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Os and Dairy  This thread currently has 4,744 views. Print Print Thread
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Sahara
Sunday, September 4, 2011, 8:15pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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This food group has been an ongoing problem for me the last few years.  I know better and have greatly reduced it over the summer.  However, I'm constantly reading all over the Internet about the "health benefits" of dairy.  

How dairy free are you?  Do you never eat dairy or if you do, how often?  Has eliminating dairy reducded your body fat %? What really are the reasons for eliminating dairy other than that it isn't a great buidling food for Os.  Is it actually metabolically inactivating like wheat?  I was more hardcore dairy free in the early 2000s and am looking for input about why kefir should not ever be in my shopping basket again.
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ruthiegirl
Sunday, September 4, 2011, 8:28pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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In the past, I discovered that consuming dairy led to nasal congestion and an increase in aggressiveness/shortened temper. I found that I didn't have these problems from goat dairy (goat milk, yogurt or kefir made from goat milk, and goat cheese) and my reactions to sheep dairy (feta cheese specifically) was milder than my reaction to cow dairy, but I still reacted.

I was dairy free, off and on, for many years. When I was doing low-carb, I came across the Paleo Diet, and cut out all dairy for about a month. I re-introduced butter with no problems, I tried cream once and felt all my symptoms return, so I've eliminated cream since that time. When I switched from low carb/Paleo to BTD, I re-introduced goat cheese, farmer cheese, feta cheese (sheep milk only) and mozzarella cheese. Somewhere in that time I discovered ghee (so easy to make! Why did i wait so long to try it?) and have been using that regularly as well. Since I did fine on butter as my only dairy product, I expect ghee to be similarly safe.

When I got SWAMI, I kept my cheese intake the same but also added in occasional paneer or ricotta (both neutral.) When I found out my secretor status, I cut out the mozzarella, feta, and farmer's cheese, and added in quark cheese (beneficial.)

However, I haven't been feeling too well lately.  I haven't noticed any obvious congestion, but I often can't smell things that my kids can smell, and my seasonal allergies have just started acting up again (tree pollen is starting to be in the air again.) I've also been having a hell of a time with my temper lately, and overall feelings of being overwhelmed and out of control. I decided that I'll finish up the current batch of quark cheese in the fridge, but then I won't make any more for a few months. I'm going to go back to "no dairy but butter and ghee" and see if that makes me feel better.

I may even try making quark from goat milk, rather than cow's milk, when I make it again. I might just have a problem with the proteins in cow's milk, regardless of what SWAMI says about certain cheeses for me.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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Lola
Sunday, September 4, 2011, 8:34pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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find out which dairy products suit your GT

there are online videos to making your own paneer, kefir, ....or other, depending on your specific variables


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Beachgirl
Sunday, September 4, 2011, 8:47pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Other than occasional butter (very, very rare these days) I'm trying to go completely dairy free.  I have crazy allergies, asthma & an immune system that reacts at the drop of a hat.  I've only been doing the BTD for a week & the GTD for a day, so it's a little early to tell if it's making a difference in allergies for me.  Yogurt/ kefir have never seemed to give me problems in the past, but I've never eliminated them before, either.  After a month or so of no wheat/ no dairy I'll be able to tell better.  (hopefully)     I'm not a big cheesehead, so I won't miss that part.  


Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again!
Goal weight acheived!!  Woo Hoo!!!!
DH of 18 yrs. O+, DS 17yo O, DS 5yo O, not sure on the boys' RH status.

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Lola
Sunday, September 4, 2011, 8:56pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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http://www.dadamo.com/B2blogs/blogs/index.php/2009/01/15/butyrate-and-ghee?blog=27
important to gut health in general, depending on type, variables, physiology and more.....Dr D has computed all this and more into his sophisticated SWAMI software


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Sahara
Sunday, September 4, 2011, 9:03pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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No my question has to do with weight gain/fat gain.  Dr. D says in LR4YT that dairy causes "undesirable weight gain."  I'm wondering why this is.  It's a whole food group which I could add to my meal or at least have once a week as a "cheat meal".  Congestion is a problem for me too if I have it too often; it is also pro inflammatory for Os.  But what really concerns me is whether or not it stalls the release of body fat.  
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Beachgirl
Sunday, September 4, 2011, 9:08pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I'm not sure about the fat yet...still waiting for that first magical pound to disappear!     Even at my thinnest/ most toned, I ate yogurt & it never seemed to be an issue, but I'm certainly no expert.


Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again!
Goal weight acheived!!  Woo Hoo!!!!
DH of 18 yrs. O+, DS 17yo O, DS 5yo O, not sure on the boys' RH status.

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Sahara
Sunday, September 4, 2011, 9:12pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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I want my kefir!!!!!!
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ruthiegirl
Sunday, September 4, 2011, 9:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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When I was doing low-carb, I found that I often lost weight well when I was including cheeses, but had many stalls when I went Paleo and cut the dairy out. Overall health improved, but I didn't see any definite weight loss from it. But then, I've always had problems losing weight, and I never really found anything that consistenly allows me to lose weight. I haven't been at a healthy weight since I got pregnant with my first child (and she'll be 17 in December.)

About the only certainty with my diet and weight is that overdoing the carbs makes me  gain weight.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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Sahara
Sunday, September 4, 2011, 11:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Maybe some of the Hunters will chime in.  Dairy really ought to be a once a week treat and imo ought to be something fermented.  But no not really sure about that.  Just because I like a food doesn't mean it's good for me.
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David
Monday, September 5, 2011, 8:15am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I read this thread, and then the O's and % body fat thread and posted some of dairy comments there. Posted another one about diary in the gallbladder thread about the benefits of beets.

I find myself wondering why almost all the O's I've seen in the forums who have done Swami are listed as Explorer or Gatherer instead of Hunter?

I have gone through the routine of helping quite a few O+ people figure out what they are and most of them came out as Hunter... Quite a few of them were born in Nigeria.

It is sounding like Swami has a more inclusive questionnaire than the book, that takes in consideration the individuals health history, activity level, emotional nature or personality characteristics etc. or what else?


