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BTD Forums    Diet and Nutrition    The Encyclopedia/ D'Adamo Library  ›  prolapse: vaginal hysterectomy? or repair? or>
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prolapse: vaginal hysterectomy? or repair? or>  This thread currently has 2,387 views. Print Print Thread
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Lola
Monday, December 19, 2011, 4:19am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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To correct a prolapse, should it be vaginal hysterectomy? or vaginal repair
operation? What are the risks of either operation? Patient fears a tightening of the vagina or slight scarring around the vaginal entrance, leaving her with the same painful intercourse issues once done. Open for suggestions, links, testimonials, advice to offer.

advice given so far:
=Pelvic physical therapy
=Maya Abdominal Massage
=osteopathic manipulations
=visceral manipulation + Spleen Tonics
consider Sepia or other remedies with problem and pattern presentation
moxa GV-20
=Quercus alba, Quercus spp. (Oak Bark)
=Kegel's 25 4 times a day for at least one
month. an herbal formulation-- Collinsonia, ruscus,
Hamamelis, Achillea, Cinnamon, Aesculus , Caullophyllum - considered
a superior remedy for uterine subinvolution, prolapse,
anteversion or retroversion; Chamaeliri

anyone have more tips? testimonials that worked?


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Victoria
Monday, December 19, 2011, 4:37am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sun Beh Nim
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Astragalus:  "An important effect of Astragalus is in its ability to fortify the “Upright Qi.”  Upright Qi is the energy allocated by the body to maintain upright posture and to maintain the position of the organs in their healthy position in their battle with gravity.  As one gets older, or if one experiences chronic fatigue or exhaustion, or during illness, this Upright Qi is easily depleted resulting in the sinking, or “prolapse,” of organs." (Ron Teeguarden, Dragonherbs)

A breathing exercise:

Inhaling ~ relax the abdominal muscles so that the lower belly gently expands, filling on up until the lungs are full of air all the way into the upper chest.

Exhaling ~ keep the abdominals relaxed as the lungs are emptied, then continue to exhale while allowing the lower belly to move inward.  Continue exhaling until no more air can be expelled, drawing the lower belly further inward and upward.  

Gently release and relax the belly as the next inhale begins.
Repeat this cycle a few times, several times/day.



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
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Lola
Monday, December 19, 2011, 4:47am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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thanks!.....got a link to someone performing these?

many learn from watching


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Possum
Monday, December 19, 2011, 4:55am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Quoted from Lola
Patient fears a tightening of the vagina or slight scarring around the vaginal entrance, leaving her with the same painful intercourse issues once done. Open for suggestions, links, testimonials, advice to offer.
anyone have more tips? testimonials that worked?
Just imo...From what I have heard, any tightening is usually a good thing... & I imagine, with the right amount of tenderness, patience (& a good lube if needed) any operation may be an enhancement, not a negative, re future sexual intercourse...
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Lola
Monday, December 19, 2011, 5:07am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Dianne
Monday, December 19, 2011, 6:04am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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I know of someone who had this reversed by herbs with a reputable TCM doctor. The herbs used were sachets of pre-packaged, pharmaceutical grade (non-contaminated) herbs.

It had a lot to do with poor kidney chi.

Along with the herbs, lamb is a great food to nourish the kidneys and compliant beans.
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Amazone I.
Monday, December 19, 2011, 6:14am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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how you spell Beckenbodentraining and I think even *oriental dance* is better coz all muscles here are demanded... also it depends how heavy the prolaps has been, I remember my grandma put a certain ring in and yuk was all ... no ops nada and she lived with that until her 89 year....


