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BTD Forums  /  Live Right 4 Your Type  /  Frustrated and confused
Posted by: Connect, Saturday, August 12, 2006, 4:17pm
I try to not use these forums very often to discuss my own personal problems, but I fear that I have hit a point where I am slightly worried about myself.  I have become increasingly depressed over the past few months, and it has hit a point where I need to seek advice.  

I started BTD last October b/c I was having hormonal imbalance problems:  my periods were very spaced out and I was noticing a lot of edema, all over but specifically in the breast tissue area.  I also felt tired a lot and wanted to drop 5 to 10 pounds.  Within 2 weeks, I was 99% compliant.  Even though I am an A Secretor, I cut out wheat and corn b/c of the impurity of them and my desire to lose weight.  I dramatically cut my grain intake, as I realized this could be what was hindering my weight loss.  I also began taking a probiotic, a multivitamin, a B Complex, B6 and Magnesium.  I took liver cleansing herbs and performed a liver flush in the Spring.  

In January of this year, I started running and swimming.  I work out 5 times a week regularly.  Initially, I was working out too hard I believe.  Laura then taught me about Heart Rate Monitors, and in April, I slowed down my running and swimming and started working out in fat burning zone as opposed to sugar burning zone.

It is now August, and I must say...there has been no change.  My weight is at the exact same place it was when I started, despite a clean diet and exercise.  I do not overeat.  I am not as compliant now as I was when I first started; however, I am still about 80 to 85% compliant.  

About 3 months ago, I became so frustrated with my hormonal imbalance, I finally gave in and went on birth control at my MDs urging.  Yes, I know how horrible this is for me, but I was desperate and felt that a lot of my problems were being caused by hormone imbalance.  I thought if I could just get this imbalance corrected, things would straighten out.  I have been taking the birth control for 3 months now, and while it has straightened out my periods, my breasts have only gotten even more swollen than before.  This would make some women happy, but it makes me miserable.  

And this is where I am now.  Miserable.  I told my doctor I was going to stop the birth control, and she said that was fine.  That 3 months was probably enough to get my body kickstarted again.  So only a few more days of BC, then I'm done.  

Currently, I am tired all of the time.  I have not dropped any weight (not measured by numbers either:  measured by the way clothes fit).  All blood tests came back normal:  adrenals, insulin, etc....the doctor said I was in excellent health.  I currently take a multivitamin, a fish oil, B Complex, B6, Mag Citrate and a probiotic.  Nothing seems to make me feel better.  I am at stasis.  I cannot understand why I would see no change.  I basically went from eating a really high carb, avoid-filled diet to being strictly compliant.  Why would I not see a physical difference or FEEL a difference?  I would think I would feel better, more energetic.

I have fallen into a depression b/c nothing seems to affect the way I feel.  I don't notice any difference when I stop my supplements.  My desire to be compliant or to exercise is waning, because I am not seeing any results from doing so.  I find it odd that I have been consistently exercising and eating incredibly well for over 8 months with not the slightest change in either my physical appearance or my mental acuity.  I don't understand and I find myself slipping further down the downward spiral into sadness.  

Any help would be appreciated.    
Posted by: Lola, Saturday, August 12, 2006, 4:53pm; Reply: 1
perhaps that exercise is not helping lower your stress levels, and you should consider focusing more on your nostril breathing techniques to lower your cortisol levels, etc......
Posted by: 903 (Guest), Saturday, August 12, 2006, 5:13pm; Reply: 2
You say you had your adrenals checked but did you take four samples throughout the day? Check out his site http://www.diagnostechs.com/main.htm Sounds to me like your adrenals might be fatigued.
Posted by: Connect, Saturday, August 12, 2006, 6:02pm; Reply: 3
Quoted from JK
You say you had your adrenals checked but did you take four samples throughout the day? Check out his site http://www.diagnostechs.com/main.htm Sounds to me like your adrenals might be fatigued.


Hi JK,

The blood test I did was a one shot deal.  It didn't measure cortisol, etc...over 24 hours.  Just once.  How does one make the adrenals healthy again, if it is indeed, adrenal fatigue?
Posted by: resting, Saturday, August 12, 2006, 6:12pm; Reply: 4
Hey connect,

it's time to be blunt here! (She and I have become good friends over the while and she CAN handle this ... connect is a wonder, hands-down!) ... review your post (above) and count the number of 'I's in it ... are there too many? .... perhaps focusing on someone in real need will help you stop navel-gazing ...........

John
Posted by: angel, Saturday, August 12, 2006, 6:32pm; Reply: 5
The one shot deals do not give a an accurate cortisol you need to do saliva samples. 4 time throughout the day and it will give an accurate reading. I did mine about two months ago. And it showed  normal to low fluctuating during the day between the two. I ahve fatigued adrenals. I am taking BT supps because they are the only clean supps I know of for someone who has the things I ahve to deal with.

I know about heart rate monitors. And by choice I ahve not used one and use my own body to tell me how it should feel. The thing is the formula used is the one-size fits all. It is not accurate, there is scientific data supporting 220-age=max HR. there are formulas otherwise with this in mind, I exercise to what I feel is right and gage it off of past experience. Let your body lead the way-if it feels better going hard one day go hard, then take it easy, and then you can ramp it up a little the next and repeat again.  My big problem is working around my kids schedulea as school is tarting again.