Thoughts Are Things... Think The Good Ones... and remember... Moderate exercise is the best mood elevator!
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Henriette Bsec
Monday, September 5, 2011, 8:43am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Well I have noticed that Danish O´s seem to have less problems with dairy compared to what I read here.
My guess is that while dairy isn´t good for O´s maybe living in a society where the lactase persistence is quite common, makes it less bad for O´s.
In Dk less than 4 % of the adult population is lactose intolerent and cassein allergy is very rare.

My daughter gets more dairy than she ought. (hard when you live wth a B  )
Especially cheese and butter are very common in her diet.
She gets some whipping cream and a little creme fraise as well- but rarely drinking milk or yoghurt.
One interesting thing is that both she, my mum and step dad( all O types seem to do better on raw milk than pastuerized milk. Maybe the lipase and lactase in raw milk makes it less problematic  



ENFP -naturalist, visual/spatial and musical/verbal/chatty Dane- Mother to DD Emma age 19,
0 rh- secr ( Hunter or Explorer )
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PCUK-Positive
Monday, September 5, 2011, 12:17pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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If you have a problem with dairy then avoid nightshades too (they make it worse) or to put it simply follow the BTD.


Kind Regards PC. FIfHI Swami III Pro

Partner (F) is O+(Non) MN. Duffy Fy(a+b+),  Lewis (a+ b-) Gatherer.
DD ( is O+(Non)NN, Duffy Fy(a+b-) Lewis (a+b-) Gatherer
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Andrea AWsec
Monday, September 5, 2011, 12:52pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from ruthiegirl
I
I may even try making quark from goat milk, rather than cow's milk, when I make it again. I might just have a problem with the proteins in cow's milk, regardless of what SWAMI says about certain cheeses for me.


Or you have something else going on in you body....

Sometimes the foods that heal us don't always make us feel good.





MIFHI

"Do not try to satisfy your vanity by teaching a great many things. Awaken people's curiosity. It is enough to open minds; do not overload them." Anatole France

"Healthy people have the least overt symptoms from eating avoid foods." Dr. D'Adamo
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balletomane
Monday, September 5, 2011, 1:48pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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David, a Hunter here

Sahara, I'm not entirely sure about the weight gain/fat gain issue related to dairy. But I go with my SWAMI, which allows a small portion of butter or ghee per week (1 tsp) and 2-4 oz of cheese per week. I only have five types of cheeses that are allowed, of which only 3 are available where I live. So I stick to that portion and find that the hard cheeses actually help my digestion and does not make me gain weight as long as I don't go overboard with the portion.

In the past, I ate a lot of "avoid" dairy products and I did gain a lot of weight... I was very puffy.

Henriette, I have read somewhere that Scandinavians are more lactose tolerant than any other ethnic groups. My husband, a Swede, seems to do well with dairy products even though many of them should be "avoids" for him.


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O in Virginia
Monday, September 5, 2011, 2:21pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I cheat occasionally with dairy.  I love cheese and ice cream, but I don't indulge often.  If I keep my portions miniscule I can get by with no problem except for a bit of congestion.  I haven't noticed any mood changes after eating dairy.  If I eat more than I should - my digestion will let me know it later.  I never suffered from lactose intolerance that I was aware of pre BTD.  But now that I have avoided dairy (mostly) for the past year, I do find it has a more immediate effect on me when I indulge.  My only superfood/beneficial dairy on swami is ghee (which I use often) and Indian buffalo milk, which I have not seen around here.  Quark is a neutral and I use that occasionally to make a cheesy rice noodle casserole (comfort food), although store bought quark is more like sour cream, and it is good to use with anything that you might enjoy with sour cream.  Cheese/dairy DOES make me gain weight, for sure.  I notice that the next day after having it.  I don't track body fat percentages.  I have enough to depress me at the moment.  
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ruthiegirl
Monday, September 5, 2011, 3:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Andrea AWsec


Or you have something else going on in you body....

Sometimes the foods that heal us don't always make us feel good.





OK, but if I'm getting the needed probiotics from fermented veggies, and the needed dairy fats from ghee, why would I *need* quark cheese?


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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ABJoe
Monday, September 5, 2011, 3:28pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from ruthiegirl
OK, but if I'm getting the needed probiotics from fermented veggies, and the needed dairy fats from ghee, why would I *need* quark cheese?

I'm not a food scientist, but my supposition is that a mix of nutrients would be helpful.  It is hard to know what all micronutrients (or the balance) you may be needing.

I know that there are days when I try to eat one member of the cabbage family, but can't and actually need a different one...  I suppose the body knows what it needs at the time and can get more from one source than another.  It has prompted me to expand the variety in my diet...


RH-, ISTJ
Wonderful Wife = A+ Teacher; Darling Daughter = A- SWAMI Explorer
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PCUK-Positive
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Kyosha Nim
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also don't wear tight clothes.


Kind Regards PC. FIfHI Swami III Pro

Partner (F) is O+(Non) MN. Duffy Fy(a+b+),  Lewis (a+ b-) Gatherer.
DD ( is O+(Non)NN, Duffy Fy(a+b-) Lewis (a+b-) Gatherer
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Brighid45
Monday, September 5, 2011, 7:03pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I have the same reactions ruthiegirl does to cow, goat and sheep milk and cheeses. Ghee is my favorite good quality fat. It's the only food of dairy origin I still eat, aside from a little pecorino or manchego. I don't like what dairy does to me-bloating, weight gain, mood swings, congestion, inflammation of my arthritis--so I leave it alone.


Everyone is entitled to his or her informed opinion. --H. Ellison
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StarPine
Monday, September 5, 2011, 8:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Quoted from 14442
But what really concerns me is whether or not it stalls the release of body fat.  


It absolutely stalls the release of body fat for me! In fact, I gain immediately. The day I eat like 1 oz of cheese for example, the next day I can gain almost 1 inch of fat on my hips. That's NO JOKE. I measure myself everyday, so that's how I know.

Dairy is the worst thing possible for me to eat when it comes to body fat. As for the rest of the "health benefits", I'm not so sure.
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StarPine
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Quoted from PCUK-Positive
also don't wear tight clothes.