MIfHI K-174
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Lola
Monday, December 19, 2011, 6:45am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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Kegel's 25 exercises

and pessary ring


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Amazone I.
Monday, December 19, 2011, 12:39pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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merci Lola  


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Chloe
Monday, December 19, 2011, 1:49pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"
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Patty H
Monday, December 19, 2011, 2:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Lola, I am not sure if you have seen this article but it looks fairly comprehensive:

http://www.emedicinehealth.com/vaginal_prolapse/article_em.htm

I believe there have been several lawsuits regarding this type of surgery.  Surgeons use a mesh that can cause all types of issues:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19155908

http://www.transvaginalmeshlawsuitcenter.com/

This is certainly something to take into consideration.


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logan
Monday, December 19, 2011, 3:04pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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My sister has been using a pessary for her uterine prolapse after the birth of her 2nd child.
Most of the doctors recommended she have a hysterectomy because she was done having children but luckily her own family doctor recommended the pessary. She has been using the pessary for 15 years which has allowed her to go into menopause naturally and not forced into it at an early age.
She has seen different specialists through the years to make sure using the pessary was still OK and
one of the doctors said she has patients in their 80's still using pessaries.

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logan  -  Monday, December 19, 2011, 8:00pm
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Victoria
Monday, December 19, 2011, 7:35pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sun Beh Nim
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Quoted from Lola
thanks!.....got a link to someone performing these?

many learn from watching


I don't have a link because it's a technique I developed during the time I was teaching hatha yoga.  It is most effective combined with a strong, high kegel lift at the end of the exhale, after drawing the lower belly in and up as much as possible.  Through practice, not only does it increase the effectiveness of the kegels but also the deep inner muscles that hold the uterus in alignment.

My female students loved this exercise and many told me that it helped reverse their uterine prolapse and improved vaginal tone.



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
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angel
Friday, December 23, 2011, 3:56am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Lola-From the voice of experience DO NOT let them take your keystone (uterus).
I wish I wouldn't have, have been paying for it ever since. The Doctor who did the surgery knew I ahd prolapse and did not tell me. Within a year I could not my urine to save my life I now wear pads and use tampons as pessiaries. I no longer have a cervix or anything for a traditional pessiary to hold onto.

My aunt got the tack up surgery for everything and it make initmacy very uncomfortable. Don't do that either. Grin and bear it. I am not letting take anything else unless it is cancerous and even then maybe not.

If you can get the Whole woman website. The exercise and explanations are valid the only thing I ignore is the vegetarian push, not good for an O. The exercise are valid and do help.

Here is the[url] http://wholewoman.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=3&products_id=19[/url]


'And some of us would die-so other men can stand up on their feet like men. A great many are going to die for that. They have in the past. They will a hundred years from now-two hundred. God grant there will always be men good enough.(James Otis)' Johnny Tremain (Forbes)

Freedom is not free!
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Lola
Friday, December 23, 2011, 6:12am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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Quoted Text
DO NOT let them take your keystone


she fears that most of all

luckily her gino is more holistic and believes her problem can be reversed through exercise....

so keep those tips coming!!


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Victoria
Friday, December 23, 2011, 6:54am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Is she willing to adhere to the consistency of exercise for the long term that it will take to strengthen her muscles?

The midwives around here teach women to do kegels all the time!  As much as possible, every time the thought even crosses our minds, to do a dozen - up to 500 a day.  It's a commitment.  



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
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Amazone I.
Sunday, January 22, 2012, 6:19pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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sepia C30


MIfHI K-174
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Dianne
Sunday, January 22, 2012, 6:24pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I love homeopathic remedies, my body responds exceptionally well with them! This one is good to know about. Thanks Isa.
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Ribbit
Tuesday, January 24, 2012, 6:19pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sorry I didn't chime in earlier.  We have not had more children mainly because of the severity of my pelvic organ prolapse following the birth of our last child.  I still am very physically limited in what I can do, and this is 2 1/2 years later.

Angel recommended the Whole Woman website, and the exercises outlined there are what saved me from the operating room.  Because I had two different OBs tell me that was my only option.

http://wholewoman.com/

Youtube has several of Christine Kent's video clips.  Here's one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvGROzIYN6w

When a friend of a friend heard of my case, she contacted me and told me about Whole Woman.  I'm serious--they kept me from having surgery.  Mine was pretty severe and the exercises strengthened my pelvic muscles enough to where I could function again.  I have all three types of prolapse.  She's lucky if it's only her uterus.

