Welcome, Guest.
Please login or register


Main Forum Page  ♦   Latest Posts  ♦   Member Center  ♦   Search  ♦   Archives   ♦   Help   ♦   Log In/Out   ♦   Admins
Forum Login
Login Name: Create a new account
Password:     Forgot password

BTD Forums    Diet and Nutrition    SWAMI Xpress  ›  Does "bacterial overgrowth" include yeast? *
Users Browsing Forum
No Members and 2 Guests

Does "bacterial overgrowth" include yeast? *  This thread currently has 2,678 views. Print Print Thread
2 Pages 1 2 » All Recommend Thread
TJ
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 9:44am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

54% Nomad
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,486
Gender: Male
Location: Midvale, UT, USA
Age: 39
In the books, "bacterial overgrowth" is mentioned as a problem for some people.  It's also a SWAMI objective to control "bacterial overgrowth" if the "digestion" health history box is checked.

I've been under the impression that the phrase "bacterial overgrowth" referred strictly to bacteria in the gut, but it was pointed out to me (by ABNoWay) that this may also include yeast overgrowth.  Which is true?

Revision History (1 edits)
C_Sharp  -  Thursday, May 5, 2011, 6:01pm
Added * to title
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message
Amazone I.
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 11:41am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh+ GT 4...E/..INTJ ....prop.=non-taster..
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 16,314
Gender: Female
Location: CH-Benglen Kanton Z�rich
Age: 56
it's all about bacterial ovg... yeast might be in the party... but musn't....


MIfHI K-174
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 1 - 33
Goldie
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 12:19pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

All Gatherer -70 Scorp/Sag on BTD/GENO 17 year
Sam Dan
Posts: 5,896
Gender: Female
Location: East Coast
yes in the end we look to balance the healthy critters witht he ones that aggrevate us.. that way no one becomes to bothersome no matter where they show their strength.


Being here is invaluable, but not enough. We need ALL the Doctors. I needed them for a very small cancer spot-I could never feel!!! Please do your mammograms! Doing so saved me from cancer later on. I am grateful! Thanks for learning from my experience! I was lucky! I wish the same for YOU!
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 2 - 33
PCUK-Positive
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 2:00pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Gatherer Rh+, NN, (lewis a+ b-) [Duffy Fy(a+b+) ]
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,887
Gender: Male
Location: UK
Age: 53
note the word "over" growth.


Kind Regards PC. FIfHI Swami III Pro

Partner (F) is O+(Non) MN. Duffy Fy(a+b+),  Lewis (a+ b-) Gatherer.
DD ( is O+(Non)NN, Duffy Fy(a+b-) Lewis (a+b-) Gatherer
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 3 - 33
ruthiegirl
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 2:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI O+ Gatherer, Healing from Fibromyalgia
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 12,188
Gender: Female
Location: New York
Age: 42
Bacterial overgrowth means that there are too many bacteria, or too many of the bad bacteria, in the gut. This might mean too many bacteria overall, or it might mean the right "total number" of germs, but too few yeasts and/or beneficial bacteria, with the "bad germs" being overgrown. (Or maybe these germs are only "bad" because they've overgrown; in the right proportions, these very same bacteria might be part of healthy flora.)

Somebody with yeast overgrowth generally has too few bacteria in his or her gut- the right amount of "good bacteria" would crowd out the yeast, preventing overgrowth.

So, does "bacterial overgrowth" specifically mean overgrowth of bacteria in the gut, or does it mean "unbalanced gut flora"? I think TJ is asking whether or not to tick the "bacterial overgrowth" box for a person with yeast overgrowth.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 4 - 33
Dr. D
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 3:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Peter D'Adamo
Kwan Jhang Nim
Posts: 4,150
Gender: Male
Location: Connecticut
Age: 58
no yeast.


A whole system is a living system is a learning system.’ -Stewart Brand
Logged
Site Site Private Message Private message Reply: 5 - 33
Amazone I.
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 3:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh+ GT 4...E/..INTJ ....prop.=non-taster..
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 16,314
Gender: Female
Location: CH-Benglen Kanton Z�rich
Age: 56
yeast often is in correlation with amalgam....