Ha!  
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StarPine
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Quoted from PCUK-Positive
If you have a problem with dairy then avoid nightshades too (they make it worse) or to put it simply follow the BTD.


So a caprese salad is definite no-no
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jetsgirl15
Monday, September 5, 2011, 11:22pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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[quote from Sahara] [No my question has to do with weight gain/fat gain.  Dr. D says in LR4YT that dairy causes "undesirable weight gain."  I'm wondering why this is.  It's a whole food group which I could add to my meal or at least have once a week as a "cheat meal".  Congestion is a problem for me too if I have it too often; it is also pro inflammatory for Os.  But what really concerns me is whether or not it stalls the release of body fat. ]

All I can say is that when I realized that it was dairy causing all my intestinal distress and gave it up completely, I lost 17 pounds in 3 weeks!!!  And I feel soooooo much better now! I follow the GTD for Gatherers and while I still do miss some foods, I don't miss them bad enough to want to feel that sick again!  
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Possum
Monday, September 5, 2011, 11:36pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I never feel sick or have any real congested reaction eating dairy (except milk) but I had got into the (bad) habit on nibbling on cheese too often & had certainly noticed the weight gain over winter Now that I am not having it in the house so can really resist, I have lost a kg (approx 2lbs) over night
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jennyg
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I have noticed if I eat dairy, ESPECIALLY ice cream or non compliant cheeses, I gain weight the next day, and takes a couple of days to a week to come back off depending on how much i eat. I also feel bloated and have trouble with constipation. It's hard for me to stay away sometimes, but every time I eat it I greatly regret it.  


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PCUK-Positive
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 12:38am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Gatherer Rh+, NN, (lewis a+ b-) [Duffy Fy(a+b+) ]
Kyosha Nim
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dairy, chocolate, sweets, chips. they all put on weight for me overnight and take nearly a week to remove, not that i need to worry about weight too much, but i hate being beaten by things lol

Apart from particularly attractive, gentle women, of course


Kind Regards PC. FIfHI Swami III Pro

Partner (F) is O+(Non) MN. Duffy Fy(a+b+),  Lewis (a+ b-) Gatherer.
DD ( is O+(Non)NN, Duffy Fy(a+b-) Lewis (a+b-) Gatherer
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Possum
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 1:00am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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O in Virginia
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 1:09am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Swami
Kyosha Nim
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If I could lose 17 lbs in three weeks I'd gladly give up dairy.  
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Possum
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 1:14am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh- Expluntherer... It means I'm an O...;-)
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Ok the race is on hey OinV???!!
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O in Virginia
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 1:30am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from Possum
Ok the race is on hey OinV???!!


17 lbs in three weeks?  Maybe if I were to become ill.  
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Possum
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 1:31am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh- Expluntherer... It means I'm an O...;-)
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Nooo I mean as something to aim for
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O in Virginia
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 1:32am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Swami
Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from Possum
Nooo I mean as something to aim for


Oh, I see.  Ok!  
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David
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Dairy ie: milks, cheeses, ice-cream and yogurt had always been a staple and comfort food for me. I would have to say that the dairy caused congestion. Thirty years ago, I began to notice that when I moved away from whole milk to 2% and then to skim products congestion issues lessened with each stage of distancing myself from something in the milk proteins or fats.

The only thing I can identify that I could say ever put ant weight on me is long term periods of eating a lot of oatmeal cookies or extended periods of inactivity.


Thoughts Are Things... Think The Good Ones... and remember... Moderate exercise is the best mood elevator!
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Sahara
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 3:38am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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I've been off wheat several months why not ditch dairy too.  This trainer says he noticed many of his clients are unable to tolerate either food:

http://www.truthaboutabs.com/2-foods-beware-weight-gain.html
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David
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Sahara, interesting question.... and link.   Working on it!

There are tons of sites which advocate using milk.... to gain weight. I remember the first time I saw milk being used to gain weight, intentionally. At lunch in High-school the football players guzzled as much as they could... to gain weight. And they did! Millions do it still.

It is available everywhere and massive commercial expenditures have been made to tell you do drink it..... Every Day. I'd bet that it goes home in more shopping bags than apples do.

Milk Fat is Fat is Fat.. It is a high energy source in a small exceptionally convenient package.


Thoughts Are Things... Think The Good Ones... and remember... Moderate exercise is the best mood elevator!
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Henriette Bsec
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 7:23am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

swamied nomad chameleon receptor worldview
Kyosha Nim
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[quote=15832
Milk Fat is Fat is Fat.. It is a high energy source in a small exceptionally convenient package. [/quote]

That is a very much one size fits all approach  

Fat does not make all people fat- actually upping my fat intake ( especially only using full fat dairy and plenty of butter ) makes me loose weight .
Full fat dairy is diamond and superfoods for me- while no and low fat neutral.
Avoiding sugar and most grains = less faton my body as well.

My o daughter is natural slim but I can see ehen she has been eating to much grains ( even spelt and rice) she gets fat on tummy- while if she eat a low grain high butter/oliveoil diet she stays slim.



ENFP -naturalist, visual/spatial and musical/verbal/chatty Dane- Mother to DD Emma age 19,
0 rh- secr ( Hunter or Explorer )
Diamonds, superfoods, Neutral,*black dots, avoids
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Drea
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Quoted from 14442
I want my kefir!!!!!!


Have you considered making your own kefir at home? Passionprincess is doing this (although she is a B) with really good results.



Let go of resistance; feel appreciation for what is, and eagerness for what is coming.
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ruthiegirl
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 4:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Location: New York
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It's not a matter of making it at home  vs buying it in the store. If kefir is an avoid, it's an avoid. Similarly Drea, beef from a happy grass-fed cow would still be a toxin for you.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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Drea
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 7:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI Warrior ~ Taster, NN, ENFJ
Sun Beh Nim
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Sorry, I wasn't aware that kefir was an avoid.


Let go of resistance; feel appreciation for what is, and eagerness for what is coming.
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Goldie
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 8:40pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

All Gatherer -70 Scorp/Sag on BTD/GENO 17 year
Sam Dan
Posts: 5,832
Gender: Female
Location: East Coast
the heading here is really a contradiction.. for me dairy is a cheat and that is way more then I would prefere.. I love feeling good.. I love my strong bones. I love BTD from the beginning to end.. Geno is more forgiving, but not better..


