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BTD Forums    Diet and Nutrition    The GenoType Diet  ›  To meat or not to meat?
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To meat or not to meat?  This thread currently has 803 views. Print Print Thread
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Beachgirl
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 12:27am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

44% Explorer, Taster, ISFJ
Autumn: Harvest, success.
Posts: 272
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Age: 43
I know others have faced this issue as well, but I'm curious as to what everyone's opinion is on this matter.  Financially, we can't presently afford to buy grass fed/ finished, let alone organic beef.  Trader Joe's sells "vegetarian fed" beef from Australia (I'm sure it's grain fed, which throws off the omega-3/ 6 ratio), and the beef is still pricey, but not as pricey as grass fed beef I'd get at Whole Foods or order online.  So, faced with eating beef you can afford, which may not be quite so "good" for you (but still a better option imo than the regular, run of the mill antibiotic loaded junk at the regular grocery store), or not eating beef all together until you can afford quality beef, which would you choose?  January will be a tight month & I'm as of yet unsure how February will pan out, so I have to make cuts.  I know a lot of our produce will not be organic either, as we just can't afford it right now.  It's disheartening as I'm trying to heal my gut & all of my allergies & asthma and I HATE having to ingest any amount of chemicals or pesticides, but there is really nowhere else we can make cuts in our budget.  


Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again!
Goal weight acheived!!  Woo Hoo!!!!
DH of 18 yrs. O+, DS 17yo O, DS 5yo O, not sure on the boys' RH status.

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Goldie
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 12:39am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

All Gatherer -70 Scorp/Sag on BTD/GENO 17 year
Sam Dan
Posts: 5,922
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MY biggest advice would be:  Do what you can and don't fret.  STRESS will harm you much more then the wrong foods.. In times of other stress it is important to keep a sense of balance.. Your body will not fall apart if it has to suffer slightly.. You already did it much good for how ever long you followed good habits so the body can with stand certain things..

Some bless their foods before eating.. it can help to infuse it with appreciation and gratefulness that you do have foods and can minimize certain issues.. better than grains.. better than junk .. eat hardy and relax.. you will make it through much better during the lean times if you just focus on the good in life..  and we still have it better then many in other places, like war zones starving zones and or parched water shortages places.. sorry I don't mean to be obnoxious just encourage to stress less.. glass half full ..


Being here is invaluable, but not enough. We need ALL the Doctors. I needed them for a very small cancer spot-I could never feel!!! Please do your mammograms! Doing so saved me from cancer later on. I am grateful! Thanks for learning from my experience! I was lucky! I wish the same for YOU!
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ruthiegirl
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 12:39am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI O+ Gatherer, Healing from Fibromyalgia
Kyosha Nim
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I personally cut back on red meat altogether last year to save money. I was already buying "the cheap stuff" because organic and/or grass-fed kosher meat is way beyond my budget, and compromising on kashrut (kosher-ness) is not an option.

I did very, very poorly. My depression returned and I found myself spending lots of money on supplements to get me back on track, until somebody on the thread said "why spend money on supplements instead of real food?" That was well over a year ago and I still have some of those supplements left, since I no longer needed them once I was eating enough red meat.

Since then, I've chosen to eat enough red meat, even though I can't afford the best quality. My body can't function without it.. I can manage, however, on slightly smaller/fewer beef servings as long as I eat enough total protein. I often fill in with eggs and/or poultry to stretch the red meat further. I like to make meatballs with ground beef, ground turkey, shredded carrots and/or sweet potatoes, and eggs.

Your body may react differently to the lack of meat than mine does. None of my kids had any negative reactions to the reduction in red meat; only I did. I would reccomend having beef at least once a month, even if you can't swing it more often than that. If you find that any of you are feeling negative effects from the lack of red meat, then increase the frequency and/or portions.

Have you seen the list of the "dirty dozen" and "clean fifteen" produce? The idea is to know which items are most pesticide-laden and get those in organic form (or skip them altogether) and buy the lower-pesticide foods in non-organic form. Celery is one of the highest in pesticides, so I hardly ever buy it anymore, and always organic when I do. Meanwhile, onions are low in pesticides so I get those in non-organic form at Costco.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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Goldie
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 12:52am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

All Gatherer -70 Scorp/Sag on BTD/GENO 17 year
Sam Dan
Posts: 5,922
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Ruthygirl  did you mean this ..  I would reccomend having beef at least once a month   ???

