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Now, we're all crazy!!  This thread currently has 2,315 views. Print Print Thread
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drholyangel
Monday, August 17, 2009, 4:48pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Please take a look at this article from the Guardian (U.K.)

Evidently, there's a movement to classify those who are "obsessed with healthy eating" under the rubric of Orthorexia Nervosa. (You know, like people who want to eat organic food and avoid the other stuff.)

Here's the link:  http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2009/aug/16/orthorexia-mental-health-eating-disorder

Now, I've been a psychologist for over 30 years and have seen my fair share of eating disorders, and I don't think that eating right is a psychological disorder. The thing that's really upsetting is that the Blood Type diet and Naturopathic interventions are specifically mentioned at the end of the article as evidence of this disorder.

I guess the GMO, food additive, over-processed eating industry is feeling a little heat; so they needed to plaster their own brand of craziness into the media.

Give the article a read and see what you think. It's getting ever weirder out there.


"One sure sign of a lunatic is that, sooner or later, he mentions the Templars." - Umberto Eco
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Peppermint Twist
Monday, August 17, 2009, 5:04pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from drholyangel
Please take a look at this article from the Guardian (U.K.)

Evidently, there's a movement to classify those who are "obsessed with healthy eating" under the rubric of Orthorexia Nervosa. (You know, like people who want to eat organic food and avoid the other stuff.)

Here's the link:  http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2009/aug/16/orthorexia-mental-health-eating-disorder

Now, I've been a psychologist for over 30 years and have seen my fair share of eating disorders, and I don't think that eating right is a psychological disorder. The thing that's really upsetting is that the Blood Type diet and Naturopathic interventions are specifically mentioned at the end of the article as evidence of this disorder.

I guess the GMO, food additive, over-processed eating industry is feeling a little heat; so they needed to plaster their own brand of craziness into the media.

Give the article a read and see what you think. It's getting ever weirder out there.

Haven't read your linked article yet, as I have to go "scan" (don't ask) right now, but I've heard of this "orthorexia nervosa" before and it is totally INFURIATING.  Yes, there are some people in the world who are way too rigid about any given diet they follow, but that doesn't mean that everyone who follows any given diet with a high degree of compliance has a pathology, a disease.  Some of us just choose to choose healthy foods in a society that has unhealthy choices as the vastly more prevalent reality, therefore, one has to seem very "out there" to choose healthily most of the time and to find healthy choices.  It means asking a lot of questions in restaurants, reading labels in stores, questioning things.  None of that makes us "sick", it makes us informed and respectful of our bodies and our health!  Like I said, there are those who follow whatever diet rules they adhere to in a way that is kinda OCD/rigid, BUT that doesn't mean that everyone who follows a diet strictly is doing so out of a pathology.  On the contrary, some of us do it to be healthy!  Choosing healthy foods in a society full of unhealthy choices will, by definition, seem weird and eccentric.  But I don't think those of us eating the organic buffalo burger wrapped in a romaine leaf are the sick ones.  I think the business entities that push those other consumers around us to eat Twinkies and Ho Ho's and Count Chocula are the ones that need their heads, or more accurately their ethics, examined.



"If you are on one of Dr. D's diets and it isn't joyful, you aren't doing it right." - moi

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NewHampshireGirl
Monday, August 17, 2009, 5:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I have met some vegans like this.  
Sounds as if there are whole groups of people who are obsessive-compulsive in the category noted in this article.  Most of us who follow the BTD probably are very quiet about it.  I know my husband and I are living a full life following BTD and we haven't been treated for a disorder, yet.  
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Brighid45
Monday, August 17, 2009, 5:18pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted Text
Orthorexics commonly have rigid rules around eating. Refusing to touch sugar, salt, caffeine, alcohol, wheat, gluten, yeast, soya, corn and dairy foods is just the start of their diet restrictions. Any foods that have come into contact with pesticides, herbicides or contain artificial additives are also out.

The obsession about which foods are "good" and which are "bad" means orthorexics can end up malnourished. Their dietary restrictions commonly cause sufferers to feel proud of their "virtuous" behaviour even if it means that eating becomes so stressful their personal relationships can come under pressure and they become socially isolated.


Isn't it interesting how not wanting to eat highly processed foods contaminated with chemicals and additives is somehow turned into crazy behavior? Wow, we're all social deviants because we don't want to eat Ding-Dongs and Doritos!

I agree with NHG that there are people out there who might fall into this category, but this article lumping us in with them is rather extreme. I guess all's fair in love and (propaganda) wars!    

