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Seraffa
Friday, June 15, 2012, 2:42am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I found it highly interesting, and relevant, to go back to the question of "how much tryptophan does my brain need to relax in the face of my current emotional drainage level." I'm very glad that I did, because as an A, I forgot to review how much B12 I need (minimum) each day - and B12 is the precursory nutrient needed to get tryptophan levels adequate in the brain.

I commented to one of my BTD friends that "perhaps this is why I must carb-load in the evenings before bedtime, to get enough sound sleep. Yet it keeps the "pounds" on my body when I should not be eating past 8PM."

For general usage I thought I'd post this list about foods found to be highest in Tryptophan:
http://nutritiondata.self.com/foods-000079000000000000000.html
Would someone please TypeBase Sea Lion meat?  

And here's a quote from http://www.3fatchicks.com/9-foods-with-tryptophan/ that comments on the "Thanksgiving Dinner" effect of Turkey, blaming carbs combined with the turkey rather than turkey itself.

I noticed I had a great health and energy improvement today when I loaded my breakfast with B12 AND turkey!Taking Bacopa alone for help with cortisol, then, has not been my complete answer to stress.

I am eager to ask our D'Adamo audience: "What are YOUR tryptophan needs these days?"

I am taking the standpoint of a non-active Bulimic whose brain is "wired differently" (or so they say....) and a person who, at midlife, does need a hormone balancing to heal. But it would be interesting to hear from people completely different from myself, and thus get an idea of how much B12 or tryptophan my body is actually using up - and needs to be resupplied with  -each day - to hold my peace with the world around me.

Thanks!!!



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Joy
Friday, June 15, 2012, 3:10am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Seraffa,

Interesting question.  I was told to take liquid B-12 that came in a rather small bottle.  It was 5,000mg.
He said to take two dropperfuls.  I was surprised at this and took it for awhile but before I knew it the bottle was finished in about two weeks.  That became too expensive because it wasn't in stores and I had to order it over the internet.  So that stopped.  I did have more energy.  Not the frenetic kind, though.

I recently bought some L-tryptophan 500mg and was taking one before bedtime.  I was also taking melatonin so I didn't know which supplement was doing what.  I also believe in Bach remedies and use them when needed.  

I feel that tryptophan has an "overall calming effect for alot of people" and that is helpful.  I don't see why someone can't take both supplements.  "Calm energy" sounds good to me.  Tryptophan (calm);
B-12 (energy).  

Right now I have some B-12 lozenge that I am going to continue to take.

Joy
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Lola
Friday, June 15, 2012, 3:19am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Seraffa
Friday, June 15, 2012, 3:53am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Lola



"Because of methylcobalamin's impact on 24-hour clock and the cycles that feed of this, it is also an important vitamin to regulate your 24-hour release of the stress hormone cortisol. This seems to be particularly important for blood types A and AB. Methylcobalamin also seems to result in a better 24-hour maintenance of body temperature. Typically individuals supplementing this coenzyme form of B12 have higher temperatures in the later hours of the daytime. This usually corresponds with improved alertness at the same time of the day. While this can be of importance to all blood types, low body temperatures seems to be an area of greater challenge for A's and B's."

INTERESTING! I remember as a young, thin twentysomething I would comment to people after Friday night dances: 'My body temperature always seems to drop after midnight, and I get cold.'

"The appropriate dose of the coenzyme forms can vary, but a dose of between 1000-2000 mcg daily is usually adequate. If attempting to influence sleep cycles or your 24-hour clock a higher dose of methylcobalamin (3000 mcg daily) is usually a more prudent starting point. Both of these forms of B12 are considered to be exceptionally safe and can be used by all blood types."

NICE. Thank you! (bookmarked)


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Joy
Friday, June 15, 2012, 3:55am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Lola,

Thanks for that information.  

I just checked on the website I ordered from and the liquid B-12 is in the form of methylcobalamin.
But it's more expensive than at the BTD store.  

Guess what I'll be ordering tomorrow morning.

And, its only one capsule a day.  