Good luck-don't give up.
Posted by: Connect, Saturday, August 12, 2006, 6:49pm; Reply: 6
Quoted from John_McDonell_O+
Hey connect,

it's time to be blunt here! (She and I have become good friends over the while and she CAN handle this ... connect is a wonder, hands-down!) ... review your post (above) and count the number of 'I's in it ... are there too many? .... perhaps focusing on someone in real need will help you stop navel-gazing ...........

John


My dear John,

As always, thank you for reminding me of my own forgotten principles.  You know I am a firm believer.....when you feel depressed, get out and help another.  When you hurt, the solution is to give.  It is all too easy to get wrapped up in one's self and forget the real suffering that exists in the world.

That said, the problem I find in following this very truth is the depression I feel seems to be a bit deeper than usual and, as such, I am having trouble fighting through it enough to get out of bed to be of service.  I promise I will try harder to put myself aside.  
Posted by: Poly, Saturday, August 12, 2006, 7:06pm; Reply: 7
Hey connect!

Maybe you'd want to look into EFT: http://www.emofree.com

Maybe you block out what you really feel - maybe you don't want to feel good...? I don't know you as well as John, but sometimes our minds work in strange ways - and very often not vey logical! ;)

EFT is a wonderful tool and easy to learn!

Good luck! :)
Posted by: ISA-MANUELA (Guest), Saturday, August 12, 2006, 7:14pm; Reply: 8
3-4x 300mg's of St. Johnswort ::) ;D :K) and instead of re-enforcing bad feelings...dearle...please take your complete attention and focus it to do something which is a pleasure for you- nothing more.....
you have to go outside of your turnarounds of insidelaberings with yourselve ;) :D :K) out..outgoing...outtathere :D feel huged dearle....(sunny)(sunny) :) :K) :K)
Posted by: Connect, Saturday, August 12, 2006, 7:27pm; Reply: 9
I know you are right Isa.  I must get out of my own head and go out, out, out.  You and John both have now suggested that.  And the two of you know me best in our dear community here (you too Laura)....so I imagine I should take your wise advice.  I do have a tendency to get stuck in my own cognitive functioning.  I call it the hamster wheel.

I was considering taking St. John's Wort for a bit.  Just to get me back on my feet.  Would this be preferable to Rhodiola Isa?  
Posted by: Carol the Dabbler, Saturday, August 12, 2006, 7:27pm; Reply: 10
I have two ideas for you, Connect:

1. For the depression, try St. John's Wort.  This herb is rated OK for A's.  Without it, I'm a puddle on the floor, but with it, I'm me again.  (Oops, I see Isa already suggested this, so I'll second it!)

2.  For hormone balance, try natural progesterone cream from the health-food store.  This is very different from the "progesterone" in your birth-control pills, which is not actually progesterone at all, but merely a similar molecule with much stronger effects, including many potential side effects.  Natural progesterone is much safer because it's the identical molecule to what your body makes, which can be a godsend for everything from PMS to menopause (I assume you're in there somewhere!).  I believe that this product literally saved my life.

Posted by: ISA-MANUELA (Guest), Saturday, August 12, 2006, 8:07pm; Reply: 11
connectle I think...Rhodiola is furthemore bene as a stressmanager; St. Jowo. is merely for "*ç+ç7(0?^`=feelings ::) but you will have the optimal effect only up from an intake of 2-3 weeks, that won't work that quick....thatswhy don't stop it just bing-bang but take it for some months and then you'll get stabilized betterrr and yup not only hamsterradle ;) but if you try to focus your attention to something outwards of your own mind, that's the trick and it works :K) good luck....
Posted by: ABJoe, Saturday, August 12, 2006, 8:14pm; Reply: 12
connect14,

My wife (A) uses Evening Primrose oil supplements to help control the hormones.  She tried bot BC from the MD and natural progesterone cream from our nutritional practitioner, but both were too potent.  The EPO really helps her balance the system.

http://www.dadamo.com/typebase4/depictor5.pl?158 - is the typebase information about it.

http://store.ourhealthcoop.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=ep - is the source!

Hope this helps...
Posted by: Lola, Saturday, August 12, 2006, 8:30pm; Reply: 13
you might want to check the protocol index.......
http://www.dadamo.com/protocols/index.htm
anti stress, fatigue, menopause come to mind.....
the recommended sups per blood type can guide you in the right direction.
Posted by: Mickey, Saturday, August 12, 2006, 9:11pm; Reply: 14
Connect,

I've been dealing with depression for awhile, have it under control due to medication.  I learned in a depression mgmt. class that you should do the opposite of what you feel like doing.  Believe me it works.  You have to push yourself, but you'll feel much better for it.  It's amazing how much better i feel when i just go out and be among people, even if they are strangers.  Depression makes you feel like isolating yourself.

When you don't feel like exercising - exercise!, if you can only do alittle don't beat yourself up for what you can't do, reward yourself for what you can.

Be realistic, don't make a  "to do list" of 10 things that you know you will not be able to complete in a day, make a list of a few things that you know are doable and feel good at the end of the day that you accomplished your list.

Learning about cognitive behavior is an important step in learning how to manage your depression, search out books, info. about cognitive behavior.

I know when i was feeling depressed, everything seemed soo overwhelming and little problems turned into major problems.  Like your weight, 5-10 lbs. is not alot of weight, your health at this point (mental/general) is more important.  Once you get back to feeling better, you can then focus on your weight.  Like others have said stress may be halting your weight loss, depression can cause alot of stress.  So it's important to get your depression under control first.

Good Luck!
Mickey   ;)
Posted by: Connect, Sunday, August 13, 2006, 2:19am; Reply: 15
Thanks for everyone's feedback.  It sounds like most of you feel that my lack of response to diet and exercise stem from stress and depression, as opposed to any serious physical ailment.  

