Curious as to how many nonnies eat grains. What their reaction is to them, how often they eat they, what kinds they do best and worst with

Laura-I don't eat grains if I can help it.  They bring me down...I get tired...I get achy...I get headaches...I waaaaaant mooooorrrrrre.  And then, the cravings for other avoids start.  I may eat brown rice once in a while at home just for a treat and rice cakes too.  Making sure I have either with protein.  But...other than that, I stay away from other grains as much as possible.   I have had a bag of compliant kamut pretzels in the food closet for about a two and a half weeks, but haven't opened them yet.   I am afraid they will turn out like Lays Potato Chips and I will end up eating the whole bag.  Crunchiness and salt.  yuuuuummmmm.

Debra  

Hi Laura,

I eat all complaint grains from Ezekiel, spelt, oatmeal and rice.  I never have any issues with them and they don't make me crave any sweets.  I typically have oatmeal for breakfast with walnuts, blueberries, flax and almonds.  Then for lunch a peanut butter or grilled cheese (sheep or goat cheese) sandwich on spelt or Ezekiel.  This about does it for a day's worth of grains.  I also love the spelt/rice pancake recipe in Cook Right 4 Your Type.  I add macadamia nuts or blueberries to the mix.  Yum!

On a side note, if I have ANY wheat in a product, I have major issues!

Hope this helps.

if you mean grains likewise a müsli, I stopped completely, get cramps and diarrhea...some speltbread
sometimes, but nowadays I eat very,very little of such thingies... Peter was right here too, those famous carbs....yeech

I voted yes, because I'll have a couple of toasted rice cakes with nut butter.   That's all.
I like to get my carbs from sweet potatoes, carrots, parsnips, other vegetables and fruits.

But I do not eat any bread, muffins, cake, cookies, chips, tortillas, cereals, cooked grains, etc....

isa,
i sometimes have the same problem but never thought it came from grains.  not really frequent diarreah but loose stools all the time and gassy probably more than normal.  so what do you eat? we are really limited to fruits grains and meat.  I would love to hear from you since there aren't and other ab nonnies on here.
ok it is first thing in the morning so no homemade granola for me i'm off to eat some eggs.  does ezekial bread or manna (essene) bread bother you isa?

Quoted from debra

Laura-I don't eat grains if I can help it.  They bring me down...I get tired...I get achy...I get headaches...I waaaaaant mooooorrrrrre.  And then, the cravings for other avoids start.  I may eat brown rice once in a while at home just for a treat and rice cakes too.  Making sure I have either with protein.  But...other than that, I stay away from other grains as much as possible.   I have had a bag of compliant kamut pretzels in the food closet for about a two and a half, but haven't opened them yet.   I am afraid they will turn out like Lays Potato Chips and I will end up eating the whole bag.  Crunchiness and salt.  yuuuuummmmm.

Debra  

Debra I feel exactly the same way when I eat grains! It's terrible but bread has always been my downfall. I try to stay away from it but sometimes when I do eat some bread boy oh boy watch out, I am miserable!

I can't eat grains at all.  Even plain rice cakes cause leg aches, pains and general fogginess.  

Fingers swell and I can't get enough sleep.  1 dose of grain takes about 48 hours to get out of my system now!

I’ve always loved rice.  Rice cakes are my crunchy snack of choice.  I eat Spelt bread.  Hot oatmeal with real butter and salt is another favorite.

Although not 100% grain free, I consider myself just that compared to the way I used to eat grains.  I believe for B nonnies the servings are 3-5 per week.  I was eating that amount DAILY!  I now have about 3-5 servings per MONTH, and it's closer to the 3 than the 5!  BTW, I only ate compliant grains -- no WHEAT.

When I do have grains, it is rice because that is a beneficial.  I sometimes have puffed cereal with goat milk for dinner when it's a hectic day!

I've noticed a BIG difference.  Especially in clearer thinking.  It's made such a difference, that's my motivation to keep from eating the grains.