MIfHI K-174
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 6 - 33
Andrea AWsec
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 3:52pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI INFJ Warrior Taster
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 7,679
Gender: Female
Location: Long Island, NY
Age: 51
Yeast is  related to secretor status, Dr. D has this all programed into SWAMI. It can be assumed that  O non secretors have yeast if they have not been following the Genotype/SWAMI, and even if they have the diet will keep it from resurfacing. Yeast is in all of us, getting rid of it completely does not work, keeping the right balance is a way better approach.

Non secretors Os and yeast

Each blood type/genotype has its issues.


MIFHI

"Do not try to satisfy your vanity by teaching a great many things. Awaken people's curiosity. It is enough to open minds; do not overload them." Anatole France

"Healthy people have the least overt symptoms from eating avoid foods." Dr. D'Adamo
Logged
Site Site Private Message Private message Reply: 7 - 33
Goldie
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 3:57pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

All Gatherer -70 Scorp/Sag on BTD/GENO 17 year
Sam Dan
Posts: 5,896
Gender: Female
Location: East Coast
I clicked on all that where issues with me at one time or another..


Being here is invaluable, but not enough. We need ALL the Doctors. I needed them for a very small cancer spot-I could never feel!!! Please do your mammograms! Doing so saved me from cancer later on. I am grateful! Thanks for learning from my experience! I was lucky! I wish the same for YOU!
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 8 - 33
Andrea AWsec
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 3:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI INFJ Warrior Taster
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 7,679
Gender: Female
Location: Long Island, NY
Age: 51
Quoted from Goldie
I clicked on all that where issues with me at one time or another..


And you still got good food to eat? Not just crackers and water?



MIFHI

"Do not try to satisfy your vanity by teaching a great many things. Awaken people's curiosity. It is enough to open minds; do not overload them." Anatole France

"Healthy people have the least overt symptoms from eating avoid foods." Dr. D'Adamo
Logged
Site Site Private Message Private message Reply: 9 - 33
ruthiegirl
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 4:57pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI O+ Gatherer, Healing from Fibromyalgia
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 12,188
Gender: Female
Location: New York
Age: 42
Crackers? I don't get crackers!


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 10 - 33
JJR
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 5:48pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

33% Nomad, calories calories!!!!!!
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,960
Gender: Male
Location: Caledonia, WI
Age: 42
So if you have dysbiosis, leaky gut, yeast overgrowth, unbalanced flora etc, does that mean it's the opposite of "bacterial overgrowth"?  I thought "bacterial overgrowth, was a general term for all of these situations, that usually seem to go hand in hand. At least, I thought they did.

On top of that my swami doesn't say anything about "bacterial overgrowth".  It just asks if you have had digestive problems.  Which I would assume is a yes for you TJ.


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 11 - 33
Amazone I.
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 6:10pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh+ GT 4...E/..INTJ ....prop.=non-taster..
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 16,314
Gender: Female
Location: CH-Benglen Kanton Z�rich
Age: 56
everybody of us can produce yeast overgrowth..sorry...


MIfHI K-174
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 12 - 33
brinyskysail
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 6:19pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

explorer~FM~lactose, soy, grain free
Ee Dan
Posts: 1,229
Gender: Female
Location: Bedford, PA
Age: 25
bacterial overgrowth and yeast problems can occur simultaneously, but bacterial overgrowth is a separate issue from yeast.


There is a good in every bad  
Logged Offline
Site Site Private Message Private message Reply: 13 - 33
JJR
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 6:35pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

33% Nomad, calories calories!!!!!!
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,960
Gender: Male
Location: Caledonia, WI
Age: 42
Quoted from Andrea AWsec


And you still got good food to eat? Not just crackers and water?




I have over half of the items checked.  All the ones I know I have a problem with.  I still have lots of food choices.  TJ seemed to think he should keep it to a max of 2 issues.  I was scratching my head about that.  Everyone's entitled to their opinion and how they do things, but it seemed odd to me.  Either way TJ, the swami doesn't distinguish between yeast or bad bacteria, it just asks if you have digestive or bowel issues.  I would think you'd want that one checked, knowing your history.  But that's just my thought.


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 14 - 33
TJ
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 6:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

54% Nomad
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,486
Gender: Male
Location: Midvale, UT, USA
Age: 39
Quoted from brinyskysail
bacterial overgrowth and yeast problems can occur simultaneously, but bacterial overgrowth is a separate issue from yeast.
That's what I thought, too, but I wanted to know if the conditions got the same treatment....

