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Why?  This thread currently has 3,424 views. Print Print Thread
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Crimson
Tuesday, March 18, 2008, 4:19pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Why are the reasons for foods being beneficial or avoid NOT listed for non secretors??? I'd like to know why I should avoid certain foods, what to expect that it may do to my body if I do eat something on the avoid list.
I had that convienience when I was eating the secretor diet.
If I had to eat SOMETHING and had to choose the "lesser of two evils", I had that option.
I do not have that option on the non secretor diet.
I've no idea why I'm avoiding soy, mozzarella cheese, almond milk or apples. Nor do I know why avacados are suddenly bennificial.

I would love to at least have a pocket guide specific to non secretors.
The pocket guid that I have for type O has nothing for non secretors. I suppose I could write it in. But that's still not going to give me any clue as to the "WHY?".
I crave information.  

I'm feeling a bit frustrated.  


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Ribbit
Tuesday, March 18, 2008, 4:41pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

~W~A~R~R~I~O~R~ Defender, Survivor
Kyosha Nim
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I thought it was an A thing to need to know WHY all the time.  Maybe it's a nonnie thing.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
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LarryC.
Tuesday, March 18, 2008, 6:24pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh+, Gatherer, Super Taster
Kyosha Nim
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Look on the typebase, it tells.


Larry C. MIFHI
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meribelle
Tuesday, March 18, 2008, 9:43pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Gatherer, with a Teacher Husband
Kyosha Nim
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Age: 66
Here is what I did when I found out I was a nonnie.  First I revised my O list in pen, and then I typed it out as an O Nonnie List.  I found on another web site where there was a list for each blood type.  It was not a Dr. D web site, though.  Anyway, I took it in my purse to the store and just used it all the time.  

As for the Why.  I consider that we nonnies do not have the antibodies for our blood type in our digestive system like the regular guys do.  Therefore, we have to have different foods for ease of digestion and assimilation.  I am not a rocket scientist, but that explanation helped me.

Now that I am a gatherer, I wonder if being a nonnie even matters, but I am still very glad that I found out.


Pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and start all over again.  Blessings, meribelle
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Crimson
Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 1:55am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ribbit: I'm not sure of it being an A thing. I've always been curious and inquisitive. ^_^

LaryC: I did look in the typebase. It does not say if the foods that are avoids are metebolic inhibitors, have lectins or lower indican levels or modify disease susceptibility for avoids. Nor does it say the whys for the beneficials. It only states if the food is beneficial, neutral or avoid.

Meribelle: I have my list. I have updated the data in my brain.
I cannot answer to myself the whys because they have not been given.

This really doesn't bother anyone?

Can someone tell me HOW I can get this information?
I really want to know.
I realize that nonnies are a small portion of the population and therefore a small portion of the people that buy these books...but that should not keep Dr. D'Adamo from posting it.
He should understand more than any other person on this diet nonsecretor or secretor, why this information is important.  


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Lola
Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 2:15am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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you have read the tutorial as well as the LRFYT book, right?
Dr D explains the issue quite well, I believe.

avoids cause inflammatory issues or agglutination or thyroid inhibition or insulin receptor issues.....and so on....
use the search button on home page to read other posts mentioning their reactions to avoids or how others have overcome disease through avoidance and also how food values change even when the body is fighting a disease, like cancer and such......
the health series books have sometimes other values and status given according to the health issue they are pursuing.

this science is in constant movement, taking so much into consideration.....it is the work of a genius no doubt!

the information is already given, you need to do the research.


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!

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Lola  -  Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 2:33am
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Lola
Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 2:44am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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you want to know why avocado is ok for nonnies, and other things specified in the books, do the search....it s all there....there s no reason why you should feel frustrated...Dr D has written down everything, and now comes new science with the GTD!
http://www.google.com/custom?h.....avocados&spell=1
avocados were beneficial for me, once I found out I was a nonnie.....they have a specific substance which helps with dental cavities and plaque among other things...but hey, now that I m a gatherer, they are not as beneficial, and I m fine with that.....but I try learning and trying out and accepting what Dr D investigates, because it works for me!