I truly am grateful to have this community.  My day was made better from the various friends I have on this board.  
Posted by: KimonoKat, Sunday, August 13, 2006, 2:52am; Reply: 16
We're glad {{{{you're}}}} here connect14!
Posted by: Laura P, Sunday, August 13, 2006, 3:09am; Reply: 17
Hey connect, I am just reading this thread now, and I have to say I agree with alot of what others say, I also think that the enviroment you are in affects you greatly just as much as you affect it, I'm trying to think how to put this and I am writing it here instead of directly to you because I think others get caught in the 'syndrome' I am about to discuss, it is something I have fought against too.  

You just moved, before you moved all I heard was 'I can't wait to get out of place A, place B will be so much better, everything will change in place b, I'll change, my enviroment will change, my health will change, things will be better, I'll be FREE.' this is not exactly what you said but it is what your words expressed.  Then the first thing I hear from you once you move to place B is 'I can't wait to get back in place A, it will be so much better'  This is you affecting your enviroment.  You saw a new place as a new way to be, and were depending on it to totally change you.  The unfortunate thing is that although a new place can offer a great opportunity to change, you are the one that has to do the work. Instead it seemed, the newness wore off and you realized you were back in your own destructive patterns, those patterns you were trying to escape from.

Does this make sense?
Posted by: Connect, Sunday, August 13, 2006, 3:24am; Reply: 18
It does make sense, and I do not disagree with you.  I thought of this today actually.  I recognize that one creates one's environment.  I do not long to go back to Place A at all, though I do miss the West Coast approach to health and well-being.  That was what I meant in my PM to you, not that I desired to return to LA.  This goes back to John's suggestion to get out and be of service.  Change my environment.

You are right:  you take yourself with you no matter where you go.  New cities and new places don't change who you are.  Where I do disagree with you; however, is in your thought that I assumed moving was a way to escape myself.  I do not believe in escapism, at all.  I believe in fully facing whatever may come my way with acceptance and grace.  Truth is always better, even when it is a bitter truth.  Perhaps that is what this post was about:  me calling myself out so that I could face it and move through it.  I consistently work hard to stay true to this, and as such, it is the only reason I feel compelled to contradict that particular part of your statement.  My move was necessitated by the desire to continue my education, not as a tool to avoid.  
Posted by: Joyce, Sunday, August 13, 2006, 9:30am; Reply: 19
Connect,

I found that birth control pills made me suicidal, even different formulations had the same effect.

When I became menopausal I tried HRT at my docs suggestion and the same thing happened.

Doc said I needed a higher dose of oestogen, made me even worse.

Both lots of hormones made me feel wonderful and on top of the world for the first 7-10 days and then it was just as if I flipped right over and fell to the bottom of a black hole.

Without the knowledge of my younger days I wouldn't have known why I was so depressed on HRT.

Progesterone was my life saver, first as suppositories and now as cream.

Joyce
Posted by: ISA-MANUELA (Guest), Sunday, August 13, 2006, 10:24am; Reply: 20
(clap)(smarty)(sunny)(sunny)(whistle) :K) :K) :K) :K) :K) :D ;) @ Mikey :K)

sometime we have to breake threw :D ;)  ;D ;D.......
Posted by: Connect, Sunday, August 13, 2006, 10:50am; Reply: 21
Quoted from Joyce
Connect,

I found that birth control pills made me suicidal, even different formulations had the same effect.

When I became menopausal I tried HRT at my docs suggestion and the same thing happened.

Doc said I needed a higher dose of oestogen, made me even worse.

Both lots of hormones made me feel wonderful and on top of the world for the first 7-10 days and then it was just as if I flipped right over and fell to the bottom of a black hole.

Without the knowledge of my younger days I wouldn't have known why I was so depressed on HRT.

Progesterone was my life saver, first as suppositories and now as cream.

Joyce


This is interesting Joyce.  I must admit that this feeling of "low" that I currently am at feels so out of place for me.  I do lean towards a certain melancholy by nature, but this that I feel now is not of that sort.  I am normally able to cognitively and spiritually traverse my own nature.  This feels differently, almost as if someone/something else is pulling the strings.  I do wonder if it the birth control.  I asked my mother the day other day whether she had ever taken birth control when she was younger, and she said that indeed she had.  She said that it made her incredibly depressed.  Tired all of the time.  And hungry all of the time.  She said all she wanted to do was sleep.  I didn't automatically attribute my symptoms to the birth control, because these are things that kind of creep up, but perhaps they are, indeed, linked.
Posted by: Carol the Dabbler, Sunday, August 13, 2006, 6:45pm; Reply: 22
Aha!  It sounds like you have identified a likely suspect.  Why not hold off on trying any new supplements until you've been off of the BC for a while?  Otherwise, you might give the credit to your new thing, when the improvement was actually due to stopping the BC.

It wouldn't hurt to get out more, though.  That could help you while you're getting the BC out of your system.


Quoted from connect14
I told my doctor I was going to stop the birth control, and she said that was fine.  That 3 months was probably enough to get my body kickstarted again.  So only a few more days of BC, then I'm done.


Any particular reason that you can't stop the BC now?

Posted by: Connect, Sunday, August 13, 2006, 7:12pm; Reply: 23
Hi Carol,

Today is my last pill.  I wanted to finish the pack, so as not to screw my hormones up anymore than they already were before the pill!  I woke up today feeling slightly better than yesterday.  I honestly believe that expressing myself and having advice from those whose opinion I value helps tremendously.  I woke up and did some work and went to the market.  

