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Lowering Cholesterol with Compliant Grains  This thread currently has 3,235 views. Print Print Thread
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Susana
Tuesday, September 20, 2011, 10:24pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Patty, you may want to read this article from the New England Journal of Medicine: http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/359/3/229/F4

It is a one size fit all but it it shows the effect on low carb and Mediterranean diet (moderate grains) on lipids and glucose. It helped me gain confidence on Dr. D's recommendation on grains especially the idea that "allowed" grains are not necessarily bad for the health of the heart.

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Patty H
Wednesday, September 21, 2011, 12:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Susana
Patty, you may want to read this article from the New England Journal of Medicine: http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/359/3/229/F4

It is a one size fit all but it it shows the effect on low carb and Mediterranean diet (moderate grains) on lipids and glucose. It helped me gain confidence on Dr. D's recommendation on grains especially the idea that "allowed" grains are not necessarily bad for the health of the heart.



Thanks for sharing that, Susana.  I appreciate it and have tried to incorporate some compliant grains once a day.  


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sunnyside
Thursday, September 27, 2012, 1:48pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Any one knows what high HDL means? I have total cholesterol 268 but HDL 127.
My BMI is 19 and do regular exercise everyday.
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krisaf
Thursday, September 27, 2012, 3:01pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Patty, I read quickly through the thread and didn't see any questions concerning your thyroid function?  My TSH (thyroid stimulating hormone)recently went up to the upper level of normal and my cholesterol and LDH increased.  I have a history of a thyroid disorder and have learned that there is a connection there between thyroid and cholesterol. With my medication increased, bringing my TSH back to a more optimal level, my cholesterol and LDH are coming back down. The doctors seem to zero in on the
cholesterol and right away want to prescribe a statin drug!  I refused my Dr. on that
and as I got up to leave he said- OH, by the way, your thyroid levels are a bit off!!
He then increased my thyroid medication to address that.   He would have first had me agree to take the statin drug before seeing if addressing the thyroid issue would help!
I also have begun to follow a gluten free diet to address the autoimmune part of my
Hashimoto's Thyroiditis.
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ABJoe
Thursday, September 27, 2012, 3:27pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from sunnyside
Any one knows what high HDL means? I have total cholesterol 268 but HDL 127.
My BMI is 19 and do regular exercise everyday.

High HDL is good...  


RH-, ISTJ
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Patty H
Thursday, September 27, 2012, 3:39pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from krisaf
Patty, I read quickly through the thread and didn't see any questions concerning your thyroid function?  My TSH (thyroid stimulating hormone)recently went up to the upper level of normal and my cholesterol and LDH increased.  I have a history of a thyroid disorder and have learned that there is a connection there between thyroid and cholesterol. With my medication increased, bringing my TSH back to a more optimal level, my cholesterol and LDH are coming back down. The doctors seem to zero in on the
cholesterol and right away want to prescribe a statin drug!  I refused my Dr. on that
and as I got up to leave he said- OH, by the way, your thyroid levels are a bit off!!
He then increased my thyroid medication to address that.   He would have first had me agree to take the statin drug before seeing if addressing the thyroid issue would help!
I also have begun to follow a gluten free diet to address the autoimmune part of my
Hashimoto's Thyroiditis.


My thyroid levels have all been in the normal range.  However, I have taken my basal body temperature and it has been low in the mornings.  I spoke with my natural health care practitioner.  She have me a metagenics product for thyroid regulation just in case but she does not think that is the problem.  Interestingly enough my mother has had hypothyroidism for years.  My sister was recently diagnosed with the same.  My cholesterol is not considered too high for an O according to Dr. D's cardio book and my ratios are very good.  I will make sure my PCP continues to monitor my thyroid level given my family history.



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ruthiegirl
Thursday, September 27, 2012, 3:40pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Patty- I remember you had issues with heavy metal toxicity and got treatment for that. Did that affect your cholesterol levels in any way?


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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tessieUK
Thursday, September 27, 2012, 4:13pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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One thing you could do with exercising to see if this improves things, is incorporate some sprint intervals into your routine. Maybe replacing one of the standard jogs with a session a week of 8-10 sprints with slow jog recovery over a lesser distance. It does sound like you are doing a more challenging workout than slow steady cardio, with all the hills, however it's very important to increase the difficulty of your workout regularly otherwise you are not triggering any more adaptive changes, only maintaining an equilbrium. Getting your heart rate up to the point you are gasping for breath, then allowing yourself to recover and repeating, is very strengthening for the heart, because you are increasing the 'reserve capacity.' Some info about that here: http://www.alsearsmd.com/pace2/jvnb/

The more intense the exercise, the better the de-stressing effects for an O, and keeping yourself in a calm balanced state generally is going to lower your risks of health problems.
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krisaf
Thursday, September 27, 2012, 4:26pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Just keep in mind that the TSH is better in the lower end of the normal range- mine came down to 1.6.
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Patty H
Friday, September 28, 2012, 6:06pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from ruthiegirl
Patty- I remember you had issues with heavy metal toxicity and got treatment for that. Did that affect your cholesterol levels in any way?


