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Victoria
Tuesday, December 26, 2006, 9:53pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Swami Nomad 56%
Sun Beh Nim
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Since the middle of the summer, when I had a period of high stress and very hard work, long hours, poor sleep (and . . did I mention High Stress? ), I have been dealing with fatigue to the extent that I rarely DON'T feel tired.  I am working with the Fatigue book, as well as the Fatigue Protocol, and at least it has stopped getting worse.  I can see how fatigue is closely related to Adrenals, and so I'm reading about Adrenal Exhaustion.
One of the big changes I am trying to make, is my sleep rhythm.  After checking out the book, Lights Out, by Wiley, it's clear that I haven't been helping my health at all by burning the midnight oil.  I am beginning to think that sleep is not something that one can really "catch up" on, and we need to honor our body's limitations in this regard.  

Italybound has mentioned her struggles with this condition, and I'd love to hear more information, ideas, and things that are working for others dealing with this challenge.



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
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Don
Tuesday, December 26, 2006, 10:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh-, MN
Sam Dan
Posts: 7,189
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Location: North Alabama
Age: 58
I have significant adrenal fatigue problems caused by mercury toxicity from my previous dental fillings.

Are you using probiotics? anti-candida supplements? B12?


FIFHI; ISTP;
Started BTD 3/2002, with 2 O- secretor teenage sons
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Victoria
Tuesday, December 26, 2006, 11:16pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sun Beh Nim
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Yes, on the Probiotics.  But I'm using a minimal amount;  only 1 capsule a day of Polyflora B.

Plus I eat goat yogurt every day.

I'm not doing any anti candida supplements.  But I do take one sublingual B 12 every day.  



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
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funkymuse
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 12:22am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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I was having major problems with my adrenals when I first moved to the NW by myself after selling my home in Califorina, after losing my 2nd husband to cancer and after leaving my first husband of 21 years.  Divorce, Death and Moving - three of the huge major stressors all within 4 years.

I went to a naturalpath and had my brain chemistry tested and all my hormones.   Wow... what we found was amazing in deficiencies.  She started me on some great supplements and got me all normalized.

The brain chemistry testing was amazing.  I hope you can find a good naturalpath to help you get on the road to recovery and that way you won't be guessing and guessing and guessing.  I was so relieved to find out what the issues were and get started on getting them addressed AND that I wasn't CRAZY!!!
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italybound
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 1:57am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from funkymuse
The brain chemistry testing was amazing.


Any way to get more info on this.

Victoria, the first thing I did was to have a saliva panel done for cortisol and DHEA and some other things. �Cortisol is tested 4 times a day, DHEA is tested 3. �You should be around 20 in the morning an hour or 2 after you get up. I was 4. From there I went to 2, 1, 1. �You should be 1 at bedtime.
I have incorporated Lights Out, Adrenal Fatigue: The 21st Century Stress Syndrome and Your Body's Many Cries for Water, as well as the BTD fatigue book. �
If you are really feeling you may have adrenal fatigue, please get it checked now. You don't want to get to where I am. EVERY morning was a struggle just to get out of bed. I was tired all the time. Would have to take a nap on my way home from work many days. Tired, tired, tired.
I think my road back is going to be a long haul, BUT having these other 3 books (especially the one on sleeping), will be a big help.
Dr Lam says in adrenal fatigue, we need to be in bed by 10 and sleep until 8:30, if possible (impossible for most people). My NP thought that was too much sleep, but I bucked him on that one and sleep from 8PM to 5:30 or 6AM. �Or close to those times anyway. Like you, I was burning the midnight oil too much. Add 7 surgeries, one birth, a divorce, 3 car accidents, 1 motorcylcle accident, constant chronic bronchitis, sinusitis (which spells antibiotics) and the list continues. When I look back thru my whole life, I can see exactly how I got to where I am now.
Dr Lam's site and Adrenal Fatigue: The 21st Century Stress Syndrome have been very helpful. �Suggested reading for you.


