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Canadj
Sunday, November 20, 2011, 10:49pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I was trying to find some medical journals that support this research since my mom said "there is no scientific basis" and that "recent studies show type A was the first".

I found these three articles:

Enas Talib Abdul-Karim.  "Blood Type Diet: Scientific Evaluation."  Iraqi Journal of Medical Sciences 7.3 (2009): 1-4.

Laura Power.  "Biotype Diet Systems: Blood Types and food allergies."  Journal of Nutritional and Environmental Science 16.2 (2007): 125-135.  Link to her site

N. Saitou and F. Yamamato.  "Evolution of primate ABO blood group genes and their homologous genes."  Molecular Biology and Evolution 14.4 (1997): 399-411.  Link

Abdul-Karim referenced Saitou and Yamamato to showcase that D'Adamo is wrong in that the O-type is oldest, and that all 4 types existed 4.5 million years ago, ergo the 40,000 yrs ago changes never happened.  S&Y say that A existed first based on analysis of Gorillas, Orangutans, cows, mice, other animals.  I didn't see any results from humans.  They say that A->O->B.

Power says that there's no evidence for lectins, and that A's do best on omnivore diets.  Her study was solely on allergies, not intolerances or effects on the body.  Says D'Adamo didn't take into account A1, A2, Rh+ or Rh-.  Both Power and Abdul-Karim say that there were no clinical studies, only online feedback used, and no references.  I did find another, a book review of ER4YT that did say he was glad someone else was taking lectins seriously, but he didn't like the approach of the book (eg. unscientific).


I am wondering if what they say is true, and how they arrived at it.  It is my understanding that the popular books (Eat Right, Live Right, etc.) are "dumbed down" versions for the everyday-Joe.  The hard science would be found in the medical journals.  I also was reading the Scientific Basis on this site, and found many other doctors giving credence to lectins, and reactions to food.

I am of the opinion that these peer-reviewed journals are against naturo-pathy, and don't like quick advances and understandings of medicine without 100 yrs of testing before they believe it.  This science is 130 yrs old though, so I don't know what's wrong with it.  If you want to take into account Hippocrates and Ancient Egypt, then it's over 4000 yrs old.  (eg. Food=medicine or poision)

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Lola  -  Tuesday, November 22, 2011, 3:49pm
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Maria Giovanna
Sunday, November 20, 2011, 10:54pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I totally agree with you Canadji, and Dr D'Adamo's  knowledge of medical research and literature is appalling to me, and I just love his courage to draw some conclusions on this, helping so many many people !


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Lola
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Lola  -  Monday, November 21, 2011, 12:13am
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Eric
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Patience


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C_Sharp
Sunday, November 20, 2011, 11:10pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Canadj
Says D'Adamo didn't take into account A1, A2, Rh+ or Rh-.


These are mentioned some in the first book.

Dietary guidelines that include A1, A2, Rh+ or Rh- are given in the second book Live Right for Your Type

http://www.4yourtype.com/prodinfo.asp?number=ED003

The live right book was published in 2000.






MIfHI                            I follow a SWAMI diet.
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DoS
Sunday, November 20, 2011, 11:19pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Some studies.

First, different levels of IAP
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16412386

Type A neutralizes IAP
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7449139

Response in humans is probably the same, but for example this would explain why people with less IAP benefit from lower fat diets

http://ajpgi.physiology.org/content/292/5/G1439.full

If you get the gist, IAP works in conjunction with other things, such as enzyme CD36, to transfer fat across the mucosa. The thing is that what is being transfered can be different structures of protein, different lengths rather. In other words it decides what type of fat makes its way into the blood.

No science? Animal Manure

There is more than enough reason for Type A people to eat low saturated fat diets. You want more? I got more. Piss on no science.
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Canadj
Sunday, November 20, 2011, 11:48pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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It's not me that needs convincing!  I was just wanting to know where these other authors are coming from, but I think I answered that in my first post.

Thank you Maria for your supportive post, and Lola for the links (3rd one doesn't work).  I already read the response to critics page here, since my mom had read and believed the Quackwatch article.  Since most of those articles cite on the first book and not the others, of course it's lacking, more advances have occurred since then.
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DoS
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Pass this link onto them... They will shortly understand that they are not even knowledgeable enough to understand the reasoning behind a lot of it. My links to pubmed are probably some of the simplest conceptions of it all.

http://generativemedicine.org/blogs/dadamolab/?p=23
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Canadj
Monday, November 21, 2011, 12:08am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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That article went way over my head.

I think the major complaint by critics is that the original book and following, don't give clinical trials.  I'm pretty sure that he does do trials, because in one of the radio interviews in the media section he says that he tests each item on ppl to determine a reaction.