Ruthie, although my levels are down significantly, I am still highly toxic.  I had to stop the chelation therapy because I was not methylating.  I just had it checked again and I am still having problems with methylation.  I don't go to my PCP until November and I will get my blood tests then, so I don't know if the chelation therapy has had an effect on cholesterol.  I have a sense that I will be detoxing the heavy metals for a long time to come.  Thanks for asking!


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Patty H
Friday, September 28, 2012, 6:08pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from tessieUK
One thing you could do with exercising to see if this improves things, is incorporate some sprint intervals into your routine. Maybe replacing one of the standard jogs with a session a week of 8-10 sprints with slow jog recovery over a lesser distance. It does sound like you are doing a more challenging workout than slow steady cardio, with all the hills, however it's very important to increase the difficulty of your workout regularly otherwise you are not triggering any more adaptive changes, only maintaining an equilbrium. Getting your heart rate up to the point you are gasping for breath, then allowing yourself to recover and repeating, is very strengthening for the heart, because you are increasing the 'reserve capacity.' Some info about that here: http://www.alsearsmd.com/pace2/jvnb/

The more intense the exercise, the better the de-stressing effects for an O, and keeping yourself in a calm balanced state generally is going to lower your risks of health problems.


Unfortunately I have posterior tibial tendonitis in both legs, so no running, walking or sprinting for me.  I can only do non-wieght bearing exercise for now  



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Patty H
Friday, September 28, 2012, 6:22pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from krisaf
Just keep in mind that the TSH is better in the lower end of the normal range- mine came down to 1.6.


My TSH was .75 in September 2010 and .71 in August 2011.  I have also had my T3 tested two times over the past year and it has always been in the normal range.


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krisaf
Friday, September 28, 2012, 8:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Guess we can put that idea to bed then!
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Patty H
Friday, September 28, 2012, 10:12pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from krisaf
Guess we can put that idea to bed then!




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Mrs T O+
Monday, October 1, 2012, 3:20am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Juliekim: Those are great numbers. The amount/ratio of HDL is more important than the total number.
As for Patty: Did you have a SWAMI?  Is your cholesterol problem just more stubborn than someone else's. It may take longer to get the numbers down.
What blood type are the relatives with the heart problems?

I try to avoid cancer, but I know that my mom who got cancer was an A and my sis & I are Os.  Therefore I don't worry as much. (But I don't assume, either!)

There are answers out there somewhere!


Interested in nutrition, lactation, religion, politics; love to be around people; talkative, sensitive, goofy; a "fishy Christian" ><>; left-handed; lived on a farm, small town & big city; love BTD/GTD; A staunch La Leche League veteran; b. 10/1947 Check BTD/GTD on facebook!
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JJR
Wednesday, October 3, 2012, 7:34pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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It looked like it went up though Mrs. T after following her diet.

I am certainly no expert, and I can totally relate.  My cholesterol has always been high and the normal doctors have pushed me to take drugs.  But this is what I know:

Mine keeps going down and down.  I follow my swami, almost to a fault.  And I'm not trying to start a war, but I eat huge amounts of oatmeal. I eat almost a cup of dried oatmeal every other day.  I flip flop between rice and oatmeal every day.  But I'm an AB. So....

But one thing is that my HDL's are pretty high.  Not as high as someone posted above, 127 is sky high, which is good.  But mine are always around 80 or so and it always helps my ratio.  I don't know if you saw, but I just posted in the swami section about my experience.  

My last numbers were:

242 total
146 LDL
84 HDL
58 Trig

It's a 2.9 ratio.  The ratio is so good, I'm not worried about it at all.  Plus, for about 2-3 years I had hovered around 300.  One time it was 380.  I as very sick at the time.  And I remember eating gobs of ice cream at the time too.  So..... But even at the 380 time, my ratio was still around 4/1 because my HDL's were real high that time.  It was almost like it was regulating itself.

I have some thoughts that might help.

1. I was metal toxic, and had all my amalgams out.  And it does appear that it has dropped steadily since that time.  Could be a coincidence, might not be. Maybe the liver is becoming less clogged.