That would kill me as I would strave to death..


Being here is invaluable, but not enough. We need ALL the Doctors. I needed them for a very small cancer spot-I could never feel!!! Please do your mammograms! Doing so saved me from cancer later on. I am grateful! Thanks for learning from my experience! I was lucky! I wish the same for YOU!
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PCUK-Positive
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 1:14am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Gatherer Rh+, NN, (lewis a+ b-) [Duffy Fy(a+b+) ]
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,944
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Age: 53
Perhaps it may help to sit down and assess your finances in general, to see if there are anything that you do not need to buy, like new clothes, alcohol, etc, then get o the things that can't be cut completely like electricity and see about reducing them. turning the thermostat down one degree etc.

getting a smaller car, not wasting petrol on unnecessary trips etc. the savings can be very good.

then look at your shopping, only buying fruit in season etc, planning meals better so not to waste any food.

not saying you waste any for example but analysing can throw up some funny stuff.

if things are really tight actually planning the same meals for a week and eating them every week, can reduce costs as you don't buy stuff that you don't need.

getting a water filter instead of buying bottled water. using immersion heater less. opening curtains to get some energy from the sun in the cold, then closing them as soon as it's dark, and keeping them closed in the heat to save on air conditioning. I make it a game, saves a fortune, while we need to.

we for example used to go to the shopping centre three to four times week in the past, now we go once and take care of other business on the way. every little bit helps. cut petrol consumption from £100 per week at worst to less than £20 now, cut insurance by half by just shopping around, getting cheaper house insurance cover, not buying sweets (save a lot) plus when you do eat them you really appreciate them

if you like pm me a copy of your outgoings and I'll try and help ( I was an independent financial adviser of 25 years)


Kind Regards PC. FIfHI Swami III Pro

Partner (F) is O+(Non) MN. Duffy Fy(a+b+),  Lewis (a+ b-) Gatherer.
DD ( is O+(Non)NN, Duffy Fy(a+b-) Lewis (a+b-) Gatherer
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ruthiegirl
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 2:13am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI O+ Gatherer, Healing from Fibromyalgia
Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from Goldie
Ruthygirl  did you mean this ..  I would reccomend having beef at least once a month   ???

That would kill me as I would strave to death..


"At least" means having that much as a bare minimum, possibly having more. I personally need red meat at least twice a week to function, although I do best if I have it 5 times a week (as per SWAMI.) Since Beachgirl was considering "not buying any beef at all" if she couldn't afford grass-fed organic beef, I'm advising her to at least include it once each month- don't skip it altogether. And keep an eye on how everybody is feeling, and make beef more often if necessary. Having beef once or twice a week is a much better idea, but if the individuals in her family do OK with beef once a week or once every two weeks, and eating more poultry, fish, and eggs, that may also be reasonable.



Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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BTypeAUS
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 2:19am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

B Type Nomad
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I love lamb, and very happy I'm a B so I can enjoy it too,, we spend quite a bit on red meat but don't waste money on processed or prepackaged foods etc. I always stock up when it's on special, like in the evenings at the supermarkets, I can usually buy good meat for half the price. I can't afford organic either but I try and buy the best I can ..for example, I make sure lamb mince has very little fat and the same with lamb cutlets etc. We don't eat beef at all at home, I guess we are lucky we have such great lamb in Australia,


B+ Nomad, mum to two type O+ boys (21 and 14) and husband type O+
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BTypeAUS
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 2:20am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

B Type Nomad
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Location: Brisbane, Australia
Age: 48
Good advice policy checker  


B+ Nomad, mum to two type O+ boys (21 and 14) and husband type O+
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PCUK-Positive
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 2:45am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Gatherer Rh+, NN, (lewis a+ b-) [Duffy Fy(a+b+) ]
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,944
Gender: Male
Location: UK
Age: 53
Also up the DHA foods like eggs leafy greens and flax oil for example. keeps the mood good.


