Print Topic - Archive

BTD Forums  /  Journal Club and Literature Review  /  Neanderthal Implications (Rh-)
Posted by: 18111 (Guest), Saturday, March 10, 2012, 11:31am
Neanderthal Implications

Since man is presumed to have evolved from apes, why do some people have Rh negative antibodies, lacking the Rhesus factors common to all apes? Analysis of the DNA taken from Neanderthal bones found in caves in Europe show that the human blood factors A, B, and Rh positive are utterly lacking in the Neanderthal. Neanderthal man had blood group O, exclusively. The Basque people in Europe have the highest percentage of blood group O (55%), and the highest percentage of Rh negative blood (33%) in the world. They have Neanderthal blood!

How the Neanderthals became the Basques
August 26, 2002
This research included studies of DNA extracted from bones of Neanderthal remains. It was concluded that Neanderthals were probably a fully separate species from modern humans, not just a subspecies. Looking now at the evidence for the theory that the Basques are descended principally from Neanderthals. The Basques are well-known to have the highest percentage (around 33%) of Rhesus-negative blood of any human population, and so are regarded as the original source of this factor. Around 600,000 years ago, in southern Europe, a species of man separated off from the ancestral line, and we call this species Homo neanderthalensis, the 'N-people'. The blood of this species contained none of the factors A, B, or Rh. Much later, possibly around 200,000 years ago in Africa, the main human line had picked up the A, B, and Rh factors, and by then could be classed as Homo sapiens, the 'S-people'.
ZetaTalk Explanation 3/3/2012: The Basque people have a high percentage of Neanderthal genetics, and thus a higher than usual percentage of Rh negative blood. It has been identified in recent DNA analysis of Neanderthal bone marrow that Neanderthal had no blood components for A, B, or Rh, which came during later genetic engineering projects. Thus their high percentage of Rh negative blood reactions. We have mentioned that Neanderthal Man was stopped, his vas cut and replaced by another genetic engineering product, as he had problems digesting food native to the Earth. Recent analysis of Neanderthal caves has confirmed that he had a meat diet, almost exclusively, and the Basque people have a tendency to have many food allergies.

Per the Zetas, Neanderthal man, as with later versions of early man, was genetically engineered. He was the first product out the door, but had to be totally re-engineered into modern man due to digestive problems. Such a radical leap, from Neanderthal to Modern man, from one blood type with no relationship to Rhesus monkeys to another based on the Rhesus monkeys, certainly shows that genetic engineering was at play.

ZetaTalk Explanation 7/15/1995: Neanderthal Man had a digestive problem and had to be totally re-engineered, with his concurrence, into a later form of man. The reason there is a missing link is because these links are on the Moon, where the genetic engineers frequently resided. The start of genetic engineering goes back many multiples of the step back to Neanderthal Man.

It was not known until some years after the Zetas made this statement that the Neanderthal's diet could not tolerate anything but meat. Even today, the Basque people, who carry a large percentage of Neanderthal genetics, frequently have food allergies.

Neanderthals Ate Mostly Meat
June 14, 2000
Modern humans arrived in Europe about 32,000 years ago, about 4,000 years before the Neanderthal disappeared. One big difference, though, was food choices. Studies of bones from the early modern humans in Europe suggest they had a more varied diet, eating smaller animals, such as rabbits, and lots of fish - up to 30% of their diet. But for the Neanderthal, it was meat, meat and more meat.

A Diet for RH Negative
June 14, 2011
Rh negative blood, the red blood cells of which are without the Rh factor, developed only among the isolated communities of the French and Spanish Pyrenees and have the highest propensity for food allergies, necessitating a special diet. Rh negative blood reacted most severely with eggs, milk, cheese, nuts, beans and gluten. Rh negative blood types had the most severe response to peanuts, suggesting a propensity for peanut allergy. Rh factor negative is also hypersensitive to beans.


Get more information on:
Posted by: D.L., Saturday, March 10, 2012, 6:18pm; Reply: 1
Thanks for the post. I am trying to find out more about my ancestry and food allergies. One of my mother's set of ancestors was from old Spain. I am Rh negative, and allergic to dairy, gluten, eggs, and have trouble digesting beans. I can hardly wait for my Nat. Geographic haplogroup results.
Posted by: Easy E, Saturday, March 10, 2012, 10:06pm; Reply: 2
In terms of modern apes, chimpanzees as a group are mainly blood group A with small amounts of O.  Gorillas are mainly blood group B, with small amounts of O.  Orangutans actually contain all 4 blood groups, A, B, AB, and O.