Being here is invaluable, but not enough. We need ALL the Doctors. I needed them for a very small cancer spot-I could never feel!!! Please do your mammograms! Doing so saved me from cancer later on. I am grateful! Thanks for learning from my experience! I was lucky! I wish the same for YOU!
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jennyg
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 9:47pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Summer: Realization, expansion.
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Quoted from PCUK-Positive
i hate being beaten by things lol

Apart from particularly attractive, gentle women, of course


HAHAHAHAHA!!!  


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Sahara
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 9:56pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
Guest User
Quoted from jennyg
I have noticed if I eat dairy, ESPECIALLY ice cream or non compliant cheeses, I gain weight the next day, and takes a couple of days to a week to come back off depending on how much i eat. I also feel bloated and have trouble with constipation. It's hard for me to stay away sometimes, but every time I eat it I greatly regret it.  


Yes I've noticed this also.  Sniff, it's a hard food to break up with.  But break up we shall......  

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Possum
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 10:06pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh- Expluntherer... It means I'm an O...;-)
Ee Dan
Posts: 5,394
Gender: Female
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Age: 53
Second day of avoiding dairy - another lb down I even have had several brown rice (home made) crackers both nights...with homemade butter
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Munchkin76
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 10:12pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Swami: Hunter (66%) / RH- / ENFJ / Libra-Dragon
Ee Dan
Posts: 812
Gender: Male
Location: Colchester, UK
Age: 37
Another Hunter here.

Individuality is great isn't it!  I find I don't really gain weight at all from cheeses, but then I don't really want to eat them that much.  I've always been slim.  With my new Swami (post being re-tested as a secretor) I get a lot more cheeses than I did as a nonnie - I eat more than I did before and I've actually lost 14 pounds in the last 4 months acutally eating more food    I didn't really have it to lose in a way, but I'm really happy with where I am now in terms of energy, well being and congestion.

We are all individuals so I would say, if cheese doesn't serve you - don't serve it.... on biscuits, toast, salads, raclettes................  


Listen to all, plucking a feather from every passing goose, but follow no one absolutely. CHINESE PROVERB

Andy Pandy��


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David
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 10:49pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Hunter - INFp-INFj-eNFJ
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Henriette
re: Milk Fat is Fat is Fat.. It is a high energy source in a small exceptionally convenient package. [/quote]

That is a very much one size fits all approach  

Fat does not make all people fat- actually upping my fat intake ... makes me loose weight .

Yea! Fat is also good stuff! Essential fatty acids, Omega's, a great source of energy, slows digestion, burns slower, diminishes cravings and appetite.


Thoughts Are Things... Think The Good Ones... and remember... Moderate exercise is the best mood elevator!
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Sahara
Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 11:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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What do you guys think about whey protein?
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David
Wednesday, September 7, 2011, 3:58am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Hunter - INFp-INFj-eNFJ
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Location: Texas
Age: 62
I have seen the discussions about protein for O's. Over the years I have tried soy and whey protein powders for smoothies. I seemed to tolerate the whey better but it still did not feel energizing.... just filling. I did not notice if it was whey concentrates or whey isolates.

My girlfriend at the time liked protein fruit smoothies every morning. I did a lot better with eggs. I think she was a BT A with a big sweet tooth. She liked to put Knudsen's electrolyte drink in it with frozen banana, ground flax seed, flax oil, strawberries or blueberries, almond milk, liquid calcium/magnesium. It was delicious... and It was nerve wracking to me when my blood sugar would drop a few hours later.


Thoughts Are Things... Think The Good Ones... and remember... Moderate exercise is the best mood elevator!
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StarPine
Wednesday, September 7, 2011, 9:02pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Quoted from jennyg
I have noticed if I eat dairy, ESPECIALLY ice cream or non compliant cheeses, I gain weight the next day, and takes a couple of days to a week to come back off depending on how much i eat. I also feel bloated and have trouble with constipation. It's hard for me to stay away sometimes, but every time I eat it I greatly regret it.  


That's exactly what happens to me too.
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Sahara
Wednesday, September 7, 2011, 10:38pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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I may buy the whey isolate as Mark suggested but otherwise it's over other than the few dry cheeses on the Hunter list.  Yayyyyyyyy!
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jennyg
Thursday, September 8, 2011, 12:51am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from 14922


That's exactly what happens to me too.


and MAAAAN is it annoying! I ate cheese over the weekend after FINALLY dropping 4 of the 12 pounds I need to lose and BAM, hello 3 more pounds! well, no one to blame but myself, onward and upward, or should I say, DOWNWARD  


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Sahara
Thursday, September 8, 2011, 3:08am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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It finally occurred to me today that pasteurized dairy is in fact almost a junk food.  
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ABJoe
Thursday, September 8, 2011, 3:21am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

34% Nomad
Sun Beh Nim
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Age: 51
Quoted from 14442
It finally occurred to me today that pasteurized dairy is in fact almost a junk food.  

Almost????  Oh sorry, my cynicism is showing...  


RH-, ISTJ
Wonderful Wife = A+ Teacher; Darling Daughter = A- SWAMI Explorer
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marjorie
Thursday, September 8, 2011, 3:32am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Hunter/Aquarious/Counselor
Ee Dan
Posts: 1,628
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Location: Colorado
Age: 39
I have been dairy free for about 5 years, and I feel much better. Typically, everytime I try to introduce dairy back into my life I get: constipated, psoriasis acts up, moody. So, I believe it is not an option for me. However, to each its own
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ruthiegirl
Thursday, September 8, 2011, 5:33pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI O+ Gatherer, Healing from Fibromyalgia
Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from 14442
What do you guys think about whey protein?