Joy


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Spring
Friday, June 15, 2012, 3:58am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Lola


An extremely educational link! Thanks!
The question I would like to ask Dr. D. is this, "Why do the higher dosages of B-12 have an extremely odd and  frightening effect on me when so many other people can take these amounts with no difficulties?"  I almost landed in the ER from one of these reactions. I can take 1/2 of one of the DPN capsules with no problems. I would love to take more, and I think I could if I were able to have some substantial food at the same time, but they recommend taking it away from food.

I was able to come out of the reactions I had by eating something. But I don't see any use in taking it if it won't do me any good if I eat food at the same time. I hope my question makes sense because it has been a conundrum for me for a long time!


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Conor
Friday, June 15, 2012, 4:36am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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In line with Lola's aforenoted link, I'm surprised by how many people still take, and even more so how many manufacturers still include, cyanocobalamin as a form of B12. Plus, I've read that as we get older, due to normal age-related decreases in gastric acid, we don't metabolise and absorb B12 as well from fish, animal meat or dairy (my belief is that compliant BT/GT dietary choices help us better maintain healthy levels of hydrochloric acid, though, even as we age). I don't supplement with cyanocobalamin because I've found that the methylcobalamin coenzyme form of B12 works much more effectively for me, and I use about 3,000-5,000 mcg daily (except for my cycle off day each week). As for tryptophan, I don't supplement with it separately but I do eat foods every day that have a good ratio of tryptophan to leucine and phenylalanine in order to positively impact serotonin and melatonin levels (of course, it turns out that wheat is one of the worst culprits for throwing this positive balance out of whack). Fortunately, bananas, dates, papayas, et al, are all beneficial foods for me (they taste better than pills, too).



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Lola
Friday, June 15, 2012, 5:21am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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you will all love the effect!!


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Goldie
Friday, June 15, 2012, 12:34pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I looked at the link you put in post 1 .. the 10th item is egg whites, maybe you would dowell to get the protein all egg based powder from DrD and use it at night.. ?


Being here is invaluable, but not enough. We need ALL the Doctors. I needed them for a very small cancer spot-I could never feel!!! Please do your mammograms! Doing so saved me from cancer later on. I am grateful! Thanks for learning from my experience! I was lucky! I wish the same for YOU!
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Spring
Friday, June 15, 2012, 12:51pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Lola
you will all love the effect!!


I suppose I would if I didn't feel so awful taking more than 500 mcg. at a time! And the only way I can even handle that much is taking it with other B-Vitamins. I have seen wonderful results people have had with taking larger amounts of B-12, my mother being one of them. So it isn't as if I'm not aware of the benefits people can have.......There really isn't any way that I know of to get any sort of answer to my question. Doctors certainly don't know anything about it.


"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin
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Lloyd
Friday, June 15, 2012, 1:10pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Conor
I'm surprised by how many people still take, and even more so how many manufacturers still include, cyanocobalamin as a form of B12.


It's a lot cheaper.
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Joy
Friday, June 15, 2012, 5:01pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Spring,

Since  it sounds like you take 500mcg's at a time, you probably are already splitting the dosage.  Once in the morning and again in the afternoon or early evening.

I just ordered some Methyl B-12 from the store and I asked about it.  You can take one or two capsules a day.  

Like I posted earlier the guy who recommended I take so much liquid was not a medical physician.  It's a long explanation but I trust him.   I stopped that because of the expense.

I wanted to know for myself so I looked up how many miligrams are in  l,000mcg (that what Dr. D's formula contains).  The answer seems to be l,000mcg equal 1mg.

Note:  someone here feel free to correct me if I'm incorrect.

Joy

P.S. I meant l,000mcg.  It looked like eleven.  Why do I try to type anything before I put in my contacts?

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Joy  -  Friday, June 15, 2012, 6:27pm
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ruthiegirl
Friday, June 15, 2012, 6:03pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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The instructions on supplement bottles to "take with food" or "take away from food" are just guidelines. They reccomend one or the other based on studies showing which method tends to work best for most people. The chewable B-12 I bought for my daughter (since she won't swallow pills) doens't give instructions at all about taking with or without food.  It's fine to take the b-12 with food if you tolerate it better that way.

