''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98 DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
Lola and Tom are wrapping two important ideas together. The Paleo diet, as far as I know it, seems to be reasonably close to O Non-secretor diet of the Blood type diet, and very similar to the Hunter Genotype diet. The underlying difference, between the Paleo diet and either the Blood type or Genotype levels of Dr. D' Adamo’s diet system, is the fundamental approach.
The O Non-secretor diet is specifically recommended for approximately 7% of the general American population. The Hunter Genotype diet is the recommendation for approximately 15% of the general population. So comparing the Paleo to either Blood type or Genotype will give different differences, depending on the person's genetics.
You are looking for one difference; but we can't give you just one. The Paleo diet has just one option, but the Blood type has 4 (really 8, and Genotype has 6. If I am wrong about the Paleo diet, I would definitely like to know more about it.
My weight loss goal: 220 lbs.  A 6'4" dyslexic oddball: the size of a line-backer, the silhouette of Winnie-the-Pooh.
The Paleo diet has just one option, but the Blood type has 4 (really 8, and Genotype has 6. If I am wrong about the Paleo diet, I would definitely like to know more about it.
Aside from the 'one size fits all' perspective there are even more serious problems with this approach. If you go back to the Stone Age say what you see is chaos. Numerous small tribes, speaking different languages, migrating across different terrains, climates and food sources. Putting all this random experience, virtually all unrecorded, into a tidy package is, to put it mildly, ridiculous. The BTD/Genotype diets relate to factors that can be measured and evaluated now.
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Following a Paleo Diet will work really well for type Os. It would probably be a disaster for an AB.
Following the Paleo Diet probably still won't be as healthy as following the appropriate BTD or GTD for your body, as the Paleo Diet includes every single fruit, nut, meat, egg, all varieties of meats, poultry, and fish, and every single vegetable that can be eaten raw. BTD/GTD excludes some foods from each of those categories. This means that even an O non-secretor with a Hunter genotype would still be healthier following one of Dr. D's plans than the Paleo Diet.
That said, the Paleo Diet is still a heck of a lot healthier than the SAD (standard american diet), especially for type Os. I did rather well on it for a while (before discovering Dr. D.)
Ruth, Single Mother to 18yo  O- Leah, 17yo O- Hannah,and  11yo B+ Jack
I attempted the Paleo Diet. I felt awful. I was then advise to follow the Protein Power Plan. 40g of Carbs 70+ g of protein... I struggled to follow the diet plan and when I did, I felt sluggish. So for me it didn't work...
A married to an O, with toddlers A daughter and O Son.
I tried it too about 3 years ago, my health was already failing, but didn't know about BTD yet.
I was instinctively dropping some veggies (cucumber, cauliflower), nuts (brazil, pistachio) and fruit (orange and tangerine) which my body couldn't cope with, but I needed BTD info for some others to be left behind (catfish, poppy seeds, sunflower seeds for example) I wasn't eating pork already, so that was not an issue.
As a type O it was kind of working for me, but I way prefer BTD, more precise, scientific and individualised.
Paul, you mentioned that the "O Non-secretor diet is specifically recommended for approximately 7% of the general American population". Can you elaborate on this?
I thought the BTD was applicable to the broad population within a specific blood type and secretor status? What makes it only applicable to 7% and what's different between the 7% of type Os and the other 93%?
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Quoted Text
"O Non-secretor diet is specifically recommended for approximately 7% of the general American population".
meaning NON secretors are unique and few in general
''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98 DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
O,A,B,AB account for 40%, 30%, 20%, 10% of the general North American population (rounded to the nearest 10%) Secretors are 80% to 85% of the population. So an O non-secretor is .4 * .15 = 6%. I generously gave an extra percent as to reflect that 15 percent for non-secretors may be too low.
This is just "back of the envelope" math.
Non-secretors are generally difficult to diagnose and are disproportionately represented on this board. We have a "Clubhouse" area of the board, so that secretors will not be overly troubled about our little complaint sessions. In a medical trial, the main results typically represent secretor reactions to the treatment, whereas the outliers are usually non-secretor reactions. "Well, there are no serious side effects for over 80% of the population so it is a success!" It depends on who you are.
I am sure that the possibility that non-secretors have a paranoid or hypochondriac gene has also been mentioned.
My weight loss goal: 220 lbs.  A 6'4" dyslexic oddball: the size of a line-backer, the silhouette of Winnie-the-Pooh.
O,A,B,AB account for 40%, 30%, 20%, 10% of the general North American population (rounded to the nearest 10%) Secretors are 80% to 85% of the population. So an O non-secretor is .4 * .15 = 6%. I generously gave an extra percent as to reflect that 15 percent for non-secretors may be too low.
Cool, that makes sense - thanks for the clarification Mark
Following a Paleo Diet will work really well for type Os. It would probably be a disaster for an AB.
Following the Paleo Diet probably still won't be as healthy as following the appropriate BTD or GTD for your body, as the Paleo Diet includes every single fruit, nut, meat, egg, all varieties of meats, poultry, and fish, and every single vegetable that can be eaten raw. BTD/GTD excludes some foods from each of those categories. This means that even an O non-secretor with a Hunter genotype would still be healthier following one of Dr. D's plans than the Paleo Diet.
That said, the Paleo Diet is still a heck of a lot healthier than the SAD (standard american diet), especially for type Os. I did rather well on it for a while (before discovering Dr. D.)
Humm... the Paleo diet I have found does not highly recommend nuts and says you should limit fruits and does not advocate at all RAW FOOD DIETS.
