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Fingerprints - Tented Arches?  This thread currently has 2,814 views. Print Print Thread
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Symbi
Thursday, August 20, 2009, 6:06am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Dear Dr D and the knowledgable community;

In the GT book it says under composite fingerprints:
  • One delta = loop
  • Two deltas = whorl
  • No deltas = Arch

The explanation and pictures for fingerprints are very helpful.

The GT book makes no mention of tented arches though.  A search of the website revealed that John Doe's SWAMI has it as a parameter under Dermatoglyphics http://www.dadamo.com/DoeJohn.pdf.  
Quoted Text
  • Whorl Count 4 (40%) 23% (for African)
  • Arch Count (0%) 4% (for African)
  • Tented Arch Count (0%) 1.5% (for African)
  • Ulnar Loop Count 6 (60%) 70% (for African)
  • Radial Loop Count (0%) 5% (for African)
  • Composite Count (0%) 3% (for African)


Therefore tented arches must be a fingerprint pattern, albeit rare (the rarest in Africa anyway) not mentioned in the book and relevant to genotype (or SWAMI anyway although the SWAMI report is an older one).

I'm not asking just academically, but because I've got four of them on my fingers including index fingers (assymmetrical though)! and am having trouble working out my genotype.  Mine look similar to this:  

I found out about them here http://www.policensw.com/info/fingerprints/finger07.html#arches

According to that page the tented arch doesn't have a proper delta, which supports the GT book's definition (as above).  I found it difficult to understand why it's not classified as a true delta though (never knew how complicated fingerprints could be!)

Which makes me ask  
1 - Are tented arches the same as arches for the purpose of Genotyping?  
2 - Does anyone else on the forum have tented arches?

I don't mean to throw such a spanner in the works and understand it is impossible to put everything in a book as research is always ongoing. (Once text books are written, for instance, they are usually out of date.)  Tented arches may be a variable in the SWAMI which is always going to be the latest and greatest version of genotyping determinator.  

I hope you can respond to this question to help me ascertain my genotype, until I can get a SWAMI done.    Keep up the good work!


INFJ ex-Ghee Whiz, GTD Explorer Sept_09 - SWAMI Mar_10

Family - O+ DH and DD (both hunter-ish)
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Lloyd
Thursday, August 20, 2009, 2:06pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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GTD use of fingerprints and other biometric data is intended to follow accepted standards and methods in use professionally.
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Gale D.
Thursday, August 20, 2009, 9:38pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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I think this is a good question to ask.

I think I have one too. I had a hard time figuring out what it was.

I was thinking a "closed loop". Nice to know it has a name.

Wonder what it is classified as when genotyping?




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Lola
Thursday, August 20, 2009, 9:57pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
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The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Gale D.
Thursday, August 20, 2009, 10:03pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Lola


Sorry if I'm being extra dense   ... I don't see anything to explain tented arches on those pages.





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Lola
Thursday, August 20, 2009, 10:17pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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all dermatoglyphics are associated with certain disease susceptibilities....

try a search on dermatoglyphics first in this website and also in general, if interested in finding out more.

the study guides for masters of IFHI had interesting aspects on the scientific data related to fingerprints, but that s not available here.......google might be your best bet.

one thread dealing with prints
http://www.dadamo.com/cgi-bin/Blah/Blah.pl?b-GTDdiet/m-1220920761/


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!

Revision History (1 edits)
Lola  -  Thursday, August 20, 2009, 11:23pm
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Gale D.
Thursday, August 20, 2009, 10:19pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I think we're just aiming to figure out how to classify a tented arch for genotyping purposes.




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Lola
Thursday, August 20, 2009, 11:21pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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classify it as an arch


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Andrea AWsec
Thursday, August 20, 2009, 11:23pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Tented arch is used on the SWAMI more specific then just arch, just like the diet.


MIFHI

"Do not try to satisfy your vanity by teaching a great many things. Awaken people's curiosity. It is enough to open minds; do not overload them." Anatole France

"Healthy people have the least overt symptoms from eating avoid foods." Dr. D'Adamo
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Lola
Thursday, August 20, 2009, 11:37pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted Text
“ This mark is a sign of a sensitive,
impulsive nature. People with tented
arches may be seekers of the truth
and may tend toward perfectionism.”
Noel Jaquin, The Hand of Man,, Faber &
Faber Ltd, London, 1934


Quoted Text
• The Tented Arch has a triradius,
usually located at the middle of the
digit.
• In the tented arch, most of the
ridges enter upon one side and flow
out the other, as in a plain arch.
However, the ridge (or ridges) at the
center do not.
• Tented arches can be confused with loops.