Quoted from Dr. D
no yeast.
...And apparently, they don't get the same treatment.  Thanks for the clarification, Dr. D.

Quoted from Amazone I.
yeast often is in correlation with amalgam....
No cavities, no amalgams.

Quoted from Andrea AWsec
Yeast is  related to secretor status, Dr. D has this all programed into SWAMI. ...Yeast is in all of us, getting rid of it completely does not work, keeping the right balance is a way better approach.

Non secretors Os and yeast
I understand that all nonnies are prone.  Os suffer from it more because they tend to be reactive, but this B Explorer is quite reactive, too.

There had been some talk on another thread that the "low grade infections" box covered yeast.  Are you saying that an anti-yeast protocol is put into effect in SWAMI automatically if you enter non-secretor as your secretor status?  No health history box to check for this problem, then?

Quoted from JJR
...my swami doesn't say anything about "bacterial overgrowth".  It just asks if you have had digestive problems.  Which I would assume is a yes for you TJ.
Yep, digestion problems here.

The intake form doesn't say anything about it, but if you check the "digestion" box, you'll see in the Further Customization section of the SWAMI printout, under the Emphasized and Deemphasized Nutrients heading, it should say that foods which "inhibit bacterial overgrowth" are emphasized, and/or that it deemphasizes food that "encourages bacterial overgrowth".

At least, that's what mine says if I only check the "digestion" box (I don't recall what it says there when "digestion" is combined with other issues).  Perhaps digestion problems are handled differently from one GT to another, but I doubt it.  It's possible that if you have several other boxes checked, their effects could cancel out the "bacterial overgrowth" effects.
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 15 - 33
Amazone I.
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 7:06pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh+ GT 4...E/..INTJ ....prop.=non-taster..
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 16,314
Gender: Female
Location: CH-Benglen Kanton Z�rich
Age: 56
so far half of mine TJ you're a lucky bum


MIfHI K-174
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 16 - 33
JJR
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 10:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

33% Nomad, calories calories!!!!!!
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,960
Gender: Male
Location: Caledonia, WI
Age: 42
Hmm..  Low grade infections cover yeast.  I guess that could be.  My swami's have always had that note about bacterial overgrowth.  Mine says: "Strong Emphasis in:

- butyric acid
- good elimination food
- quercitin
- inhibits bacterial overgrowth

My take is yeast or no yeast, you would want yours to say that.  Especially if you had antibiotics.  But I still don't understand the separation of the the two.  Isn't yeast a bacteria?  And you don't want too much of it.  You want some, but not an overgrowth.  Same goes for any of the "bad" bacteria.  There needs to be a proper balance.  I'm not sure what the percentages are, but the good should have more population than the bad.  Then, your system overall is likely to work better.  Immunity, detox, etc etc.  Life and death start in the Gut.  hehehhe  I've heard that said before.

So, am I wrong about this?


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 17 - 33
C_Sharp
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 10:36pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Teacher Rh+ Lewis: a+b-, NN,Taster
Sa Bon Nim
Administrator
Posts: 8,453
Gender: Male
Location: Indiana
Age: 54
Quoted from JJR
  Isn't yeast a bacteria?


Yeast are unicellular fungi, they are not bacteria.

If one want to include both yeast and bacteria, one would speak of:

"Bacterial and/or fungal overgrowth"

or use the more inclusive term:

"microbial overgrowth"


Bacteria are procaryotic organisms (their cells lack a nucleus) and fungi are eukaryotic organisms (their cells have a nucleus).


MIfHI                            I follow a SWAMI diet.

Revision History (1 edits)
C_Sharp  -  Friday, May 6, 2011, 5:42am
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 18 - 33
brinyskysail
Thursday, May 5, 2011, 10:36pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

explorer~FM~lactose, soy, grain free
Ee Dan
Posts: 1,229
Gender: Female
Location: Bedford, PA
Age: 25
Quoted from JJR
Isn't yeast a bacteria?


technically no; it's a fungi.


There is a good in every bad  
Logged Offline
Site Site Private Message Private message Reply: 19 - 33
Andrea AWsec
Friday, May 6, 2011, 12:22am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI INFJ Warrior Taster
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 7,679
Gender: Female
Location: Long Island, NY
Age: 51
Quoted Text
I understand that all nonnies are prone.  Os suffer from it more because they tend to be reactive, but this B Explorer is quite reactive, too.