Several great articles can be found on the site here in regards to why this Paleo advocate does not recommend these food items in large quanities or suggests avoiding them altogether if ones gut is currently comprised: http://paleodietlifestyle.com/
Humm... the Paleo diet I have found does not highly recommend nuts and says you should limit fruits and does not advocate at all RAW FOOD DIETS.
I think the point of Ruthie's comment was that the Paleo diet makes no differentiation for blood type lectins in the food classes much more than there was a focus on any specific food type or raw vs. cooked...
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The Paleo Diet criteria I used to follow was "eat any vegetable that CAN be eaten raw, even if you decide to eat it cooked." So, carrots were OK, sweet potatoes were not. Green beans were OK, black beans were not. And since nuts could be eaten raw, they were fine to include, even if you ate them roasted. The idea was that Paleolithic people didn't have ready access to cooking fires, and all their foods needed to be edible raw. But they didn't shy away from cooking foods when they did have a campfire available, so there's no need for us to worry about food preparation.
I'm not saying there's any valid data to support the claim that Paleolithic people ate that way. But that was the criteria we used to determine which foods to eat. It was a subforum of a more generalized low-carb website, and the members kind of decided upon the "rules" ourselves, gleaned from whatever books or websites we'd each read.
All in all, I don't think it was a bad dietary choice for me at the time. I started out with Protein Power and then refined things from there, taking on the "Mostly Paleo" label when I cut out legumes, dairy, and limited grains to about twice a week. I was 100% gluten free but still included corn. I was going to cut out corn next when I decided to give BTD a try instead. Thanks to BTD, and now SWAMI, I've been able to add things to my diet instead of cutting more and more away.
Ruth, Single Mother to 18yo  O- Leah, 17yo O- Hannah,and  11yo B+ Jack
Paleo/primal has some interesting ideas and is close to the Hunter diet. I go back and forth on things like beans, grains etc- foods that are on the Hunter diet but eliminated on Paleo. Eh, in terms of frequency no I really can't have beans every day, they aren't a main food for me like fish and vegetables, so I don't tend to disagree with them much. The real problem is all the non Hunters on the diet......
I attempted the Paleo Diet. I felt awful. I was then advise to follow the Protein Power Plan. 40g of Carbs 70+ g of protein... I struggled to follow the diet plan and when I did, I felt sluggish. So for me it didn't work...
Just to play devils advocate here... Has anyone looked into the Perfect Health Diet by Paul and Shou-Ching Jaminet? They have a newer and IMO more scientifically valid approach to the idea of ancestral health/paleo. Their book is very well thought out and researched and they have a very helpful blog to support it. As a Type A secretor, I've been surprised and confused at how much easier it has been on my digestion to eat a along their guidelines - High fat - 65%, moderate carb - 20-30%, and low ish protein - 15%.
I love the concept of the BTD, but have found that my gut has a very hard time with a high vegetable, legume and soy diet.
The answer that paleo diets don't hold up to BTD because they aren't individualized is operating from the point of view that the btd is 100% accurate in ots approach and this doesn't answer the underlying question of whether the need for individualization is a necessary fact or still a theory. For those of us who struggle to feel well, everything is just a theory. There are many very well educated and researched Practioners in the the nutrition world and it would probably do many of us good if they would get together and compare ideas and discoveries from time.
Just to play devils advocate here... Has anyone looked into the Perfect Health Diet by Paul and Shou-Ching Jaminet? They have a newer and IMO more scientifically valid approach to the idea of ancestral health/paleo. Their book is very well thought out and researched and they have a very helpful blog to support it. As a Type A secretor, I've been surprised and confused at how much easier it has been on my digestion to eat a along their guidelines - High fat - 65%, moderate carb - 20-30%, and low ish protein - 15%.
I love the concept of the BTD, but have found that my gut has a very hard time with a high vegetable, legume and soy diet.
The answer that paleo diets don't hold up to BTD because they aren't individualized is operating from the point of view that the btd is 100% accurate in ots approach and this doesn't answer the underlying question of whether the need for individualization is a necessary fact or still a theory. For those of us who struggle to feel well, everything is just a theory. There are many very well educated and researched Practioners in the the nutrition world and it would probably do many of us good if they would get together and compare ideas and discoveries from time.
You've fouled your argument immediately by proving Dr. D'Adamo to be correct. We are all different, yes. The BTD addresses four degrees of differences, LR4YT 8 degrees, GenoType 6, and further work with person selectors you get thousands of combinations of degrees of differences.
See, he has accounted for why some Type A don't respond to a regular Type A diet, nor a heavy red meat paleo diet, etc.
The importance of eating based on Ancestral dietary habits is eclipsed by epigenetics. We are talking about eclipsed like the difference between trying to sooth child birth by comfortable pillow and an epidermal.
It depends on whether the 65% fat is in terms of calories or grams. Of course, a Paleo man didn't need to live as long as we'd like to live today.
If I need to lose weight or eliminate cravings, Paleo is better for me than BTD or SWAMI. But I follow Paleo mostly within the context of SWAMI. Anyway, since the main dietary avoids are common in all my diets (wheat, corn, soy, dairy) I consider them to be the same but with different portions for certain foods (rice, black beans, etc.)
My SWAMI diet is a blend of BTD and GTD Explorer, but I'm not totally compliant.  Also I try to choose foods that have a Low Glycemic index.  DW and DD are A+, probably also Explorer.
you can take your swami food lists and eat paleo style with them....
That's right. You can take your Swami food list and tweak it in whichever direction your specific needs direct you - gluten-free, sugar-free, food combining, paleo, etc.
Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are. Let me not pass you by in quest of some rare and perfect tomorrow. ~Mary Jean Irion
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