system correlating MB personality functions with D'Adamo's genotypes, as follows:

Extraversion: genotypes 2,5, and 6
Introversion: genotypes 1, 3, and 4

Sensation: genotypes 2, 3, and 6
Intuition: genotypes 1, 4, and 5

Thinking: genotypes 1, 2, and 5
Feeling: genotypes 3, 4, and 6

Judging: genotypes 1, 2, and 3
Perceiving: genotypes 4, 5, and 6

If I go by this guideline, INFP would be GenoType 4.
Individuals will all be atypical to some degree. Try not to focus to closely on the typical.

AH: You're reading a "guideline" (re MBTI's 4-letter/ conglomerate "types") into the above strength-tests for each separate letter.
That's like saying if you combine two positive strength tests (say, for one aspect of your family medical history plus your taster status) that adds up to Genotype 4; it does not do so.
This is one strength-test among scores of other strength-tests. Alone, personality-typing doesn't point to any genotype at all - even if you have 3 or 4 of its pieces. At best it can only tweak the result arrived at by far weightier data, including those strength-tests that track immutable, objective input.
Posted by: The Mystic, Wednesday, February 25, 2015, 4:38am; Reply: 64
Quoted from Lloyd


Typical only applies to the GT group as a whole. Individuals will all be atypical to some degree. Try not to focus to closely on the typical. More important is that your GT is generally correct in the sense that it is more correct than the other GT's. The rest is SWAMI (if used) narrowing down on modifications for your individuality.

Yes, just tonight with re-testing I've narrowed down my genotype once again to Hunter. But I'm gathering all the strength testing in order to actually do the SWAMI PRO once all the testing is complete. I'm soooo looking forward to the SWAMI results.
(smile)
Posted by: The Mystic, Wednesday, February 25, 2015, 4:55am; Reply: 65
Quoted from san j
This is one strength-test among scores of other strength-tests. Alone, personality-typing doesn't point to any genotype at all - even if you have 3 or 4 of its pieces. At best it can only tweak the result arrived at by far weightier data, including those strength-tests that track immutable, objective input.

All I can say is - this transition from BTD to GT to SWAMI PRO is requiring enormous intuition and leap of faith. If I hadn't already developed unwavering confidence in Dr D's work, this leap would be much more difficult. It's more complex than I can grasp.

Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, February 25, 2015, 6:50am; Reply: 66
btw in the booklet *Giftsdifferings* it's beautifully marked how every type is prone for his/her favoured aspects for example  INTP and INTJ are different as seen:
INTP has its favoured onto the T-side = thinkng and INTJ merely onto the N-side= intuition both are thinkers and then remeber the golden rule:all introverts do the oposite of their endings... all infos from all books are the true synthesis... ;)(cool)(shrug)(funny) and also C.G.Jungs work must be observed and implemented as well... even if this means blo... work in comparisons  and true understandings...(whistle)
Peter once wrote about us the explorers being all extraverts.. no 1 ENTP/J's Im no more persuated... we do exist in our extravert bt also introvert forms...(smarty)(hehe)(grin)

and as said it's a huge mistake to see the swami assumtions as they were *fixed* now...it seems to have been adapted to it instead to accept as it was made from their inventors named before: Meyers-Briggs, keirseys and the enneagram are nearly +- congruent in their conclusions and teachings ! Based upon C.G.Jungs work...
Posted by: Mickey, Wednesday, February 25, 2015, 7:07am; Reply: 67
OK, I found it!.  So are you saying that just by adding my personality type, my swami could change me to an entirely different genotype?.
Posted by: Lloyd, Wednesday, February 25, 2015, 1:33pm; Reply: 68
Quoted from Mickey
OK, I found it!.  So are you saying that just by adding my personality type, my swami could change me to an entirely different genotype?.


Possible but not likely.

Some people score out relatively close to the border between one GT and another. For those people one or two changes could switch the GT - even something seemingly innocuous.
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, February 25, 2015, 7:03pm; Reply: 69
all what I right now get to understand is.. none of you really has understood any systems mentioned... if so.. no such erroning matters would have been combined with real yuky issues...(funny)(funny)(funny)(evil)(evil)(hand)
so far this has leaded to a lot of missunderstandings... mischoosings etc.. coz of diferent systems......I guess??)

Must  tell you that I've got since a certain time problems to re-read my scripts onto this board..due to ??) Therfore I apologize for my comitted fauls in scripts.

Would like heaviliest that this problem should be solved onto the international rat as soon as possible (pray) :K).....
Posted by: san j, Wednesday, February 25, 2015, 8:46pm; Reply: 70
Quoted from Amazone I.
all what I right now get to understand is.. none of you really has understood any systems mentioned... if so.. no such erroning matters would have been combined with real yuky issues...(funny)(funny)(funny)(evil)(evil)(hand)
so far this has leaded to a lot of missunderstandings... mischoosings etc.. coz of diferent systems......I guess??)

I agree with A. Isa, and it's a quandary.
The writings of Myers-Briggs and von Franz answer it, but, habibi, we cannot expect everyone to read the foundational and scholarly literature.
I think most just consider it a detailed way to "measure" personality, and don't necessarily distinguish between the sources and the LOADS of popular literature on the subject. On the internet you can answer a questionnaire at a massive number of websites, and get an instant programmed result from one-knows-not-whom.
But the combinations and permutations of the actual Myers-Briggs system are complex, even for those who study it in depth.
As for the enneagram: The wings, the directions, the processes...the three subtypes...

But here, these complex systems are made "E-Z to Understand" via numerous authors and websites, and their E-Z version results are then fed into SWAMI.

When we use systems we don't understand, we must do so with tremendous care.
I think that's what you're saying.

Nonetheless, some people are getting consistent MBTI type results, longitudinally and cross-websites
And Dr. D'Adamo has found correlations between certain letters/functions and certain genotypes.
The attempt to factor these into SWAMI has begun, and there's something of a Research Window about it. I understand that.
The claim that there is a very tidy, numerically perfect correspondence of MBTI types with genotypes is, however, not possible - don't worry, it looks like the doctor has not so claimed. :)
Posted by: Amazone I., Thursday, February 26, 2015, 7:50am; Reply: 71
so it is (clap)(ok)(smarty)(dance) :D and yo're right with your thoughts that none can be master of all such systems..expressis verbis not if a combination is done which isn't of truth of the very early beginnings... bt what this all shows to me...my own form of being a bit compulsive to correct such errors  ;) ;D... this is so typical for me but at the same time peeps do feel unease coz often I do see em coming...the errors-fakes etc...  :B even not wanted voluntarily but  this is one of the gifts we got...(evil)(eek)(scared)(funny)(shrug)

btw..while looking into http://www.eclecticenergies.com you will get your type and all the others which seem to complete yourself... a bit like *horrorskope*... ;) ;D :P but yep it seems all those systems do function and are of value even if we do think all esomist...... ;) ;D :X but remember the words of B.Lipton...mind over genes and the scripts of Louiise Hay... so far also this seems to be not well nderstood...thoughts are all a form of energy which have tendencies to manifestation...! This often is overlooked and misunderstood almost in oncology....psychotherapy and so on... even foodwise...
Posted by: cajun, Friday, February 27, 2015, 6:12pm; Reply: 72
Isa,
I enjoyed reading "Please Understand Me" over 10 years ago. ;)
I took the Meyers-Briggs test.
The results were  ISFJ.
Before I ran my first swami I took the Meyers-Briggs test online.
The results were  ISFJ.

It seems as though it fits me as I am a true Teacher/Explorer mix.
The I matches GT 4 as does F and ISFJ matches GT3. (I have very typical Explorer fingerprints and also have Teacher highly visible tendons yet the measurements/strength points of each GT).




Posted by: Amazone I., Sunday, March 1, 2015, 5:01pm; Reply: 73
:K) to you dearest cajun  ;) ;D(clap)(ok)(smarty) but as said..we're all E & I... and your statement exactamundo fits the true
enneagram outputs as well as it does with MBT...thanx for your kind statement  :D(sunny)(happy)
Posted by: Chloe, Sunday, March 1, 2015, 6:54pm; Reply: 74
I am an INFP...I have taken dozens of versions of this test and always come out the same.   I answer questions so rapidly I'm barely
reading them carefully,....but the results are always exactly the same.  I score super high in perception...over 60%  I think of myself as an introvert only because I can't stand irritating noise and large crowds make me feel claustrophobic.......I can watch others having fun but I don't always care to be in the middle... yet I can walk into a room and blend into any group of people....I'm sort of a chameleon...Put me anywhere and I'pretty tolerant.......unless it's
hot, humid and there are annoying physical sensations I have to deal with...In my family, I'm considered a hermit because a calm, quiet life is my priority........although put me in a group of people, and I can be the life of the party, if I feel like it...Most of the time, I just don't feel like putting out that much energy.  I can entertain myself for hours without anyone around....I have a lot of fun just being inside my own mind....My two sisters must be with people...or else they feel alone. Not me..:)
Posted by: cajun, Sunday, March 1, 2015, 7:18pm; Reply: 75
Chloe,
I like your description of yourself. ;)
Like you, I don't enjoy large crowds or humidity but I do like to have fun dancing and being goofy with people I know or love, example: my son's wedding. Or any family get together.
Also, like you, I can be totally happy completely by myself for hours( only child syndrome?) ; but, I like to be around people or "people watch",example; I get cabin fever and will drive to SuperTarget or Macy's just to get out and about.
If my best friend or my mom lived closer than 75 miles away I would probably be hanging out with them most of the week. ;)
Because of my 5 dogs and the fact that something always needs attention around my house/property, I stay busy enough and just talk to my mom and friend on the phone.
I do drive down the hill to see them though , almost every week.  :K)

Isa,
;) Yes, I pretty much fit the ISFJ  8)  
Posted by: Amazone I., Sunday, March 1, 2015, 9:36pm; Reply: 76
Chloé... isfp/j are very often confonded with infp/j's..... ;) but while coming along in comparisons...all will become more then clear...