Not about being over reactive,  more about  not having your blood type in your secretions.  


Quoted Text
Candida sp.

ABH non-secretors are much more likely to be carriers of Candida sp. and to have problems with persistent Candida infections. Blood group O non-secretors are the most affected of the non-secretor blood types. One of the innate defenses against superficial infections by Candida species appears to be the ability of an individual to secrete the water-soluble form of his ABO blood group antigens into body fluids. The protective effect afforded by the secretor gene might be due to the ability of glycocompounds in the body fluids of secretors to inhibit adhesins (attachment lectins) on the surface of the yeast. In attachment studies, preincubation of blastospores with boiled secretor saliva significantly reduced their ability to bind to epithelial cells. ABH non secretor saliva did not reduce the binding and often enhanced the numbers of attached yeasts. (66,67) In one study, among individuals with Type II diabetes, 44% of  ABH non-secretors were oral carriers of this yeast.  (6

Although non-secretors make up only about 26% of the population, they are significantly over represented among individuals with either oral or vaginal Candida infections, making up almost 50% of affected individuals.  (69) The inability to secrete blood group antigens in saliva also appears to be a risk factor in the development of, or persistence of chronic hyperplastic Candidosis. In one study, the proportion of non-secretors of blood group antigens among  patients with chronic hyperplastic Candidosis was 68%.  (70)

Women with recurrent idiopathic vulvovaginal Candidiasis are much more likely to be ABH  non-secretors. Combining both ABH non-secretor phenotype and absence of the Lewis gene Lewis (a- b-), the relative risk of chronic recurring vulvovaginal Candidiasis is between 2.41-4.39, depending on the analysis technique and control group. (71)

Oral carriage of Candida is also significantly associated with blood group O (p less than 0.001) and independently, with non-secretion of blood group antigens (p less than 0.001), with the trend towards carriage being greatest in group O non-secretors. (72)  


MIFHI

"Do not try to satisfy your vanity by teaching a great many things. Awaken people's curiosity. It is enough to open minds; do not overload them." Anatole France

"Healthy people have the least overt symptoms from eating avoid foods." Dr. D'Adamo
Logged
Site Site Private Message Private message Reply: 20 - 33
TJ
Friday, May 6, 2011, 2:54am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

54% Nomad
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,486
Gender: Male
Location: Midvale, UT, USA
Age: 39
Quoted from JJR
Low grade infections cover yeast.
I'm not saying that it does cover yeast, just that someone suggested that it does.  I don't know!

Quoted from JJR
Isn't yeast a bacteria?
(As if you need another answer! )  Yeasts and bacteria are as different as skunks and skunk cabbage... taxonomically speaking.

Quoted from Andrea AWsec
Not about being over reactive,  more about  not having your blood type in your secretions.  

Quoted Text
ABH non secretor saliva did not reduce the binding and often enhanced the numbers of attached yeasts.

Well, that sucks.  But thanks for sharing that snippet, it was quite informative.

I thought what you meant was that nonnies are more prone to have yeast overgrowth, but that Os are more likely to suffer from it.
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 21 - 33
brinyskysail
Friday, May 6, 2011, 2:58am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

explorer~FM~lactose, soy, grain free
Ee Dan
Posts: 1,229
Gender: Female
Location: Bedford, PA
Age: 25
I'm beginning to think I should do the secretor test


There is a good in every bad  
Logged Offline
Site Site Private Message Private message Reply: 22 - 33
TJ
Friday, May 6, 2011, 3:03am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

54% Nomad
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,486
Gender: Male
Location: Midvale, UT, USA
Age: 39
Knowledge is power.  Not knowing about something unpleasant may not make it any less unpleasant; ignorance might just prevent you from taking the right steps.
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 23 - 33
Lola
Friday, May 6, 2011, 3:04am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT1; L (a-b-); (se); PROP-T; NN
Sa Bon Nim
Admin & Columnist
Posts: 51,170
Gender: Female
Location: ''eternal spring'' Cuernavaca - Mex.
Age: 57


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
Logged
Private Message Private message YIM YIM Reply: 24 - 33
2 Pages 1 2 » All Recommend Thread
Print Print Thread

BTD Forums    Diet and Nutrition    SWAMI Xpress  ›  Does "bacterial overgrowth" include yeast? *

Thread Rating
There is currently no rating for this thread