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Fermenting and sprouting for our Type  This thread currently has 8,980 views. Print Print Thread
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Lola
Thursday, July 8, 2010, 10:02pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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important is you bring out the natural juices in the fruit you ferment......the salt neutralizes the sugars since the yeast feeds off of them......


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Cristina
Friday, July 9, 2010, 3:35am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Fruit and nut Kimchi (fermented fruit and nut):

4 cooking pears
4 apples (2 green, 2 red)
handful of each, almond, walnuts, peanuts
some flaxseeds
some sesame seeds
some pumpkin seeds
handful of each dates, figs, goji berries (all organic, no additives dry fruit)

coarsely chop everything.  I thought I got clever and threw all my nuts on my new blender: it pulverised them!! in a couple of seconds!! Oh well, a few got left in bigger pieces, so I am still using the lot (finely chopped and all), see what happens ...

I put everything in my slow cooker bowl (obviously I will not be able to slow cook anything for a few days   ).  Mix everthing up with a handful of coarse Celtic salt, added warm boiled water to cover, put a plate and some heavy lids on top to hold the fruit and nuts underneath the brine.  Some of the seeds scaped, impossible to keep down, they are floating in the water on top of the plate, but everything else is held tight!!

Put the bowl and lids in the slow cooker, placed a bigger loose lid over it all and left it in the counter, near my stove, where I can keep a good eye on it all the time!!!  

The plan is to let this ferment for a few days, 5 or 7 days.  Then I will put the contents in a glass jar and keep it in the fridge.  I am following the guidelines from my permaculture teacher here, did the course a few years back, got the books ... but it is all rough, by feel, measurements not necessary here, just put it together with resources and ingredients you have ... using compliant ingreedients of course!  have a try, something yummy is bound to come out of it !!! ...  




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Vicki
Friday, July 9, 2010, 4:07am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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What a great adventure, Cristina!
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Lola
Friday, July 9, 2010, 5:15am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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I have had no need to add the water using mango and pineapple, jicama as well lets out so much juice.....beets......sweet sour like chutney!


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Cristina
Friday, July 9, 2010, 6:32am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Thanks Lola, spot on as usual! Did not have any of those and wanted to start it now rather than tomorrow!!1  Maybe should have juiced some apples and pears and use that instead, but I do not think I had enough either ...  Need to do big shopping tomorrow .... I have plenty of lemons in my trees, I wonder if I could have used that?  would it have been too acidic?  




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Cristina
Friday, July 9, 2010, 6:43am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Added progress report 2 to the 'seed variation sponge' ferment loaf (check Reply 93) ..




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Cristina
Friday, July 9, 2010, 11:11am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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The seed variation sponge project: Progress report 3  added to reply 93, page 4.  




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Lola
Friday, July 9, 2010, 2:39pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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for fermenting veggies or fruits and nuts and whatever, I believe best is to simply use the juice you can process out of whatever it is you are fermenting.....

lemon juice you can add once the process is done fermenting and you serve yourself a portion of it on your plate.......I would avoid the citric environment during the fermenting process.


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Cristina
Friday, July 9, 2010, 7:48pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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thanks, I will have that in mind next time!  




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AKArtlover
Friday, July 9, 2010, 9:28pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I don't know that I have the willingness to make the time to do this now, but I am enjoying reading this thread. I am wondering if you have ever had issues with mold? We tend to get mold growing on fruit/veg on counters within a week. Wondering if that is an issue.


"For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well." Psalm 139:13,14
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Cristina
Friday, July 9, 2010, 10:10pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Aha!! we are going through our winter months here now, so I can afford that luxury!  I have used these techniques many years before, but I was then living in a very dry place, very hot, but very dry, so as long as you cover your cultures well, there was no danger of molds developing, not the unwanted ones anyway ...

If we keep this thread alive long enough, we will see how I fare during the summer months in this humid subtropical coastal climate I am in now.  

Others may be able to tune in with their experiencies and what techniques they use in dialing with humid, hot environments to successfully ferment, sprout and grow culture food in general ...  




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Cristina
Friday, July 9, 2010, 10:21pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Regarding making the time to do these things now or not, that is fine, I've been there myself too, and, like you, even though we may not be able or willing to make time for these things then, we are still blessed with the spark within us to be interested and keep in touch reading, learning, these techniques..  Keeping in touch, for that 'you never know when we might need it' kind of thing ... At least knowing that if one day, we cannot get any yogurt or Polyflora tablets, or commercial yeast because of catastrophic transport chaoes or some other horrible thing (please not!!),  we will know there is a way to get around these shortcomes and we will still be able to look after the goodies in our guts by baking our own, breeding our own cultures, fermenting, sprouting away ...  