Thanks for posting this, drholyangel. It's always good to know what the opposition is up to.


Everyone is entitled to his or her informed opinion. --H. Ellison
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Mercedes
Monday, August 17, 2009, 5:53pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I think there's a difference between avoiding those kinds of processed foods and the mentality of a person with Orthorexia.

BTD followers for one, believe a food to be bad for us as individuals generally, but because of chemistry, not because the food has "fat" or "too many calories." And while some of us are neurotic about some avoids, do any other O's really *FREAK OUT* if there's a cucumber in something we eat? I dislike cucumbers, but I'm not going to fret if I accidentally eat one.

The very fact that Dr. D considers compliance 80-90% (if I remember correctly) should mean that we aren't obsessive. Moreoever, I don't think we eat the way we do to exert control- which is a classic part of eating disorders. We eat the way we do because we feel better doing so. Orthorexics probably wouldn't know if they react to anything- they'll just label something bad, and then obsess about avoiding it.

The last paragraph is just absurd- they should have included things like eat to live or veganism instead of body-chemistry related diets. But I absolutely know people who are likely Orthorexic. I know a 16 year old girl who didn't eat for 12 hours at a fair because she said all the food offered was bad- sure french fries aren't good, but running around in the sun all day with no food isn't good either.
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Dr. D
Monday, August 17, 2009, 6:50pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I'm sure that upon reading the article, many more people will discover the benefits of orthorexia and the BTD.


A whole system is a living system is a learning system.’ -Stewart Brand
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Amazone I.
Monday, August 17, 2009, 7:08pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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creative and inventing minds are such a ... fine thing to get people
into the trap of dependancies...fear...fear..fear...etc...baa..

I am this..I have that.... ....eat and live right 4 your type and all becomes ok......it is thaaat simple...


ooops...forgot to mention, ther's one point   ..no 1 in the enneagram seem to be prone for such issues, the super propper clean often related to foods and nutritionals and meds....ENTP/J's... but as we are both, so no.5 is in that boat as well....and all of our neighbours .... but if you are aware about such patterns... no problem we can handle them.... easily..........


MIfHI K-174

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Gale D.
Monday, August 17, 2009, 7:13pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Eventually those fat- sugar- chemical-eating people will die out, and the progeny of those who eat healthy will take over the world...

Our evil plan has been exposed... muuuhhhhahahaha!




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Peppermint Twist
Monday, August 17, 2009, 7:15pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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P.S.  Okay, I have now read the linked article.





!!!

All I can say in addition to what I already said, pre-reading-it, is the following:  it is a rhymes-with-spam good thing that the article doesn't allow COMMENTS!

(&*&#&#*!~!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  :lk$&*&#!   I MEAN, *(&$#*&#???? !! wuh?


"If you are on one of Dr. D's diets and it isn't joyful, you aren't doing it right." - moi

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PixieO
Monday, August 17, 2009, 8:30pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I work at a place that sells raw food, and I can definitely say that I have seen this particular phenomenon in a couple of people - you can usually tell by the PANIC that ensues when we are out of something they planned on eating - but I wouldn't say everyone who eats raw must have a disorder, thats ridiculous. Same for the blood type diet. I am sure there are SOME who hide an eating disorder behind it, but that is probably a very small percentage, not the majority. Its like saying everyone who watches calories must be anorexic.

The worst thing about this, is that orthorexia Nervosa actually is a disease that people should be aware of, but making these sweeping statements does nothing to help those that have it, and just pisses of the rest of us. Very counterproductive.
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Chloe
Monday, August 17, 2009, 9:22pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I actually love it!

Look at it this way, you can tell your therapist that you're following the BTD and if
you talk about it enough, you can have a clearly defined disease and suddenly
there is a PDR "code" for your condition...Your insurance will be able to cover you to talk about the BTD or the GTD in therapy.

It's a really good deal if you ask me  !


"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"
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Debra+
Monday, August 17, 2009, 9:35pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Dr. D
I'm sure that upon reading the article, many more people will discover the benefits of orthorexia and the BTD.



oh...yes...turn it around to make a positive.       

Debra


"Everything that irritates us about others can lead us to an understanding of ourselves." C.G. Jung"

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drholyangel
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 12:10am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Good comments, everyone. I believe that those who could be diagnosed with orthorexia actually have an underlying condition such as obsessive-compulsive disorder, or a compulsive personality disorder. There is no need to clutter up the diagnostic nomenclature with this condition, especially if it is an attempt to marginalize those of us who eat sensibly, but choose to eschew (ha, ha!) certain foods.