At first I was very irritated to find that even an O-secretor can have more grains than a B-nonnie!  Not fair I thought.  I got over it though!  And I can't be happier!

ahaaa...with *grains* carbs were meant ....ok-ok...sometimes a little rice, speltbraed ( I do it on my own) no cramps here
and @ Mandi....
in the morning I am eating quark with dried cranberries or other non-dried fruits and or walnuts or pekannuts in....thats all, for lunch...depends how many time I do have, some meat, veggies or salade
or even fish and veggies or salade, lots of apples as snack, or even just fruits as a complete lunch or supper.....
since I stopped to eat too much grains, even speltbread not daily, I feel much better; and it's even possible to lose a little more weight (without training ) ....aaaannndddd I am drinking enormously
lots of thés, H2O, some little cafés yup... I know can't let it be for 100%....

p.s.
even in the morning, eating soy-products and I'll get fat whithin days, similar to carbs
since I've changed....= better  

I still have grain avoids on occasion.  Less now than, say, a year ago.  But generally I will have some brown rice or kamut pasta (more likely the former) once a week, and I do occasionally have Manna bread with breakfast (again, maybe once a week).  Summer it's easier to stick to meat, fruit and veggies!

isa or anyone else who knows...... what is quark?  also isa do you eat more that the 2-3 of fruit recommended?

I need breakfast ideas.....
all i eat is eggs or my homemade granola.  
breakfast is the hardest meal of the day for me.

Actually Breakfast is hard for me too, I run right before and so it is my recovery meal, normally I have fish or chicken and some veggies or eggs, this just doesn't seem to make sense to me though since I need more carbs, I eat an egg and some fruit before I go, so I don't want this again, it is very frustrating

Mandi,
Maybe Isa will tell you for sure, but Quark is a type of soft cheese/sour cream type of milk product..It's neutral for you AB nonnies.

Beneficial dairy for you would be:
Kefir
Mozzarella cheese
Ricotta cheese
Cottage cheese
Farmer cheese
Feta cheese
Sour cream

and then, of course.....eggs are beneficial for you!

Beneficial nuts are:
walnuts & black walnuts
chestnuts

If you're having granola, hopefully you aren't using avoid sweeteners.  

But your symptoms almost sound like candida.

Hi everyone,

This is rather long, so I hope it will be of interest to people here.

I eat no grains at all now. No grain-like seeds, either (so, no quinoa) and also no beans, either. Very Paleo, I guess. It's weird, because now I eat a lot of meat, but I never would have chosen this way of eating had it not been for the clear health problems I developed by avoiding it or limiting animal foods.

It was quite surprising for me to find out that I'm highly intolerant to gluten after many years of being a semi-vegetarian (lacto-ovo usually) and thinking that my ailments weren't related to diet. Last year, I was tested by Enterolab http://www.enterolab.com (stool testing developed by Dr. Fine. This form of testing for gluten is starting to be more well known. A new standard in the future, most likely). It turns out that I'm intolerant to both gluten and casein. As an interesting side note, Dr. Fine is an A + and suspects that he might be a Nonnie! I suggested that he get tested. He's following a strict vegan diet to try to address his health issues, but that diet will be especially problematic over time if he is indeed a Nonnie.  If so, the man will need some lamb.

History: a few years ago, I stopped eating wheat because I was eating different whole grains 'for fun' and variety instead, such as oats and barley. During that time, my joint pain from fibromyalgia (I started suffering in my early 20s. I'm 35 now) was greatly reduced.  But it took 3 times of stopping wheat before I connected things.  In my life, I always craved starchy things and would have cravings for bread, pasta, rice, and types of candy that were pretty much pure sugar (e.g. jelly beans).  I knew that these foods were my 'trigger' foods - they would lead me to eat too much and feel buzzy then sleepy. They were working like a drug for me, I now realise.  I developed lots of allergies in my 20s, mostly chemical sensitivities. I suffered from food allergies when I was very very young (under a year old), but supposedly 'grew out of them.' Based on my studies on this subject, t's more like they were dormant for years, as can often happen, and then emerged again in my 20s big time. Very frustrating to figure out.  As a child and teen, I would sometimes get really bad IBS (nasty intestinal cramps followed by diahrrea) after eating a certain quantity of bread or pasta, or (very oddly) sticky rice at Chinese restaurants.