(grin)(hehe)
Posted by: san j, Monday, March 2, 2015, 3:27am; Reply: 77
Isale: Are you familiar w/ this/ these ideas?

http://research.similarminds.com/tag/enneagram
Posted by: Amazone I., Monday, March 2, 2015, 5:09pm; Reply: 78
Oscar Ichazo is a type with his own system... I'm not that familiar with him but must say that the booklet"wisdom of the enneagram" provides more then enough of inputs-insights and infos' you nearly get overloades if you try to implement all into one ongoing working positively system... ;) ;D btw he wasn't that well recognized in the last years when he got adapted to the Enneagraminstitute...he seems to become a bit shizo or better said psychotic in old ages??) I've never met him... but it seems his time is very long over... :X(evil)(clown)(goofy)(huh)(shrug) this was colported last September in Italy when I made the seminars in Serestri Levante...can't tell ya if all this is true and correct...sorry and I don't like any gossippings about a person ... :-/
Posted by: Easy E, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 1:54pm; Reply: 79
I'm pretty sure I am ESTP after reading through them.  Many parts of it at least, not everything.
Posted by: Easy E, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 3:15pm; Reply: 80
One good point is that if one is out of balance, they may not express their true personality strengths in strong and noticeable ways and may be overlooked, just like a fish in a pet store is not showing its true bright colors because it is not in top health often times (I am an aquarium/fish keeper past 8 years)!
Posted by: Easy E, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 5:30pm; Reply: 81
Prob ENTP a better describer for me.  ESTP or ENTP depending on the day, time, situation, weather, etc.
Posted by: The Mystic, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 7:47pm; Reply: 82
Quoted from Chloe
I am an INFP...I have taken dozens of versions of this test and always come out the same.   I answer questions so rapidly I'm barely
reading them carefully,....but the results are always exactly the same.  I score super high in perception...over 60%  I think of myself as an introvert only because I can't stand irritating noise and large crowds make me feel claustrophobic.......I can watch others having fun but I don't always care to be in the middle... yet I can walk into a room and blend into any group of people....I'm sort of a chameleon...Put me anywhere and I'pretty tolerant.......unless it's
hot, humid and there are annoying physical sensations I have to deal with...In my family, I'm considered a hermit because a calm, quiet life is my priority........although put me in a group of people, and I can be the life of the party, if I feel like it...Most of the time, I just don't feel like putting out that much energy.  I can entertain myself for hours without anyone around....I have a lot of fun just being inside my own mind....My two sisters must be with people...or else they feel alone. Not me..:)

Chloe, this description is so ME that I could have written it myself. From one INFP to another.   (cool)
Posted by: Amazone I., Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 7:56pm; Reply: 83
Easy E you're on your integrative way...please remember 1-7-5-8-2-4-1.... ;) compared with the enneagram...and as said...often dif. no's look very similar as mentioned 1-3-7... but sorry you don't ressemble at all to no 3... but please use all those infos also for your job as a therapist... ;) :D(smarty)(ok)(dance)

greetings from Switzerland :X(evil)(clown)(woot)(shrug)(shhh)
Posted by: Easy E, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 8:39pm; Reply: 84
I looked at enneagram types.  Nope I am not a 3.  Maybe a subset part in there, there is an air of vanity within me, but I don't want to hurt anyone with it, but have the ability, gotta keep it checked.  I am not an achiever to rack up plaques or trophies, not out to impress a single person except the man upstairs!  The more mandates placed on me, the more I want to do the opposite.  

I don't understand how enneagram types and the myers Briggs types work together.  I like work as a therapist, but am not one for the paperwork and in my job now, scheduling.  But the interactions are short and to the point, and when a client comes in with an issue, I listen and give feedback when needed, with occasional group work.  More regulations being placed, feeling it!  Will adapt and find the holes!

I honestly think at best I am a mediocre therapist and don't know how i ended up there.  The man upstairs carried me there, I follow with faith best I can.

And partying rejuvenates me!  Depends on the crowd tho.  And also many other things too.  Also like to chill.   I am a mid level party animal, not hard core like some people I know.  It's all balanced for me, but lately been on the slower side!  
.
Posted by: Jane, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 8:53pm; Reply: 85
It's been a long time since I took a MyersBriggs but everytime I've taken it, it's been ENFP but the E and the I are just about equal.  I'm very similar to what Chloe said.  I'm perfectly fine being by myself but can be equally comfortable talking to just about anyone in any setting.  Only setting I'm uncomfortable with but can do if I have to is public speaking....makes me very nervous.
Posted by: misspudding, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 9:40pm; Reply: 86
Quoted from Easy E
Prob ENTP a better describer for me.  ESTP or ENTP depending on the day, time, situation, weather, etc.


Same here! I'm a detailed big picture thinker. :)

I wonder if it's related to having herding ancestry (I'm mostly Scottish/Irish, Alps, and far northern Scandanavian ancestry...huge herding areas). When I think about Border Collies, they're so good at focusing on the little details like that sheep moving it's one leg in that one direction, but they're also good at knowing how to herd those sheep over large areas. You just have to be good at both.

I look at my dog (Shepherd and Collie mix) and he's so much like me it's not even funny. Down to the chemical sensitivity and ADHD. If I spray perfume or burn something, he sneezes. It's too cute! I have an Explorer dog. LOL!
Posted by: san j, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 10:19pm; Reply: 87
Quoted from misspudding
I look at my dog (Shepherd and Collie mix) and he's so much like me it's not even funny. Down to the chemical sensitivity and ADHD. If I spray perfume or burn something, he sneezes. It's too cute! I have an Explorer dog. LOL!

Funny!
Gotta love the dog-breed stuff.
  :D
Cute idea:
If You Were a Dog, What Breed Would You Be?
Posted by: misspudding, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 10:37pm; Reply: 88
Hahahah. I think this needs to be it's own thread, san j.
Posted by: san j, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 10:39pm; Reply: 89
Quoted from Easy E
I don't understand how enneagram types and the myers Briggs types work together.
  They don't, necessarily. Like MBTI/bloodtype, they're not connected systems, but you're free to use both of them if you like.

Quoted from Easy E
I like work as a therapist, but am not one for the paperwork and in my job now, scheduling.

This speaks to F and P.
--It's rare for a T to be a therapist. But it's also relatively rare for a man to be F.
--To have problems with the paperwork and scheduling of any profuse amount, speaks to P, over J.

Quoted from Easy E
But the interactions are short and to the point

ergo, tolerable for a T!

Quoted from Easy E
...I honestly think at best I am a mediocre therapist and don't know how i ended up there.
Yeah, the usual track for the counseling man is through a strong F identification, unless that counseling is very focused -- say on Finance or Career or Purchasing Advice or something.

Quoted from Easy E
The man upstairs carried me there, I follow with faith best I can.
If you're referring to Jesus, He has first dibs on us, after all!

Quoted from Easy E
And partying rejuvenates me!  Depends on the crowd tho.  And also many other things too.  Also like to chill.   I am a mid level party animal, not hard core like some people I know.  It's all balanced for me, but lately been on the slower side!  
.
Speaks to small E/I differential.

Pick up a copy of Keirsey, who divides the 16 types into four "temperaments":
SP: Artisans
SJ: Guardians
NF: Idealists
NT: Rationals

And each of those is divided into its four MBTI types.

Note, the ESTP is the quintessential "Smooth Operator" -- highly unlikely to be in a counseling field, to put it very mildly!
The ENTP is a kind of rebellious/techie type, archetypally; if he's a counselor, it can't be vague/feely stuff, but more IT tutoring or something. He's a renegade rather than a helper...

Take a look at the F questions/category - Make sure you're not overlooking something that would put you more in the Idealist camp.
A guess.
I don't know you.
Maybe Keirsey will give you some insights -- also can't hurt for anyone in counseling to be familiar with him.
Posted by: misspudding, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 10:46pm; Reply: 90
Quoted from san j
Note, the ESTP is the quintessential "Smooth Operator" -- highly unlikely to be in a counseling field, to put it very mildly!
The ENTP is a kind of rebellious/techie type, archetypally; if he's a counselor, it can't be vague/feely stuff, but more IT tutoring or something. He's a renegade rather than a helper...


ENTP is also seen as the "out of the box thinking" type or the "inventor" type. Also, the "lawyer" type. If always wanting to argue little tiny details with someone to the death, and frequently switching sides just to play devil's advocate because you really see the value in all arguments, sounds like you? Then you're an ENTP. LOL. Ask me how I know...
Posted by: san j, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 10:48pm; Reply: 91
Here's another MB-derived (as Keirsey's is MB-derived) system:
Loren Pedersen posits, for men:

ST: Thinkers
SF: Doers
NT: Idea men
NF: Idealists

You'll note he pairs both S and N with their evaluative (T/F) counterpart in his Big Four classification system, rather than assigning J/P to S.
Posted by: misspudding, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 10:51pm; Reply: 92
I recall reading somewhere that ESTP tend to be "the jocks". Can you explain that one, san j?
Posted by: san j, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 10:52pm; Reply: 93
Quoted from misspudding


ENTP is also seen as the "out of the box thinking" type or the "inventor" type. Also, the "lawyer" type. If always wanting to argue little tiny details with someone to the death, and frequently switching sides just to play devil's advocate because you really see the value in all arguments, sounds like you? Then you're an ENTP. LOL. Ask me how I know...

I guess you're a lawyer.
Yeah, that's the sort of counseling ("Counselor at Law") to which I was referring, for an NT -- something very focused and non-feely: Law, versus, say, Diaper-changing!   :D

Posted by: misspudding, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 10:54pm; Reply: 94
http://www.reddit.com/r/mbti/comments/2b5f7z/confused_about_how_people_view_estps/

Ahh, it's the "physically oriented hobbies".
Posted by: san j, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 10:55pm; Reply: 95
Quoted from misspudding
I recall reading somewhere that ESTP tend to be "the jocks". Can you explain that one, san j?
Glad you looked it up.

Posted by: misspudding, Tuesday, March 3, 2015, 10:55pm; Reply: 96
Quoted from san j

I guess you're a lawyer.
Yeah, that's the sort of counseling ("Counselor at Law") to which I was referring, for an NT -- something very focused and non-feely: Law, versus, say, Diaper-changing!   :D



Nope. I just like to argue on the internet. Hahahahaha.

I'm a geologist. :)
Posted by: Chloe, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 12:24am; Reply: 97
Quoted from The Mystic

Chloe, this description is so ME that I could have written it myself. From one INFP to another.   (cool)


Ah....you are my kindred spirit!  :)

Except..... go check out Dr. D's personality quiz thread and read my post   http://www.dadamo.com/cgi-bin/Blah/Blah.pl?m-1425399458/

....  I came out completely different on that test because I could easily answer both "yes" and "no" to many of those questions...and they are collectively tabulated by
groups, not individually like most MyersBriggs tests....  Within each group, I could answer almost an equal amount of yesses and nos...and therefore neither the A group nor the B group was obviously dominant.
Posted by: Chloe, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 12:31am; Reply: 98
Quoted from Jane
It's been a long time since I took a MyersBriggs but everytime I've taken it, it's been ENFP but the E and the I are just about equal.  I'm very similar to what Chloe said.  I'm perfectly fine being by myself but can be equally comfortable talking to just about anyone in any setting.  Only setting I'm uncomfortable with but can do if I have to is public speaking....makes me very nervous.


.......yes, I would agree......Public speaking would be the last place where I'd feel comfortable.



Posted by: misspudding, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 1:38am; Reply: 99
Another good version of the test, though not as quick or simple as Dr. D's.

http://www.celebritytypes.com/test.php

This gives actual percentages of the different letters. I'm apparently 100% T. Being a scientist, I'm glad to see that.
Posted by: misspudding, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 1:48am; Reply: 100
Quoted from misspudding
From my SWAMI:

MBI JP(P) function suggestive of GenoType/Characteristic of Explorer
MBI SN(N) function suggestive of GenoType/Characteristic of Explorer

I'm an ENTP, and the two things that are absolutely non-negotiable about my personality are the T and the P. The E and N are on the fence most of the time, but the other two...set in STONE.