Kind Regards PC. FIfHI Swami III Pro

Partner (F) is O+(Non) MN. Duffy Fy(a+b+),  Lewis (a+ b-) Gatherer.
DD ( is O+(Non)NN, Duffy Fy(a+b-) Lewis (a+b-) Gatherer
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Rev144
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 2:48am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Summer: Realization, expansion.
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Location: Under a rock
I know you said your budget was tight, this is just an option for later when the funds are there.  You can look at craigslist for steers for sale. You can find a steer that is about butcher size or a little smaller, sometimes you can pay the person you are buying from to take it to the butcher.  Then you have 300 to 400 lbs of meat that should last your family over a year. A lot of times people dont grain the beef, or you can talk to the grower and ask them not to grain your beef.
We found a man here who raises Dexter Cattle.  He does not vaccinate, grain or give them any injections. His price is about 5 cents above the market.  Last year we bought two steers, one bigger 700 lbs, one 400 lbs.  We kept the 700 lb guy for a few months then butchered him.  I think it ended up costing us 3.00 per lb by the time he was cut and wrapped (him included). We have 2.5 acres so we cant do a large scale anything, but raising my own beef is a necessity.  Anyway, its just an option if you have some extra funds.  
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PCUK-Positive
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 3:53am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Gatherer Rh+, NN, (lewis a+ b-) [Duffy Fy(a+b+) ]
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,944
Gender: Male
Location: UK
Age: 53
Whilst it may be better to eat everything organic if you have to choose make smart choices so always buy the top 12 fruit and veg organic. and perhaps don't buy organic fruit and veg that is on the clean list - but do your own research too. (the number in brackets are from other lists that differ slightly to the main one. I checked 8 lists generally they agree but not necessarily in the right order - they also seem to change every year which seems odd)

Pesticides on Popular Produce
1. (worst) Celery (2) I always buy organic
2. Peaches (4)
3.Strawberries (3)
4.Apples (1) I always buy organic
5.Blueberries - U.S. Grown  (10) I always buy organic
6.Nnectarines  (6)
7.Sweet Bell Peppers  (
8.Spinach (5) I always buy organic
9.Kale and Collard Greens (12)
10.Cherries
11.Potatoes (9)
12.Grapes – Imported from outside U.S. (7) I always buy organic
13.Lettuce (11) I always buy organic or grow my own
14.Blueberries - Imported
15.Carrots
16.Green Beans – U.S. grown
17.Pears
18.Plums - Imported
19.Summer Squash
20.Cucumbers - Imported
21.Green Beans - Imported
22.Hot Peppers
23.Red Raspberries
24.Oranges
25.Grapes – U.S. grown
26.Cantaloupe
27.Cucumbers - U.S. Grown
28.Cauliflower
29.Tomatoes
30.Bananas
31.Broccoli
32.Winter Squash
33.Cranberries
34.Plums - U.S. Grown
35.Honeydew Melon
36.Sweet Potato
37.Grapefruit (I can only buy unorganic)
38.Watermelon
39.Cantaloupe - U.S. Grown
40.Cabbage
41.Eggplant
42.Kiwi
43.Asparagus (I can only buy unorganic)
44.Sweet Peas (frozen)
45.Mango
46.Pineapple (I can only buy unorganic)
47.Sweet Corn (frozen)
48.Avocado
49.Onions (least)


The clean List  perhaps the choices you can buy un organic if cost is an issue and they are compliant or course

1. Onions
2. Sweet Corn (I never buy not compliant)
3. Pineapple
4. Avocado Avocado (I never Buy - not compliant)
5. Asparagus
6. Sweet peas
7. Mango (I used to buy organic but now buy unorganic due to cost)
8. Eggplant (I never buy not compliant)
9. Cantaloupe (domestic)
10. Kiwi (I never buy not compliant)
11. Cabbage (I never buy not compliant)
12. Watermelon
13. Sweet Potatoes (I used to buy organic but now buy unorganic due to cost)
14. Grapefruit
15. Mushrooms (I used to buy organic but now buy unorganic due to cost)


Were we shop organic bananas are only slightly more expensive than unorganic bananas so i buy the organic ones anyway.


Kind Regards PC. FIfHI Swami III Pro

Partner (F) is O+(Non) MN. Duffy Fy(a+b+),  Lewis (a+ b-) Gatherer.
DD ( is O+(Non)NN, Duffy Fy(a+b-) Lewis (a+b-) Gatherer
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ruthiegirl
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 3:53am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI O+ Gatherer, Healing from Fibromyalgia
Kyosha Nim
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It's not just having the funds available to buy a whole animal at once; you also need the storage space in your home. I bought a deep freezer when my oldest was a baby, and it broke a few years ago. I haven't had the money to replace it. Some people wouldn't have space for a deep freezer, even if they could afford to  buy one.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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BTypeAUS
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 4:58am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

B Type Nomad
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Age: 48
Quoted from ruthiegirl
It's not just having the funds available to buy a whole animal at once; you also need the storage space in your home. I bought a deep freezer when my oldest was a baby, and it broke a few years ago. I haven't had the money to replace it. Some people wouldn't have space for a deep freezer, even if they could afford to  buy one.