It's funny.  I was just reading your blog where you talk about how lethargic the heat and humidity have made you.  I moved to Austin, Texas this month from Los Angeles, and I must say, the heat is stifling!  It is hard to want to do much out of doors when it is 100 degrees!  

Thanks again for your kind advice.  I'll keep you posted.
Posted by: ISA-MANUELA (Guest), Sunday, August 13, 2006, 7:34pm; Reply: 24
dear missa ;D
I think the key lays here...no pilli will solve your thingies for a long time...but please do have an ::) into the Enneagram too and get your eyes opened :D btw. don't say yes when your inner voice (belly) says no......don't be kind when your opinion says no; don't be whatsoever if you feel weak or sad or whatsoever...then live it but please not that longlasting repetitions, but try to take one of those marvelous options to come out of this affaire; how.....??) just letting go and no feelingsenforcements...
just recognition and good it is....when your mind and brain are said...all your organs are sad too-thatswhy probs with digestion etc...thatswhy perhaps better to begin to have an eye onto the psychosomatic interactions ...ja.....:D
Posted by: Victoria, Sunday, August 13, 2006, 9:10pm; Reply: 25
connect,
What is your age?  Just wondering if you are perimenopausal.

Going off bc pills can upset the emotions too, so don't be too alarmed if you don't feel immediately yourself.  Herbs such as Vitex (Chastetree) can help with hormonal-based depression, and Motherwort is also very calming to emotional storms brought on by hormones or monthly cycles.  

As others have said, St. Johnswort is a specific for blood type A, but must be taken daily for a while before results are seen.  It is not a fast acting herb.  Daily for a couple of weeks should really reduce depression.

Rhodiola, on the other hand, is fast acting.  It will stabilize your energy and combat depression.  It is especially good for O's, but is not contra-indicated for us other blood types.  I like it very much, and don't have to take it daily.

Bach Flower Remedies are homeopathic relief for emotional imbalances.  

For depression:
Gentian
Mustard
Gorse

and for difficulty during transitions:
Walnut

and for feeling stuck, unable to get up and get things done:
Hornbeam

Click HERE for more info on the Bach remedies.  Then click on each single remedy to read more about it.  Don't hesitate to ask if you need more info on how to use them.
Posted by: Connect, Sunday, August 13, 2006, 10:47pm; Reply: 26
Hi Victoria,

I am recently turned 30.  Hopefully not Perimenopausal just yet!
Thank you for the Bach Flower Remedies.  I was just looking at them today at the HFS.  I will look at them more closely.
Posted by: 774 (Guest), Sunday, August 13, 2006, 11:19pm; Reply: 27
Connect, when do you eat? Dr. D. says that for A's to loose weight it is not so much what you eat but when you eat. For A the King, Prince, Pauper (breakfast, lunch, dinner) applies more then for any other bloodtype. It is something I have noticed. If I eat a normal dinner at night I will almost immediately gain weight, or at least not loose any. If I stick to small meals (and I mean really small meals) at night I do loose weight.

Just a thought.

Oh and another thing. With all the exercising you probably built up some muscle eventhough you've been working in the fatburning zone. Maybe trying more yoga and less "heavy" exercising will help. Cut the fitness to twice a week and start yoga or tai chi (or both) for 2 days a week.
Posted by: angel, Monday, August 14, 2006, 5:42am; Reply: 28
Connect,

I actually went into to perimenopause not too long after my 5th child, which was after I turned 30 (5 years ago). Women are actually starting earlier.
I recommend reading Dr. Christine Northrup her books women's wisdom and women's bodies and her menopause book are very good. temper those books with Dr. D's and you should be fine.
As far as weight, more bene's, less neutrals and no avoids. your body will adjust and the weight go when it is appropriate.

Good luck.
Posted by: Joyce, Monday, August 14, 2006, 9:41am; Reply: 29
Quoted from connect14
Hi Victoria,

I am recently turned 30.  Hopefully not Perimenopausal just yet!
Thank you for the Bach Flower Remedies.  I was just looking at them today at the HFS.  I will look at them more closely.


According to Dr Katrina Dalton, whose book Once a Month explained so much to me about my depression triggered by hormone pills, our levels of [natural] progesterone drop significantly in our 30's.

Joyce
Posted by: Connect, Monday, August 14, 2006, 2:07pm; Reply: 30
Interesting.  Thanks for the information.  Both of my doctor's believe that I have not ended Perimenopause yet, based on many factors.. My doctor's opinion of the disturbance in my cycle is that my HPA axis was basically shut down due to highly stressful events that occured in my life over the past two years.  This, in addition to the radical changes in my diet and exercise patterns, she believes just got my body out of tune and only needs some minor readjustments.  Last year was, by far, the most stressful of my life.  One traumatic event after another occurred, and I would not be surprised if, indeed, the Hypothalamic functions just shut down.  

Posted by: ISA-MANUELA (Guest), Monday, August 14, 2006, 2:14pm; Reply: 31
Victoria :D
what I observed with Rhodiola was, that it works really best for O's....but it might be-that they become tired and a feeling likewise *lazyness* or similar to it.....and not at all for depressions but anger management.....;)
Posted by: 41 (Guest), Tuesday, August 15, 2006, 1:01pm; Reply: 32
I am very new to this diet and this forum.  I also do not own the book, just borrowed it from the library, so do not have access to what an "A" needs since I am an "O".  I do, however, feel I can offer a "maybe" to the depression problem.  During the high protien, low carb diet fad, depression became a very big problem, especially for women.  Perhaps you reduced your grains to much.  I know for "O" there is no beneficial grains, but since clinical depression runs in my family, I still comsume neutral ones.  Perhaps you eliminated to much to suddenly.