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Symbi
Saturday, August 22, 2009, 12:38am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Lloyd
GTD use of fingerprints and other biometric data is intended to follow accepted standards and methods in use professionally.


Lloyd - the Link I got the tented arches information from was the NSW (an Australian State) Police Department.  I don't think you can get any more professional than that.  
So it is a fingerprint pattern not mentioned in the GT book but is in the SWAMI and that's okay.  Just needed some clarification to help me ascertain my genotype and wondered if other people might too.

Rethinking the delta, now I understand better why the delta isn't a true delta, as it explains on the police NSW website

Quoted Text
If you study this image long enough you might say "wait there appears to be a delta in there and it can't be an arch with a delta!!". Well you are partially correct in that yes, you could see a delta in this print (three sides of the triangle) but here is why it is not a valid delta: To be a valid delta there has to be a significant recurving line which passes in front of the delta, and in this case there is not.


This is referred to in the Genotype Diet Book when it says that a delta is found in the middle of two flowing lines.  There aren't any of those flowing lines to differentiate the pattern area in a tented arch.  So the middle (tent area) is not classified as a delta.

Does that make sense to you?


INFJ ex-Ghee Whiz, GTD Explorer Sept_09 - SWAMI Mar_10

Family - O+ DH and DD (both hunter-ish)
IBS, Fibro, Hashimotos, Adenomyosis, Oral Lichen Planus, Breast Cancer, Terminal case of Optimism
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Symbi
Saturday, August 22, 2009, 12:39am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Thanks for the research Lola.. If they count as Arches I'd better recalculate my Genotype, as I may be a Warrior.  

Quoted Text
“ This mark is a sign of a sensitive,
impulsive nature. People with tented
arches may be seekers of the truth
and may tend toward perfectionism.”
Noel Jaquin, The Hand of Man,, Faber &
Faber Ltd, London, 1934


That resonates with me alot.  Impulsive, like blurting out things and then also very sensitive about whatever I've said later and a bit of a perfectionist!  Great quote!  That book sounds fascinating.

Found some more interesting interpretations, unsure of their scientific basis though.  
Quoted Text
"Both the tented arch and arch patterns represent tendencies to avoid feelings: the tented arch by over-mentalizing, the arch by running around a mile-a-minute, too busy to feel. We have found that those possessing two out of ten fingerprints in either category, or, even more pronounced, two of each type out of ten fingerprints, face a lifetime designed to teach the hard lesson of not letting others in. Maybe "Desperado" should become their theme song." The Hand Analysis Newsletter, Volume 4, Issue 3, INTERNATIONAL INSTITUTE OF HAND ANALYSIS http://www.handanalysis.net/publications/nwsl_desperado.htm



Are you a wise counsellor or someone who can’t make decisions? (Free palm reading lesson) http://handanalysisonline.com/.....palm-reading-lesson/

What's up?
Oh it's just my tented arches!

Are you going camping?
No, why do you ask?
It's just your arches have tents packed and everything


INFJ ex-Ghee Whiz, GTD Explorer Sept_09 - SWAMI Mar_10

Family - O+ DH and DD (both hunter-ish)
IBS, Fibro, Hashimotos, Adenomyosis, Oral Lichen Planus, Breast Cancer, Terminal case of Optimism
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Lola
Saturday, August 22, 2009, 1:45am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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thank Dr D for those quotes!

yes, arches have no deltas, no matter what type..


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!

Revision History (1 edits)
Lola  -  Saturday, August 22, 2009, 2:26am
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Symbi
Monday, August 24, 2009, 2:06am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted Text
thank Dr D for those quotes!


Thanks Dr D - it's so great that you share your warmth and knowledge through the forums.  It's so good that you write more on the internet, always researching and advancing.  I enjoy your writing so much, it's insightful and you make technical concepts understandable to all while being entertaining too.  

Quoted from Gale D.
I think this is a good question to ask.

I think I have one too. I had a hard time figuring out what it was.

I was thinking a "closed loop". Nice to know it has a name.

Wonder what it is classified as when genotyping?


D_Gale19 - Thanks for the posts.  A closed loop is a good description, it must have been a real head scratcher!   \

Classifying the fingerprint as an arch - does that mean that you could be a Warrior now?  Longer legs than trumk are a sign of a warrior, a long head and arches are often found in the fingerprints.  I read on here that best way to measure sitting height is by sitting on the floor against the wall.  

I'm not sure what I am, I had trouble measuring my head and got two different answers for my leg torso ratio.  Gut feeling says I am part explorer and warrior.  Going to get a tape measure and try it all again soon (was using a piece of string!).  