It's an avoid for me on SWAMI. I don't buy it or use it. The O's in the family shouldn't be using it, and the B in the family doesn't need a processed protein source- he eats enough "real foods" including whole milk.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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Sahara
Thursday, September 8, 2011, 10:46pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Quoted from marjorie
I have been dairy free for about 5 years, and I feel much better. Typically, everytime I try to introduce dairy back into my life I get: constipated, psoriasis acts up, moody. So, I believe it is not an option for me. However, to each its own


How about the weight thingie?  Correlations?
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marjorie
Friday, September 9, 2011, 10:22pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Hunter/Aquarious/Counselor
Ee Dan
Posts: 1,628
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Age: 39
Quoted from 14442


How about the weight thingie?  Correlations?


Weight is low with NO DAIRY
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Sahara
Saturday, September 10, 2011, 8:53pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Quoted from marjorie


Weight is low with NO DAIRY


My weight is low it's my body fat bwha ha ha ha ha  
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StarPine
Sunday, September 11, 2011, 10:39pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Quoted from jennyg


and MAAAAN is it annoying! I ate cheese over the weekend after FINALLY dropping 4 of the 12 pounds I need to lose and BAM, hello 3 more pounds! well, no one to blame but myself, onward and upward, or should I say, DOWNWARD  


Yes it is WAY annoying! I agree
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Sahara
Sunday, September 18, 2011, 6:31pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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I admit, I will eat the melted cheese on the chili stew I order at one of the places I go.  And that's it!  Much happier almost a month off dairy again.  What a food.....
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EquiPro
Sunday, September 18, 2011, 8:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Gatherer!
Sam Dan
Posts: 2,238
Gender: Female
Dairy is a weird one for me.  First, it is one of my very favorite food groups and I ate a very high proportion of dairy throughout my entire life until originally trying the BTD and then going Vegan.  I love dairy and have almost no discernible reactions to it....eating it doesn't even impede me losing weight!

HOWEVER, I have come to realize that it is a trigger food for me and that I have to be very, very careful with it.  I truly think it is because most dairy is eaten with starch and THAT is the combo of which I have to be the most careful.  Think about it...we almost always eat:

-milk with cereal, cookies, sandwiches, cake.  While we occasionally want to just drink a glass of cold milk (I do, anyway), it is much easier to NOT eat milk if you keep it away from it's starch partner.  After all, who really thinks of drinking a glass of milk, or pouring milk on, let's say, saute'd zucchini?

-cheese with pasta, on bread (grilled cheese, pizza, etc.), mixed in with rice, served with beans, on crackers.  Cheese IS tougher because there are times when cheese is great all by itself, but, realistically, it's still more common and easier to eat it with starch than alone.  

-butter on pasta, bread, in cookies, on potatoes, on rice.  While I don't limit butter much, it's very interesting to be completely open to eating butter, yet limiting grains because it opens your eyes to how much butter is eaten on or with grains, but so much less so without them.  

I don't really like ice cream, so it's not an issue for me.  When I want it, I eat it.

HOWEVER, I truly DO love cheese, so what I do is I stay within the framework of the cheeses that are allowed on my SWAMI, but I don't particularly stay within the suggested portions.  This keeps me from getting into other cheeses.  So, I eat Feta nearly every day on my salad or scrambled with my eggs.  I eat cottage cheese as a way to stave off a starch craving, and, AMAZINGLY it almost always works.  If I feel like I just have to have some grains, if I eat 1/4 to 1/2 a cup of cottage cheese, it will usually nip the craving in the bud enough for me to pass on it.

I am very wary of milk. I love, love, love milk, but it always involved cereal, which is a big no-no for me, so I avoid milk at all costs.

So there you have it.  As far as I can tell, I'm non-reactive to almost all dairy - at least as I am able to tell, BUT, since I love dairy so much and it's so easy for me to overeat it, I try to limit it to my SWAMI-compliant ones and I eat those as I find that I need to in order to stay away from the non-compliant ones.


FRESH START TODAY!!!
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ruthiegirl
Sunday, September 18, 2011, 9:45pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI O+ Gatherer, Healing from Fibromyalgia
Kyosha Nim
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Butter is quite tasty on veggies, even without starch!


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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Possum
Monday, September 19, 2011, 12:50am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh- Expluntherer... It means I'm an O...;-)
Ee Dan
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I agree
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weroflu
Friday, September 30, 2011, 10:37am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

hunter
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Location: europe
Age: 48
I was off milk for over 20 years, and thought it was just not suitable for humans or for O's. Recently discovered that if I boil pasteurized milk it works really well. Live and learn. This was from ayurveda where they always recommend boiling milk, it has to do with pasteurization not being complete enough to break down the proteins. I was very skeptical about it, but it worked.


As for cheeses i do well on really well cooked, almost burnt cheeses like on pizza. Mozzarella i think is good for hunters.

Interesting for me that pizza is ok if i eat it really oily/greasy. Extra oil makes the bread part less toxic for me for some reason, or adding a high fat cheese.

ice cream was an addiction for me for a long time, but it caused diarrhea. but, strangely it was the only food that gave me sustainble energy, i could not exercise at all without it. one time in school i did something like 1000 situps after gorging on ice cream. the only thing i was able to figure out about this is that straight sugar was a better energy source than grains, and maybe the sodium also was good for me. maybe with improperly functioning liver the sugar/fat combo works as a direct fuel source for muscle like the mct in coconut oil.
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PCUK-Positive
Friday, September 30, 2011, 10:58am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Gatherer Rh+, NN, (lewis a+ b-) [Duffy Fy(a+b+) ]
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,874
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Location: UK
Age: 53
Quoted from weroflu
ice cream was an addiction for me for a long time, but it caused diarrhoea. but, strangely it was the only food that gave me sustainable energy, i could not exercise at all without it. one time in school i did something like 1000 situps after gorging on ice cream. the only thing i was able to figure out about this is that straight sugar was a better energy source than grains, and maybe the sodium also was good for me. maybe with improperly functioning liver the sugar/fat combo works as a direct fuel source for muscle like the mct in coconut oil.


You may find this information interesting.