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Crimson
Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 3:37am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I have done the bloody searches. Do you see where it says that avacodos are O Nonnie beneficial? And where it says O Secretor Avoid and in B status it says that it contains lectin or other aggluten? Why? Specifically. Why is it beneficial?
Not a guess. A true reason.
It does not say specifically why certain foods are avoids like it does for secretors.
Brussel sprouts for example...
They're avoids for O nonnies. Neutral for O, A, A nonnie, AB, AB nonnie...and beneficial for B and B nonnie. Reason: Contains component which positively influences known disease susceptibility.
See. I want that.
I have the Blood type encyclopedia, and ER4YT along with the pocket guide for O. The encyclopedia is supposed to be the most updated.
It is full of info. But not the specific blood reactions that O *or any* non secretors have to the foods that are avoid or beneficial to them.

Don't get me wrong. I've been on the BTD for two years. I do follow it well. I just recently found that I am non secretor. And I'm not accustom to not having this information available to me.
And I'm not one to blindly trust anyone. Even if they've given me good info in the past. In cases of science, there's no reason for it to not be available.  

And I have no intrest in the GTD. I've read the book and it's not for me.


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Lola
Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 5:56am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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I believe you now know for sure, that you want to follow the non secretor BTD closely, since you have been tested as a nonnie.

I too got tested years after I had been following the diet, but I intuitively followed the nonnie diet from the very start, and by reading the LRFYT book gave me all the answers you believe you are lacking.

have you got any health issues you would like to tackle?
I would then recommend you get not the LRFYT book but one of the health series books which best suits your needs, cause again, certain food values change regarding disease and you might think Dr D is trying to pull your leg!
I see you ll be 30 yo, perhaps you d want to follow the more targeted advice given in the aging book and be the healthiest most vibrant O nonnie 30 yo in your country!!
let me know what you decide.....but again, the reasons for the food value changes are definitely written in black and white!
and the search button leads you to many old threads and other articles where every question is answered appropriately.
Quoted Text
Contains component which positively influences known disease susceptibility.

that is basically it when it comes to avoids!!

before I forget, have you seen and or heard all of Dr D s videos and interviews?
there is such wealth of information there, too!
check the media center on the left margin on homepage and indulge in all those goodies.

also here s more if you haven t already seen this
Blood Type O Basics: Click Here
http://www.4yourtype.com/TypeO_basic.asp
.......................
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-VPbbu2pmU
I don t think you' ve yet had the time to absorb all the wealth of information there is on this site......all I can say is, I haven t finished reading all there is either and I ve been here quite a while!


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!

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Lola  -  Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 6:11am
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Lola
Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 6:27am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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Quoted Text
Dr D
Avocado has a lectin which reacts with the other types, being difficult to digest

Quoted Text
main benefit of avocado for nonnies is that is reduces pellicle on the teeth, helping with cavities which can be a problem for nonnies thereby discouraging bacteria from latching onto the teeth.


Quoted Text
avocado Help block the degradation of preelastic fibers and mature elastic fibers by and enzyme called human leukocyte elastase (HLE). Avocado and soybean have fractions called 'unsaponifiables' which may be beneficial in patients with
gingival inflammation and parodontitis, since HLE plays a major role in these disease states.

Quoted Text
"Avocados have a funny little quality which takes them from Avoid (the lectin that haunts secretors isn't a problem for nonnies) past Neutral to Beneficial: avocado helps reduce pellicle, the tooth-coating in which bacteria like to snuggle and thrive. Because nonnies statistically have more dental disease, this pellicle-peeling quality of avocados is a particular boon to them.


hope you get my point.....these are a few quotes I ve kept throughout the years, from reading and learning......


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Schluggell
Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 8:46am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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THe LECster Database in the Science section can be of help to us Nonnies as well. THough on the technical side, many foodstuffs listed there have a more detailed description of the Lectin involved and with a little thought, & some Coffee {OOPS did I say that?   }, can be revealed why it helps or hinders different Blood-Types.