Looks like based on that other quiz I posted, my two "set in stone" characteristics are E and T, not P and N. Wonder why I skew this way. Perhaps the E is more an O thing; the T is also more an O thing, right? Maybe that's why my SWAMI says I might derive benefit more from classic BTD than genotypes. But only if I put that my ancestry is Northern European, not Western European. How can that have so much pull!
Posted by: jayneeo, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 2:00am; Reply: 101
Ah…Jane!  My lost Twin! I am an enfp! Yay! ;D   Yay for the perceptives and the feelers! And the people who need people! And yet I had a very high I score, close to the E. (both high as they are not mutually exclusive in this test)
Posted by: Lola, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 4:07am; Reply: 102
ANNUNTIO VOBIS GAUDIUM MAGNUM HABEMUS
http://www.dadamo.com/cgi-bin/Blah/Blah.pl?m-1425399458/

;D
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 11:52am; Reply: 103
oops need to correct again

there are NF's versus NT's and SP versus SJ's in the Keirseys' system....very similar to MB or BM...but not that much to CG Jung's system...(whistle)... and the most cleary outspoken descriptions are still found in the booklet"wisdom of the enneagram" but also can be seen in all of our numers and wings here: http://www.eclecticenergies.com  ;)(sunny)

My problems was some weeks ago- tested a man and he resembled to both SP and SJ (ESFP/) ) but really 50:50 so far I think he's in a psychological process...can't tell ya right now integrative or justamente the opposite... did do the test again with the enneagram and here clearly he described himself as a 7/8 =ESTJ...(hehe)(eek)(goofy)(think)(ok) but indeed can't be otherwise coz I got himself since months into this number and so far he only  enforced my guessings with the tests...
Posted by: Easy E, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 12:00pm; Reply: 104
Quoted from san j
  They don't, necessarily. Like MBTI/bloodtype, they're not connected systems, but you're free to use both of them if you like.


This speaks to F and P.
--It's rare for a T to be a therapist. But it's also relatively rare for a man to be F.
--To have problems with the paperwork and scheduling of any profuse amount, speaks to P, over J.


ergo, tolerable for a T!

Yeah, the usual track for the counseling man is through a strong F identification, unless that counseling is very focused -- say on Finance or Career or Purchasing Advice or something.

If you're referring to Jesus, He has first dibs on us, after all!

Speaks to small E/I differential.

Pick up a copy of Keirsey, who divides the 16 types into four "temperaments":
SP: Artisans
SJ: Guardians
NF: Idealists
NT: Rationals

And each of those is divided into its four MBTI types.

Note, the ESTP is the quintessential "Smooth Operator" -- highly unlikely to be in a counseling field, to put it very mildly!
The ENTP is a kind of rebellious/techie type, archetypally; if he's a counselor, it can't be vague/feely stuff, but more IT tutoring or something. He's a renegade rather than a helper...

Take a look at the F questions/category - Make sure you're not overlooking something that would put you more in the Idealist camp.
A guess.
I don't know you.
Maybe Keirsey will give you some insights -- also can't hurt for anyone in counseling to be familiar with him.


The main job I have now is very specific, I am a counselor at an opiate replacement therapy clinic, set amounts of methadone are used to block actions of other opiates and to prevent withdrawals and improve lives for many with severe opiate addictions.  I have a caseload of 55 patients.  See each at least once per month.  Drug test them.  Check in with them, encourage them, B.S. with them, listen, etc.  This job is up my ally.  The paperwork is all computer and typed.  Very structured but free to make my own schedule.  Very specific lines of behavioral action used if a patient keeps producing illicit drug screens, such as increased number of days required to come to the clinic, up to every day.  
It is no nonsense and to the point, the best counseling job I have held as of yet.  I have had jobs where it was just pure counseling, doing mental health counseling.  My lack of planning made me feel sessions were floating around and going nowhere, which can be good or bad.  

The job I have now has a high degree of external structure to keep me going in a straight line, and also gives me enough space to do things without someone hovering over me.  It is ran well and I am glad to work for this company I work for.

Posted by: Easy E, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 2:56pm; Reply: 105
On occasion I have long and awesome counseling sessions of a very powerful and spiritual nature, such as today!  Other times it is quick and to the point if they have no pressing issue.  Sometimes it is light and sometimes it gets into deep stuff.  No day is the same, yet there is the perfect amount of structure for me.  So I say that God brought me to this job, because I had no plans of any kind, it unfolded and happened that way.  It is where I am needed right now ;)
Posted by: Easy E, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 4:38pm; Reply: 106
Quoted from misspudding


Looks like based on that other quiz I posted, my two "set in stone" characteristics are E and T, not P and N. Wonder why I skew this way. Perhaps the E is more an O thing; the T is also more an O thing, right? Maybe that's why my SWAMI says I might derive benefit more from classic BTD than genotypes. But only if I put that my ancestry is Northern European, not Western European. How can that have so much pull!


I believe that all personality types exist in every blood type.  Within group variability greater than between group variability.

Placing something complex like personality with a blood type I think is erroneous and can be very short sighted and leaves one to sterotyped thinking (not you just in general that thinking:).  That's what I think about it.
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 5:22pm; Reply: 107
Easy E..would merely point out for this very aspect....: "there are obviously *tendencies*... ;) :X(whistle)(goofy)(ondrugs)(shrug)(think)(smarty)....
Posted by: Chloe, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 5:43pm; Reply: 108
Quoted from Easy E



Placing something complex like personality with a blood type I think is erroneous and can be very short sighted and leaves one to sterotyped thinking (not you just in general that thinking:).  That's what I think about it.


I agree....My two younger sisters and I are all blood type A, and likely we're all Teachers because we're sort of built the same....although one could be an Explorer...None of us are remotely alike in personality...

I think you can be wired with specific potential characteristics but who you actually become
depends upon so many other variables. I was the shyest of my sisters....but at the time, I was brought up during
WW 2, living with my mother and grandparents in an apartment together while my dad was fighting a war...
They all spoke Yiddish only to one another....hardly ever spoke to me.... and living in a world where I barely
saw children my own age.... I felt isolated and didn't understand a word people were saying to one another.
So I became an observer rather than a participant. I always participated in my mind...but kept a safe and healthy
distance from actually being in the middle of most activities...

My two younger sisters, (and we're all 4 years apart)....and born in a time frame when they played with
young children and saw other families socializing together....So in general, my sisters were very social at an
early age....went to nursery school  (and I didn't)....They always had a lot of friends and I
am uncomfortable with groups.....so who I might have become under entirely different circumstances is a "ME" I will never know.  I feel I have the potential to be way more outgoing than my inner child allows me to
be....and somewhere inside me is always the memory of me being an observer more than a participant....I'm cautious or reasons that have to do with me needing to understand a bigger picture before I act....This is likely not who I am by genetic design...but who I became by adapting to the world I lived in.

So, to conclude I'm like other blood type A people would be rather a stretch.  Both my children are A as is
my husband....they are vastly different in personality. My daughter in law and 3 out of 4 grandchildren are type A as well....All vastly different.  I feel we're all products of our social environment....our birth order...

Actually if I had to find two people in my family who are very alike....it would be my Scorpio youngest son and
Scorpio husband....:)
Posted by: Averno, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 5:55pm; Reply: 109
Quoted from misspudding
Another good version of the test, though not as quick or simple as Dr. D's.

http://www.celebritytypes.com/test.php

This gives actual percentages of the different letters. I'm apparently 100% T. Being a scientist, I'm glad to see that.


I liked the directness of these questions. Solid INTJ result.

But it did seem more about a clear division of NT's from SP's.

The way I found myself answering the questions, I feared the result would be "You are a robot". Which would have been OK with me because the alternative would be "You are a bowl of chowder".  

(funny)
Posted by: misspudding, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 6:06pm; Reply: 110
Quoted from Averno

The way I found myself answering the questions, I feared the result would be "You are a robot". Which would have been OK with me because the alternative would be "You are a bowl of chowder".  

(funny)


HA! Why hello there, chowder...
Posted by: Easy E, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 6:31pm; Reply: 111
Quoted from Amazone I.
Easy E..would merely point out for this very aspect....: "there are obviously *tendencies*... ;) :X(whistle)(goofy)(ondrugs)(shrug)(think)(smarty)....


That was a black and white thinking moment!  What I wrote, I am prone to ;D

Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 6:31pm; Reply: 112
Averno-shatzala...seems to be plus minus the same as eclectic energies... but ok often in dif. languages outputs might become different...it depends of our mumlanguages... ;) ;D I scored justamente only one minuscule f...so I popped into the INTJ cathegorie as well... but it fits me tremendiously... :o :-/ :P(blush)(wiseman)(funny)(goofy)

btw... my scripts justamente got vanished again as last week... and rebelotte...Dr. DDDDD.. please hold the line and come along for European's even that Swiss peeps aren't counted in... :B :K)
muchas gracias in advance...reallyb nasty if you can't detect how all this...... >:( >:( >:(...rrrggghhhh(eek)(dissappointed)(mad) need to stop here if not I'm getting nuts about the
hyroglyphes...(scared)(worried)(hand)
Posted by: san j, Wednesday, March 4, 2015, 7:49pm; Reply: 113
Easy E: Good morning - scanned your post - looks like you are happy to be where the Lord your God has placed you, and that (not personality-typing) is what it's all about!
Let God be true and every man a liar, saith the Scripture.
Hold That Line!  :)
Posted by: Easy E, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 12:12pm; Reply: 114
Quoted from san j
Easy E: Good morning - scanned your post - looks like you are happy to be where the Lord your God has placed you, and that (not personality-typing) is what it's all about!
Let God be true and every man a liar, saith the Scripture.
Hold That Line!  :)


Thanks!  I believe that people can excel in jobs/careers that may be counterintuitive to what a personality test says.  Also, some personality traits only came to be expressed as I matured a bit.  

Like Amazone said, they are tendencies.  I can have black and white thinking and personality typing with these systems are open to interpretation and can be subjective, so I have a hard time answering the tests accurately, because to me it depends on the context and I don't think I have the best self insight.  In fact, I don't even respond well to talk therapy.  I actually do better with writing.

In the end I think any enjoyable activity is therapeutic, basically, just having fun!  As long as it isn't causing serious problems in life, unless one enjoys
living life that way!  I for one try to minimize them
Posted by: Averno, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 1:56pm; Reply: 115
Quoted from Easy E


Thanks!  I believe that people can excel in jobs/careers that may be counterintuitive to what a personality test says.  

In the end I think any enjoyable activity is therapeutic, basically, just having fun!


Always do your best  ;)  

Long before I'd heard of don Miguel Ruiz, these words came naturally, allowing me to thrive in environments that were not ideal or of my choosing. I've had a lot of jobs, but the only truly dreadful one was BTB sales. BS'ing a BS'er is not in my DNA  ;D

Posted by: Easy E, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 2:42pm; Reply: 116
Quoted from Averno


Always do your best  ;)  

Long before I'd heard of don Miguel Ruiz, these words came naturally, allowing me to thrive in environments that were not ideal or of my choosing. I've had a lot of jobs, but the only truly dreadful one was BTB sales. BS'ing a BS'er is not in my DNA  ;D



I never held a sales job, but I don't think it would be my cup of tea.  Too me, if they want it they would buy it, if not, they won't.  I do not like people trying to talk to me about products too much, just show me the pamphlet and let me read it!  If I want it I will buy it, if not, please accept I don't want it.  That's my mentality for it!

But...if the passion were there, I believe I could do it and like it.  I'm slow to warm up to people usually, it would prob induce higher stress levels for me always breaking ice with new people and going into unfamiliar places to talk to people I barely know.  In this context, the introversion would predominate!!  