1st -Why We Crave Our Food Allergens
Part of the addictive effect of our food allergens is because eating our allergens can cause the same effects in our body as taking drugs like morphine. Another way of looking at the addiction to food allergens is that it is more like an addiction to amphetamines. This stimulation provided to the body by consuming an allergen is like a shock to the system, but a stimulating shock. Some people may experience feeling very well the day before they come down with an illness or a return of their symptoms. This is the same effect as when we eat our allergens and feel well at first.
One of the best things that I can hear from a patient when I tell them that they need to give up a food allergen is that, “It is going to be so hard because I love bagels, or I love eggs, or I can’t do without my milk. These words tell me that the person has an addictive attachment to the food.


and 2nd http://drbass.com/addiction.html



Kind Regards PC. FIfHI Swami III Pro

Partner (F) is O+(Non) MN. Duffy Fy(a+b+),  Lewis (a+ b-) Gatherer.
DD ( is O+(Non)NN, Duffy Fy(a+b-) Lewis (a+b-) Gatherer
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Patty H
Friday, September 30, 2011, 12:24pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

HUNTER L(a+b-) NMg Prop Super Taster
Ee Dan
Posts: 2,122
Gender: Female
Location: Massachusetts
Age: 56
Sahara, why don't you consider going on the elimination diet and then adding the compliant dairy back in once you have done the elimination diet for a couple of weeks.  None of us here can tell you how the kefir will react with your body, due to your individuality.  I have a copy of the elimination diet I can get you if you PM me.

Kefir is a black dot for me, but I have not added it back.  I can only have one serving of dairy per week.  Uusally I try to save that up for when I go out to a friends' house.  I will bring manchego cheese and rice crackers so that I know for sure I will have an appetizer I can eat.  My husband and I are very social, so eating at other people's homes does become a challenge.


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Patty H
Friday, September 30, 2011, 12:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

HUNTER L(a+b-) NMg Prop Super Taster
Ee Dan
Posts: 2,122
Gender: Female
Location: Massachusetts
Age: 56
Quoted Text
Milk Fat is Fat is Fat.. It is a high energy source in a small exceptionally convenient package.

[/quote]

That is a very much one size fits all approach  

Fat does not make all people fat- actually upping my fat intake ( especially only using full fat dairy and plenty of butter ) makes me loose weight .
Full fat dairy is diamond and superfoods for me- while no and low fat neutral.
Avoiding sugar and most grains = less faton my body as well.

My o daughter is natural slim but I can see ehen she has been eating to much grains ( even spelt and rice) she gets fat on tummy- while if she eat a low grain high butter/oliveoil diet she stays slim.

[/quote]

Yes, but for a Hunter this would not be the case.  Most Hunters are only allowed a tiny bit of dairy once a week.  So I would agree with David on this - "Milk Fat is Fat is Fat" and if a Hunter cannot break down the milk fat, it stands to reason that it can make a Hunter gain weight.


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Patty H
Friday, September 30, 2011, 12:31pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

HUNTER L(a+b-) NMg Prop Super Taster
Ee Dan
Posts: 2,122
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Location: Massachusetts
Age: 56
Quoted from ruthiegirl
It's not a matter of making it at home  vs buying it in the store. If kefir is an avoid, it's an avoid. Similarly Drea, beef from a happy grass-fed cow would still be a toxin for you.


Kefir is a black dot for me, not an avoid.


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O in Virginia
Friday, September 30, 2011, 2:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Swami
Kyosha Nim
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So how does one actually tackle an addiction to an avoid, cold turkey?  Some other way?
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Patty H
Friday, September 30, 2011, 2:56pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

HUNTER L(a+b-) NMg Prop Super Taster
Ee Dan
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O in V, we are all different and I have seen many people who wean themselves off of avoids.  I, for one, went cold turkey.  I just works better for me.  Coffee was tough for me to give up, so I just went out and bought a large supply of green tea and drank that every morning.

Now I can have coffee infrequently and I am not tempted to go back to the habit daily.  In fact, our daughter finished college and has moved home.  She drinks coffee every morning and I am not tempted.


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Possum
Friday, September 30, 2011, 10:53pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh- Expluntherer... It means I'm an O...;-)
Ee Dan
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Interesting - I haven't had any dairy now for quite a few weeks, or any coffee for several weeks, but this morning I decided to test things by having a coffee with a small amount of cream... Enjoyed it, but within the hour I noticed I sniffed & (sorry if tmi) sure enough, slight bit of mucous had formed... Guess that was a once in a while treat?!
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O in Virginia
Friday, September 30, 2011, 11:10pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Swami
Kyosha Nim
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Patti H, coffee was easy for me to give up, much easier than I anticipated.  

Dairy also gives me the sniffles, Possum, but doesn't upset my digestion much, unless I overdo it.

I have lifelong addiction/love for sweets.     I have given up wheat, corn, dairy (pretty much), coffee, pork, grains in general, and all kinds of other things, and I don't miss them much.  But my sweet tooth has me by the throat.
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Possum
Saturday, October 1, 2011, 2:25am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh- Expluntherer... It means I'm an O...;-)
Ee Dan
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Quoted from O in Virginia
...my sweet tooth has me by the throat.
The visual (& trying to imagine the logistics of it) is too funny However, I well know the outworking may not be

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Patty H
Saturday, October 1, 2011, 2:50am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

HUNTER L(a+b-) NMg Prop Super Taster
Ee Dan
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Quoted from O in Virginia
Patti H, coffee was easy for me to give up, much easier than I anticipated.  

Dairy also gives me the sniffles, Possum, but doesn't upset my digestion much, unless I overdo it.

I have lifelong addiction/love for sweets.     I have given up wheat, corn, dairy (pretty much), coffee, pork, grains in general, and all kinds of other things, and I don't miss them much.  But my sweet tooth has me by the throat.