2. I have been taking a teaspoon of Cod Liver oil every day, for as long as I can remember.  It was one of the first things I started to do when I developed health problems.  This might help the HDL number.  My Cardiologist also seems to think it's a very good practice.  

3. If it is the metal issue, than food probably doesn't have as much to do with it.  In the last 6 months, I've eaten more quantities of all food categories than I have in years.  And my cholesterol went down.  I eat somewhere between, 8-12 ounces of meat every day, an egg, a little butter, more olive oil than I used to eat, and it's still going down.  And yeah, I eat a real good amount of grain every day.  And my BMI is 20 according to this last test I just took.  Low normal.  I'm not overweight by any means and I was grossly underweight.

In my case, if I had to guess, it has more to do with how healthy my liver and insides are, moreso than the food.  Having said that, I make all our foods fresh / frozen and eat out about once a week and am very choosy about what I eat out.  I pretty much avoid thickeners, and preservatives that I can't pronounce or spell.  I eat salads every day and when I go out to eat, that's usually what I have, but the only dressing I use is olive oil.  I think for me, those things might be helping "un gum" my liver.  And my cholesterol is going down because of it.  Possibly.

Or maybe it's all just dumb luck.  I don't know.  But I thought I'd throw out my thoughts to you also.  It has always concerned me also.  But I'm getting less and less concerned about it.  

One thing you said strikes me very hard.  And I've heard this said before too, you said you had family with Low Cholesterol that have had heart attacks.  And ones with High.  So, I think it's possible you're looking in the wrong place to avoid a heart attack.  One of the people posted an article about how "inflammation" is a bigger deal.  And I've heard this theory before.  How you avoid that, I'm not sure.  Eat anti inflammatory foods.  Which include grass fed beef and good oils.  Pineapple.  Etc.  And then there is the theory of High homocysteine.  And then something about the genetic of IL4.  I'm not really sure they know how to prevent heart attacks.  And I think it's a hard deal because it's different for everyone.  I try not to worry about it any more and give it to God.  I do what I can as far as my health, but I'm not sure if there is a perfect solution to avoiding one.  

One more thing, my Doctor has a supplement called "Policoosinol" that helps lower cholesterol.  I was on that for a while once.  I don't need it any longer though, I guess.    


And FWIW, when I say I try not to worry about it any longer and give it to God, I still struggle with fears about it.  For example, a friend from Church just had one.  And man if I wasn't struggling with fears about it happening to me.   I always tell my wife and she always tells me not to worry.  My doctor has told me the same thing.  It's all good.  I would say your numbers aren't really bad at all.  The ratio is still pretty good.  I've seen it marked on test that anywhere from 2/1 to 4/1 is acceptable.  The doctors just look at that overall number and tell you it's a reason to get you hooked on a drug.  That benefits a whole lot of other people.  But I'm not sure they're that good for your liver.  But that is something we all have to come to our own conclusion about.  I've never taken any though.  



The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Patty H
Wednesday, October 3, 2012, 10:52pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Mrs T O+
Juliekim: Those are great numbers. The amount/ratio of HDL is more important than the total number.
As for Patty: Did you have a SWAMI?  Is your cholesterol problem just more stubborn than someone else's. It may take longer to get the numbers down.
What blood type are the relatives with the heart problems?

I try to avoid cancer, but I know that my mom who got cancer was an A and my sis & I are Os.  Therefore I don't worry as much. (But I don't assume, either!)

There are answers out there somewhere!


Mrs T O+ - two of my siblings (brother and sister) are A's and my other brother is an O.  One of my cousins is definitely an O.  All three siblings have had bypass surgery as has my O cousin.  All the male cousins on my Dad's side have heart disease and some of the females as well.  I assume my dad was an O because my mother is an A.  In this case, BT has not mattered.  The family history is on my Dad's side.  In this case, it seems to be genetic rather than blood type related.


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Patty H
Wednesday, October 3, 2012, 10:53pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from JJR
It looked like it went up though Mrs. T after following her diet.

I am certainly no expert, and I can totally relate.  My cholesterol has always been high and the normal doctors have pushed me to take drugs.  But this is what I know:

Mine keeps going down and down.  I follow my swami, almost to a fault.  And I'm not trying to start a war, but I eat huge amounts of oatmeal. I eat almost a cup of dried oatmeal every other day.  I flip flop between rice and oatmeal every day.  But I'm an AB. So....

But one thing is that my HDL's are pretty high.  Not as high as someone posted above, 127 is sky high, which is good.  But mine are always around 80 or so and it always helps my ratio.  I don't know if you saw, but I just posted in the swami section about my experience.  