Hehe uve reminded me of my parents home in Iraq, everything was cooked from scratch and we had a deep freezer in the hallway (no room in the kitchen). Mum used to buy fresh meat and freeze it for months ahead. We even had frozen freshly squeezed lemon juice ready for cooking  


B+ Nomad, mum to two type O+ boys (21 and 14) and husband type O+
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Amazone I.
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 6:13am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh+ GT 4...E/..INTJ ....prop.=non-taster..
Kyosha Nim
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l'tyrosine might be a good option for depresseion espec. as being an O dearest r-girl; not expensive at all but highly effective wish you all the best greetings from Switzerland


MIfHI K-174
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Beachgirl
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 7:19am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

44% Explorer, Taster, ISFJ
Autumn: Harvest, success.
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Age: 43
Thanks for the input everyone.  I do try to buy organic for the worst offenders on the list... celery was actually a surprise to me, guess I'll have to switch that one over.  PC, I've gone over our budget & gas & food are our highest costs, the rest are all bills that are pretty set...gas is high in the winter & power is exorbitant in the summer (with our avg. temp being 110+ degrees), but they remain fairly constant throughout the year.  I do go around turning the heat down & shutting off lights & tvs after the family.  I wash most laundry in cold water as well.  Our teenage son recently became a driver, which has driven up our gas & insurance costs.  He knows he will have to start paying for his insurance & gas to help out, but he's only been getting about 4 hrs. a week at his job, so it hasn't even been enough to cover those expenses.  He's currently looking for a new job where he can get more hours, but it's difficult, as NV still has one of the highest unemployment rates in the US.  Also, being in the dessert, in the middle of nowhere, drives up food prices like crazy.  Nothing grows here & everything has to be shipped in, so the cost is passed along to us.  Land is also a premium, so our postage stamp sized lot leaves little room for gardening and any livestock would be out. (not to mention my allergies wouldn't tolerate any animal with hair or fur around even if we had the land and/or the money)  I know things will get better, we just need to tighten up over the next few months.... also, we don't drink so no money is spent on alcohol & I rarely buy anything that's packaged or processed.  It was actually cheaper when I bought that garbage, but I'd never go back to eating that way.  I'll try to add in more eggs & things that are reasonably priced & fill in with good veggies.  Once we do bounce back, I would love to be able to get a freezer & see if we could do some bulk ordering, that would help tremendously!  Thank you all for your opinions & options, I truly appreciate them!  


Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again!
Goal weight acheived!!  Woo Hoo!!!!
DH of 18 yrs. O+, DS 17yo O, DS 5yo O, not sure on the boys' RH status.

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grey rabbit
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 2:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

swamix 47% Teacher-INFP
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,303
Gender: Female
Location: Seattle
Age: 58
Hey Beachgirl, I lived in Las Vegas for a short while, I loved the weather - my ex hated it. You have a wonderful growing season, two actually, out there. It does not take much room to do container gardening, in fact it would be the better way to go even if you did have more room. Containers hold in the good soil and water much longer than just planting in the ground. I know you have wonderful garden centers around there and I know there are garden clubs too. Do a little research and have a lot of fun - really nothing better than planting some seeds and watching them grow!


“Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It’s perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we’ve learned something from yesterday.”

John Wayne's last words
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Rev144
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 5:08pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Summer: Realization, expansion.
Posts: 72
Location: Under a rock
The container gardening is a great idea.  I grow greens all winter long in Idaho in what is called Global Earth Buckets. I have grown tomatoes, potatoes, cucumbers, and all kinds of greens in these.  Here is a link to directions, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Dk1H-3YtD0&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lE8OrdUZQKk
My buckets look like these, but I use one 6 gal bucket and cut the bottom out of some 5 gallon water bottle and used it for the space between the water resivor and the dirt.- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXEgJXec_Zk&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbTdcoqkEDU&feature=related


Sometimes you can get free buckets from deli's .
This is for bigger containers and helpful hints.
http://earthtainer.tomatofest.com/pdfs/EarthTainer-Construction-Guide.pdf  
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Patty H
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 5:16pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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I joined a local meat co-op and bought a CSA for a year of beef, lamb and poultry.  The price per pound is much cheaper than buying at Wholefoods or Trader Joe's and the quality of the meat is superb.  It tastes so much better.  You have to save up to pay the money up front, but then you don't have to buy those things throughout the year.  I pick up my share once a month, so it is not like getting an entire year's worth of meat all at once or buying an entire cow and then needing the freezer space to store it.  My share fits nicely in my regular freezer.  I am sure you can find something in your area.  The benefits of joining a meat co-op go well beyond the quality of the food and the cost per pound.