O in V, you are preaching to the choir here!  I used to be a pastry chef   Giving up sugar, for me, took much longer, but I started many years ago, well before the BTD/GTD.  I learned to bake because I LOVE sugar and sweets    Once I got my sugar addiction under control, I limited my sugar intake to special occassions or special cheats.  I am sort of a sugar snob - unless someone can make something better than I can, I will not eat it.  I also am ok with just passing it up all together, which is what I do now.  If I am at a wedding or a birthday party, I will partake of the cake so as not to be rude and to make it a special treat, but even if we go out to dinner now and everyone else gets dessert, I will pass.  It's not always easy, but I do understand that sugar can be a very slippery slope  


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ambermac
Wednesday, September 5, 2012, 4:43am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I'm an O- hunter, i'm trying to loose a little weight but i have a jar of goats cheese in the fridge ... because I'm trying to cut down the amount I eat i put a little bit on the salad I have with my fish for dinner... bad idea? or do you think i could get away with it?  
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ambermac
Wednesday, September 5, 2012, 4:44am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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besides maybe butter and I'm going to try and introduce ghee (superfood) its probably going to be the only dairy i have (feta is neutral for me)
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Lola
Wednesday, September 5, 2012, 6:22am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted Text
bad idea? or do you think i could get away with it?


let swami do the guess work for you!


http://www.4yourtype.com/swamixp_video.asp
http://www.dadamo.com/media/swami.htm
http://www.dadamo.com/media/gtd.htm
find out how food rates for you individually, given your personal variables.


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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CJ likes Surf n Turf
Monday, November 26, 2012, 1:29am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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When I was trying it loose fat I found that having dairy made it nearly impssible to make visible progress. Milk shakes, yogurts, cheeses and cream would holt progress for a week or more. When I used to have milk shakes and cereal with dairy I would lob on pounds over a few weeks. Now I strictly follow BTD and don't eat any bread, grain, flour, beans, corn and dairy as well as a personal choice of no processed food and no sugar, honey, agave etc and my fat runs away by it self without strenuous exersice.

From experience I can vouch for complying with BTD on this matter; remove completely for the best health of your life.

When I removed all avoids completely as we'll as all substitutes (soy milk etc) after about a month I started feeling like never before and I'll never go back.
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aussielady582
Monday, November 26, 2012, 3:51am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Be kind to everyone; be persistent with health!
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well done, CJ - good to hear your progress!
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AnnaSKB
Monday, November 26, 2012, 6:53am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Location: San Antonio, Texas
Age: 56
My husband's an O+ Hunter, and he went from a 38" to 34" pants..We are OFF gluten, changed from wheat to bread made with rice flour.  When he cheats and has wheat or anything made with it he gains a pound or two for 3 days, then loses it again, then  a few days later cheats again and the same happens...when he doesn't eat wheat or wheat products he either maintains or loses a lb or some ounces.
Follow the SWAMI superfoods, your best bet...
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marjorie
Monday, November 26, 2012, 4:11pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Hunter/Aquarious/Counselor
Ee Dan
Posts: 1,628
Gender: Female
Location: Colorado
Age: 39
Quoted from 24474
When I was trying it loose fat I found that having dairy made it nearly impssible to make visible progress. Milk shakes, yogurts, cheeses and cream would holt progress for a week or more. When I used to have milk shakes and cereal with dairy I would lob on pounds over a few weeks. Now I strictly follow BTD and don't eat any bread, grain, flour, beans, corn and dairy as well as a personal choice of no processed food and no sugar, honey, agave etc and my fat runs away by it self without strenuous exersice.

From experience I can vouch for complying with BTD on this matter; remove completely for the best health of your life.

When I removed all avoids completely as we'll as all substitutes (soy milk etc) after about a month I started feeling like never before and I'll never go back.


do you eat alot of meat?
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chrissyA
Tuesday, November 27, 2012, 2:51pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT3 Teacher 49%, super-taster,
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Good job CJ!!! Welcome


SWAMI
“Let thy food be thy medicine and thy medicine be thy food.” --Hippocrates (460-377 B.C.)
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Marc121
Wednesday, November 28, 2012, 2:26am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I`m not sure but the only dairy that I craved for is Cheez whiz(real canadian cheddar).
I always feel good after consuming it.
But since I think I don`t consume enough vitamin D and calcium, I think that is the cause of my craving .
Has anyone of you experienced it?


What has surprised me? What has touched me? What has inspired me?  
              
We are closer than we think   , keep pushing                                     

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ABJoe
Wednesday, November 28, 2012, 2:46am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

34% Nomad
Sun Beh Nim
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Quoted from Marc121
I`m not sure but the only dairy that I craved for is Cheez whiz(real canadian cheddar).
I always feel good after consuming it.

Does Cheez whiz even count as "dairy"?  

If it is calcium you are after, there many vegetables that contain quantities of it and are much better for you...  Just saying!  


RH-, ISTJ
Wonderful Wife = A+ Teacher; Darling Daughter = A- SWAMI Explorer
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marjorie
Wednesday, November 28, 2012, 3:16am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Hunter/Aquarious/Counselor
Ee Dan
Posts: 1,628
Gender: Female
Location: Colorado
Age: 39
Quoted from Marc121
I`m not sure but the only dairy that I craved for is Cheez whiz(real canadian cheddar).
I always feel good after consuming it.
But since I think I don`t consume enough vitamin D and calcium, I think that is the cause of my craving .
Has anyone of you experienced it?



Nope, I do crave frozen yogurt now and then, but cant recall the last time I had any.