My last numbers were:

242 total
146 LDL
84 HDL
58 Trig

It's a 2.9 ratio.  The ratio is so good, I'm not worried about it at all.  Plus, for about 2-3 years I had hovered around 300.  One time it was 380.  I as very sick at the time.  And I remember eating gobs of ice cream at the time too.  So..... But even at the 380 time, my ratio was still around 4/1 because my HDL's were real high that time.  It was almost like it was regulating itself.

I have some thoughts that might help.

1. I was metal toxic, and had all my amalgams out.  And it does appear that it has dropped steadily since that time.  Could be a coincidence, might not be. Maybe the liver is becoming less clogged.

2. I have been taking a teaspoon of Cod Liver oil every day, for as long as I can remember.  It was one of the first things I started to do when I developed health problems.  This might help the HDL number.  My Cardiologist also seems to think it's a very good practice.  

3. If it is the metal issue, than food probably doesn't have as much to do with it.  In the last 6 months, I've eaten more quantities of all food categories than I have in years.  And my cholesterol went down.  I eat somewhere between, 8-12 ounces of meat every day, an egg, a little butter, more olive oil than I used to eat, and it's still going down.  And yeah, I eat a real good amount of grain every day.  And my BMI is 20 according to this last test I just took.  Low normal.  I'm not overweight by any means and I was grossly underweight.

In my case, if I had to guess, it has more to do with how healthy my liver and insides are, moreso than the food.  Having said that, I make all our foods fresh / frozen and eat out about once a week and am very choosy about what I eat out.  I pretty much avoid thickeners, and preservatives that I can't pronounce or spell.  I eat salads every day and when I go out to eat, that's usually what I have, but the only dressing I use is olive oil.  I think for me, those things might be helping "un gum" my liver.  And my cholesterol is going down because of it.  Possibly.

Or maybe it's all just dumb luck.  I don't know.  But I thought I'd throw out my thoughts to you also.  It has always concerned me also.  But I'm getting less and less concerned about it.  

One thing you said strikes me very hard.  And I've heard this said before too, you said you had family with Low Cholesterol that have had heart attacks.  And ones with High.  So, I think it's possible you're looking in the wrong place to avoid a heart attack.  One of the people posted an article about how "inflammation" is a bigger deal.  And I've heard this theory before.  How you avoid that, I'm not sure.  Eat anti inflammatory foods.  Which include grass fed beef and good oils.  Pineapple.  Etc.  And then there is the theory of High homocysteine.  And then something about the genetic of IL4.  I'm not really sure they know how to prevent heart attacks.  And I think it's a hard deal because it's different for everyone.  I try not to worry about it any more and give it to God.  I do what I can as far as my health, but I'm not sure if there is a perfect solution to avoiding one.  

One more thing, my Doctor has a supplement called "Policoosinol" that helps lower cholesterol.  I was on that for a while once.  I don't need it any longer though, I guess.    


And FWIW, when I say I try not to worry about it any longer and give it to God, I still struggle with fears about it.  For example, a friend from Church just had one.  And man if I wasn't struggling with fears about it happening to me.   I always tell my wife and she always tells me not to worry.  My doctor has told me the same thing.  It's all good.  I would say your numbers aren't really bad at all.  The ratio is still pretty good.  I've seen it marked on test that anywhere from 2/1 to 4/1 is acceptable.  The doctors just look at that overall number and tell you it's a reason to get you hooked on a drug.  That benefits a whole lot of other people.  But I'm not sure they're that good for your liver.  But that is something we all have to come to our own conclusion about.  I've never taken any though.  



JJR, it will be interesting to see if my cholesterol is lower after having my amalgams out.  Actually, I am not too worried anymore.  My ratios are really good and I had my particle size measured and I am good  


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JJR
Thursday, October 4, 2012, 12:10am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Great!!

What is a "particle size"?


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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ruthiegirl
Friday, October 5, 2012, 9:18pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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It's a test of how "fluffy" the cholesterol particles are. I think it's the dense particles that are dangerous, while the "fluffy" ones are harmless, but I could have it backwards.

Basically, it means that you could have a "bad" HDL/LDL ratio but still be "heart healthy" if the particle size is good.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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AKArtlover
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JJR
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I like how it says cardiac arrest and "sudden death" are a symptom of low magnesium.  I'm assuming anyone with that "symptom" would not be looking on that website.

I used to take cal-mag-k and it seemed to help with my heart arrhythmia at the time.  I don't feel I need it any longer, but I do wonder if my magnesium isn't the greatest level.

I've heard that LDL's can be broken up in to different categories and some are better than others.  It's very complex.  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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