Surgery is a temporary fix and the mesh has a bad reputation for working its way back out.  When they tack up the bladder or uterus, they attach the mesh with little pins to TISSUE.  Guess what that does?  The tissue isn't designed to have tacks in it.  It's only a matter of time before it starts pulling apart.  Some people don't have any trouble.  But I wasn't willing to risk it.

Having a hysterectomy doesn't solve the problem and it often makes it worse. The uterus is called the matrix for a reason. It's the very center--the hub--of a wheel of muscles connecting the pubic bone, the inside of the hip bones and the ilium (across the inside of your very low back) as well as the muscles supporting the rest of the pelvic organs--bladder and rectum.  Remove the uterus and everything collapses, given time.  It's only a temporary fix too.

Here's some reading about Kegels.  They're the standard pat-answer given by OBs and midwives, but they don't necessarily help, depending on the way they're done and the extent of the prolapse.  http://mamasweat.blogspot.com/2010/05/pelvic-floor-party-kegels-are-not.html

Whole Woman exercises are based on ballet.  Yoga and pilates both have a couple of moves that put a woman's body in a compromised position, destabilizing the pelvic organs.  WW takes that into consideration and builds a very specialized exercise program combining ballet and yoga.  I do highly recommend it.  My low back pain diminished greatly and I was able to eliminate completely after only a few weeks of the exercises.  Because I was unable to empty my bladder, I had a UTI for several months after the baby's birth and I was unable to get rid of it through diet.  I was also severely constipated (and I do  mean severely) because of the pocket that's created in the lower bowels when the muscles are compromised and the organs collapse.  The video and book both are worth every penny.  They explain precisely what's going on and how to fix it.  


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
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angel
Friday, January 27, 2012, 4:33am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I am going to be using Whole woman in combo with my physical therapy. I was considering the bladder surgery, because like ribbit it had been my only option given. But when they did urodynmic testing. They had me hold my urine as much as possible. I emptied 900 mL. Then they proceeded to fill my bladder as much as possible I guess I started leaking at 600 mL. So the recommendation was Physical therapy. I do 3 sets of 10 reps of 2 second hold of teeny kegels trying to activate just the urethral spincter and believe me it takes a lot of practice and concentration. I repeat the same process but with 10 seconds holds. I am supposed to do this 6 time a day. I am doing good getting 1-2 sets of each 6 times a day  and possibly more depending. I do them whenever I think of them. I am also to do teeny pelvic tilts(flattening the tail bone-a very tiny motion) 3 sets of ten reps, and I can feel it in my low back.   Well I have decided to also use the whole woman videos and book. I will have to order the new series of videos.
Always get a second third fourth and fifth opinion or as many as necessary until you have one you are comfortable with. Then if it is in your nature pray about it.


'And some of us would die-so other men can stand up on their feet like men. A great many are going to die for that. They have in the past. They will a hundred years from now-two hundred. God grant there will always be men good enough.(James Otis)' Johnny Tremain (Forbes)

Freedom is not free!
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yaeli
Friday, January 27, 2012, 5:17am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Lola
thanks!
This is precious!  I love Astragalus and my lady doctor recommended to me in my appointment last week to take 2 capsules in the morning. I've had no idea that it is of such utmost importance for me.

Quoted from Lola
Many learn from watching
Incl YT here   



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yaeli
Friday, January 27, 2012, 5:24am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Victoria
The midwives around here teach women to do kegels all the time!  As much as possible, every time the thought even crosses our minds, to do a dozen - up to 500 a day.  It's a commitment.  
Amazing. Someone should have told me that when I was 10 years old. I understood then that what the body was doing automatically must be for some good reason, but alas, there was nobdy to talk to     



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