Cheez whiz... omg, have not heard that term in forever! Eat some broccoli or maybe drink some almond milk to ease the craving.
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aussielady582
Wednesday, November 28, 2012, 3:54am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Be kind to everyone; be persistent with health!
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Location: Sydney, N.S.W., Australia
Age: 52
calcium - broccoli, bok choi, leafy greens, raw spinach, sesame seed, tahini, almond (other nuts); sea vegetables.   Plus some say to NOT over-eat the meat/fish/poultry as too much protein can deplete the calcium from bones/teeth in order to keep the blood alkaline at 7.4ph; 80% alkaline foods daily (fruit, vegetables mostly plus quinoa/amaranth, millet, almonds) and about 20% acid foods (animal protein, most seeds, nuts, grains, legumes) - eat slowly and chew food well.  some say eat more raw fruit/vege; depends on season and a person's constitutional type as to how much raw veg one eats, to get all nutrients intact.  stir-fried veg good too; tasty!
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aussielady582
Wednesday, November 28, 2012, 4:11am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Be kind to everyone; be persistent with health!
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I am type O', "hunter", I do best with ghee, butter only occasionally.  Goat's cheese I like (in warmer weather and it causes no problems - but only small amounts at lunch time.  A little parmesan cheese in an omelette I like).  An Ayurvedic doctor (traditiional Indian medicine) said no dairy after 1 or 2pm as it leads to ama (which is toxicity in system) as is hard to digest later in day when our digestive fire (agni) is reduced!  So a little at breaky or lunch for me, goats cheese in salad. Greens and herbs will help to digest cheese, also spices do this too. I do not have weight problems so guess I am lucky, I am underweight and would like to to build muscle.  I just like a little cheese sometimes, not every day.  Most dairy causes sinus congestion for me, and slows down digestion/elimimation.  I read that for some people, dairy is not good for the colon, it coats the lining, and also in the lungs (in Chinese medicine, colon and lungs are related).  This may happen more for gatherer, or type A or AB.  Cows milk produced & designed by cows for their own babies (calves).....  Humans are only species drinking milk from another species, and even after we are weaned!  it has something which can be addictive and hard to give up.  To any people making their own ghee, what temp is best in oven and how long to leave in oven??; I may do a search; I also like home-made ghee; smell and taste nice; I missed ghee when I didn't have it.  lubricates insides and fat needed to digest some vitamins.
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Marc121
Thursday, November 29, 2012, 6:21am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from ABJoe

Does Cheez whiz even count as "dairy"?  

If it is calcium you are after, there many vegetables that contain quantities of it and are much better for you...  Just saying!  


Is it not? But why? Its cheese right. Why did you ask its not a dairy?  

Just curious.


What has surprised me? What has touched me? What has inspired me?  
              
We are closer than we think   , keep pushing                                     

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Drea
Thursday, November 29, 2012, 2:33pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sun Beh Nim
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In this country, Cheez Whiz is a highly processed "food", which is why many folks don't consider it actual dairy...

Cheez Whiz


Let go of resistance; feel appreciation for what is, and eagerness for what is coming.
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Lola
Thursday, November 29, 2012, 3:57pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT1; L (a-b-); (se); PROP-T; NN
Sa Bon Nim
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marc, simply read ingredients on your CW jar



''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Marc121
Saturday, December 1, 2012, 5:41am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ooh, sorry for that.

I looked at the ingredient and it contained modified milk.
And other processed stuff. Thank you .

Well go to control my craving and substitute things for that.  


What has surprised me? What has touched me? What has inspired me?  
              
We are closer than we think   , keep pushing                                     

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BHealthy
Monday, December 3, 2012, 1:36am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

43% GT1 Hunter
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Age: 57
Before I started SWAMI I practically lived on raw sheep's milk coffee, raw goat manchego, tomatoes, homemade trail mix (almonds, walnuts, pistachios, pumpkin seeds, macadamia nuts, goji berries, raisins, mangoes, apricots, and coconut -- all raw and seasoned with salt and chili), grass fed beef, organic pork, and gallons of raw cream sauces.  I ate a LOT of dairy!

My migraines were down to 3 per month and I maintained my weight.  The only 'issue' I had was a persistent cough.

Now that I have eliminated the avoids: milk, coffee, pistachios, raisins, apricots, coconut and pork) my migraines have returned, I still have that cough, and my weight is stable even though I still eat the raw goat manchego in much greater quantities than my SWAMI recommends.  

Ergo, dairy does not cause me to gain weight.  

Rice, quinoa, and dried beans are another story.  I eat them very very rarely even though they are 'allowed'.


"Excellence is the result of caring more than others think is wise, risking more than others think is safe, dreaming more than others think is practical, and expecting more than others think is possible."
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BHealthy
Monday, December 3, 2012, 1:56am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

43% GT1 Hunter
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I've just read Dr. D's writing on cholesterol http://www.dadamo.com/btdisease/PathType-read.pl?show=29 in which he states:      
Quoted Text
+ Samburu people, for instance, eat about a pound of meat and drink almost two gallons of raw milk each day during most of the year. Milk from the African Zebu cattle is much fattier than cow's milk, which means that the Samburus consume more than twice the amount of animal fat than the average American, and yet their cholesterol is much lower, about 170 mg/dl .

+ Shepherds in Somalia eat almost nothing but milk from their camels. About a gallon and a half a day is normal, which amounts to almost one pound of butter fat, because camel's milk is much fattier than cow's milk. But although more than sixty percent of their energy consumption comes from animal fat, their mean cholesterol is only about 150 mg/dl, far lower than in most Western people.

+ According to the view of the Masai people in Kenya, vegetables and fibers are food for cows. They themselves drink half a gallon of Zebu milk each day, and their parties are sheer orgies of meat. On such occasions several pounds of meat per person is not unusual. In spite of that, the cholesterol of the Masai tribesmen is among the lowest ever measured in the world, about fifty percent of the value of the average American .

What is perhaps worth noting here is the fact that virtually all of these tribes are characterized by high percentages of O type blood as compared with A or B. (Moruant) And most of these societies have had a long tradition of hunter gathering versus agrarian existence. This can be demonstrated by looking at the distribution of blood type in Africa along the lines of latitude (north/south).

Granted, the article is on cholesterol and the fact that a high fat diet does not cause high cholesterol in type Os but...given that RAW dairy does not seem to be a problem for these ancient hunters, why is it an avoid for us 'O' hunters?


"Excellence is the result of caring more than others think is wise, risking more than others think is safe, dreaming more than others think is practical, and expecting more than others think is possible."
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ruthiegirl
Monday, December 3, 2012, 6:54pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI O+ Gatherer, Healing from Fibromyalgia
Kyosha Nim
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Dr D has not evaluated raw dairy separate from pasteurized dairy products. Nor has he evaluated camel or zebu milk.

Most people consider the raw items to have the same value as the pasteurized counterparts that are listed. You may wish to consider raw dairy to be "untested and therefore neutral....with caution" if you want to consume it.

For untested foods, eat a small amount and see how your body responds. If you do well, you can increase the amounts. It's suggested that you completely "eat clean" and not include any "questionable" foods for a few weeks or months first, so you can better tell if there are any subtle reactions.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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