Posted by: Amazone I., Thursday, March 5, 2015, 5:16pm; Reply: 117
Easy E enjoy the shades of grey as well... ;) ;D(smarty)(hehe)(funny)(evil)(ondrugs)(hugegrin) but I know this from me as well... :B :P...all or nothing is the motto... :X
Posted by: san j, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 6:22pm; Reply: 118
Interestingly, there's an MBTI-typing/human resources specialist who is convinced Introverts make the best salespeople.
Customers do not feel pressured by introverts. Introverts are in it because they know a great deal about a certain product, and are better able to convey product attributes without the pressure of a Whole Personality behind it. The Introvert seller does not feel personally invested in whether or not a prospect shells out the dollars, but is more concerned with genuine customer-satisfaction. The buyer is thus sure that the purchase was completely self-chosen.

I'm glad this came up, here/now.
It brings to the fore the very meaning/definition of Introversion.
There's the prevalent misconception that Introverts are withdrawn, antisocial, solitary beings, and this is not at all what is meant by the term.
Two individuals - one a moderate Introvert and the other a moderate Extravert - can happily live their lives quite similarly, in terms of the structure of their day, the scheduling of their time, for instance.
But their MOTIVATIONS will be different, and what they derive from similar experiences will be very different.
This is one of the reasons the Introvert may more effortlessly achieve extremely high sales numbers, and it can be one of the reasons Introverts can do well as counselors - which involves a whole lot of concern with other people!
Yet another reason I reject quite a bit of the pop literature on typing - it's not nuanced. Someone like Easy E, too, needs to read the better literature as something worthier to apply to his complex situation.
In fact, I'd venture this:
Anyone who tests Introvert should read Myers-Briggs and von Franz in order to understand what this really means.
And Jung, too, of course, if his / her curiosity so moves.  ;)
Posted by: san j, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 8:01pm; Reply: 119
My post, above, treats of Introversion as a particularly important factor in MBTI-typing, as this is the only reading that alters the weighting of the three other functions.

However, there's another function that, to my mind, is usually very misunderstood, and that is "Feeling", construed by most as a more extreme "emotionality" than one would find in a Thinking type -- an error that, sadly, the Quizzes tend to perpetuate.
James Hillman has written an important essay, "The Feeling Function", that treats of this in excruciating detail.
Suffice it here to say that the T/F continuum is one of judging/evaluation.
Everyone must judge/evaluate, but how does one come to an assessment? Is it primarily on the basis of reason? or is it primarily on the basis of a "feeling"? I hope y'all can see that this has nothing whatsoever to do with how emotionally one might express oneself; it certainly says ZERO about how deeply one's feelings/emotions run.
Also: The T/F function is irrespective of Intelligence. In point of fact, it's the INFs who have the highest incidence of Rhodes Scholarships, Merit Finalisthoods, etc.

I hope it's becoming clearer that the Quizzes present a mere shadow of the Myers-Briggs system.
Posted by: misspudding, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 8:09pm; Reply: 120
Quoted from san j
My post, above, treats of Introversion as a particularly important factor in MBTI-typing, as this is the only reading that alters the weighting of the three other functions.

However, there's another function that, to my mind, is usually very misunderstood, and that is "Feeling", construed by most as a more extreme "emotionality" than one would find in a Thinking type -- an error that, sadly, the Quizzes tend to perpetuate.
James Hillman has written an important essay, "The Feeling Function", that treats of this in excruciating detail.
Suffice it here to say that the T/F continuum is one of judging/evaluation.
Everyone must judge/evaluate, but how does one come to an assessment? Is it primarily on the basis of reason? or is it primarily on the basis of a "feeling"? I hope y'all can see that this has nothing whatsoever to do with how emotionally one might express oneself; it certainly says ZERO about how deeply one's feelings/emotions run.
Also: The T/F function is irrespective of Intelligence. In point of fact, it's the INFs who have the highest incidence of Rhodes Scholarships, Merit Finalisthoods, etc.

I hope it's becoming clearer that the Quizzes present a mere shadow of the Myers-Briggs system.


The T/F thing to me seems like more of a "absolute black and white" versus "gray area" method of seeing the world. Objectivity versus subjectivity. Or is that more of a S/N distinction?
Posted by: san j, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 8:10pm; Reply: 121
Quoted from misspudding


The T/F thing to me seems like more of a "absolute black and white" versus "gray area" method of seeing the world. Objectivity versus subjectivity. Or is that more of a S/N distinction?

S/N. BUT:
S/N is a matter of S's tree-focus, versus N's forest-focus.
You can't really call one objective and the other subjective.
And note: Both are "focused"! Both see equally clearly!

As for the terms "absolute" versus "gray areas": There are absolutes and gray areas in Reason as well as Feeling-evaluation. So I'm not sure I'm answering that particular question.

The Objective/Subjective continuum is indeed T/F, respectively, as it refers to the evaluative function.
Reasoned objectivity will trump gut-feeling in most of a T's evaluations, whereas
a subjective feeling is more likely to sway an F-type.
Hope that helps.
Posted by: misspudding, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 8:23pm; Reply: 122
Quoted from san j

S/N. BUT:
S/N is a matter of S's tree-focus, versus N's forest-focus.
You can't really call one objective and the other subjective.
And note: Both are "focused"! Both see equally clearly!

As for the terms "absolute" versus "gray areas": There are absolutes and gray areas in Reason as well as Feeling-evaluation. So I'm not sure I'm answering that particular question.

The Objective/Subjective continuum is indeed T/F, respectively, as it refers to the evaluative function.
Hope that helps.


Yes, it does. Thank you.
Posted by: san j, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 8:25pm; Reply: 123
whoops, mp - just added a sentence to the final paragraph.
Sorry - we're operating IRL time, here -- "chatting"!
Posted by: misspudding, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 8:27pm; Reply: 124
Quoted from san j
whoops, mp - just added a sentence to the final paragraph.
Sorry - we're operating IRL time, here -- "chatting"!


Indeed. I do see the edit. And yes, that makes a lot of sense. I'm very T but I if a subjective assessment makes a lot of rational sense, I'll go with it. :)
Posted by: san j, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 8:29pm; Reply: 125
Quoted from misspudding


Indeed. I do see the edit. And yes, that makes a lot of sense. I'm very T but I if a subjective assessment makes a lot of rational sense, I'll go with it. :)

BINGO!

(clap)
(By George, I think she's got it!)
Posted by: misspudding, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 8:48pm; Reply: 126
Quoted from san j

BINGO!

(clap)
(By George, I think she's got it!)


Hahaha!
Posted by: san j, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 9:08pm; Reply: 127
Gotta say:
This here Introvert has reached her chat limit for now! (tongue)(dizzy)
Posted by: misspudding, Thursday, March 5, 2015, 9:11pm; Reply: 128
Quoted from san j
Gotta say:
This here Introvert has reached her chat limit for now! (tongue)(dizzy)


:)
Posted by: Easy E, Friday, March 6, 2015, 1:51pm; Reply: 129
Quoted from san j
Interestingly, there's an MBTI-typing/human resources specialist who is convinced Introverts make the best salespeople.
Customers do not feel pressured by introverts. Introverts are in it because they know a great deal about a certain product, and are better able to convey product attributes without the pressure of a Whole Personality behind it. The Introvert seller does not feel personally invested in whether or not a prospect shells out the dollars, but is more concerned with genuine customer-satisfaction. The buyer is thus sure that the purchase was completely self-chosen.

I'm glad this came up, here/now.
It brings to the fore the very meaning/definition of Introversion.
There's the prevalent misconception that Introverts are withdrawn, antisocial, solitary beings, and this is not at all what is meant by the term.
Two individuals - one a moderate Introvert and the other a moderate Extravert - can happily live their lives quite similarly, in terms of the structure of their day, the scheduling of their time, for instance.
But their MOTIVATIONS will be different, and what they derive from similar experiences will be very different.
This is one of the reasons the Introvert may more effortlessly achieve extremely high sales numbers, and it can be one of the reasons Introverts can do well as counselors - which involves a whole lot of concern with other people!
Yet another reason I reject quite a bit of the pop literature on typing - it's not nuanced. Someone like Easy E, too, needs to read the better literature as something worthier to apply to his complex situation.
In fact, I'd venture this:
Anyone who tests Introvert should read Myers-Briggs and von Franz in order to understand what this really means.
And Jung, too, of course, if his / her curiosity so moves.  ;)


That is interesting.  My wife is an O+ gatherer and a true extravert.  She is truly energized by talking on the phone, having people over, and excelled in marketing beyond most people that have advanced degrees in it.  She started a successful in home day care and knows like half the city we live in!  I can appear standoffish and maybe even rude to people i don't know at times i'm sure, but it is not because i don't like people, i feel em out and watch first!  If i am super cordial to stangers, it is a bit faked and forced, but i can do it a little while.

In fact, she taught me a lot about marketing and techniques to work with people and it has helped me work with people much better.  I surely have much more introversion, but also am energized by being around people, not necessarily talking to them always.  Doing work in counseling enabled me to learn that i enjoy interacting with people in a more one to one or small group format, but in a more personal type of way.

My wife appears confident on the surface, but says she has very low confidence??  She is a Taurus and a gatherer!  I on the other hand may appear like I am not confident to someone who does not know me, yet inside I am very sure of myself.  I am a virgo A+ explorer with an O- mother and an AB+ father and an A- sister!  I am the only one in my family that has a blood type that is in double digits in the population!  Have a lot of weird genes in me probably, so i don't fit inside a standard box usually!

Posted by: Averno, Friday, March 6, 2015, 2:51pm; Reply: 130
Quoted from Easy E


That is interesting.  My wife is an O+ gatherer and a true extravert.  She is truly energized by talking on the phone, having people over, and excelled in marketing beyond most people that have advanced degrees in it.  She started a successful in home day care and knows like half the city we live in!  I can appear standoffish and maybe even rude to people i don't know at times i'm sure, but it is not because i don't like people, i feel em out and watch first!  If i am super cordial to stangers, it is a bit faked and forced, but i can do it a little while.

In fact, she taught me a lot about marketing and techniques to work with people and it has helped me work with people much better.  I surely have much more introversion, but also am energized by being around people, not necessarily talking to them always.  Doing work in counseling enabled me to learn that i enjoy interacting with people in a more one to one or small group format, but in a more personal type of way.

My wife appears confident on the surface, but says she has very low confidence??  She is a Taurus and a gatherer!  I on the other hand may appear like I am not confident to someone who does not know me, yet inside I am very sure of myself.  I am a virgo A+ explorer with an O- mother and an AB+ father and an A- sister!  I am the only one in my family that has a blood type that is in double digits in the population!  Have a lot of weird genes in me probably, so i don't fit inside a standard box usually!



You've described me here as well. Also a fellow Virgo, which is how I used to explain a lot of things.

I've found that many introverted people are more engaged if they're comfortable opening up, pulling down their defences. For those who won't, I think an extroverted facade is commonly employed, just to get through and get along. Not surprisingly, though, in the right atmosphere, we introverts become happy, natural extraverts. As Amazone I says, we do the opposite of our endings. I believe this is meant that we are complex and variable, not stuck in a rut at all. And when we explore the hows and whys of our "holding back" (not the definition of introversion BTW) we can become more at ease as quiet people fitting into a raucous world.

Posted by: Dianne, Friday, March 6, 2015, 3:11pm; Reply: 131
Quoted from Averno


Not surprisingly, though, in the right atmosphere, we introverts become happy, natural extraverts. As Amazone I says, we do the opposite of our endings. I believe this is meant that we are complex and variable, not stuck in a rut at all. And when we explore the hows and whys of our "holding back" (not the definition of intraversion BTW) we can become more at ease as quiet people fitting into a raucous world.