I personally take a B-50 complex in the mornings and Dr D's b-12 towards the evenings. I also take 5-HTP around bedtime, plus melatonin if needed. I don't take a special tryptophan supplement,  or measure the tryptophan in my diet, but I do get plenty of overall protien.

I've  been taking the B complex for years, from even before I found BTD. I've experimented with not taking it, and find that I have much less energy and poorer moods when I don't take it.


Ruth, Single Mother to 20 yo  O- Leah , 18 yo O- Hannah, and  13 yo B+ Jack


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D.L.
Friday, June 15, 2012, 6:35pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I've been using B12 sublingual strips by Essential Source, that dissolve under the tongue; 2,000 mcg Methylcobalamin B12, plus 5 mg B6, 800 mcg folic acid, and 2,500 mcg biotin.
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Spring
Friday, June 15, 2012, 7:03pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Joy
Spring,
Since  it sounds like you take 500mcg's at a time, you probably are already splitting the dosage.  Once in the morning and again in the afternoon or early evening.
I just ordered some Methyl B-12 from the store and I asked about it.  You can take one or two capsules a day.  
Like I posted earlier the guy who recommended I take so much liquid was not a medical physician.  It's a long explanation but I trust him.   I stopped that because of the expense.
I wanted to know for myself so I looked up how many miligrams are in  l,000mcg (that what Dr. D's formula contains).  The answer seems to be l,000mcg equal 1mg.
Note:  someone here feel free to correct me if I'm incorrect.
Joy
P.S. I meant l,000mcg.  It looked like eleven.  Why do I try to type anything before I put in my contacts?

Yes, Joy, I pour half into an empty capsule. I was looking at one site today, and they were recommending up to fifty milligrams a day! I would be in a coma if I took that much. Surely it was a misprint! I am still weak and lethargic from taking about 750 mcgs. this AM and 500 last evening.

I wish I knew the answer to why I have a problem with taking more than 500 mcgs. (and that is with other B-vitamins). It has been going on since I first started trying to take more nearly three years ago. All of it has been from DPN.  I feel like I have taken a powerful drug. And the exasperating thing about it is that it doesn't help me sleep even though I feel like I'm about to conk out - day and night. I have never heard of anyone in my life with this problem! And a further mystery is that Trehalose Complex has actually helped me sleep at night and given me a lot of energy in the daytime! Puzzled to the nth!!


"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin
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Spring
Friday, June 15, 2012, 7:07pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from D.L.
I've been using B12 sublingual strips by Essential Source, that dissolve under the tongue; 2,000 mcg Methylcobalamin B12, plus 5 mg B6, 800 mcg folic acid, and 2,500 mcg biotin.


I can only take about 300 mcgs. of biotin in a day. If I take more, my head nearly bounces off the pillow at night from the force of my heart beating. Doesn't happen at all with 300 mcgs.


"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin
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Adopted4
Friday, June 15, 2012, 9:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I second the 5-HTP recommendation. It works great for me.....including better sleep, calmer moods during stressful times and PMS. I call them my "happy pills".

Coleen


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Joy
Friday, June 15, 2012, 10:00pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Spring,

That does seem to be a bit of a mystery about the dosage of B-12.  It sounds like you have it worked out ok though with the help of TC.

I'm going to see how much Methyl B12 I can take.  Maybe I'm one of those people who can tolerate a higher dosage.  Don't know yet.

PS.   I got a real visual from the description of your head almost bouncing off the pillow.  lol.

But I sometimes feel my heartbeat pounding just in my right ear.  Crazy.

Joy
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ruthiegirl
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Spring, I wonder if your B-12 level is already too high, and that's why taking too much supplementally pushes you so out of balance. We know that B-12 affects the sleep/wake cycles and energy levels. It's not so unreasonable to think that "too much" can mess things up as much as "too little."

Or, perhaps you're low in something else that lets you process the B-12, and taking the B-12 without that "something else" is what puts you out of balance.


Ruth, Single Mother to 20 yo  O- Leah , 18 yo O- Hannah, and  13 yo B+ Jack


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Spring
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Quoted from ruthiegirl
Spring, I wonder if your B-12 level is already too high, and that's why taking too much supplementally pushes you so out of balance. We know that B-12 affects the sleep/wake cycles and energy levels. It's not so unreasonable to think that "too much" can mess things up as much as "too little."