If it's any consolation, remember that this is the same gang that considered homosexuality a disease and tried to "cure" it for decades (without success, of course). Kind of makes me proud to be a shrink . . . . . . not.    


"One sure sign of a lunatic is that, sooner or later, he mentions the Templars." - Umberto Eco
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Lola
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 1:12am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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great seeing you again!

Quoted Text
many more people will discover the benefits of orthorexia and the BTD.


ortho will sound more appealing to those ignorant of lifestyle change and wellness.


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!

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Amazone I.
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 9:24am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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............

Orthomed-NutriGenomics Albrecht  is my firms' name


MIfHI K-174
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Jumari
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 9:54am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Here is another crazy thing going on in my part of the world.

It was my spiritual meditation teacher that recommended the BTD to me.

When I finally decided to buy the GT diet book. I went to our Australian Borders and they didn't have it. I had to go to the local Spiritual shop to buy it. There I found it next to books on Epigenetics, like the Biology of Belief by Bruce Lipton and Alternative medicine.

Aren't Genetics and Epigentics considered to be matter of fact, accredited sciences by the medical profession?
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Jumari
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 10:15am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Here is an interesting video on Orthorexia Nervosa

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5je5QcEH8M

I think they or shall I say we are also referred to as Health food junkies.
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Andrea AWsec
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 12:17pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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A therapist might  say it is all about controlling your world. Because you were out of control as a child (unable to make choices for yourself or you are a last child and everyone made decisions for you), so you need to be in control of something and food is easy to be in control of.


MIFHI

"Do not try to satisfy your vanity by teaching a great many things. Awaken people's curiosity. It is enough to open minds; do not overload them." Anatole France

"Healthy people have the least overt symptoms from eating avoid foods." Dr. D'Adamo
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Peppermint Twist
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 12:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from drholyangel
Good comments, everyone. I believe that those who could be diagnosed with orthorexia actually have an underlying condition such as obsessive-compulsive disorder, or a compulsive personality disorder. There is no need to clutter up the diagnostic nomenclature with this condition...

Exactly.  It's cluttered up with enough shullbit as it is.  We don't need another made-up disease that one person unilaterally came up with (tangent:  just like us tail-end-of-the-Boom Baby Boomers don't need to be summarily tossed into a different supposed "generation" that was really just made up by one person--stay away from me, I'm a Baby Boomer...there's no such thing as "Generation Jones"  ).  As you said, what he's really talking about are other diseases that are already in the aforementioned nomenclature.  This guy just makes up this disease and it is taken as gospel that it exists?  Nope.  Not buying it.
Quoted from drholyangel
...especially if it is an attempt to marginalize those of us who eat sensibly, but choose to eschew (ha, ha!) certain foods.

Yeah, mind your own biz, Bratman.  I eat what I choose to eat and don't eat what I don't choose to eat.  That is called following a certain diet.  It is not a pathology, especially since said diet is as healthy as it gets.  It is called being smart about diet.  Not as catchy of a title as "orthorexia", but it has a good beat and you can dance to it.  I give it a ten!


"If you are on one of Dr. D's diets and it isn't joyful, you aren't doing it right." - moi

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Amazone I.
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 12:40pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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this film relates to no anorexia nevrosa but is  merely all about  bulimie !!!
Often bulimie is first and anorexia will follow..... ......but
both maladies haven't anything to do with so called *healthfood junkies *


hhhhaaa...about healthfood junkies....do you know that Teutonia has got a biiig problem right now that all its veggies and most of the fruits are contaminated with too much of cadmium but also the so called bio or organic stuffs are ... ... Those who wanted to eat healthy, the vegans and vegetarians are all +++ concerned about those issues... it came yesterday up in the Teutonic TV... every one is shocked, and justamente go for it as usual... ....
this I name really crazy.... but one thing is good in that story...they asked people to switch to spelt and rye....not eating any wheat in the next few months!......nice to live in Switzerland.....


MIfHI K-174

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Amazone I.  -  Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 1:02pm
Amazone I.  -  Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 1:00pm
Amazone I.  -  Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 12:55pm
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Peppermint Twist
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 1:21pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from Jumari
I think they or shall I say we are also referred to as Health food junkies.

Isn't calling us "health food junkies" a contradiction in terms?  Shouldn't we instead be called "health food quality-ies"?