This is a very long article, Victoria, but w/ all the knowledge you have, I think you should understand most of it. When I first read it, I was not so lucky, but it makes much more sense to me now.
Adrenal Fatigue: The 21st Century Stress Syndrome �will explain alot more and
Lights Out, well you've read that apparently, so you know how important good and long sleep is. Going to bed at 8 is tough, but I'm going to do it for as long as I need. Will have to finish reading the rest of that book to see when I need to change that. I understand from what I've read so far, that the 9.5 hours he recommends is only for 7 mths of the year. VERY interesting book so far and I'm only maybe 30 pages in.
Let me see if I can find the site w/ the saliva panel testing information. BRB
Here ya go:

Then select Tests and Panels
Then read each of the 'articles' under the Adrenal Stress Index heading.
This will give you some ideas of what the test consists.
Do you have a good NP there?
If you need anything else, PLEASE feel free to ask. �{{{{{{ HUGs }}}}}} �
Oh, I am also taking 9 Polyflora a day to try and undo the antibiotic damage.
I am also going to get some of one of the new NAP supps for stress. Don't remember which one it is, tho. Will try to check that tomorrow. HAVE to get in bed.

The NAP prod I was looking at is Tranquility Base:
http://www.dadamo.com/napharm/BTstore/BTSstore.pl?user_action=detail&catalogno=NP035














Revision History (2 edits)
Lola  -  Wednesday, May 21, 2014, 5:23pm
Lola  -  Wednesday, May 21, 2014, 5:23pm
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Victoria
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 2:43am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Swami Nomad 56%
Sun Beh Nim
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Quoted from funkymuse
I was having major problems with my adrenals when I first moved to the NW by myself after selling my home in Califorina, after losing my 2nd husband to cancer and after leaving my first husband of 21 years.  Divorce, Death and Moving - three of the huge major stressors all within 4 years.

The brain chemistry testing was amazing.  I hope you can find a good naturalpath to help you get on the road to recovery and that way you won't be guessing and guessing and guessing.  I was so relieved to find out what the issues were and get started on getting them addressed AND that I wasn't CRAZY!!!


Hi Funkymuse,
And thanks for your suggestions!  I can relate to some of those major stressors, myself!  
I would be interested in any more information that you can share on the type of testing you had done.  And also do you remember what the supplements were that were helpful for you?



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
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Victoria
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 3:20am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Swami Nomad 56%
Sun Beh Nim
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Italy,
I was hoping that you would step into this conversation.  I read that article by Dr. Lam already, but just now went back and read it again.  I feel that I'm on the right track with the supplements that I'm taking, and my intention to get in bed early and sleep at least 9 hours (or more when I can) per night.

I'm signing off now so that I can finish everything I need to do and get in bed early tonight.  Thanks for  sharing!  



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
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Don
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 4:43am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh-, MN
Sam Dan
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Quoted from Victoria
Yes, on the Probiotics.  But I'm using a minimal amount;  only 1 capsule a day of Polyflora B.

Plus I eat goat yogurt every day.

I'm not doing any anti candida supplements.  But I do take one sublingual B 12 every day.  

I now discourage anyone with mercury fillings from using B12 or probiotics because of the potential to drastically hurt your health. I believe supplementation with these products are what caused my health collapse 4 1/2 years ago.

Read:
Read FAQ #8:

Candida is very common in people with mercury problems. Candida binds with mercury.  Therefore, if you take anti-candida supplements which kills some of the candida it will cause a release of the mercury.


FIFHI; ISTP;
Started BTD 3/2002, with 2 O- secretor teenage sons

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Lola  -  Wednesday, May 21, 2014, 5:24pm
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resting
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 12:51pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sam Dan
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Victoria,

I do not know whether this is adrenal fatigue relate, decades ago if I watched tv for 4+ hours (sitting some 20' from the box), my arms would tingle and I felt as if I had just run a marathon.  [This was a long while before I understood that tv's emit a magnetic field that competes with my own.]

It's been decades now with no tv - one of the 'best' things I've ever done for personal energy.

Most computer monitors are a similar-to-tv design (oscilloscope).  The newer flat-screen models do not have any magnetic-field problems.

John


The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane. Marcus Aurelius

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funkymuse
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 3:52pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Ok... here ya go...



My NP did most of the testing using the Neuroscience testing kits.  She tested everything she could on me for dopamine, serotonin, etc., etc...

Also tested all of my hormone levels which play a big part in everything.

She prescribed supp's based on what my tests showed so what works for me may not for you so I wouldn't want to recommend anything.

I hope you can find a good NP to go work with on this. I live in OR so if you live nearby here, let me know.  My NP is great.

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Lola  -  Wednesday, May 21, 2014, 5:24pm
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italybound
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 5:22pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from John_McDonell_O+
Most computer monitors are a similar-to-tv design (oscilloscope). The newer flat-screen models do not have any magnetic-field problems.John


What about laptop screens?

funkymuse, thanks for that info!! I'm going to have my NP look in to this. I may have this done as well.