Herr Schlggell -- Establish a Garden; Cultivate Community. "To see things in the seed, that is genius. He who obtains has little. He who scatters has much. The way to do is to be." -Lao Tzu
Bruno Manser, Ned Lud, August Sabbe, Richard St. Barbe-Baker, Eddie Koiki Mabo, Masanobu Fukuoka
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Mrs T O+
Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 12:06pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Hi Crimson! It's always nice to read your posts as there are few West Virginians around & even fewer interested in natural foods!
I think I know what you mean. You want to know the exact mechanism of how each food works. That would be very detailed. When I was younger, I was more interested in the minute details, but as I get older & have more info to process & more people to keep track of, etc., I am not as curious about every detail. However, I like the fact that you are so interested. We need to know what is going on in our bodies & in the world of medical research. Keep searching.
I think that a very high percentage of folks on the board are nonnies! That's why this nonnie thread was established after the site was constructed. I would think that more nonnies buy the BTD books. So, we/they may be 15-20% of the population, but I would venture to guess at least double that here! I  haven't counted all the folks here who know their secretor status, but maybe someone with time(or one of the busy moderators who have more stats)could find out.
I think I am one & the nonnie diet worked better for me. But as I think I am a borderline gatherer, many beneficials are now
neutrals & dots, including my beloved avocados! I now pass them along to my A+ teacher friend. [I have so many because my husband shops at this huge fruit market & goes overboard buying great bargains!]
I hope this helps. When there are changes, it takes time. I changed from O diet(with little improvement)to nonnie to hunter(which I wasn't) & now to gatherer. Each time it takes time & effort & a little grief at the change.
So, hang in there, sister. It's gotta get better!!
Sea Salt & Light,
Mrs "T"    O+  


Interested in nutrition, lactation, religion, politics; love to be around people; talkative, sensitive, goofy; a "fishy Christian" ><>; left-handed; lived on a farm, small town & big city; love BTD/GTD; A staunch La Leche League veteran; b. 10/1947 Check BTD/GTD on facebook!

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Mrs T O+  -  Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 12:09pm
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Dr. D
Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 1:06pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Peter D'Adamo
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1.  



While it is certainly a great idea to put in the non-secretor rationales, it ultimately devolves upon me to do it.

We have TYPEbase, which took me about 100+ hours to hand code.

Now, a few facts:

  • I see patients 3 days weekly in the clinic.
  • I'm not getting any younger.
  • I have a family, a lawn to cut, and snow to shovel.


It's nice to be spoon fed, but not always so nice to have to always be the one to hold the spoon. Yeah, science is great and every mechanism should have its full elucidation, but you are talking about an essentially one-man operation over here.




2.  

Now, other folks who want to know why there are no 'reasons' in the GTD book...

Well, let's see:
  • 6 genotypes x 700 foods= 4200 food determinations..

Assuming each 'reason' runs about 2-3 lines of text..
  • 10,000 lines of text..


Assuming each page of a typical book has about 80 lines of text..
  • 10,000/80 = 125 pages.


So we would have to remove 125 pages of other text to include the rationales.

No exactly what a publisher would consider a bestseller..

What text should we remove?






A whole system is a living system is a learning system.’ -Stewart Brand
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Ribbit
Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 1:50pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Aw, come on.  Nobody can fault us for wanting to know why, and nobody can fault you, Dr. D for having stuff to do other than figure out which 125 pgs. to remove.

Crimson, you may have to wait for your answers.  We all like to have the reasons why we should do something or not do something, and it does definitely help in choosing the lesser of two evoids (that's a combination of evil and avoid) if you need to.  But I think we're just going to have to wait.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
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Rodney
Wednesday, March 19, 2008, 2:04pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sun Beh Nim
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We should all be thankful for what Dr.D has done for us and take it upon ourselves to do some of the work on our own.
Being practical and use common scene can take a person a long way.
Thanks you Dr.D
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C_Sharp
Thursday, March 20, 2008, 4:24pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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Looks to me that if we want to know the reasons for our own avoids, we should get the SWAMI done and study the Chart Report.


MIfHI                            I follow a SWAMI diet.
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Crimson
Friday, April 4, 2008, 4:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Thank you all for your replies. I appreciate every bit of it.
I will re-read all the posts, and the pages that you've referenced and get a hold of a copy of LRFYT.

I'm currently having some serious issues with my stomach and am getting a genetic screening test for gluten sensitivity and celiac. So, I'm a bit out of my head about how and why all these things seem to be showing up NOW and after two years on the BTD, on top of two months on the Nonnie diet.
It all seems to have started right before the nonnie test and just....snowballed.   So many of the foods right now that are beneficial or neutral on BTD are tearing me up! I'm quite frustrated....with my own body.
I'm quite glad that I have the information I have to help myself in this. Knowing that I'm nonsecreter and how prone they are to Celiac is what has had me reading into it. I'll know in a few weeks.
I skipped the blood tests and the biopsy because they can sometimes give false negatives. I'm reading many who've been though way too much trying to get a diagnosis like that. Having to go back to eating gluten to see if there's damage...NO Thank you! The genetic screening will tell me more than I need to get better.

