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why do Rh-negatives exist?   This thread currently has 2,890 views. Print Print Thread
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jayneeo
Monday, September 28, 2009, 4:02pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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This question-why do rh negatives exist is interesting....I'm not saying you wanna google it, but.....if you do, be prepared for some wild stuff! (reptilian ancestors...hey, wait, doesn't everyone have reptilian ancestors?....ET's and more)
....(of course I am one)
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shoulderblade
Monday, September 28, 2009, 6:11pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I believe that I have read that originally all humans were RH- and that RH+ was a mutation that caught on very well.

The same might be the case for non-secretors and secretors with a new form replacing an old one to some extent. Likely both forms have some advantages so that some sort of equilibrium will be reached.

Refer to another thread on secretors/non secretors on this.





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jayneeo
Monday, September 28, 2009, 6:18pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I'm not so sure about that.....still open to data...
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shoulderblade
Monday, September 28, 2009, 8:12pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I'm not so sure either really. My thought was that the most uncomplicated system would be the basic issue and the more complex the mutation.

Turns out it gets really complicated, I did a brief search via Google and came across this.(at bottom) Seems the origin and working nature of the gene are somewhat in the research stage. However if there is leakage between the mothers placenta and her bloodstream (given RH incompatability) there can be serious immune reactions. In the days before modern medicine this would have been a significant problem.




1 Wiener's hypothesis: Wiener postulated a number of (at least eight) multiple alleles at a single locus. According to him, gene R contains eight alleles such as r, Ro, R', RĒ, R1, R2, Rx or Re, and Ry.


2. Fisher's hypothesis: Fisher rejected the Wiener's concept of multiple allelism for R gene, instead of it, he proposed that a series of at least three pairs of pseudoalleles remain so closely linked with each other that they are usually inherited as a block. According to him, gene R is composed of three pairs of pseudoalleles or separate gene such as Cc, Dd and Ee. Recent genetical investigations have confirmed the Fisher's concept of pseudoallelism.












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Mayflowers
Monday, September 28, 2009, 11:46pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Hi Bruce. Where ya been hiding?  
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teri
Tuesday, September 29, 2009, 3:55am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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This is interesting, talks about rh negative in relation to Basques, and suggests the possibility of two different species of humans, that neanderthals and homo sapiens quite possibly have evolved separately and not along the same "Darwin" line. At least, that's my interpretation...

http://www.aoi.com.au/bcw/neanderbasque.htm


I'm onto you, 'euphoria'
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teri
Tuesday, September 29, 2009, 6:06am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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With all this reading about rh negative tonight I wonder what the effects might be (other than with pregnancies) of having a build-up of antibodies. I've had two miscarriages and never been given any anti-D. I have no doubt now that I'd continue to have miscarriages without it (except that I've long stopped trying). This must mean that I'm carrying the antibodies. Does anyone know what health implications there could be, if any? Or might the BTD be working to clear my blood of these antibodies?


I'm onto you, 'euphoria'

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teri  -  Tuesday, September 29, 2009, 7:23am
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jayneeo
Tuesday, September 29, 2009, 5:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh- Gatherer
Kyosha Nim
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interesting, teri, I doubt that the antibodies could cause you any trouble but may be implicated in your miscarriages...sorry you had to experience that.

Thanks for the interesting link!
(proud to be one of them!)

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jayneeo  -  Tuesday, September 29, 2009, 5:21pm
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shoulderblade
Wednesday, September 30, 2009, 10:13pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Hi Diana. Out of hiding

Quoted from teri
This must mean that I'm carrying the antibodies. Does anyone know what health implications there could be, if any? Or might the BTD be working to clear my blood of these antibodies?


I don't think that it is very likely that you have any antibodies in your system. As I understand it the original problem is when a Rh- mother has a pregnancy with a Rh+ father any mixing of blood will lead to an immune reaction. Normally the mother gets a shot (a vaccination) against the childs Rh+. But if there are no Rh+ cells in the mothers system there is no point in producing antibodies. What you may have is a memory/storage spot in your immune system that would respond quickly if the body were exposed to the Rh= stimulus again.