During my 20s, I stayed slim with a horrendous amount of will power that led to an eating disorder (exercise bulimia) until about age 30.  I suffered from low estridiol levels starting in my early 20s, and so did my sister, even though my sister wasn't as slim as me.  I was put on the birth control pill to normalize things, and my sister was too.  I now know that gluten intolerance can lead to hormonal problems like this, including PCOS. My sister is 18 months younger than me, has the same 'trigger' thing with grains and sugars, so I think that she has must have a problem with grains, too. She always needed quite a bit of animal protein to feel okay. She always liked meat, though. She's an A+, but is likely an secretor. Her health problems have never been as bad as mine.  My mom is also an A+, but is likely a  Nonnie. I developed almost all of the same health problems she has (very chronic fatigure related things) but now I'm doing better with no grains while she's opted to take Rx drugs to manage things.

Wheat bran always gave me horrible gas, despite the fact that my body should have been used to having high fiber diet (from vegetables and fruits).  Sprouted rye bread was bad, too. I suffered from IBS a lot. I still do, but not like before. Digestive enzymes are helping me. Many years of damage, I guess.

2 years ago, I posted to an online forum I belong to about various problems I had (thin tooth enamel, IBS, skin problems, fibromylgia, interstitial cystitis) and someone told me about gluten intolerance. I was fairly resistant to the idea that this was my problem because I wasn't a 'classic' Celiac (also, as many of you may know, many people who are gluten intolerant or Celiac do not test postive via standard blood tests).

I dropped wheat and all 'gluten' grains (spelt, triticale, kamut, barley, rye). Not long after that, I stopped getting canker sores in my mouth. I was so used to getting them in my life that this was very very surprising! I then found out that they are a classic reaction to gluten! Wow.

Wheat was the worst for me (it has the highest levels of gliadin of all the grains), but as studies have shown, the other grains simply contain smaller amounts of the problematic proteins. A person will still react to them, but they don't necessarily feel it. Damage can be occuring to the villi of the small intestine slowly, and lead to all kinds of 'leaky gut' related problems, like chemical sensitivities, and also auto immune disorders (fibromyalgia is  often classified as an autoimmune disorder).

I did eat oats for a while, and thought I was okay on them, but then realised that, increasingly, they had a negative effect on me  - chronic fatigue, anxiousness, sleep problems (I didn't sleep deeply enough, even as a baby), joint pain, starch/sugar cravings. Oats do not contain gliadin (the protein in wheat, spelt and kamut), but they are usually contaminated with gliadin during processing since most grains are processed in the same place as wheat, or close enough.  It all started to make sense , so I dropped oats too, and only ate Lundberg Rice (guarenteed not to be contaminated by gluten if purchased in bags, not bulk bins), buckwheat groats and quinoa. But then I decided to drop ALL grains one by one.

Finally my tendency toward anxiety and depression lessened. My hormones seem to work better, too. I have better esridiol levels. Now I don't crave sugar or starch like I used to, my joints don't hurt very often, and I feel more 'clear.'  It's hard to explain, but my brain works differently. I have more clarity mentally, and am less likely to think too much, be obsessive in my thinking, and that kind of thing.  

My friend, also an A+ Nonnie, has experienced the same mental clarity. He only eats quinoa and amaranth now, no other grains. He dropped them one by one and found that he does much better without them. They just feel nutrionally void to both of us now, even when they are whole grain. It's really interesting how sensitive one becomes to their body's responses to foods after doing elimination diets. I would have dismissed this kind of thing not so long ago.

Some of the improvements took a long time, and are rather subtle, which makes this hard to explain. I learend that It can take 2-3 years of being gluten free before the healing is done. It is so WEIRD to be eating mostly meat and vegetables now! I have never been a big meat eater (I never liked most meats, even as a kid. For example, I stopped liking Macdonald's hamburgers at age 6), plus I am sensitive to suffering. By finding 'humane' sources for meat - http://www.eatwild.com is a good site - and visiting organic farms, etc., I finally feel better about this. The book The Yoga of Eating is really good, too. It isn't about Yoga in the classic sense.

http://www.yogaofeating.com/contents.html

The site http://www.beyondveg.com is also really good. Very respectful.