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resting
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 5:43pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sam Dan
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Hi ib,

flat screens and laptop screens use the same technology - LED (I think).  My chiro said radiation from these was 0.25" (1/4 inch), while from older-style monitor is 17' (17 feet).

John


The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane. Marcus Aurelius

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jayney-O
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 6:26pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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does this apply to flat screen TV?
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jayney-O
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 6:30pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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and also, have you guys read diana schwartzbein? she, of course, is not a BTD doctor, butr otherwise she is pretty awesome...her recommendations for adrenal fatigue are very powerful and she lets you know it takes years to correct this problem. (I have had this condition and am better but probably not healed yet...)
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Victoria
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 7:47pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Swami Nomad 56%
Sun Beh Nim
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Ok, MoDon and Laura,
I'm willing to forgo the B12 for a while.  My committment to myself is to get all the mercury out of my teeth within the next 1/2 year.  So this will give me extra motivation to stay with it.

Resting,
I'm not a tv watcher, maybe once a week, I'll watch a video from 8 feet away, but the computer moniter is something to consider.  Thank you for this reminder!  

funkymuse,
Thank you for that link.  I'm going to take my time and browse through it later, so I don't have anything intelligent to say about it yet!  

Jayney,
There is a lot of stuff on Google about Diana S.  Is there a particular site that you recommend for getting a good idea of what she promotes?  Thanks for that tip, and I will look into her approach some more.



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
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Victoria
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 7:55pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Swami Nomad 56%
Sun Beh Nim
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Last night, I got in bed by 10:15 pm and managed to sleep pretty much all through the night until 9 am.  I was amazed by how long my body really wanted to sleep when I gave myself permission to do so.  After the 1st of the new year, I'll have to start getting up at around 7 am again, but I hope that by then I have gotten into the rhythm of sleeping longer.  I'll just go to bed earlier then, if I can.  I think this is going to be one of the keys to my healing.  Maybe most people make it on 7 or 8 hours of sleep, but it appears that at this point anyway, I need 9 or 10.

The site that Italy provided has a check list for adrenal fatigue, which is pretty interesting.  I relate to a number of them.  A couple of points are pretty telling, I think.  I have a major fatigue attack between 3 and 5 pm every day, and then my energy stabilizes back out.  There is another big slump around 9 pm.  I'm wondering if that means I should go to bed at 9??  

Also in the morning, after I wake up, if I do what my body is asking of me, I really need about an hour to really wake up before I get out of bed.  That's a strange thing for me.  I'm definately not lazy.  This is an experience of waking up with zero energy, and allowing myself to lie there while my energy slowly builds to the point that I feel good, and ready to  "spring out of bed with a smile on my face".  wierd. . .



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
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resting
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 8:14pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sam Dan
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hi jayney-0,

flat screen tv's that are LCD should be OK for this.  I do not know anything about plasma tv's ... so will not advise one way or the other.  

John


The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane. Marcus Aurelius

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Victoria
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 8:18pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sun Beh Nim
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Jayney,
I just reserved a copy of "The Schwarzbein Principle" from my library.



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
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jayney-O
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 8:32pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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good idea. It is her books tha t I am familiar with. One of her ideas is that we must eat fats with everything, to heal. She explains it so it makes sense. there's much more, including sleep. And she's a "no sugar" gal.
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Victoria
Wednesday, December 27, 2006, 9:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sun Beh Nim
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Well, so far, I can relate to all those things, Jayney.



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
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italybound
Thursday, December 28, 2006, 2:41am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

~Concealed~Carry~Hunter~
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 9,163
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Quoted from Victoria
Last night, I got in bed by 10:15 pm and managed to sleep pretty much all through the night until 9 am.  I was amazed by how long my body really wanted to sleep when I gave myself permission to do so.  After the 1st of the new year, I'll have to start getting up at around 7 am again, but I hope that by then I have gotten into the rhythm of sleeping longer.  I'll just go to bed earlier then, if I can.  I think this is going to be one of the keys to my healing.  Maybe most people make it on 7 or 8 hours of sleep, but it appears that at this point anyway, I need 9 or 10.
The site that Italy provided has a check list for adrenal fatigue, which is pretty interesting.  I relate to a number of them.  A couple of points are pretty telling, I think.  I have a major fatigue attack between 3 and 5 pm every day, and then my energy stabilizes back out.  There is another big slump around 9 pm.  I'm wondering if that means I should go to bed at 9??  
Also in the morning, after I wake up, if I do what my body is asking of me, I really need about an hour to really wake up before I get out of bed.  That's a strange thing for me.  I'm definately not lazy.  This is an experience of waking up with zero energy, and allowing myself to lie there while my energy slowly builds to the point that I feel good, and ready to  "spring out of bed with a smile on my face".  wierd. . .