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shells
Thursday, October 1, 2009, 11:39am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from teri
This is interesting, talks about rh negative in relation to Basques, and suggests the possibility of two different species of humans, that neanderthals and homo sapiens quite possibly have evolved separately and not along the same "Darwin" line. At least, that's my interpretation...

http://www.aoi.com.au/bcw/neanderbasque.htm


Thank you teri,

That was such a fascinating read!  All the O negs in my family and my O neg children all have the straight nose, definite chin, low body temp, low blood pressure and most of the females have the large eyes  

The Neanderthals  

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jayneeo
Thursday, October 1, 2009, 4:12pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Neanderthals, Unite!
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RedLilac
Friday, October 2, 2009, 3:18pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from shells


Thank you teri,

That was such a fascinating read!  All the O negs in my family and my O neg children all have the straight nose, definite chin, low body temp, low blood pressure and most of the females have the large eyes  

The Neanderthals  



Iíve got low blood pressure & low body temperature, so is this a trait of RH-?  My genes may be old (RH- & non-seq), but my mind is young.  



I am B- NON-Sec Explorer; my son is B+ SEC Nomad; my Mother was O+; and my Father was AB-
SWAMI Thanksgiving present 2008
Revised from Arlene B- NonSec to RedLilac on 3/31/06
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shoulderblade
Friday, October 2, 2009, 4:52pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Here is an interesting idea from the Wikipedia entry.

Quoted Text
Differences in the prevalence of Toxoplasma infection between geographical regions (0-95%) could also explain the striking variation in the frequency of RhD-negative alleles between populations. It is possible that the better psychomotor performance of RhD-negative subjects in the Toxoplasma-free population could be the reason for spreading of the ďd alleleĒ (deletion) in the European population. In contrast to the situation in Africa and certain (but not all) regions of Asia, the abundance of wild cats (definitive hosts of Toxoplasma gondii) in the European territory was very low before the advent of domestic cat.


I interpet this to mean that that good psychomotor skills allowed RH- to establish itself in Europe, in the absence of large cats, but elsewhere they were eaten up.





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Rylie
Friday, October 2, 2009, 7:52pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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I am B- and I am having fertility issues. I had my husband's blood tested and he is O+ so I will have to take the shots during pregnancy it sounds like. I have heard that the shot has been linked to autism but it definately seems like the benefits outway the risks. Has anyone else with negative blood had fertility issues? I have tried for over 2 years to cure this naturally but I am going to do my first round of fertility treatments this month. Hopefully it works!

R
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Mohairandsilk
Friday, October 2, 2009, 8:20pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Hi,

I am O+
I used to have low blood pressure and low temperature.
I think the problem comes from bad metabolism of sugar and carbs. I am new to the diet, and sure the BTD will improve at least the blood pressure.
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Lola
Friday, October 2, 2009, 8:51pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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bt compatibility
http://www.dadamo.com/B2blogs/.....ompatibility?blog=27

Eat Right for Your Baby is a marvelous book which covers just about everything: Pre pregnancy, getting pregnant, pregnancy, breastfeeding......
http://www.dadamo.com/science_abo-bloodgroups-lewis.htm
scroll down to
Fetal Loss and Infertility

http://www.dadamo.com/knowbase/physiology/physiology7.htm
there s lots more if you use the main search button
http://www.dadamo.com/


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!

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Lola  -  Friday, October 2, 2009, 9:26pm
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jayneeo
Friday, October 2, 2009, 9:41pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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the first article, on bt compatability does not address the Rh factor, which is of critical importance. Your doctor will advise you on the rhogam shot. I had it after my first child, to protect my second pregnancy.
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Lola
Friday, October 2, 2009, 10:31pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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getting pregnant is first!
the rest you can worry about later.....


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
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Katsy
Saturday, October 3, 2009, 12:32am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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And it is also possible for some of your children to be Rh-negative. Since Rh- is a recessive trait, it's possible for your husband to be Rh+ (a dominant trait, much like brown hair/eyes) but still be able to produce Rh- offspring (a recessive trait, like blond hair or blue eyes) And like my ability to produce Type O offspring -- although I am Type A, I have a recessive O (which I think was passed on to my from my dad), which was passed on to one son, but not the other. So, you might want to do a blood test after the baby is born, to determine Rh status, just to be sure (because if you or baby don't need Rhogam, then why subject yourself to it?).


A married to an O with two children, A & O

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against ...spiritual wickedness in high places. Eph 6:12
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Heidi
Saturday, October 3, 2009, 5:25am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Katsy
So, you might want to do a blood test after the baby is born, to determine Rh status, just to be sure (because if you or baby don't need Rhogam, then why subject yourself to it?).