Also, omega oils have been proven to help with depression (it is the omega type fat that your brain uses to communicate with itself and the body), as well as help your body to rid itself of bad fat.  Basically, if you remove all the fat from your diet, your body will not be as capable to rid itself of the bad fats, and you will not be able to loose weight.  Studies have shown that by adding good fats back into a diet, the folks actually began to loose weight again.  Reading the posts, I did not notice omega oils being mentioned as to weather you are consuming them or not and in what amounts.

And......... if your depression has a physical cause, removing all the "I's" from your vocabulary will not make you feel better.  Though you definatly don't want to fall into a pity party, lots of clinically depressed people do not feel they can put the "I" into describing what is going on because they don't believe they deserve to (getting back to your statement "I am having trouble fighting through it enough to get out of bed to be of service") since the fatique, ect. often makes them feel "selfish" causing them to be even more depressed.  It is good you are seeking help and advice.

I know this is probably a lousy way to introduce myself to the forum.  This is a topic near to my heart (since, as previously stated, it runs in my family) and upon reading the posts, noticed that these thing were not mentioned. Hope you find this helpful, Sandy O
Posted by: Peppermint Twist, Tuesday, August 15, 2006, 1:08pm; Reply: 33
Quoted from Mickey
Connect,

I've been dealing with depression for awhile, have it under control due to medication.  I learned in a depression mgmt. class that you should do the opposite of what you feel like doing.  Believe me it works.  You have to push yourself, but you'll feel much better for it.  It's amazing how much better i feel when i just go out and be among people, even if they are strangers.  Depression makes you feel like isolating yourself.

What Mickey says is so true.  I'm battling a bit of a reactive depression right now and the thing really is to FORCE yourself (and I know it is hard--they don't call it depression for nothing, it is REAL and it is PARALYZING) to do SOMETHING, take an action, forget about the things you can't control and the things that maybe you could do something about but are too overwhelming to you for some reason, and focus on the little things (or big things) that you CAN do.  Even something as simple as putting in a load of laundry or vacuuming the house can make you feel so much better, more empowered, less overwhelmed, etc.  Also, exercise, it just can't be stated enough how important this is (although, Connect, it does sound like you definitely do get enough exercise, so that is great).

I am a big afficionado of fish for depression, those omega 3's are where it's at, baby.  Eat salmon, salmon, SALMON and probably take a high-quality omega 3 capsule as well for a while at least.

The supplement CoQ10 is very helpful for energizing your cells and revitalization.

It sounds like you are trying very hard to do everything you can do to counteract this depression in a holistic way and I'm impressed with that.  Hang in there.  Like I said, I have a bit of one going now myself and even a mild one is hard to fight.  Because depression makes you feel so paralyzed and like just getting into a fetal position and staying there.  I've had a tough time with that the past few weekends.  But I've been at least MAKING myself do a few things, even though I never feel like what I do is enough and that is part of my depression, I'm just so overwhelmed and feel like, geez, nothing is ever enough with the house in particular, it just stays overwhelming no matter what I do!  So why do anything?  But getting back to what I quoted at the beginning of this post, when you feel like that, that is the exact time to do SOMETHING anyway!  Anything, no matter how small.  Last night, I swept the front sidewalk and walkway to my house for the first time in a while and it felt really good to do so.  Just a little thing but it helped me feel more in control, energized, and empowered!  (edited to add:  btw, yardwork in general is EXCELLENT as an antidepressant, I find.  It has been so terribly hot here, though, that I can't really go on a yardwork marathon, but even a little here and there is a tonic--if the heat doesn't kill me.)

Finally, just hang in there.  A hormone imbalance is so difficult, it is like fighting against the ocean current or something, and the current is always stronger than you.  But if you work with it instead of fighting against it, you'll float and not drown.  Hopefully you can do what you need to do with customized diet, targetted supplements and proper exercise, and stress reducing techniques such as yoga, to get that current in balance.  It's tough, though, and I commend you for your good effort so far.  Hang in there!!!
Posted by: Peppermint Twist, Tuesday, August 15, 2006, 1:20pm; Reply: 34
Quoted from angel
Connect,...I recommend reading Dr. Christine Northrup her books women's wisdom and women's bodies and her menopause book are very good. temper those books with Dr. D's and you should be fine.

I second that!  Dr. Northrup is DA BOMB, I absolutely LOVE her!!!!!!!!  Did I mention I LOVE HER?  Well I do!