Not sure if they even have neg or positive blood types though.  Many evolutionary biologists believe all of the 4 blood types could be millions of years old, dating back to the times of the first hominids on earth.

It is a puzzle among biologists studying evolution why O is in such high numbers in humans, but very low in all the other ape species.  If the neanderthals have no other type than O, then that would explain higher levels in humans of O.  But all of the blood types existed well before neanderthal existed, according to most biologists studying the subject, in various primate species.
Posted by: tessieUK, Saturday, March 10, 2012, 11:09pm; Reply: 3
55% of blood type O is not the highest in the world amongst any population-I belive native american indians are 100% O for example. Not sure if that was what you were trying to say...

Interesting ideas about the neanderthals :)
Posted by: Chloe, Saturday, March 10, 2012, 11:15pm; Reply: 4
Quoted from tessieUK
55% of blood type O is not the highest in the world amongst any population-I belive native american indians are 100% O for example. Not sure if that was what you were trying to say...

Interesting ideas about the neanderthals :)

It appears that many native american indians are blood type A according to this information

Posted by: cajun, Sunday, March 11, 2012, 2:18am; Reply: 5
Thanks Chloe and Dierk for those sights. This is all great info and extremely interesting! Love to read this stuff! :)
Posted by: Lola, Sunday, March 11, 2012, 4:54am; Reply: 6
a few quotes by Dr D in various contexts concerning RH neg
for you Dierk Wallrabenstein :)

Quoted Text
Quoted Text make universal donor blood that is acceptable for anyone in an emergency (O Rh negative), the blood would have to be taken from Rhesus negative donors, who are in the minority compared with Rhesus positive individuals.

Quoted Text
Quoted Text
    R+/- impacts on ABP status?
    No real direct impact. Rhesus is a purely erythrocytic protein related antigen. It is combined with ABO because these two systems comprise the most basic way to predict transfusion reactions. Rhesus antigens are not secreted in free form (unlike ABO), nor do they influence phenotype all that much (since they do not play a role in protein glycation), nor do they seem to have many pleiotropic associations (i.e gene linkage effects). Rh- status has been associated with a greater propensity to autoimmune disease. From an anthropological perspective the various haplotypes that comprise the Rh system (CDEcde) are quite interesting. Although the positive and negative outcome of Rh is determined by the D antigen (D/d) the cde (i.e totally recessive haplotype) is associated with Mesolithic elements, at least in Europe.
Posted by: Possum, Sunday, March 11, 2012, 5:16am; Reply: 7
Interesting article/links Dierk... So what does this say, Lola in the end - I am descended from Neanderthals or I'm not??!! Please don't leave me hanging - from a tree :D
Posted by: Lola, Sunday, March 11, 2012, 5:55am; Reply: 8
shake hands a monkey as well!! ;D
Posted by: Possum, Sunday, March 11, 2012, 5:59am; Reply: 9
Posted by: Amazone I., Sunday, March 11, 2012, 6:34am; Reply: 10
my ebf who died recently was expressis verbis taken as a donor O RH- and as someone who needs blood Rh +.... how can this be??)
Posted by: O in Virginia, Sunday, March 11, 2012, 9:49pm; Reply: 11
Neanderthal here.  :)
Posted by: Jumari, Monday, March 12, 2012, 3:29am; Reply: 12
Neanderthals unite
Posted by: Possum, Monday, March 12, 2012, 9:22am; Reply: 13
At least - "The old concept of Neanderthals being brutish, primitive people has receded in the light of modern studies. Instead, with their powerful, tough physiques and brain size above the modern average, and increasing evidence of cultural and artistic achievement, we may all become quite proud of our Neanderthal inheritance!"
Posted by: paul clucas, Tuesday, March 13, 2012, 1:17am; Reply: 14
There is evidence of Neaderthal admixure, Cro-magnon admixure, and Denisovian admixture.

The whole concept of species as mutually exlusive groups needs to be thrown out, if you ask me.
Posted by: tessieUK, Tuesday, March 13, 2012, 3:20am; Reply: 15
Chloe not sure how reliable that link is, since according to the info AB blood apparently doesn't even exist  ;D
Posted by: paul clucas, Sunday, April 29, 2012, 9:10pm; Reply: 16
Those maps are of the pre-1500 blood type distirbutions.  Almost all genetic distribution maps use that cut off date to make determination easier.