I type always as INFJ and over the years, I can relate to being in the right atmosphere as you quoted above, that I can be quite an extravert and really enjoy myself much to my own surprise. But when these friends see me in another situation, they must find me peculiar as I go quiet and retreat.  :)

Posted by: Averno, Friday, March 6, 2015, 3:18pm; Reply: 132
Yep. One can get a reputation of "moody" from that. But close friends know better  ;)

It helps alot to feel well physically. Some of our reserved nature comes from being overwhelmed and exhausted. It can take a lot of energy to be on our game.
Posted by: Amazone I., Tuesday, March 10, 2015, 9:07pm; Reply: 133
right ho dearle Averno but often all this is confonded to so called coldness or arogance of INTJ's... which isn't at all but often only being an introvert to a super introvert...


sorry can't come along with any smily... they don't want to work for me this evening...or do they resist to Switzerland.....:-/....
I  implemented signs of the script board of my pc.. but none of the D-boards worked...so far..ok beautiful that those  worked ;-)... but hey guys  or Dr. D. would be nice to get this fixed soon as well and thanx for all your kind interventions and help for old Europe ...:-) mmmuuuaaahhhsss... xoxi from Isa
Posted by: The Mystic, Wednesday, March 11, 2015, 1:34am; Reply: 134
Quoted from san j
Thanks, C_Sharp for showing us SWAMI's very tidy system correlating MB personality functions with D'Adamo's genotypes, as follows:

Extraversion: genotypes 2,5, and 6
Introversion: genotypes 1, 3, and 4

Sensation: genotypes 2, 3, and 6
Intuition: genotypes 1, 4, and 5

Thinking: genotypes 1, 2, and 5
Feeling: genotypes 3, 4, and 6

Judging: genotypes 1, 2, and 3
Perceiving: genotypes 4, 5, and 6

Look how perfectly balanced these are!
Even Jung, Keirsey, vonFranz and the Myers-Briggses themselves couldn't make the numbers add up like that!


Quoted from The Mystic
If I go by this guideline, INFP would be GenoType 4.

If my new genotype testing comes up Explorer, then I'd still be atypical.
I am Rh+ and have tested twice as a Secretor.



San J - my Swami Pro Practitioner says that I AM in fact an Explorer - not a Hunter.  

Posted by: Averno, Wednesday, March 11, 2015, 1:46am; Reply: 135
Quoted from Amazone I.
right ho dearle Averno but often all this is confonded to so called coldness or arogance of INTJ's... which isn't at all but often only being an introvert to a super introvert...


sorry can't come along with any smily... they don't want to work for me this evening...or do they resist to Switzerland.....:-/....
I  implemented signs of the script board of my pc.. but none of the D-boards worked...so far..ok beautiful that those  worked ;-)... but hey guys  or Dr. D. would be nice to get this fixed soon as well and thanx for all your kind interventions and help for old Europe ...:-) mmmuuuaaahhhsss... xoxi from Isa


Hmmmnnn... My smileys aren't working now either.

Posted by: ABJoe, Wednesday, March 11, 2015, 3:39am; Reply: 136
Quoted from Averno


Hmmmnnn... My smileys aren't working now either.



:) :-/ :o ;) :P :B 8) ;D :( :K) :D >:( :'( ::) ??) :X(sunny)(evil)(clap)(dance)
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, March 11, 2015, 9:02am; Reply: 137
btw the mentioned chiphres above are wrongly posed in their meanings....so wrong infos are taken to be  guaranted as exact and we're torn into the wrong direction... therefore adaptions of dif. systems aren't  the solution to work together at all....:-(

and my smilies still don't work.....
Posted by: san j, Wednesday, March 11, 2015, 8:35pm; Reply: 138
Quoted from The Mystic
If I go by this guideline, INFP would be GenoType 4.

If my new genotype testing comes up Explorer, then I'd still be atypical.
I am Rh+ and have tested twice as a Secretor.
Quoted from Amazone I.
btw the mentioned chiphres above are wrongly posed in their meanings....so wrong infos are taken to be  guaranted as exact and we're torn into the wrong direction... therefore adaptions of dif. systems aren't  the solution to work together at all....:-(

Gotta say. AH-->NAH-->TM: I'm w/ our Schweizele on this one.
Yes, our friend C_Sharp was kind enough to show us the program.
Go where you need to.  :)

Posted by: Amazone I., Thursday, March 12, 2015, 6:14am; Reply: 139
San J it's merely written likewise S c h w e i z e r l i  ;) and I'm not against C_Sharps friendly show ups what is written elsewhere... but I'm merely against N O T to respect other systems of psychologocal traits which were wrongly put into scene  :P :-/ this is against my honour for the creators expressis verbis C.G. Jung!!!

Next: NT's often have the intense feeling for corrections... :B ok I agree...and it's also true that I nearly feel humilated when things likewise happen....coz it shows also that a lot follow without any doubts nor thinkings about
our own healthsystem so far so long... :-/... :X and I also was persuated it was to be seen elsewhere... not to put any wrong data nor false infos onto whatever...and now it happened obviously... I get nearly crazy to take knowledge about this.... ::) :P >:( :B and need to persuade myselve to go for further tolerances....and what else next??)...
Even the Keirseys system wrote about MB or B-M's funny sort of puttings NF's versus NT's and vice versa...here we only can trust the enneagram to have put all this into its correct lines...therefore I'm very thankful coz it shows up the way it really is...  ;D

wohooo smileys are working again thanx to the one who made it possible :K)(clap)(dance)(ok)(cool)
Posted by: san j, Thursday, March 12, 2015, 3:16pm; Reply: 140
Quoted from Amazone I.
Quoted from san j
I'm w/ our Schweizele on this one.
it's merely written likewise S c h w e i z e r l i   ;)

Unless what one means is indeed "Schweizele", Isale chèrele.  ;) ;)
Posted by: Averno, Thursday, March 12, 2015, 3:48pm; Reply: 141
Quoted from Amazone I.
right ho dearle Averno but often all this is confonded to so called coldness or arogance of INTJ's... which isn't at all but often only being an introvert to a super introvert...


Funny you should mention this. My directness (OK, my wife calls it bluntness)  does sometimes appear as cold, impatient arrogance. In certain situations this might admittedly be true, though people close to me "get it". But in normal curcumstances I am outwardly warm and empathetic- the guy that strangers recognize will hear them out and help them. But if the BS starts to fly...

House of David, given your previous observation about your own INTJ -ness, maybe you can speak to these contrary appearances?



Posted by: Averno, Thursday, March 12, 2015, 4:21pm; Reply: 142
Quoted from Amazone I.
NT's often have the intense feeling for corrections... :B ok I agree...and it's also true that I nearly feel humilated when things likewise happen....coz it shows also that a lot follow without any doubts nor thinkings about
our own healthsystem so far so long... :-/... :X and I also was persuated it was to be seen elsewhere... not to put any wrong data nor false infos onto whatever...and now it happened obviously... I get nearly crazy to take knowledge about this.... ::) :P >:( :B and need to persuade myselve to go for further tolerances....and what else next??)...
Even the Keirseys system wrote about MB or B-M's funny sort of puttings NF's versus NT's and vice versa...here we only can trust the enneagram to have put all this into its correct lines...therefore I'm very thankful coz it shows up the way it really is...  ;D


Yep, this the BS flying, and I too have no patience or tolerance for the sales pitches being offered by the Pharmaceutical Industrial Complex. (Shame on medical providers who've forgotten their Hippocratic oath and lost the ability to think and act independently of their institutions).

And yes, it conjures a great frustration and disappointment that so many people prostrate themselves to this and become prey, incurious of their own fate. Too bad more aren't better equiped to see through it.   ;)





Posted by: san j, Thursday, March 12, 2015, 5:48pm; Reply: 143
Interesting to note this thread's OP:
Quoted from Constantine
I notice that SWAMI asks for your MB type (ISTJ, INTP, etc.)  Is this for research purposes or does this directly go into calculating your GenoType?

If the latter, it'd be interesting to know the correlations, particularly for the Nomad type.  But I don't remember reading about anything like this in the GenoType book.  Maybe I missed something....  Anybody have any info on this?

His avatar states he is B, Nomad, INTP.
There is another thread running right now on Personality Type and SWAMI  (continuing the Forum's recent trend toward splitting a conversation between threads)  ??)
It's the correlation between MBTI and SWAMI that this thread questions, back in 2009. He wants to know if there's anything at all written about this.
I'm interested in this subject and, with Constantine, misspudding and many others, await some examples of research on it.  :-/

In the meantime, I personally keep my studies of MBTI separate from dietary considerations. But I'm open to being convinced otherwise (P-type that I am!  :D )
Posted by: gulfcoastguy, Friday, March 13, 2015, 11:48pm; Reply: 144
Quoted from Averno


Funny you should mention this. My directness (OK, my wife calls it bluntness)  does sometimes appear as cold, impatient arrogance. In certain situations this might admittedly be true, though people close to me "get it". But in normal curcumstances I am outwardly warm and empathetic- the guy that strangers recognize will hear them out and help them. But if the BS starts to fly...

House of David, given your previous observation about your own INTJ -ness, maybe you can speak to these contrary appearances?





Yes as an INTJ I often cut straight to the heart of a question and plainly and clearly answer it. I'm not usually one to "break it gently".  That actually sometimes helps me at work because everybody knows that I don't dissemble and thinks that if I did I would be really bad at it. Now after I answer your question I'll go out of my way to help you deal with the situation if that is what you want. Not a big one on just listening to people complain about a situation if it is obvious that they aren't going to take any action to remedy it or adapt though.
Posted by: Averno, Saturday, March 14, 2015, 12:13am; Reply: 145
Quoted from gulfcoastguy


Yes as an INTJ I often cut straight to the heart of a question and plainly and clearly answer it. I'm not usually one to "break it gently".  That actually sometimes helps me at work because everybody knows that I don't dissemble and thinks that if I did I would be really bad at it. Now after I answer your question I'll go out of my way to help you deal with the situation if that is what you want. Not a big one on just listening to people complain about a situation if it is obvious that they aren't going to take any action to remedy it or adapt though.


Ding! Ding! Ding! Give that man a cheroot!
Posted by: Amazone I., Sunday, March 15, 2015, 3:15pm; Reply: 146
Averno was it meant Hypocrite oath  ??) :X(scared)(funny)(evil)
Posted by: Averno, Sunday, March 15, 2015, 3:17pm; Reply: 147
Quoted from Amazone I.
Averno was it meant Hypocrite oath  ??) :X(scared)(funny)(evil)


I sometimes wonder.
Posted by: san j, Sunday, March 15, 2015, 7:04pm; Reply: 148
I just wrote an explanation of the difference between the Introvert's and the Extravert's ruling function's presentation. It's on the "E/I and J/P" thread running concurrently to this.