Or, perhaps you're low in something else that lets you process the B-12, and taking the B-12 without that "something else" is what puts you out of balance.

Your remarks are interesting, Ruthie. I have always tried to balance my B-Vitamins, but, as you say, there could be something else. I don't seem to have digestion problems. I do know what it feels like to eat and "not feel a thing" because of digestion problems, but that was years ago. I have been taking probiotics for about twenty-four years, and they worked like magic. I have never been "anemic" in my life except for the few months I was eating so many Tums for acid reflux and inflammation.

But taking more than 500 mcgs. of B-12 is almost like ingesting poison for me. It took me until around 7:00 this evening to get over taking that extra this AM.

The confusing part about trying to decide if we are getting too much or too little of something is that both have the same symptoms in many cases!
Thanks for your input!


"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin
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Spring
Saturday, June 16, 2012, 1:11am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Joy
I'm going to see how much Methyl B12 I can take.  Maybe I'm one of those people who can tolerate a higher dosage.  Don't know yet.
PS.   I got a real visual from the description of your head almost bouncing off the pillow.  lol.
But I sometimes feel my heartbeat pounding just in my right ear.  Crazy.
Joy


Joy, I don't think you will have a problem at all. I've never heard of anyone reacting to B-12 the way I do. I can tell you this, though, it is an awful feeling! So if you do react, you won't have to wonder what caused it! Just eat a lot of food, and you will probably be all right. It took me a while to realize that food was the answer! At about the same time, I completely quit taking it except for the tiny amount in my B-Complex. Gradually, over a few months I increased it to 500 mcgs. and had to be satisfied with that amount.


"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin
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Spring
Saturday, June 16, 2012, 1:15am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Adopted4
I second the 5-HTP recommendation. It works great for me.....including better sleep, calmer moods during stressful times and PMS. I call them my "happy pills".

Coleen


Strangely enough, I have never tried 5-HTP. But I think I have tried just about everything else! Melatonin, Chamomile, Holy Basil, Valerian Root, etc...


"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin
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Joy
Saturday, June 16, 2012, 3:20am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Spring,

I have a feeling you may be right about the Methyl B-12.  When I was taking the large amounts of the liquid everyday I didn't get any adverse reactions.

In my opinion, it's a real balancing act.   Juggling supplements and dosages and trying to get just the right combination.  Then when you get it; whalah, it changes again because something else came into the mix.  

B-12 will be a good addition to my "supplement soup".  

Joy
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Spring
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Quoted from Joy
B-12 will be a good addition to my "supplement soup". Joy

Good! I know my mother got wonderful results from it and the other B-Vitamins. Oh, and I can just see you eating that "soup" with a spoon!!


"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin
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Spring
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On the other hand...... I wonder........
■Vitamin B12 – In conjunction with folate, this B vitamin is important for the methylation, or detoxification, of homocysteine. Higher levels of homocysteine are associated with increased oxidative stress.....This is from Lloyd's post on another thread...
And:
How many vitamins should I take to lower my homocysteine level?

Daily recommended doses of folate, B vitamins, and multivitamins are generally sufficient in regard to lowering homocysteine levels. These daily doses are recommended by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) and the doses in a specific product are printed on the label of the vitamin bottle by the manufacturer. Usually, folate supplementation is recommended at 1 milligram daily; vitamin B6 is recommended at 10 milligram per day; and vitamin B12 at one-half milligram per day.

I guess I just won't worry about it anymore......


"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin
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Conor
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Quoted from Spring
How many vitamins should I take to lower my homocysteine level? ...

Hi Spring, this combination previously worked for me (although I currently take higher amounts of B12):

B2/Riboflavin  25 mg
B6/Pyridoxine  25 mg
B9/Folic Acid  800 mcg
B12/Cobalamin  500 mcg (MeB12 form)
TMG/Trimethylglycine  500 mg



Compliant, me?!? ... I even attended a university whose mascot is one of my ◆ Superfoods!
What is food to one man is bitter poison to others. ~ Titus Lucretius Carus
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