If you have next to 0% B, you will have next to 0% AB.  It stands to reason.
Posted by: firetown, Saturday, January 12, 2013, 10:26am; Reply: 17
There is zero proof that the Neanderthals were rh negative. An article claims they were o negative, but the test results do not state that. What is stated is that the 001 allele has been found, but it could also not be tested whether or not A or B were found.

So the possible genotypes of the Neanderthals were AO, OO and BO, positive OR negative.
Which leaves us with six possible phenotypes. O negative being only one.

You can view the official test results here:
Posted by: D.L., Saturday, January 12, 2013, 5:03pm; Reply: 18
23 and me says I am 2% Neanderthal and I am A positive. The first blood test I took from Dr. D said A negative, which I didn't believe, so I took another one. It said A positive. Then 23 and me also said A positive. My husband has two kinds of native American Indian in his background. He is A positive.
Posted by: Goldie, Saturday, January 12, 2013, 6:18pm; Reply: 19
Could we all have grown from mushrooms?  I mean way before there where monkeys? or apes?..

I celebrate my Rh-Neg.. I am not even astounded that I could eat meat all day!!!!.. if it was properly fed beef.. haaa    Yes I could do it...

This makes me wonder, might I be better of not eating eggs?  I sometime wonder .. is it a habit food for me???.. because I feel I ought not eat meat for breakfast as well.  

Oh I wish I could have some Buendnerfleish.. air-dried beef tenderloins.. cut thin for breakfast was my grandfathers food.  --- So I might have something in common with him?  Yes--- it would be on my fathers paternal side.. bent over in old age.. (not me- but I started to work on that for prevention years ago.. I have one niece who has the same issue!   She never met her great grandfather at all.. to bad)
This actually seems right up to my questions.. this might be an answer!! to my diet issues. The Buendnerfleisch is so expensive I could not over eat..the salt in it might feel satisfying... hunger answer..  ha-ha

I was tested last week for whatever, came up iron-iodine short.. interestingly, I had a yen for creamed spinach the first time in 10 years.. might be both for the iron and the Iodine!! How the body KNOWS.. when pieces fall into place...

Dr D.. amazing!

A day later, I ate meat for breakfast with spinach.. will see if that is going to be better.  
Posted by: shoulderblade, Monday, January 14, 2013, 5:07pm; Reply: 20
Quoted from tessieUK
Chloe not sure how reliable that link is, since according to the info AB blood apparently doesn't even exist  ;D

;D Here is another source that does include AB. It appears that the North American/Eskimo involves other types than O.

Blood distribution.

Posted by: Munchkin76, Tuesday, January 15, 2013, 7:46am; Reply: 21
Another "possible" Neanderthal here - depending of course on the validity of the whole Rh- origins argument. I do have quite a few allergies and food intolerances though  ::)
Posted by: Amazone I., Tuesday, January 15, 2013, 10:50am; Reply: 22
I'm not persuated of all those statements.. it's known we are all out of Africa... descendent from a mum named *Lucy*  ;) ;D ;D :X.........(evil)(think)(dizzy)(hehe)
Posted by: Munchkin76, Wednesday, January 16, 2013, 8:14am; Reply: 23
Quoted from Amazone I.
I'm not persuated of all those statements.. it's known we are all out of Africa... descendent from a mum named *Lucy*  ;) ;D ;D :X.........(evil)(think)(dizzy)(hehe)

Posted by: shoulderblade, Sunday, January 20, 2013, 5:28pm; Reply: 24
Quoted from Amazone I.
I'm not persuated of all those statements.. it's known we are all out of Africa... descendent from a mum named *Lucy*  ;) ;D ;D :X.........(evil)(think)(dizzy)(hehe)

That is generally considered to be the case though I think the Basques may have arrived earlier and independently. Their language is not connected to other European ones and the proximity of Africa to Spain/France suggests they may have arrived from the south by sea.

The question as to whether humans and Neanderthals somehow cross bred in he past I find rather puzzling. How do you tell the difference between interbreeding and material inherited from a common ancestor?

Print page generated: Saturday, April 21, 2018, 8:08am