I mention it within the context of this INTJ discussion:

The TJ is always meeting the world with his THINKING function.
Thinking is his Extraverted function.
But, because he is an Introvert, his ruling function, Intuition, remains unseen, inside, away from the meet-&-greet rough and tumble of the day-to-day world.
This is a type whose Intuition is the Primary function, Thinking is the Auxiliary function, Feeling is another auxiliary, and Sensation is the so-called "Inferior" function.
If an INTJ's "TJ-ness" is problematic, he can benefit from training Feeling to step in and buffer/assist that misunderstood sentry, Thinking.
All the while, Intuition/Intuitiveness reigns, introverted.
:)
(See other thread for details)
Posted by: Amazone I., Monday, March 16, 2015, 8:22am; Reply: 149
as to be seen in Gifts differing and also in the  Keirsey system...

intp/j's are often misunderstood coz somtimes our communication is so detailed that none can really follow what is...was meant coz the blubberer is far away in his concerned thoughts about his/her own bubbles ... ;D ;D ;D
But we do expect others  know and have understood.... :B :B :B which isn't true at all...(evil)(funny)(shrug)....


This happened lately to me comparing and discussing with a prof of physic "the string theory-Einstein's rel. theory
with his own trouvaillen inwhich he was doing the demontage of Einstein's theory..." we blubbered a long time on the phone and no-one of us really had gotten the partners speech or meanings indeed... :o
what was the causa here... typical NT attitude of stubborn arrogance and the way how to proceed or being aware about different views... can't be accepted sauf the blubbers are from the blubberer.... ;) ;D(hehe)(hehe)(eek)(shrug)

This is it what maked discussions so hard and often people angry...
Posted by: san j, Tuesday, March 17, 2015, 8:47pm; Reply: 150
Some data y'all are awaiting:

Estimates differ, but Keirsey's population prevalence figures are -roughly- something like:

SP ("Artisans"): 40% or more:
ESTP "Promoters": 10% or more
ISTP "Crafters": as much as 10%
ESFP "Performers": something over 10%
ISFP "Composers": 9 or 10 %

SJ ("Guardians"): 40% or more:
ESTJ "Supervisors": at least 10%
ISTJ "Inspectors": perhaps as much as 10%
ESFJ "Providers": very likely more than 10%
ISFJ "Protectors": perhaps as much as 10%

NF ("Idealists"): 7% or more:
ENFJ "Teachers": around 2%
INFJ "Counselors: little more than 1%
ENFP "Champions": 2-3 %
INFP "Healers": around 1%

NT ("Rationalists"): 6% or more:
ENTJ "Fieldmarshals": something less than 2%
INTJ "Masterminds": no more than, say, 1%
ENTP "Inventors": About 2%
INTP "Architects": say, 1%

As you can see, Keirsey is estimating S as around 85%, with N a minority of around 15%.
He sees the other continua (E/I, T/F, and J/P) as roughly evenly divided 50/50)
Posted by: san j, Sunday, March 22, 2015, 6:35pm; Reply: 151
Here's a fun one, y'all, wherein the four Keirseyan temperaments are used as categorizers:

Quoted from Kroeger & Thuessen, Type Talk
We have a swimming pool so we entertain a lot in the summer.

Our SP guests always grab all the pool toys, head right for the water, and invent a new game.
The NFs sprawl on the lounge chairs and talk earnestly about life and people.
The NTs Dangle their feet in the water, rib each other, and critique the issues and people in their professions.
And the SJs always, always find some work to do, like hanging up towels, husking corn, scrubbing the grill, or pulling weeds from the garden.
Posted by: misspudding, Monday, March 23, 2015, 7:14am; Reply: 152
Quoted from san j
Some data y'all are awaiting:

Estimates differ, but Keirsey's population prevalence figures are -roughly- something like:

SP ("Artisans"): 40% or more:
ESTP "Promoters": 10% or more
ISTP "Crafters": as much as 10%
ESFP "Performers": something over 10%
ISFP "Composers": 9 or 10 %

SJ ("Guardians"): 40% or more:
ESTJ "Supervisors": at least 10%
ISTJ "Inspectors": perhaps as much as 10%
ESFJ "Providers": very likely more than 10%
ISFJ "Protectors": perhaps as much as 10%

NF ("Idealists"): 7% or more:
ENFJ "Teachers": around 2%
INFJ "Counselors: little more than 1%
ENFP "Champions": 2-3 %
INFP "Healers": around 1%

NT ("Rationalists"): 6% or more:
ENTJ "Fieldmarshals": something less than 2%
INTJ "Masterminds": no more than, say, 1%
ENTP "Inventors": About 2%
INTP "Architects": say, 1%

As you can see, Keirsey is estimating S as around 85%, with N a minority of around 15%.
He sees the other continua (E/I, T/F, and J/P) as roughly evenly divided 50/50)


Wow, N's are really rare. Interesting!
Posted by: Amazone I., Monday, March 23, 2015, 7:39am; Reply: 153
we can also observe here the so called 20/80% rule but I'm asking what about the 7% of those who stay appart??) ;)...

btw it can be seen that the world is into a science research thema...so far 7% of NT drive the world nuts and 40% of the SJ's make the money out of all this by financing studies with their companies... ;D
40% of the Sp's do gentelly accept all those try to make us believe in popping the pills and the NF's will  give a try to save our souls by preaching in psychotherapy ....(evil)(funny)(hehe)
Posted by: Averno, Monday, March 23, 2015, 11:20am; Reply: 154
Quoted from Amazone I.
btw it can be seen that the world is into a science research thema...so far 7% of NT drive the world nuts and 40% of the SJ's make the money out of all this by financing studies with their companies... ;D
40% of the Sp's do gentelly accept all those try to make us believe in popping the pills and the NF's will  give a try to save our souls by preaching in psychotherapy ....(evil)(funny)(hehe)


(funny)(clap)(smarty)(cool)

That is hilarious!
Posted by: Amazone I., Monday, March 23, 2015, 12:43pm; Reply: 155






                                                       ;) ;D :D :B
Posted by: san j, Monday, March 23, 2015, 11:05pm; Reply: 156
Quoted from san j
Estimates differ, but Keirsey's population prevalence figures are -roughly- something like:...
Quoted from misspudding
Wow, N's are really rare.

Re-read what I've emphasized.  ;)
Keirsey posits it, and, since you find it interesting, you might want to look into what others' research finds.  :)


Posted by: Amazone I., Tuesday, March 24, 2015, 7:10pm; Reply: 157
btw I justamente made some more comparisons between all the 3 systems and became aware that even in the Keirsey system things might  appear very similar between NT's and SJ's so described in MBTI but then correctly described in the enneagram... I'm really not sure who'r right..perhaps all ??)...I also observed a lot can be changed whithin NF's and NT's as well between SP's and SJ's coz I think it's a bit the similar family... NTs &NF's as abstract -one in their t-and f-sides in word and scripts- and SP's and SJ's as the so called "matter of facts" peeps and even the super-reallistic-ones... living in the here and now... but then there are some more ??) huh..what... as said it isn't really detectable whithin all the systems......."who's right " ;)  ;D(smarty)(shrug)(funny)

There are a lot of tendencies and while implementing the enneagram with all the sub-types... jaminei we won't get ready until...??) :o :-/(evil)(clown)

Ok lets say : become aware of your own prefered style to face and cope the world... but then give you the chance to digg much deaper.... ;)... if  really wished for further understandings...(smarty)(whistle)(hehe)

Wish you all "bonne chance" todays I think the best always still is your belly feeling...even as being an NT... ;) ;D
Posted by: san j, Wednesday, May 13, 2015, 6:19am; Reply: 158
http://www.lifehack.org/articles/work/which-job-should-you-get-based-your-personality-type.html
Correlating MBTI w/ top-5 career picks?
Posted by: Amazone I., Friday, May 15, 2015, 8:57am; Reply: 159
not at all... this ressembles to me a bit too associatif... :-/ and stereotypically.... :P(evil)(funny)(shrug)....
Posted by: misspudding, Saturday, May 16, 2015, 6:29am; Reply: 160
Quoted from san j


I identify way more with the INTP picks. Not at all a marketing/politician type, and I'm don't have the guts to be an entrepreneur. Interesting, though.
Posted by: san j, Saturday, May 16, 2015, 3:44pm; Reply: 161
These, as most simplifications do, represent "pure" types, IMO: Those who test 100% to type, without ever varying.
I don't think I've ever met one o' those.  :D

The best way to use this chart is actually the best way to use any typology:
For learning.
As a gauge or meter.
To assist in articulating contributing factors.
For refinement of understanding.

Take it for what it is, not what it isn't, and you'll be okay with it.  ;)
Posted by: Amazone I., Sunday, May 17, 2015, 6:53am; Reply: 162
Mp...please remember...we can play all kinds of NT'roles... once merely the extraverts...depending up the very situation, and once more the introverts... ;) it also depends of the tests... here and there we are mentioned as E's and then change the provider and you're reduced to an I...so far....we are both but do have a sort of prefered  pattern to be able to cope with the outer world...the true entrepreneur is often E-lasting...;) ENTJ the most outgoing but reserved role.... but also related to intj..... ;D(hehe)(funny) while moving  on in the enneagramm we do need strong correlation for the 8's called ENFP/J...'s ... ;)as a sort of integrative  performance....(whistle)(goofy)(ondrugs)...and please also remember as well: all introverts do the opposite of their endings.... :o ;D.....


btw. I justement saw a speech from a psychatrics of teutonia and he really thinks and believes the shrott he labers about so called: borderline syndrome... ha-ha-haaa he describes the classical no 4... equal if 4/3 or 4/5 = infp or infj as a very sick person.... :o :-/ :P >:(....
and  instead of accepting the person infront of him... he paralyzes him or her and sended her/him into completely wrong ways of several therapies... behaviouristics and so on and infliges those as being partiellamente nearly nuts and very in need of any therapy....(funny)(evil)(funny)(evil)(funny)(shrug)..........

I got really upset but then thought by myselve....all a question of systems and the acceptance of the envirenement.... as long as we do believe in syndromes created by those and big pharma... as long we might be the losers... but if we're able to look beyond of all those systems we might become clearminded and clearsighted as well... instead of victimized !!! (sunny)
Posted by: Amazone I., Monday, May 18, 2015, 8:42am; Reply: 163
justamente passed another test and I scored...

Type 5 = 9 points   =intp/J    
Type 1 = 8,7 points =ENTP/J
Type 8=  5,7points  =ENFP/J  

& the wings.... :o... :D....


1/9 = 10.6points =ENTP
5/6= 10.2 points =intj
1/2 = 10.2points =ENTJ
5/4= 9.5 points =intp


                                                                                                          ;D ;D ;                                                                                                                                                                                                            
Posted by: deblynn3, Monday, May 18, 2015, 2:27pm; Reply: 164
as a ISTJ I'm glad to hear there aren't so many "norm" types.  
Posted by: misspudding, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 12:48am; Reply: 165
Quoted from Amazone I.
Mp...please remember...we can play all kinds of NT'roles... once merely the extraverts...depending up the very situation, and once more the introverts... ;) it also depends of the tests... here and there we are mentioned as E's and then change the provider and you're reduced to an I...so far....we are both but do have a sort of prefered  pattern to be able to cope with the outer world...the true entrepreneur is often E-lasting...;) ENTJ the most outgoing but reserved role.... but also related to intj..... ;D(hehe)(funny) while moving  on in the enneagramm we do need strong correlation for the 8's called ENFP/J...'s ... ;)as a sort of integrative  performance....(whistle)(goofy)(ondrugs)...and please also remember as well: all introverts do the opposite of their endings.... :o ;D.....


I'm very extroverted, but I need my alone time, too! I have read ENTPs tend to be the least extroverted of the extroverts. :)

Haha.