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Jenny
Friday, July 9, 2010, 10:35pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Woo-hoo
I got fed up with trying to use the slow cooker as a bath for the sour dough starter--it just seemed to go on forever with not enough activity despite one small window of success, so I just left the bowl of starter on the bench overnight --very low temperature in my climate--this morning it is frothing and bubbling in a most satisfactory way, looks like a lambswool blanket that has been through the wash.
all I can think is that the slow cooker on the lowest temp is still too hot. However it is not wasted, I think it will be right for a couple of jars of yoghurt sitting in the water. I am guessing that yoghurt 'cooks' at a higher temp than sour dough.
Now I will try to figure out a recipe for the machine with the correct proportions of starter, flour and liquid. It is such a lucky chance art, not really a science,(like Cristina's) in my kitchen.
I only want to make one loaf at a time.   Perhaps I could do the initial mixing by hand then put it in the machine and fiddle with the timer buttons so that it virtually starts half way into the process? I will be giving it maximum rising times, so that the whole process takes twice as long as normal.



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Cristina
Saturday, July 10, 2010, 4:59am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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WooHoo!!! ditto!!! Well done!!!

It is a chance thing here too, trying to capture what I have been doing to make it less chancy, but still, environment, how the little beasties feel, the quality of berries, flours ... even the rain water, all differs with each attempt!!  and we love it!!! no assured commercial artificial staff for us!!  

My take in the proportion:

1 cup starter
1 cup warm water
2 tsp salt or more to taste
about 5-8 cups flour (dpending on whether white, whole, grainny)

that should give you enough dough to fill the breadmaker tray...

If it is kneaded bread you are after I would just set a medium crust, basic setting and let the machine take care of the rest.  That is what I did with my earlier machine ones, with great success, I think the posts are still under Cristina's Swami X thread.

If it is the no knead bread, then, that is the one you need to use manual settings, select 0 time for almost all knead sessions, set longest time possible for first rise, a few 3-5 minutes or so of punch down time or second knead time (just enough to gather the dough again), about another hour or so for second rise, no knead time for third rise and start with another hour for the last rise, but if you think your loaf got where you want it with height any sooner, remember that for next time and adjust ...

Mine has 3 knead and rise times, plus a punch down I think, your manual settings (if any) may be different ...  Whatever you do, please keep us informed!!  I feel you are in my kitchen already!!! The wonders of cyberspace ....  




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Cristina
Sunday, July 11, 2010, 8:41pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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In spite of my last post, here is a formula I tried for my last loaf, just out of the oven:

2 cups starter
1 cup warm water
1 tbsp celtic salt
about 6 cups flour

Mix salt and water, added it to starter and mix well
Add the flour one cup at a time, mixing well with a fork, but I used my hand for the last cup.  Turned it and twisted it around to blend in all flour.
Covered it with dish cloth and put it in warm place overnight.  

That was at about 8:30pm last night.  At 4:00am this morning it had more than doubled in size!! To the top of the casserole dish I had put the dough in.

I set the oven to very high temp (250C).  Normally I would have transfered the dough to a proper loaf pan tray, but it was so high and beautiful, I did not want to run the risk of letting everything fall down and then have to go through the process of waiting for it to raise again!!!  My crew wanted to have the bread yesterday!!

So I just put the caserole dish with the lid on in the hot oven and set the timer to 20 minutes.  After the 20m, I lowered the temp to about 200C, I removed the lid (happy to see the dough kept its height), sprayed water on top, closed the oven and set it for another 20 minutes.  during that time I sprayed the top twice more for the first 10 minutes.

Removed the loaf, put the dish upside down on a cooling rack covered with dish cloth. After one hour or so, removed it from the casserole dish (had to use a knife to dislodge it from the dish), took photos, cut it, took more photos.  It is now ready to be enjoyed with the coffee I am preparing as soon as I finish typing here ...

In the meantime, the final has gone into extra time (soccer ...) ...  Will be a few more minutes before I get to upload photos to Photobucket and post links here ...

This bread is the top of the range in my collection of sourdough breads!!  Maybe my dough starters are getting better as they mature ...  