Posted by: Jane, Tuesday, August 15, 2006, 1:34pm; Reply: 35
Moving in and of itself is stressful and being in a new place can make you feel isolated.  It sounds like you have a lot going on.  Being under stress myself this past few months I know that sometimes all you want to do is nothing....There are times when I just want to go home and plop down in front of the TV and eat chocolate or cookies.  Whether it's chemical or whatever, just taking some kind of action is the first step.  I'm an O and I personally find that Catechol (Rhodiola) is a big help.  Since you are an A, I'd try the St. John's Wort and see if it elevates your mood.
It's great that you can talk about it.  Sometimes that's a great first step.
Jane
Posted by: Lola, Tuesday, August 15, 2006, 4:17pm; Reply: 36
paulssandy,
welcome!)
thanks for sharing your opinion on depression and omegas, etc.
great advice!
get acquainted with the forum and all features
of this website.
If you go to the top of the page and click on member centre (on the top right hand side of this page) and get yourself a nice avatar (located on the left) then we can all see what blood type you are and you won't have to type it each time you post.
-if you want to add information below your avatar setting, such as Rh +/-, by going to the Profile Information section in the Member Center and typing in the Personal Message box.  You can also create a Signature of any other information you want to share that will go at the bottom of every message you post.
-You can also create a Signature of any other information you want to share that will go at the bottom of every message you post.
..
Posted by: Carol the Dabbler, Tuesday, August 15, 2006, 8:00pm; Reply: 37
Quoted from paulssandy@adelphia.net
... if your depression has a physical cause, removing all the "I's" from your vocabulary will not make you feel better.  Though you definatly don't want to fall into a pity party ...



Very well put, Sandy.  I struggled with an "emotional" problem (chronic panic) for seven years before I discovered, quite by accident, that it was actually caused by sensitivities to mercury (in my fillings) and the odorizer that's added to natural gas.  During that seven years, I learned some coping techniques that were a great help -- but they didn't cure the problem.

Most problems, whether they seem to be emotional or physical, have components of both.  So it's best to deal with any problem on both fronts.

Oh, and welcome to the BTD forums, Sandy!

Posted by: resting, Tuesday, August 15, 2006, 8:58pm; Reply: 38
Hi paulssandy,

I took a chance (and I'm taking one now, with you): connect is superbly gifted in how lucid and 'up-front' she is.  I was attempting to give her a cyber-hug because I suspected she needed someone to say: 'Hey connect I believe in YOU .... so like it or not, I'll be here ... for you!'

Any advice - BTD-wise; psychology-wise, etc.  is of secondary importance IMHO ... and it may be sage or it may be all wrong but at least she understands that she's not alone!  If she can still connect (as her moniker says), she will grow .... its when we are fixated on words like 'depressed' '..... then we see no other avenue.  The word of a friend carries much weight!

If connect wishes my presence (my love) to help as we both grow - she has it.  


John
Posted by: italybound, Wednesday, August 16, 2006, 11:29am; Reply: 39
connect14, please don't feel the need to apologize about posting a thread for personal help. People post for that all the time and this forum is for all types of requests, inquiries, help, etc.  All types, thus Little Fishes, even. :-)
It's now been 2 days since your last post, so hope you are getting some relief.
I had a similar experience last Oct/Nov.    I was diagnosed Clincally Depressed. That in itself made me even more depressed. The fact that the dr did NOTHING but try to ply me w/ medicine really irked me, to put it mildly. I wanted him to run some blood tests to see where hormones, etc, stood. He refused. He is no longer my doctor. Instead of the meds, I went home got STRICT w/ taking my adrenal supps and also got STRICT w/ BTD again. I too, at that time, was about 80-85% compliant. Within a week, I was fine. Some people just need a higher compliancy to feel good - me being one. Maybe you as well. :-)

You said all your blood tests came back normal. By whose standards? Doctors ONLY look at whether your test is "in range". :-(   Even if the range is 25-50 and your result was 26, they consider your result to be fine. Not true. Being that low (or on the other end, at the high end of the range), indicates a problem. Just one example: This happened to me w/ my iron once. Just as I gave the example. Dr said I was fine, tho I was so tired I could barely function. Took my BT results to my chiro. One look, he said I needed iron and folic acid. (there was another issue also, which the chiro quickly resolved and the med dr overlooked - not surprising0  Took recommended dosages for recommended length of time and was all better. :-)    I always get my BT results faxed to me and look them over myself. I usually have my chiro look at them as well. I absolutely DO NOT trust doctors to be a good judge of how "great" my blood work is. Sad but true.
You say your blood tests for adrenals came out okay. Here is prob part of your problem. I seem to remember later in this thread, you said they only took one cortisol level. Problem one w/ doctors!!  This needs to be done at least 3 times throughout the day and 4 is better. My SIL has adrenal problems and she wanted to get tested. I advised the same as above and lo and behold, the dr did one "test". Just irritating!! And I think the SIL forgot to mention the 4 times thing. I had also mentioned to her saliva testing would be better but she did the BT and IMHO, it was all for naught.
My NP told me 2 years ago, blood tests should not be the "deciding" factor in adrenal problems. Symptoms should be. Please check out the symptoms:
Signs and Symptoms of Adrenal Fatigue


   * Tendency to gain weight and unable to loose it, especially around the waist.
   * High frequency of getting the flu and other respiratory diseases and these symptoms  tend to last longer than usual.
   * Tendency to tremble when under pressure.
   * Reduced sex drive.
   * Lightheaded when rising from a laying down position.
   * Unable to remember things.
   * Lack of energy in the mornings and also in the afternoon between 3 to 5 pm.
   * Feel  better suddenly for a brief period after a meal.
   * Often feel tired  betweeen 9 - 10 pm, but resist going to bed.
   * Need coffee or stimulants to get going in the morning.
   * Crave for salty, fatty, and high protein food such as  meat and cheese.
   * Increase symptoms of PMS for women; period are heavy and then stop, or almost stopped on the 4th day, only to start flow again on the 5th or 6th day.
   * Pain in the upper back or neck with no apparent reasons .
   * Feels better when stress is relieved, such as on a vacation.
   * Difficulties  in getting up in the morning
   * Lightheaded


Other signs and symptoms include:


   * Mild depression
   * Food and or inhalant allergies
   * Lethargy and lack of energy
   * Increased effort to perform daily  tasks
   * Decreased ability to handle stress
   * Dry and thin skin
   * Hypoglycemia
   * Low Body Temperature
   * Nervousness
   * Palpitation
   * Unexplained hair loss
   * Alternating constipation and diarrhea
   * Dyspepsia

You can read the complete article here: http://www.drlam.com/A3R_brief_in_doc_format/adrenal_fatigue.cfm
It's a bit long, so if you do decide to read, please do so when you have the time and the quiet. :-)   It has a lot of really good info. I see someone mentions progesterone also, which then leads me to wonder if you have  an estrogen dominance problem perhaps.  Just wondering outloud here.  Here is some info from the same site:http://www.drlam.com/A3R_brief_in_doc_format/adrenal_fatigue.cfm

Mickey's suggestion of :   "Be realistic, don't make a  "to do list" of 10 things that you know you will not be able to complete in a day, make a list of a few things that you know are doable and feel good at the end of the day that you accomplished your list.", is great!  It's easy in this hectic society we live, to have ourselves overwhelmed w/ the things we "need" to do. I feel this way all the time. I feel I have SO many things that need to be done..........where to start??!!!!!
Trying to be realistic in expectations of ourselves is really helpful. I tend to want to be "Superwoman" I guess and be able to do all, fix all. Bad result of growing up in a very abusive household.

paulssandy, great first post!!!  The mention of Omega3 is a great thought!!  Welcome to the forums and BTD!!!!

connect14, your comment: "My doctor's opinion of the disturbance in my cycle is that my HPA axis was basically shut down due to highly stressful events that occured in my life over the past two years.", makes me wonder all the much more if your adrenals are a big part of your problem. Stress really works them over.
I am taking an adrenal sup, B5, Vit C.  My NP says some people need as much as 1000 mg a day to help. I can send you the info he sent me if you'd like. The adrenal supp I take is here: http://www.thekeycompany.com/cart_keycompany_list_detail.asp?ProductsAutoNum=18534&NavButton=03
It does list sorbitol as an ingredient, but it is no longer used. I've checked twice. It does have guar gum in it which is an avoid for all and as the 2nd ingred, not so good, but I bought a whole big bottle, so will use them but may switch back to these and adjust some other things  :http://www.thekeycompany.com/cart_keycompany_list_detail.asp?ProductsAutoNum=18533&NavButton=03

If you want more info on this, please PM me. I can get you whatever info you need. :-)            Hope you'll be feeling super soon!!
Posted by: Connect, Wednesday, August 16, 2006, 6:39pm; Reply: 40
I am here.  I am here.  Doing a bit better.
Thank you for your warm regard.  

Italybound:  I appreciate all of the information.  I will read the website more thoroughly.  I take a hefty supply of B Vitamins, so hopefully this will help if my adrenals are a bit overwhelmed.  

John:  I cannot thank you enough for your previous comments.  I completely agree with you regarding depression.  Sometimes, we just need the gentle nudge of a friend to remind us to get out of ourselves.  To remind us that our own problems, which can begin to seem horrific when left to our own devices, are merely bumps in the road of this thing we call life.  In getting up and being of service, we not only begin to see the larger picture again, we also get to feel the beauty of what it means to help another.  To connect.  To not feel so isolated.  The core of depression for most is that sense of aloneness.  That sense of isolation.  A million symptoms may be the things we complain about (weight, physical ailments, other people's behaviors, etc...) but I believe that the underlying cause of most depression is that existential aloneness.  That feeling of being unequivocally isolated from the rest of the world.  When someone reaches out to break through that, it is always a relief that seems to alleviate that depression somewhat.  

 
Posted by: ISA-MANUELA (Guest), Wednesday, August 16, 2006, 7:38pm; Reply: 41
@ John (dance)(smarty)(sunny)(sunny) :K) :K) :K) :K) ;D :D ;D


@ connectle :K) :K) :K) :K) :K)  :K) :K) :K) :K) :K) :K) :K) ;) ;D :D :D :D :) :) :D :K) 8)
Posted by: italybound, Wednesday, August 16, 2006, 8:06pm; Reply: 42
Quoted from connect14
 The core of depression for most is that sense of aloneness.  That sense of isolation.  A million symptoms may be the things we complain about (weight, physical ailments, other people's behaviors, etc...) but I believe that the underlying cause of most depression is that existential aloneness.  That feeling of being unequivocally isolated from the rest of the world.  When someone reaches out to break through that, it is always a relief that seems to alleviate that depression somewhat.
 


I also believe this to be very true. When I was feeling very depressed, I was being very negelected by the DH.
Posted by: Connect, Wednesday, August 16, 2006, 8:19pm; Reply: 43
I don't want my comments to be misleading:  I do not believe in laying the blame for our moods and depressions on other people, nor do I believe they can "cure" us of them.  That responsibility rests solely on our own shoulders.  However, I do believe that other people can help us rise above ourselves by helping us understand that though we feel alone, we are very much human.  We are often reminded of our own humanity when another reaches out and identifies with us in some way.    Sometimes just that recognition alone is enough to take ourselves a little less seriously.  That was the reasoning behind my original post.  A hopeful step that might produce some type of response that would help me lighten up and laugh at myself a little.  

I am certainly glad I posted, because I have gotten all of that and better!
Posted by: italybound, Wednesday, August 16, 2006, 8:50pm; Reply: 44
Quoted from connect14
I don't want my comments to be misleading:  I do not believe in laying the blame for our moods and depressions on other people, nor do I believe they can "cure" us of them.