INFJ ex-Ghee Whiz, GTD Explorer Sept_09 - SWAMI Mar_10

Family - O+ DH and DD (both hunter-ish)
IBS, Fibro, Hashimotos, Adenomyosis, Oral Lichen Planus, Breast Cancer, Terminal case of Optimism
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Gale D.
Monday, August 24, 2009, 8:02pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Quoted from Symbi
D_Gale19 - Thanks for the posts.  A closed loop is a good description, it must have been a real head scratcher!


I sent the questionable prints to an experienced person for a 2nd opinion.

Quoted Text
Classifying the fingerprint as an arch - does that mean that you could be a Warrior now? Longer legs than trumk are a sign of a warrior, a long head and arches are often found in the fingerprints

Arch fingerprints and a long head would not change me from Teacher genotype. I have the longer torso, longer upper legs, longer index fingers. Apparently those measurements are enough to classify you without even knowing any of the other measurements.

If you can get your torso, leg and finger measurements, that should be enough to use the calculator on page 289.


Quoted Text
I read on here that best way to measure sitting height is by sitting on the floor against the wall.

I imagine some people are unable to get down on the floor. The chair method is pretty good if you use the same chair for everyone.

Quoted Text
I'm not sure what I am, I had trouble measuring my head and got two different answers for my leg torso ratio.  Gut feeling says I am part explorer and warrior. Going to get a tape measure and try it all again soon (was using a piece of string!).  


I've been told that one cannot be mixed Genotype. You are either one or the other by the measurements in the book.

Draw a line at the crease just above your knee with a pen. Sit down to do your upper leg - it's easier to find the crease at the top in the middle of your thigh.

For the lower leg, put your foot up on a chair, find the bone to the side of your knee and mark it with the pen, then measure from the fat part of the ankle bone to your pen mark.

Once you've found and marked those points, measuring is much easier to do.

If you can just figure out which is wider -- front to back or side to side, that should be enough to decide your head shape.










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yaeli
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"Both the tented arch and arch patterns represent tendencies to avoid feelings: the tented arch by over-mentalizing, the arch by running around a mile-a-minute, too busy to feel. We have found that those possessing two out of ten fingerprints in either category, or, even more pronounced, two of each type out of ten fingerprints, face a lifetime designed to teach the hard lesson of not letting others in. Maybe "Desperado" should become their theme song."

Thanks GW. This is correct for the unaware person. I believe it can be transofrmed through inner faith work (lots of it). I have arches on both my 3rd fingers - have foolishly been striving to appear ruthless, mainly at work - until two years ago. Silly old me. Doesn't suit anybody incl. YT    As far as I am concerned they may start growing loops now...    The rest of the fingers are loops. No "Desperado" - another word for lazy, never for optimistic  


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Symbi
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Hey Yaeli.  You're welcome! The day you stop learning and changing is the day you die!  

I've always had a tendency to be emotionally distant as it says.  Identifying these things is a good start in the right direction.  I'm really glad for the Genotype Diet and BTD to show me so much.  From BTD I found out that I have obsessive tendencies.  These things can be fought once you know!


INFJ ex-Ghee Whiz, GTD Explorer Sept_09 - SWAMI Mar_10

Family - O+ DH and DD (both hunter-ish)
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judygirl
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[quote=6180]
2 - Does anyone else on the forum have tented arches?
quote]

I have a radial loop on one index finger, and either a tented arch or the skinniest ulnar loop in creation (hard to tell with white lines) on the other index finger. Didn't know tented arches were so rare.

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Gale D.
Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 12:17am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Symbi
I have a radial loop on one index finger, and either a tented arch or the skinniest ulnar loop in creation (hard to tell with white lines) on the other index finger. Didn't know tented arches were so rare.


I know what you mean about skinny loops -- 2 of mine have one or two really skinny loop shapes surrounded by arch shapes. Here's one of them (cropped to make it not personally identifiable):



It's almost like it was trying to be an arch 'till the last minute.





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Symbi
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judygirl - have you measured yourself up to see which genotype you are?  Radial loops on index fingers are a hallmark of the Explorer.  Then again arches are the hallmark of the Warrior.  

Thanks for sharing.  Hope you get your white lines fixed up soon and can see what your fingerprint is for sure!


INFJ ex-Ghee Whiz, GTD Explorer Sept_09 - SWAMI Mar_10

Family - O+ DH and DD (both hunter-ish)
IBS, Fibro, Hashimotos, Adenomyosis, Oral Lichen Planus, Breast Cancer, Terminal case of Optimism
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