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grey rabbit
Thursday, December 29, 2011, 5:36pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

swamix 47% Teacher-INFP
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,303
Gender: Female
Location: Seattle
Age: 58


“Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It’s perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we’ve learned something from yesterday.”

John Wayne's last words
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Mrs T O+
Saturday, December 31, 2011, 11:33pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Concealed Carry Gatherer! SWAMI Explorer Blend
Kyosha Nim
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Location: Chicago, Illinois
Any of you have friends that go deer hunting? That should be close to organic meat. Maybe you could offer to pay some of the expenses of the hunter.  (There are various expenses of hunting with licenses, permits, traveling to the woods & lodging.)
Often they like to share their meat with friends. The taste is a little different, but if you stew it or make the hamburger into spaghetti sauce, it it fine.
This year we were blessed with a several packs of venison. Mr T says for me to go ahead & enjoy it. I doubt it is compliant for AB, so I'm glad he isn't too interested!


Interested in nutrition, lactation, religion, politics; love to be around people; talkative, sensitive, goofy; a "fishy Christian" ><>; left-handed; lived on a farm, small town & big city; love BTD/GTD; A staunch La Leche League veteran; b. 10/1947 Check BTD/GTD on facebook!
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Beachgirl
Sunday, January 1, 2012, 12:27am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

44% Explorer, Taster, ISFJ
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Posts: 272
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Age: 43
You guys are awesome!  Grey rabbit, I've tried gardening here and am able to grow herbs really well... everything else I tried was fried before it could fully grow.  I need to experiment more with the timing.  I love the temps, but HATE the 10 mos. of pollen in Vegas.  REv144, thanks for the links... I need to do some more research into those.

Thanks to all the info, I've actually found a meat co-op in Vegas.... I didn't even know we had any!!!  I had Googled co-ops, but not specifically "meat" ones, so, in the future, when we have some more $$$, I'll get a small freezer & go that route.  It won't help for now, but it'll help down the road.  For now, I'll just have to go less beef until I can afford the good stuff.  

Mrs. T O+, you can have my share of venison!!!  My Dad used to hunt (east coast) when I was a child & I've never liked it.  Can't get past the taste... same thing with lamb.  I know there are folks that adore it, but I'm not one of them.  Things will be brighter & better down the road, so that's where I've got to keep looking.  


Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again!
Goal weight acheived!!  Woo Hoo!!!!
DH of 18 yrs. O+, DS 17yo O, DS 5yo O, not sure on the boys' RH status.

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PCUK-Positive
Sunday, January 1, 2012, 1:26am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Gatherer Rh+, NN, (lewis a+ b-) [Duffy Fy(a+b+) ]
Kyosha Nim
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Age: 53
venison is a little more palatable with a little cranberry sauce or horseradish.


Kind Regards PC. FIfHI Swami III Pro

Partner (F) is O+(Non) MN. Duffy Fy(a+b+),  Lewis (a+ b-) Gatherer.
DD ( is O+(Non)NN, Duffy Fy(a+b-) Lewis (a+b-) Gatherer
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san j
Sunday, January 1, 2012, 1:40am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Nomadess
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Quoted from Mrs T O+
This year we were blessed with a several packs of venison. Mr T says for me to go ahead & enjoy it. I doubt it is compliant for AB, so I'm glad he isn't too interested!


TypeBASE says Venison is neutral for the AB-nonnie, but Avoid for the AB-secretor. Note, however, that Venison shows up, in Live Right 4 Your Type, on "Tier Two", rather than "Tier One", which means that if Mr. T is not pursuing maximum-compliance, occasional Venison would not be particularly detrimental.

There are numerous ways to make venison absolutely delicious. Amazon has many books on the subject, BTW.


D'Adamo proponent since 1997
dadamo Blogger and Forum participant since 2005
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