I know it's just a tool to help understand oneself, not a badge of absolutism.
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, May 20, 2015, 9:40am; Reply: 166
:D(clap)(ok)(smarty)(evil)(funny)(shrug)(hugegrin)(bunny)
Posted by: Ro, Saturday, May 23, 2015, 10:54am; Reply: 167
Hi, I just received my SWAMI yesterday in the mail.  I haven't taken the tests yet.  I tested as an Explorer in 09, I think before SWAMI was available.  The diet helped but all of it did not work.  Hoping the SWAMI fills the holes.  I have briefed through most of this thread and I am hopeful I will test different although looking at my potential other genotypes still nothing is a perfect fit.  My system can handle the product Almased.  It is a soy based protein shake.  It is non GMO and organic and has honey enzymes and a probiotic.  I think the Warrior type can handle soy.  The explored is a no and the Hunter is a no for soy. In the Warrior diet the meat choices are limited and no eggs  and I can eat farm fresh eggs daily with no back lash.  We have a livestock farm and eggs are everyday around here.

I am a female INTJ enneagram 5w6 sx variant.  I also took a poll over male function vs female function addressing masculinity/femininity  and tested exclusively feminine.  Most/Many INTJ females test masculine.  The Ti stack wins out.  I test like 75-85% in Fi and 95-98% in Ti...so I function high in Feelings of empathy and compassion...but my logic always tells me people are where they are from the decision they made in most...but not all...cases, so my Feels can go by the way side.
I think I would do well on the Hunter or Warrior diet.  ANYTHING but the Explorer diet! I don't like it...at all.  The only thing to note on that is my grandmother died of non alcoholic fatty liver disease.  I too do not kick things out well at all.   I react to chemicals, meds and smells....so typing myself has been difficult.
I am A- blood, Rh-, a super taster and do not have my secretor done yet.  
I have read on Rh-blood and have read that it can factor into changing your type.
Any thoughts on the info I have given would be appreciated.
INTJ
Enneagram 5w6 sx variant
A-
Rh-
tested as Explorer from the book....NOOOOOOO :K)
Thanks in advance!
Posted by: Averno, Saturday, May 23, 2015, 12:38pm; Reply: 168
Hi Ro.

INTJ  enneagram 5 Warrior here. I also have some Explorer traits,  and your general disposition decribes me as well. I handle soy very well.

The secretor test is highly recommended and will be valuable in determining your Swami food lists. As an Rh- you are most likely Explorer, but the secretor issue may refine your diet towards the foods you seem naturally driven to. However, and as you no doubt already know, what an individual feels is suitable is not always what that individual should eat over the long run. Immediate reactions to foods are not always the best indicator of a healthy compatibility. A transition period should be expectected, but this adjustment may leave you in a better state than you thought possible. Certainly true for me, at least.
Posted by: san j, Saturday, May 23, 2015, 2:51pm; Reply: 169
INTJ means soy is good?

PS. This thread is running right now, on Soy.
http://www.dadamo.com/cgi-bin/Blah/Blah.pl?m-1431753435/s-new/#num11
Posted by: Averno, Saturday, May 23, 2015, 4:08pm; Reply: 170
Quoted from san j
INTJ means soy is good?


No.
Posted by: Ro, Saturday, May 23, 2015, 4:37pm; Reply: 171
agreed with Averno...NO...that was not the emphasis I was linking with Soy.  Read the entire post and don't be so impulsive. ;)
Posted by: Serenity, Sunday, May 24, 2015, 3:08am; Reply: 172
Hi Ro,
I am an infj, I followed the warrior diet for years until I updated some info on swami & was changed to teacher.  Soy has always sat well with me also. :)
My sister is an intj, I would describe her as niether masculine nor feminine, I have never thought about that before.
Do you have a link for the test you used?  
Posted by: Ro, Sunday, May 24, 2015, 3:56pm; Reply: 173
garrote.bdmonkeys.net/bsri.html  is the actual link to the test I took for a poll.  For whatever reason it will not open on my computer now.

I found a second link.  I have not taken this but it said it was similar to BSRI
http://personality-testing.info/tests/OSRI/

Hope it works
BSRI-  Bem sexual role inventory.
I am traditional in most things...so feminine fits and is not so much the way of women today.  I can see any INTJ female going either way.  Think with a brain that builds and puts things together makes you competitive with male in a job scenario.  I live on a farm....I can't out brute my husband...and would never try ;).
Posted by: Averno, Sunday, May 24, 2015, 8:46pm; Reply: 174

Interesting test. I scored:

70 / 100 masculine
72 / 100 feminine
60 / 100 androgynous

Kind of makes sense given that I'm INTJ over INFJ by only 1%.
Posted by: Ro, Sunday, May 24, 2015, 10:25pm; Reply: 175
Balance builds a more efficient human Averno :) :o :D
Posted by: Serenity, Monday, May 25, 2015, 9:07am; Reply: 176
I scored 85 masculine & 112 feminine, I didn't score an amount for androgenous.  
Am I right in thinking both are high scores & are therefore androgenous?
Posted by: Ro, Monday, May 25, 2015, 12:42pm; Reply: 177
Hi Serenity.  
Honestly, I have no idea.  I haven't taken the test that you took.  I took the one that I cant get the link to work on ...I posted it first.
The main thing that fascinated me about the poll was that there was an EXTREMELY LOW amount of feminine scoring INTJ's.  I scored really high in fem...I just think it drops the "percentage of people" in the  group of people that are like me.  I think INTJ females are only 1% of the population...or less...a fem preferring has got to be less.
I have the capability of shutting the fem preference off and behaving more masculine, I just choose not to.  It has worked out better for me in life to live in the traditional fem qualities.  I am very traditional by nature though.
Posted by: Amazone I., Monday, May 25, 2015, 3:56pm; Reply: 178
hello Ro and welcome in the club ;) ;D...btw where is that test to find ??)... I'm sure I'll score  more masculine then feminine parts... sure and certain... :B :P(evil)(funny)(shrug)
Posted by: Ro, Monday, May 25, 2015, 5:03pm; Reply: 179
Hi Amazone I...love the handle btw,

Go to page 7 on this topic and I posted a link and maybe a little info.  It is towards the bottom of the responses.  What is your Briggs Meyer type?
Posted by: Averno, Monday, May 25, 2015, 10:36pm; Reply: 180
Here's another version of the OSRI that illustrates your scoring on an x-y field graph.

http://personality-testing.info/tests/OSRI/

The site also provides some other interesting tests:

http://personality-testing.info
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, May 27, 2015, 7:05am; Reply: 181
thanx and as mentioned I scored 101 over 96 of prefering masculine traits to handle  outer world ;)...and btw..I've marked my type in  the seen AB infos ;)...
latest testversion of  eclectic energies are  also described.... ;) ;D..... :o :-/ :P


btw I'm not sure what shall be the typical masculine atributes or vice versa... a bit of too much clichée thinkings.. no ??)... :o(disappointed)(worried)(mad)(shrug)(scared) ( read all about not well developed types in B-M's "gifts differings"... ;) ;D ;D :X


and Averno dearle...can't say anything about your mentioned links... need to see em first ;) ;D....

best to all outta Switzerland .... :D :K)


ps.


ok I've seen those infos...great and thanx Averno-dearle ;)... but all this leads to me... speeches from my old "advaita-teacher" *Isa, if you believe in karma...so ther's karma... and if you don't believe in karma...so ther's no karma *... but all those inventions
are proofs for me that the enneagram seems to be right...all NT's need to take more accurarcy in their researches...if not all of this might be...or become..: assumptions...presumptions and so on... ;) ;D(hehe)(funny)(hehe)(scared)(hand)(goofy)(think)


ppss:

I presume that all this is due to my prénatale conditioneerings of the expectancy of my parents "to become a boy" ;).. ;D(funny)(hehe)(hugegrin)(shrug)(whistle)..... and re-belotte backjumpings into the beautiful victim-role.......(woot)(evil)(clown)(shhh)...and so on....... :o ;D ;D :X
Posted by: Easy E, Wednesday, May 27, 2015, 11:29am; Reply: 182
If I don't believe in gravity, it doesn't exist? ;)  Or should i just call it another name?!  I disagree with your teacher on this point:)  

Many of these tests are biased and if one knows how to answer them a certain way, they will get the results they believe they will get.  There is little objectivity and accuracy to these tests (just my belief).  They never worked for me and i don't understand them well.
Posted by: Averno, Wednesday, May 27, 2015, 12:10pm; Reply: 183
Mostly, I think, just parlor games. Fairly simplistic. While they do carry the potential for some self-awareness, the risk, as Amazone I points out, is of self definition founded in conceit. The difference is in understanding that what we make of knowledge is far more valuable than what we've learned. Not always apparent to a lot of folks.

BTW, Easy E, gravity, like Karma, is unproven beyond observation of it's effect. It remains theoretical  ;)

http://ncse.com/rncse/27/5-6/gravity-its-only-theory
Posted by: Easy E, Wednesday, May 27, 2015, 1:09pm; Reply: 184
That is true.  There is a lot people do not understand about some things, even things like gravity.   In certain conditions the laws of gravity may change.  But there are hard and fast rules to many things that will not change just because one believes it to be or not be so.  If there are none, no boundaries exist and a person will be overcome and lost.  

Hence we see the many problems with morality and general corruption seen in society today, they all want to think they can live in their own reality and own rules all the time, if it works for them, then it is okay, if i believe it then it is so, if not it isn't there, etc.  They think as long as i am happy that is what matters, and these people are not happy!   I believe this is a deceptive way of thinking that will lead one to confusion and possibly down a bad road.  I disagree with Amazone's professor/teacher regarding that statement!


Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, May 27, 2015, 2:32pm; Reply: 185
(hehe)(hehe)(hehe)(funny) hilarious Easy E... please re-read your response about your belief system... this is exactly the point of... and don't worry your mustn't  believe Jean Klein at all...  ;) ;D :K).............toooooo funny...(evil)(clown)......... :X

ok I've seen your responses justamente a bit later and I apologize it is as Averno describes... sorry for my bad enggglish  :o :B :B :o :-/(smile)(goofy)
Posted by: Easy E, Wednesday, May 27, 2015, 3:50pm; Reply: 186
I gathered that is what you were saying as i took time to read more closely!  I saw the karma statement and just put it together quickly in my mind and assumed.  That is how i make assumptions, just see a little bit of the info and come to a conclusion and that is what it is to me, and then it can be hard to shake! ;)   Perhaps this is why personality tests cause me issues :)  
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, May 27, 2015, 4:12pm; Reply: 187
dearle.. please become more aware about the MB's booklet : gifts differings " :d..... and please don't feel offended.. it wasn't meant  at all :B.... !!!

:K) from yours amiga Isa ... :D
Posted by: cajun, Wednesday, May 27, 2015, 4:39pm; Reply: 188
Interesting tests, Averno! ;D
I took the artistic preference test;  as I believe i enjoy a wide variety of styles.
Turns out I picked Romanticism first, Impressionism second and tied for third were Realsim and post Impressionism.
Classic and Baroque were in the middle with Expressionism and Rococco last.
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, May 27, 2015, 4:51pm; Reply: 189
cajun-dearle you seem to be a 4/5 called infj ;)... but also can be...detoured by ... yallahisimo indeed for 9/1 ;)... = isfj.......(ondrugs)(bunny)(blush)(wiseman) :K)... they're soooo similar...but one is merly nf and the other one sj or even sp... but all are introverts...;) .. ;D
Posted by: Easy E, Thursday, May 28, 2015, 6:03pm; Reply: 190
Quoted from Amazone I.
dearle.. please become more aware about the MB's booklet : gifts differings " :d..... and please don't feel offended.. it wasn't meant  at all :B.... !!!