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Cristina  -  Tuesday, July 13, 2010, 9:47am
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Ribbit
Monday, July 12, 2010, 12:41am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I haven't read this whole thread, but I wanted to add that I've been sprouting green peas and/or lentils lately.  They taste like dirt, but I find that I actually really want to eat them and enjoy the energy they give.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

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Lola
Monday, July 12, 2010, 2:30am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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my sprouted peas and lentils don t taste like dirt.....


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Cristina
Tuesday, July 13, 2010, 8:56am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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No knead, spelt bread using home made starter.  Recipe in Reply 114 above ...  




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Munchkin76
Tuesday, July 13, 2010, 9:02am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Cristina, that bread looks amazing .  Bet it was scrummy right?


Listen to all, plucking a feather from every passing goose, but follow no one absolutely. CHINESE PROVERB

Andy Pandy��


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Cristina
Tuesday, July 13, 2010, 9:15am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Andy Won the bet!!!  (sending cyber slice of it ... )

I really surprised myself with this one!!! it is the highest no knead bread I baked!! It leaves those bought sourdough breads out there begging!!!   Have you noticed one of my starter jars in the background? ...

BTW Thanks Andy ...  

Also, remember my starters have Polyflora specific for my type !!!  double treasures for the gut ...





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Cristina  -  Tuesday, July 13, 2010, 9:25am
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Cristina
Tuesday, July 13, 2010, 9:21am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Fruit Kimchi progress report:

This morning I transfered it from the slow cook bowl to 3 glass jars.  Tonight they are overflowing!! I may need to split them into more jars ...

This morning I was in a roll!  I started lots of vegie fermenting:

2 jars of sauerkrat using green and red cabbage,
2 jars of celery and lebanese cucumber with a couple of leaves of cabbage to stimulate lactic acid ...

I only use salt, no water at all  

They are bubbling away ... what a nice colouful picture!!!     My good gut inhabitants are already arranging a festival in preparation for the arrival of these goodies to their home ....  




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Munchkin76
Tuesday, July 13, 2010, 9:26am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Cristina, you're a star!

Yes, I did see the jar fermenting away in the background  .  I have yet to get myself sorted on the fermentation front.  I have done one brew of kombucha (3L approx) which is in it's secondary fermentation (bottled) in my cupboard.  It'll be ready on Thursday - will let you know how it turns out.

What do you do with the fermented fruit?  Is it high in alcohol?  I might give this a burl next!

I'm waiting a few weeks (trying to shed a few more pounds accumulated during the Aussie relative visitation) before re-introducing any grains - apart from quinoa breakfast every other day.


Listen to all, plucking a feather from every passing goose, but follow no one absolutely. CHINESE PROVERB

Andy Pandy��


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Cristina
Tuesday, July 13, 2010, 9:57am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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I had this fruit kimchi as a dessert in one of my permaculture classes where everything was home made self sufficiency driven    We then had the choice to have it with home made yogurt, fresh cream (from teacher's own cows) and or cheese curds.  All made in class, except the cream, I think she brought that up already whipped or something ... Needles to say I was nowhere near BTD lifestyle then, but knowing me, i think I either had it with the yogurt or the cheese curds, I was never too found of cream on its own,  ... It was Yummy!!  




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Jenny
Tuesday, July 13, 2010, 10:34am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Just to let you know that I am finally making some reasonable sour dough breads with various flours. Haven't quite finalized the best recipe yet, but have learned a lot of tips from Cristina and will continue to practice the art. I do notice that my sourdough seems to get more active all the time, and after using the bulk of it for a loaf, and reviving it with a cup of rye and a cup of pure water, it is bubbling in no time, and could be used 24 hours later if I wanted to.To be honest I prefer the taste of hybrid modern flour v spelt, so will sometimes make that loaf with various alternative variations such as seeds. These flavours are definitely acquired tastes, and members of my wider family are sometimes less enthusiastic than I am. But my man is very happy with my Explorer loaf made with half spelt, quarter rice flour and quarter millet along with sour dough as he does not like commercial yeast.
The funniest thing of all is that in the end I have found that capturing the wild yeasts in a wide metal mixing bowl on the kitchen bench has turned out to be perfectly successful despite all my hysteria with my cold climate.
Has anyone posted recipes at Recipe Central yet?



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Cristina
Tuesday, July 13, 2010, 10:46am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SwamiX Explorer A2+; L(a-b+); MN,INFP, T/ R1b-M343
Ee Dan
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Jenny, that is great!! True kitchen warrior, conquering the beasties!!!  Once you get your starter going, it seems to be such an easy process ... Are you baking the knead or no-knead versions?




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