Again, Thank you all!


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Paula 0+
Friday, April 4, 2008, 5:23pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Wow, great thread here.  Crimson, I too am someone who always wants to know why.....so I can
relate.  I hope that you get the results soon of your celiac test.  I think wheat/gluten can cause so
many problems for those who suffer from it.  My history of health problems includes thyroid/liver
issues.  Back in the 80's a female md told me it was probably candida.   Then in the 90's it was
hep C.  But over the years and alot of reading, both of those issues have much improved by getting off wheat/gluten.  The times when I indulge (which are rare) I always have symptoms flare up.

I'd be interested in hearing what you find out.  Someone above said "keep searching" and I agree.
Best wishes for increased health!
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Rex
Friday, April 4, 2008, 5:53pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I am still curious & wondering "why" about a lot of Dr. D's recommendations but I'm never doubtful about the fact that what Dr. D. recommends works.  I've been following his advice for a long time now & have never been disappointed with the results.  
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Spring
Friday, April 4, 2008, 7:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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I thought for sure that I was gluten intolerant, but after a lot more research and listening to my gut, I don't think so. Corn, corn products and uncultured dairy (fake yogurt - expensive garbage too) had done some serious damage to my stomach. After I got rid of that stuff and started watching out for polyamine overload, I feel like I have a brand new stomach!!!
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Mrs T O+
Friday, April 4, 2008, 7:57pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Sometmes the mixture of the foods causes upset.
Always eat fruit on an empty stomach, Don't mix types of proteins(meats & beans, for example. It's OK to mix red meat, fish, & poultry.).
Don't mix starches & proteins, altho I do often.
Don't eat if not hungry.
S S & L,
Mrs "T"    O+  


Interested in nutrition, lactation, religion, politics; love to be around people; talkative, sensitive, goofy; a "fishy Christian" ><>; left-handed; lived on a farm, small town & big city; love BTD/GTD; A staunch La Leche League veteran; b. 10/1947 Check BTD/GTD on facebook!
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Crimson
Friday, April 4, 2008, 8:19pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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https://www.enterolab.com/Home.htm

This is where I'm having the gluten intolerance/ celiac genetic screening done... for anyone that's interested. You order, do the cheek swab and send it back. It's not much different than the nonnie test.
I think I typed this in my last post. But for those who may think they're gluten intolerant or sensitive, the gene screening seems the way to go. Especially with knowing that celiac is diagnosed AFTER GI damage has been done and found. They seemingly put you through hell for amusement. The actual diagnosis would mean little if I'm THAT sick. I think my body has been though quite enough of late.

I want to make clear that I have great respect for Dr. D'Adamo's work.
Otherwise I would not be following the diet. I do wish that the information for non secreters were more readily available.
I would imagine as stated by Mrs "T", the majority of people who follow the BTD most would be the nonsecreters.  
I believe this should be taken into consideration. *maybe when Dr. D is thinking of a new book to write *Hint Hint**
It might not exactly be on the "best seller" list.
But a book specified for non secreters would certainly sell.
To those of us who ask "why?".  


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JJR
Friday, April 4, 2008, 9:52pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

33% Nomad, calories calories!!!!!!
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I'm a secretor and I'm very interested in the diet.  I see your point though.  I had thought that too sometimes like I wished the "why" was next to the nonnie info.  Doesn't matter for me now though.

I'm sorry you're having all the troubles.  I can relate totally.  I've had gut issues for a year and a half and I'm still not sure what's going on.  I gotta ask my doctor about the gluten / celiac thing.  Although I don't think I eat any gluten products now.  I'm not sure.  When I eat rice I eat brown rices. Brown Rice cakes.  I'm told those are gluten free.  And I eat millet and flax bread that I believe is gluten free too.  

You're an O, I thought you were supposed to stay away from grains mostly anyways?

And I must say, if that's you're picture at the bottom, you are smoking!!!!!!  You should put one with a shirt on for us married men.


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Lola
Saturday, April 5, 2008, 1:33am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I definitely asked why, considering my double lewis negative status, and did get my answers reading LRFYT!
plus all the info available on this site, wiki and what not.....
I d still be lost had I not found ERFYT from the very beginning and believe like many have grown and educated ourselves in parallel, with every new book which Dr D publishes for us!


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Ribbit
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Kyosha Nim
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ABNoWay.  Dude.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
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