:K) from yours amiga Isa ... :D


I wasn't offended.  I mainly was critiquing john klein (whoever he may be, i know he was your teacher) on the karma statement because i felt like that is the same as all or nothing thinking or narrow thinking.  I feel close to brain strain so my abstract thinking is not full on the past 2 days!  I also can be narrow minded :P

Myers briggs and other personality stuff interests me a good bit actually.  I still don't know what letters i am.  I don't think i could ever do a self test or just learn what it is on my own because it would be biased.  I know myself (pretty well, still learning :))  I know what traits i personally admire and hold in highest regard, that would bias my results prob!

Posted by: Averno, Thursday, May 28, 2015, 6:41pm; Reply: 191
These are common concerns, Easy. It requires some real honesty to answer the questions without some bias coming through. These tests do ask a fair number of questions in order to minimize that. Just try to answer with a mind to how you've processed things throughout your life, who you naturally are. Not necessarily how you've been "trained" to respond or how you might idealize your responses. Take the tests when you feel fresh.

You might even get different (though similar) results each time or with different tests. Not terribly unusual, but the more honest you are with the answers, the more likely you'll say "Hey, that's me!"   (Mostly  ;) )
Posted by: Amazone I., Thursday, May 28, 2015, 7:27pm; Reply: 192
amigo mio Easy E... oum sigh... Dr. Jean Klein was and still is..even he's dead since a while... one of the greatest and wisest advaita teachers of this century !!!
Next::  I think you've lots of  traits of no 1-5 and 8 of the enneagram....;) :D... but helas we do cope with both parts of E and i-ness ;)

wish you a fine day all best from Switzerland ..... 8)
Posted by: cajun, Thursday, May 28, 2015, 8:39pm; Reply: 193
Hi Isa!

What does 4/5 and 9/1 mean?  ??)
Yes, I am an  ISFJ.... ;D
Posted by: Amazone I., Friday, May 29, 2015, 6:48am; Reply: 194
cajun-dearle g'd morning :D

isfj = 9/1 in the enneagram
infj= 4/5 in the enneagram


they ressemble a lot but infj's do more use their n-side and isfj's merely their s'side... this is the little quarrel if I may say this likewise... indeed it is not coz all types are inborn but different gifts ;) ;D... So the sensing types like sp and sj do match nicely together coz they are matter of facts and NF's and NT's do...coz they are merely abstract thinkers .... :D

But this doesn't mean that none of em can cope with the others...coz here in the booklets from Prof.Keirsey mentions the so called "pygmalion project" ... this means that often we're going to want to change our partners instead accepting them as they are...;) this might lead to conflicst....
internal and external ;) ;D... :X

                                                                                                       :K)

have a fine day and greetings from Switzerland (smarty)(sunny)(clown)
Posted by: san j, Friday, May 29, 2015, 9:54pm; Reply: 195
Quoted from Averno
You might even get different (though similar) results each time or with different tests. Not terribly unusual, but the more honest you are with the answers, the more likely you'll say "Hey, that's me!"   (Mostly  ;) )

It's also not unusual for typing professionals to eschew the tests altogether.
Kin'a like saying: Should you answer a questionnaire to find out your eye color? or might you look in the mirror?
Those researchers prefer 16 descriptions, one for each type, which the subject reads; very often there's one description that stands out immediately. (This is also used by some with respect to the nine Enneagram types.)  Yes: The "Hey, that's me" can be stated even without submitting to a test, in many if not most cases. The tests are imperfect and often don't help the individual arrive at the right answer! You'll hear, "I tend to test 'Intuitive', but it doesn't match my overall personality; if I change that 'N' result to an 'S', the type-description fits very well." Do we trust questionnaires more than the subject? This isn't the case with everyone, but the Paragraph Method as the first line of questioning, with Test questions as backup for fine-tuning, where there are doubts, blankets the field more effectively, IMO.

Similar to our knowing whether we do well with certain foods/ ingredients/ sports, etc.:
Many of us gravitated to the BTD because we already knew we, as individuals, did better eating/avoiding certain items; we didn't need Dr. D'Adamo to tell us that, but it was a confirmer.
Posted by: Averno, Friday, May 29, 2015, 10:54pm; Reply: 196
More art than science  ;)
Posted by: misspudding, Saturday, May 30, 2015, 12:00am; Reply: 197
I'm apparently "androgynous". Pretty much equal on masculine/feminine stuff. I always figured that about myself anyway.
Posted by: san j, Saturday, May 30, 2015, 4:37am; Reply: 198
mp - Either sex can be any type.  MBTI type doesn't imply sex.
Edit: Oh, I see - no longer about Myers-Briggs...
Posted by: Easy E, Saturday, May 30, 2015, 5:37am; Reply: 199
Quoted from Amazone I.
amigo mio Easy E... oum sigh... Dr. Jean Klein was and still is..even he's dead since a while... one of the greatest and wisest advaita teachers of this century !!!
Next::  I think you've lots of  traits of no 1-5 and 8 of the enneagram....;) :D... but helas we do cope with both parts of E and i-ness ;)

wish you a fine day all best from Switzerland ..... 8)


I'm gonna read about him and advaita.  I never heard of it.  Thanks for the info.  I learn a lot of stuff here!
Posted by: Amazone I., Sunday, May 31, 2015, 9:41am; Reply: 200
have an eye onto the booklet named: "beyond knowledge"  or "la joie sans objets" ;)... b u t perhaps is all this only a facon to become aware about being a 5 in the enneagram...this means also importance to get on a healthier way in a sort of non-identification with anything... hard to believe for some other types here.. but for us often even "life-saving" ;)...

Another system to become whole and healthy...(cool) (shrug)(funny)... he always asked us to think about "what we are not"..... :P ;D ;)(hehe)(huh)(ok)
Posted by: Easy E, Monday, June 1, 2015, 11:14am; Reply: 201
5 sounds pretty accurate!  I don't think i am a pure 5, but 5 may be my base number in the enneagram.  

Have you heard of Super and Holland's big 5 traits?  Realistic, investigative, social, artistic, conventional, and entrepenurial?

I did this test and was tied at realistic and investigative as number 1, and social as number 2, then artistic, then conventional, then last was entrepenruial.  That was like 11 years ago though, when i was a senior in college and took a career test.  

Basically it means i like to work with my hands and investigate at the same time, and like to socialize a bit and don't want to work alone all the time, but probably sometimes!  And that i don't like too much paperwork.  

I would think that Super and Holland could also relate to Myers Briggs.

Posted by: Amazone I., Monday, June 1, 2015, 3:48pm; Reply: 202
you might be a 5/4 or a 1/9  ;) I think that we are both..... it depends how we do feel at this very moment and often tests aren't that accurate or do err in itself ;-) how and why... I observed a lot of similarities f. examp. 1-3-and 7 looklike a lot... as 9and 4 do... and I also think and observed that we really seem to use those status as roleplaying behaviour so I'm merely convinced ...all about balancing our psyche ;) ;D :D(smarty)(hehe)
and if you think about the said that the enneagram isn't rigide at all but a system of movements....or in the integrative way or justamente the opposite... :-/ ;)......... b u t very very accurate.....(clap)(ok)(woot)(evil)(smile) then compared with Keirseys... nothing but amazing....(whistle)
Posted by: Easy E, Tuesday, June 2, 2015, 7:50pm; Reply: 203
It may be harder for some personality types or someone who was injured emotionally or psychologically too to know their true nature.

If someone grew up not being able to express themselves or not allowed room to grow it could restrain them.  

Personality tests could also help people to learn more about themselves and give them good info to have too.  Just like knowing blood type and genotypes!
Posted by: Amazone I., Wednesday, June 3, 2015, 6:28am; Reply: 204
our given agreements often in childhood might reduce ourselfs tremendiously but  unconsciously ....

as mentioned a w a r e n e s s is the motivation here ;)

hugs from Switzerland  :D


ps.

Deepak Chopra wrote also some beautiful and interesting books.... ;)
Posted by: Amazone I., Thursday, June 4, 2015, 6:40pm; Reply: 205
btw...Sep Blatter ex-chief of Fifa (Switzerland and football blas :-( ....& trallala's typical no 3 of the enneagram, malheureusment no name here coz no 3 is only known as so called A-shapement in  modern psychotherypy ;)... ;D :X  I'm happy that he's gone... :B ;)(dance)(ok)(clap)(shrug)(whistle)
Posted by: san j, Saturday, June 6, 2015, 5:17pm; Reply: 206
Quoted from Easy E
It may be harder for some personality types or someone who was injured emotionally or psychologically too to know their true nature.

If someone grew up not being able to express themselves or not allowed room to grow it could restrain them.  

Personality tests could also help people to learn more about themselves and give them good info to have too.  Just like knowing blood type and genotypes!

Most recent research/writing on the subject takes into account different "levels" of functioning of each type, which levels are vulnerable to psychic injury, Type itself remarkably retaining its distinct character.
I.e., an injured ESTJ will act like an injured ESTJ, not like a healthy INTJ.

Another reason to determine type with description, rather than trait-by-trait questionnaire.

Posted by: Amazone I., Sunday, June 7, 2015, 6:20am; Reply: 207
as long as we do identify in " I am this and that and I have this or that (sickness)" it will be difficult ongoing in healings.... as said awareness is the motivation here...  so called psyche injuries might also be a fine helper or to heal instantly coz of being aware of my true nature and my habits... but it also is a beautiful downer to let me stay into helpless situation and victimizing myself.... all others are da culprit... I'm such a pooooorle....(dizzy)(funny)(naughty)(evil)(disappointed)... True self can't be injured nor hurt... coz it is essence of your nature.... nothing else...can't die will alway be reborn.. if you agree  ;D ;D.... what the causa of the real problem always is: the overactive ego with its trained patterns...habits etc... huge difference to our *essence*..... here all negativities are born and created and lived up..... as said awareness about this very issue is also one of the desired integrative modalities to get into the direction called : mental & psychological health ... ;) :D = taking full responsability onto your life.....!!!

The true answer in working on ourselfs... so we don't need any therapists..... ;D(cool)(ok)(dance)(smarty)(goofy)(whistle) but good and honest friends and teachers.... ;D ;D ;D
first ther's a thought (born about what kind of ??) )... next a feeling and then actings....;) or even no actings... but body remembers all situations even before birth and we shall have an eye onto our conditioneerings as well and ask ourselfs is this really me and true ??) !....Silencing our mental blubberings of the daily living is one  of the first steps....(smile)
Posted by: Averno, Sunday, June 7, 2015, 12:31pm; Reply: 208
Beautifully said! (clap)(book2)(think)(smarty)(sunny) (dove)

And we all know this deeply in our beings, where the ego is unformed.
Posted by: Amazone I., Monday, June 8, 2015, 7:01am; Reply: 209
this is it ;) and thanx for your kind words complete of mine :D... ya know SP and SJ-stylers do have a hard time with such blubberings...they're masters of the concrete... and master of the facts....but therefore we're seen as  in a form of being "nuts"... but often things aren't taken seriously so far they might rest in their habits and patterns and never ever will become aware about this very thema ;) ... ::)
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