(Is that link part of a book?  It looks like he published another book this year.)
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Lola
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Quoted Text
Dr D
on first blood type

quote
''In discussions I read on the matter, this sort of terminology was used to describe the evolutionary or mutation process.  It makes more sense when you see depictions of the A, B and O molecules, but, very simply, the A and B molecules are more complex than O.  So, speculation was that, based on other mutations that have been observed in nature, it was more likely that the simpler type O developed from more complex type A than the other way around, with the a "defective" O developing into A and/or B.''


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
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Patty H
Monday, November 21, 2011, 12:39am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Not that it matters at all to me, but I, too have read that blood type A came first.  Is there something I can show to others who question this?  I love to share the BTD/GTD but have not found anything I can pass along on this subject.  The link Lola provided is great, but it deals more with when blood type AB came into being.

THANKS!  Let's continue to spread the word . . .


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C_Sharp
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Quoted from Canadj
That article went way over my head.

(Is that link part of a book?  It looks like he published another book this year.)


The link is to the Center for Excellence in Generative Medicine at University of Bridgeport where Dr. D. teaches.

Dr. D. did not publish any books this year (That I am aware of) .

Students at the University of Bridgeport do use a textbook that Dr. D. published in 2010.

Book is available at:

http://www.4yourtype.com/prodinfo.asp?number=ED012

The textbook is also mentioned on Center for Excellence in Generative Medicine, if you explore it a bit more.


MIfHI                            I follow a SWAMI diet.
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DoS
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Quoted from Patty H
Not that it matters at all to me, but I, too have read that blood type A came first.  Is there something I can show to others who question this?  I love to share the BTD/GTD but have not found anything I can pass along on this subject.  The link Lola provided is great, but it deals more with when blood type AB came into being.

THANKS!  Let's continue to spread the word . . .


Negligible information anyways. Speculations on first blood types doesn't change one damn fact about how our bodies respond to food, not one fact with any study related to ABO and secretor status.

By the way the oldest record of blood type we have is A, that does not prove it came first. Furthermore that Type A individual likely has nothing in common with any of the current phenotypes regardless of ABO status.
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Goldie
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I am so glad to be a living experiment the verify the validity of O's ..  I could not care any less about it being real.. if anyone wishes to see results, I say try it and disprove it.  As for religions and their ideas .. people have tried to disprove them for more time than words can express and still the powers to be would fight over right, territory, or nationality.. Humans have that need to argue about things they know near nothing about.

I say let them that need to argue - let them argue.. and all others do what WE here.. we KNOW it to work.. And then, imagine even if we all prove right and are healthier for it?  Imagine who will inherit the world? These so learned professionals just confirm -my being leery of 'ignorance' -as justified.  

I am pleased with Dr D no matter all the arguments.. BTD principals WORKS for ME!  and I don't even mind if not all foods recommended under BTD suddenly become widely available in stores and soon after double in price.. I wonder why..! indeed!


Being here is invaluable, but not enough. We need ALL the Doctors. I needed them for a very small cancer spot-I could never feel!!! Please do your mammograms! Doing so saved me from cancer later on. I am grateful! Thanks for learning from my experience! I was lucky! I wish the same for YOU!
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Patty H
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Quoted from DoS


Negligible information anyways. Speculations on first blood types doesn't change one damn fact about how our bodies respond to food, not one fact with any study related to ABO and secretor status.

By the way the oldest record of blood type we have is A, that does not prove it came first. Furthermore that Type A individual likely has nothing in common with any of the current phenotypes regardless of ABO status.


I agree with you, DOS, but the problem is if people can poke holes in the diet theory, this is one of the places they attack first.  I am just asking if there are resources to which can direct them that would help to support Dr. D's theory on this subject, as it is one of the first subject that he discusses in ER4YT.  


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DoS
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Those people need to be ridiculed for attacking an assumption to explain real world accepted facts that are contemporary and not disputed (currently).
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Lola
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Quoted Text
The link Lola provided is great, but it deals more with when blood type AB came into being.


not quite......

Quoted Text
...the A and B molecules are more complex than O


Quoted Text
....it was more likely that the simpler type O developed from more complex type A than the other way around


do not know where you read type AB alone......


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
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Patty H
Monday, November 21, 2011, 1:43pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from DoS
Those people need to be ridiculed for attacking an assumption to explain real world accepted facts that are contemporary and not disputed (currently).


DOS, in my humble opinion, ridiculing anyone will not help advance the ideas of Dr. D or anyone else.  We are all individuals and have the right to our beliefs.  I think providing the scientific evidence is a better route towards helping people counter the criticism of the diet.