Shel

thank you Victoria for the translation of my protoscientist-protoscientist (qoarks & orks )
and yes it is a form of softcheese and as our maischddaa told us to eat mostly of proteins in the morning, so I try to be brave and do what he recommends

about fruits: hmmm it depends on my mood and day sometimes more, sometimes less but it is the only way for me to maintain my weight, because if not....paddapoum....
instantly I get fat....  I eat lots of grapefruits, as fruit or juice, lemons in all the thés I take daily, and so I've no problem with respiration, nor allergies  about eggs.... hmm...not that bad, but please only the yolk of em...I dont like the white of the eggs to much
no potatoes, no noodles, no similar stuffies because it only maked me very tired and I do need vivid foods, like salades of all kinds and fruits....and please not treated with whatsoever

Shel,
very powerful testimonial!!
thanks for sharing all the details with us, it will help many overcome the same issues.

Wow, Shel, I found your post very interesting. Got me to thinking about the joint pain and inflammation I stll experience sometimes. Using the arthritis A nonnie food list, been suspecting it was caused by a hidden avoid or too much dairy, but will check into the grains this week. Using mainly spelt and brown rice.

I'm cutting my two rice cakes down to one a day.  This grain business is "food for thought", and maybe not food for humans.

Victoria have you been reading the no more obscurity for grains thread? I have posed some questions there

Grains, though they hypnotize me with their evil spell *lol*, are not for me, I've learned.

I am going to give them up.  Currently, I still eat rice cakes and, occasionally, rice.  But I really should NOT, I have an addictive response to rice, as I think it gives me a "glucose rush" and whatever it does, I want to eat too much of it.  Once my kitchen is up and running and I'm not living out of boxes and the fridge in the living room (!), I'm going to go all veggie/meat/fruit/nut, and no grains.  The exception might be quinoa, which is technically not a grain at all.  I may experiment with making tabouli with quinoa.  Other than that...I ideally need to be off all grains.

What do they do to me that's so bad?  Well, they make me want to eat more and more of them, they cause cravings for carbs, they cause me to gain weight and, in the case of avoid grains like wheat, the litany of what happens when I eat them is much longer, all having to do with inflamation, basically (joint issues, back issues, sinus issues, mood issues...well, maybe that last one is unrelated to inflamation, but anyway).

I personally do not think that Type O non-secretors should eat any grains, if we are being ideal about our diet.  Dr. D. was being generous when he said "zero to two portions per week", which still only equates to ONE cup of cooked grains per week.  One cup of cooked rice, for example, is a very small amount of rice, imho.  I personally feel he is saying, okay, if you HAVE to have some compliant grains, have that token amount, but really you shouldn't have any.  And if he wasn't saying that, I am.  Nonnies:  head for the veggies, leave the grains for the secretors.

Hate to tell you this PT, but if you are going to go off grains you need to GO OFF GRAINS, including quinoa, it is going to cause the same response as other grains.  you have one of the strongest grain addiction I have ever seen, I cannot tell you how many times I have heard you say that you need to go off them only to justify your reason for not going off them one breath later

Another O nonnie here...no grains for me whatsoever.  I don't even bother entertaining the thought of eating grains - my body can't deal with them.

Quoted from lkpetrolino

Hate to tell you this PT, but if you are going to go off grains you need to GO OFF GRAINS, including quinoa, it is going to cause the same response as other grains.

Quinoa is not actually a grain,* though, which is why I think it might be different, reaction-inducing-wise.  I've had quinoa instant breakfast cereal in the past and no adverse reaction.  I'm going to try a quinoa tabouli, once I get my kitcen up and running.  It is actually a seed.

* http://www.wholegrain.umn.edu/grains/quinoa.cfm