That's what was done in my case. The babies were typed and then I got the shot. I didn't have any injections during the pregnancy at all.




Rh-, ISFP, Super Taster, Non-Secretor 52% SWAMI-XP'd Explorer.

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Henriette Bsec
Saturday, October 3, 2009, 9:38am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Mohairandsilk
Hi,

I am O+
I used to have low blood pressure and low temperature.
I think the problem comes from bad metabolism of sugar and carbs. I am new to the diet, and sure the BTD will improve at least the blood pressure.


Intersting

I am B-
and my bloddpressure and temperature is fairly low
( I am fairly sensitive to too many grains and sugars)

However my mum is O- and have high blodpressure   so ??


ENFP -naturalist, visual/spatial and musical/verbal/chatty Dane- Mother to DD Emma age 19,
0 rh- secr ( Hunter or Explorer )
Diamonds, superfoods, Neutral,*black dots, avoids
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shoulderblade
Friday, October 9, 2009, 7:35pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Back to the original question posed by this thread I would have have to conclude that RH-'s are people that have been bypassed by the general sweep of evolution. According to the Wikipedia page on this subject RH- is pretty well non-existent in Africa and Asia but includes16% of Europeans with an even higher rate among the Basques.

I would have to assume that RH+ is some sort of immune improvement as it is totally dominant in areas where diseases are most likely to be generated. (to be exact - tropical areas) No one ever heard of a disease starting off in Alaska or Canada or the Nordic countries or Siberia and working south - it is always the other way around.

Possibly the Basques entered Europe earlier than other humans and their isolation allowed them to maintain a high RH- population. But anyhow the fact that the original humans carried such a high level of RH- would imply that the mutation must be a fairly recent one.





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teri
Saturday, October 10, 2009, 3:18pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from shoulderblade
I don't think that it is very likely that you have any antibodies in your system. As I understand it the original problem is when a Rh- mother has a pregnancy with a Rh+ father any mixing of blood will lead to an immune reaction. Normally the mother gets a shot (a vaccination) against the childs Rh+. But if there are no Rh+ cells in the mothers system there is no point in producing antibodies. What you may have is a memory/storage spot in your immune system that would respond quickly if the body were exposed to the Rh= stimulus again.

Isn't that the same thing as an antibody? Any "memory/storage spot" would have to be in the form of something physical.


I'm onto you, 'euphoria'

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teri  -  Saturday, October 10, 2009, 3:32pm
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CharlieSays
Sunday, October 11, 2009, 1:08pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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All my family are types of rh negative (mostly Os) and all have low blood pressure and cold body temperature. My diet has not affected this and it has never been a problem (it is not dangerously low, just always measured a little under 'normal'). I am and always have been perfectly healthy (like my family), so I don't see it as a bad thing. I wouldn't necessarily agree with the adaption to climate theory as I am very much at home in any climate (even extreme temperatures) and never caught any illness or disease during the time I spent in Africa or Asia.

There are many crazy ideas on the internet surrounding rh negative simply because science hasn't got a better answer (yet). I haven't noticed any scales myself! My father's family are all old Jewish and my mother's from Southern France/Spain (possibly Basque, although I don't know how that is defined), so my generation all got a double dose of rh-neg!

In regards to the Rhogam shot, one of my great-aunts had this following four miscarriages. Her husband is A rh-positive and it took nearly ten years for the doctors to notice this as the cause. My second-cousin was born as a result and is now in her thirties. She has some health problems, but I don't know if this is due to inheriting her father's A+ blood or her mother being older when she was conceived. My aunt certainly isn't affected by it.

If modern humans do indeed stem from various species then rh-negative blood would make more sense. A lot more research needs to be done though.

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Jumari
Sunday, October 11, 2009, 11:19pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from teri
This is interesting, talks about rh negative in relation to Basques, and suggests the possibility of two different species of humans, that neanderthals and homo sapiens quite possibly have evolved separately and not along the same "Darwin" line. At least, that's my interpretation...

http://www.aoi.com.au/bcw/neanderbasque.htm


I found this article so interesting because I am Basque and RH -. My Father is an O -. And the debate about the origins of the Basque language has been going on forever. They say that Euskera, the basque language is older than Spanish as they are unable to determine its origin.

I guess next time someone calls me a Neanderthal, I'll take it as a complement.
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