Victoria, per your post above: being in bed around 10 and getting up at 8:30 is what Dr Lam recommends (as you prob remember and maybe that is specifically why you did that.
Anyway,  I think it is in the Adrenal book that it says the most healing time to the adrenals is between 7-9AM. So, yes, when you have to be up at 7, please give yourself a couple extra hours sleep at night. It's a hard habit to get into but I'm sure your adrenals will thank you for it. I am in agreement that the extra sleep will be a big key in healing the adrenals. Plus a dose of whatever supplements you are taking , at night before beddy bye.
The 3-5 slump is a big sign of A/F and if you are really feelin' pooped around 9, run and jump in bed as fast as your little legs will carry you.  If you stay up, your adrenals will then kick in for a 2nd round, which means they will then be doing 2 days work in one. THIS is how our adrenals become so fatigued and then exhausted.

I am kind of the same way when I wake up. My mind wakes up before my body. I really don't have the luxury of laying in bed for an hour, but if I could, I would.
Rosco has been really noisy lately. For the past 3 nights he has awaken me repeatedly w/ his barking. I hate to put him in the garage, but if it keeps up, I will.  Having 9 hours of BROKEN sleep is no good either.



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Victoria
Thursday, December 28, 2006, 5:18am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I'm glad you have brought the adrenal issue to our attention, here on the Forum, Pat.  Because of you, I started taking my fatigue very seriously, and being more focused with my supplements, AND getting my body into bed at an early hour and trying to stay in bed longer in the a.m.

Once my daughter's school starts back again, I'll need to be up at an earlier hour, but I'm convinced that I'm on to something important.  This has been a much better day than I've had in weeks.  I did have my 3 - 5 slump, but it wasn't as severe as usual.  And the rest of the day, I was productive without having to push myself.

So thank you very much!!!  

And I must thank Don for inspiring me to get moving with having these mercury fillings removed.  



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
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italybound
Thursday, December 28, 2006, 12:25pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from Victoria
I'm glad you have brought the adrenal issue to our attention, here on the Forum, Pat.  Because of you, I started taking my fatigue very seriously, and being more focused with my supplements, AND getting my body into bed at an early hour and trying to stay in bed longer in the a.m.
Once my daughter's school starts back again, I'll need to be up at an earlier hour, but I'm convinced that I'm on to something important.  This has been a much better day than I've had in weeks.  I did have my 3 - 5 slump, but it wasn't as severe as usual.  And the rest of the day, I was productive without having to push myself.
So thank you very much!!!  
And I must thank Don for inspiring me to get moving with having these mercury fillings removed.  


You are so welcome Victoria. Sometimes I think people must wish I'd shut my piehole about adrenal fatigue, but I really believe it is MUCH MORE of a problem than is realized.   And if my yakkin' helps someone, then guess I'll keep yakkin'.
Also, wondering if you are waking up thru the night? And if so, what times?
Also, if you haven't read this piece, the Adrenal book suggests that even if you can only sleep until 9AM on the weekends, to do so. There again referring, IMHO, to the restorative goodness that sleeping between 7-9 AM brings.
I would love to see a book by Dr D on Adrenals. I have been meaning to go suggest that for weeks, so I guess NOW is that time to do so.
Have a great day all!!  



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Janet
Thursday, December 28, 2006, 3:44pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh+Somewhere Between BTD+Warrior
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I agree with Victoria, Pat was the reason I looked into this whole subject too.
I'm working on mine but as we all know it can't be fixed in 5 mins and different supps don't suit all people!! i plod on though!!


Janet
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italybound
Thursday, December 28, 2006, 4:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from janet
I'm working on mine but as we all know it can't be fixed in 5 mins


This is exactly why I can't seem to shut up about this issue. If people are more aware it is a huge problem, maybe they can catch it before it they get to the point where they feel like "Am I ever going to be well again".

Saw a little something today I thought I'd share.
It's a little clip from a 'column' of a sort -
Question:"Can staying up late raise my risk of cancer?"
Answer:  "Startling new evidence says Yes. Women who worked a night shift had a 48% greater cancer risk than those who didn't. Evidence indicates that watching TV or sitting in front of the computer until the wee hours can produce the same results. Late night light exposure appears to be harmful to human health."

Just what we've been saying here, eh?



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