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Patty H
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Quoted from Lola


Lola, I was referring to the second link:
http://www.dadamo.com/forum/archivea/config.pl?read=75037

Quoted Text
No Bee In Your Bonnett
Posted By: Peter D'Adamo
Date: Monday, 4 December 2000, at 1:53 p.m.

The mutations which produced the ABO alleles are ancient, but the A and B genes were in scarce supply prior to 25-50 thousand years ago. Their gradual increase in number was a result of the forces brought about by neolithic changes including the greater lethality of pandemics and communicable diseases which worked against type O.

This was simplified somewhat in ER, but in fact is true. Should you wish, you can read someone like AE Mourant for further information.

The shroud could theoretically be Christ's and AB as well. ER only makes the point that AB are not found in significant numbers of grave exhumations until the Langobard Era (ca 900AD). However that doesn't mean that they were not found in insignificant numbers prior to that.

However, at least one Egyptian pharoah has been typed as AB, indicating that admixing of A and B genes was already occurring by 3,000 BCE. The influx of the conquering Hyskos (a semitic tribe) into Egypt and their mixing with indigenous Indo-European strains would have produced some AB -especially at the upper rungs of Egyptian society that resulted from intermarriage.

By the way, I'm not certain that one can be 'very wrong.'

All wrong is probably very wrong.



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No Bee In Your Bonnett
Peter D'Adamo -- Monday, 4 December 2000, at 1:53 p.m.

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ruthiegirl
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Quoted from Patty H


I agree with you, DOS, but the problem is if people can poke holes in the diet theory, this is one of the places they attack first.  I am just asking if there are resources to which can direct them that would help to support Dr. D's theory on this subject, as it is one of the first subject that he discusses in ER4YT.  


It might help to point out that the "what each individual should eat NOW" is based on hard science, while the "which BT came first?" is mostly speculative.

For curiosity's sake, Dr D delves into the evolution of  blood types, but "meat" of his work is on individualized nutrition. Our different bodies are here now, and Dr D knows how to feed us. How we got here is fun to speculate on,  but isn't the foundation of Dr D's work.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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Patty H
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Quoted from ruthiegirl


It might help to point out that the "what each individual should eat NOW" is based on hard science, while the "which BT came first?" is mostly speculative.

For curiosity's sake, Dr D delves into the evolution of  blood types, but "meat" of his work is on individualized nutrition. Our different bodies are here now, and Dr D knows how to feed us. How we got here is fun to speculate on,  but isn't the foundation of Dr D's work.


Unfortunately the argument then can arise that A's should be the meat eaters, like their ancient ancestors and O's should be vegetarians, like their ancient ancestors, so in fact, the order of the blood types does matter, according to Dr. D's theory.  Just playing devil's advocate here  


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Maria Giovanna
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Patty You 'd be right  if not for IAP and stomac acid and pepsine higher in Os than in As, these are the A issue with a lot of meat


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DoS
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Quoted from Patty H


Unfortunately the argument then can arise that A's should be the meat eaters, like their ancient ancestors and O's should be vegetarians, like their ancient ancestors, so in fact, the order of the blood types does matter, according to Dr. D's theory.  Just playing devil's advocate here  


Yes, but my point, our ancestors are not the ones giving us support for current research, we are; and at best our great grandparents. How people respond to food today is more important than all of history. Genetic markers may say something about our history, but they say more about our response to food and exercise.
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DoS
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Quoted from Patty H


DOS, in my humble opinion, ridiculing anyone will not help advance the ideas of Dr. D or anyone else.  We are all individuals and have the right to our beliefs.  I think providing the scientific evidence is a better route towards helping people counter the criticism of the diet.


I disagree. Today lies are ok, and confronting them is not. At no point will I be ok with that. It is a problem in every facet of our lives; believes mean more than simple fact. The opposite means it comes to morals where it is unethical to differ on - the problem promoting it.

Ridicule does not have to mean the "poo poo on their head" but rather a good laugh and disregard, to continue on with whatever is being worked on/discussed.  
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Patty H
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Quoted from DoS


Yes, but my point, our ancestors are not the ones giving us support for current research, we are; and at best our great grandparents. How people respond to food today is more important than all of history. Genetic markers may say something about our history, but they say more about our response to food and exercise.


Yes, but Dr. D goes to great length to describe O's as the oldest and were the hunter/gatherers, A's as the agrarians, whose blood changed to type A to accommodate the change in lifestyle once the herds were all hunted out and people began living together in communal groups and growing their own crops, etc., etc.  You cannot separate which blood type came first with his theory on what one should eat as it is the central axis on which his theory rests in ER4YT.


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