True, I didn't mean to lay the blame on my DH for my depression either. However, when 2 people are married, I believe there is a certain amount of commitment to "paying attention", shall we say, to them.  This "paying attention" comes in all shapes and forms. For me anyway. For him it only comes in one. Anyone want guess what that is. LOL.  ;)
Posted by: jayney-O (Guest), Thursday, August 17, 2006, 6:40pm; Reply: 45
that's easy, Italybound, (I'm married)
Posted by: italybound, Thursday, August 17, 2006, 10:53pm; Reply: 46
Quoted from jayney-O
that's easy, Italybound, (I'm married)


??????????
Posted by: Carol the Dabbler, Friday, August 18, 2006, 2:20am; Reply: 47
Quoted from pkarmeier
This "paying attention" comes in all shapes and forms. For me anyway. For him it only comes in one. Anyone want guess what that is. LOL.  ;)



I-B:  Jayney just took you up on your challenge to "guess what that is."

Posted by: Carol the Dabbler, Friday, August 18, 2006, 2:47am; Reply: 48
I've been dealing with depression since menopause -- which implies that my case, at least, has a hormonal basis.  Fortunately, it responds very well to St. John's wort, so it's generally under control, but every now and then, I somehow end up taking too little SJW for one reason or another, and the symptoms sneak up on me again, so I've had some experience recognizing them.

There is definitely a correlation between how well Hubby treats me and how depressed I am -- in the sense that the worse I feel, the worse I think he's treating me.  I'm NOT saying that it can't happen the other way.  But in my case, the mistreatment and apathy are about 90% paranoia.  (The other 10% is due to Hubby's frustration at having a wife who cries no matter what he does.)    Then I adjust my dose of St. John's wort, and he miraculously shapes up.  Happens every time!

The really scary part is how very real these phantom problems seem when I'm depressed.  They come on gradually, which makes them that much harder to recognize for what they are.  It always takes me quite a while to believe that the problem is really with my SJW intake.


Posted by: italybound, Friday, August 18, 2006, 3:12am; Reply: 49
Quoted from Carol_the_Dabbler
I-B:  Jayney just took you up on your challenge to "guess what that is."


Oh....just didn't know to what she was referring (no quote - I was confused) :-)  
Posted by: brenda50 (Guest), Saturday, August 19, 2006, 8:00am; Reply: 50
Hey connect

This is just a suggestion, but I noticed that you said earlier that you have had a lot of stress in your life. After a period of trauma, I noticed too that my weight gain became impossible to shift despite watching what I ate, and I also sank into depression. I came to the conclusion that after a great emotional trauma, this is the normal reaction of the body, to go into a down, as I had read somewhere that emotional or psychic healing always takes presidence over physical healing and this is what I found in myself. It is important to nourish the body during this time, but we will be disappointed if we expect to see results from what we are doing to happen at the usual pace. The process of healing takes its own time but we can help things by not beating ourselves up and by getting emotional support from somewhere. We are to put ourselves in intensive care, not by ignoring ourselves but by really paying attention and giving ourselves the care that we probably have neglected to do. Guilt about thinking that we are being selfish will only delay healing.

This is what I have done, and now I can feel that my body is starting to recover and the weight is going down (but very slowly). Acceptance is the key.
Posted by: italybound, Saturday, August 19, 2006, 1:32pm; Reply: 51
Quoted from brenda50
This is just a suggestion, but I noticed that you said earlier that you have had a lot of stress in your life. After a period of trauma, I noticed too that my weight gain became impossible to shift despite watching what I ate, and I also sank into depression..


All associated w/ fatigued adrenals.
Posted by: Victoria, Sunday, August 20, 2006, 1:05am; Reply: 52
Brenda,
That is a very insightful observation.  Thanks for sharing!  :-)
Posted by: Connect, Sunday, August 20, 2006, 1:32am; Reply: 53
Brenda,

Thank you so much for that kind post.  I, too believe that we must heal our mental/psychic selves before any physical healing can occur.

Thanks for reminding me of this important principle!
Posted by: brenda50 (Guest), Sunday, August 20, 2006, 2:39pm; Reply: 54
:)  you are welcome.
Posted by: iolanif (Guest), Saturday, September 2, 2006, 7:59pm; Reply: 55
I also have struggled w/ depression.  Interesting to think it may be the birth control pills.  My ND suggested  reading the book where ever you go there you are by Jon Kubat-Zinn.  Has anyone read this?  Whould you reccomend it?  
No one said anything about thyroid problems. Is that a possibility?
Posted by: Lola, Saturday, September 2, 2006, 10:34pm; Reply: 56
have you had a chance to read the diabetes book yet?
Posted by: Connect, Saturday, September 2, 2006, 10:42pm; Reply: 57
Quoted from iolanif
I also have struggled w/ depression.  Interesting to think it may be the birth control pills.  My ND suggested  reading the book where ever you go there you are by Jon Kubat-Zinn.  Has anyone read this?  Whould you reccomend it?  
No one said anything about thyroid problems. Is that a possibility?


Jon Kabat-Zinn is fantastic.  He's a good introduction to mindfulness and to really accepting life.  I would certainly recommend anything he has written.  Kabat-Zinn will help you with finding a state of mind that is more peaceful and more accepting.  

Really a good read for those suffering depression.  
Posted by: Isannah, Tuesday, September 5, 2006, 11:39pm; Reply: 58
Have you had your thyroid checked? You seem to have alot of the same symptoms I had when I was Hypo-thyroid.
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