Quote:

"There is no such thing as junk food.  There is junk, and there is food, but there is no junk food."*

Hence, one cannot be a health food "junkie".  One can only be a health food "foodie".  PT has decreed it.  So it is written.  So it shall be. *Thuderclap!*

* That quote is by a doctor on a PBS special...can't think of his name or the name of the special, and can't seem to find it on a PBS program listing...sorry...





"If you are on one of Dr. D's diets and it isn't joyful, you aren't doing it right." - moi

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SquarePeg
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 5:22pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Quoted from Chloe
I actually love it!

Look at it this way, you can tell your therapist that you're following the BTD and if you talk about it enough, you can have a clearly defined disease and suddenly there is a PDR "code" for your condition...Your insurance will be able to cover you to talk about the BTD or the GTD in therapy.

It's a really good deal if you ask me  !
Clever!  I'd rather have the insurance company recognize the health benefits of the BTD and pay me a stipend for the extra expense of buying quality food.



My SWAMI diet is a blend of BTD and GTD Explorer, but I'm not totally compliant.  Also I try to choose foods that have a Low Glycemic index.  DW and DD are A+, probably also Explorer.
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SquarePeg
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 5:28pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I don't have a problem with it.  Here's the key, which is the same criteria applied to differentiate between healthy exercise and obsessive exercise, working hard and workaholism, washing your hands after using a tissue, the bathroom, and before eating vs. obsessive handwashing:
Quoted Text
The obsession about which foods are "good" and which are "bad" means orthorexics can end up malnourished. Their dietary restrictions commonly cause sufferers to feel proud of their "virtuous" behaviour even if it means that eating becomes so stressful their personal relationships can come under pressure and they become socially isolated.


My SWAMI diet is a blend of BTD and GTD Explorer, but I'm not totally compliant.  Also I try to choose foods that have a Low Glycemic index.  DW and DD are A+, probably also Explorer.
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drholyangel
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 5:32pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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While the whole "food and control" issue has merit, I find it particularly ironic that some of the most controlling people are those who seek to give something a name in an attempt to control by appearing to be experts.

This has been a human quality since forever, though. Look at all the beliefs claiming that if you know the true name of something, you can control it, and bend it to your will.

Methinks "they" are trying to bend everyone to their will by trying to stigmatize groups for their weird habits, like wanting to eat what's best for them. What kind of loonie would want to do something like not eat the garbage that is processed food?? Gotta be something wrong with those "food obsessed" types, what?


"One sure sign of a lunatic is that, sooner or later, he mentions the Templars." - Umberto Eco
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Chloe
Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 6:40pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Actually, thinking about this further...

Controlling what we eat isn't as easy as it once was, when food was purer and
chemicals weren't routinely dumped everywhere on our food sources...and our
lakes and rivers weren't polluted...and people weren't so ill...and trying to hard
to figure out the reason why they're so ill and what it would take to make everyone
well again.  So, the more we know about agri food business and the more we learn
about disease, all the more reason to avoid the very things connected to becoming
a disease model.

We have free will or least we'd like to think we have it...but it's easy to lose that free will once we give up and turn ourselves over to the medical establishment, people with possibly the best of intentions, but limited to what they've learned in school and rarely looking outside of the box for better ways to prevent and treat disease....so what are our options?  We need to figure out how to save ourselves
which is where all these self help diet books came from......

What can modern medicine offer us in the way of teaching any of us anything about healthy eating? Is the FDA attempting to regulate genetically modified foods?  

Look how clever the medical establishment has become...and look how much
money can be made from medical procedures, many of which probably wouldn't
have been necessary if people paid more  careful attention
to eating a healthier diet and living a more rigid lifestyle that includes avoidance
of chemicals and pollutants and getting more exercise... So who is threatened when we pick and choose what we eat?  Do we need a diagnosis of  mental dysfunction to save ourselves from, what?  Ourselves?  No, the medical establishment is threatened that we might be able to find less use for their services...and this is
money they don't make from us.

The medical model is invested in drugs and surgery... Yes, you can
get a gastric bypass surgical procedure just for eating the very foods us
healthier minded individuals are avoiding ...and yes, drug companies are frantically looking to find the perfect diet pill....but if you choose to control your own life by eating foods of your own choice, even if it comes from a food list prescribed by a program you choose to follow, why is this method of self control coming out to a diagnosis that implies you're pathological?  Because it's their label and then you're
back in their system...with their diagnosis and their treatment.  It's all about them
trying to control us.



"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"
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