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Milk and Hunters  This thread currently has 2,533 views. Print Print Thread
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Sahara
Tuesday, November 8, 2011, 11:46pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Joeyy, also consider the possibility that high cholesterol is not necessarily a bad thing, I've read this is normal for Os.  I never felt normal or well on a vegetarian diet, not mentally or physically.  Something was always "off".  
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Susana
Tuesday, November 8, 2011, 11:58pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT1 Hunter 51%
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 1,445
Gender: Female
Location: Tenerife, Spain
Age: 51
Quoted from Joeyy
.... Since giving up milk I have found that my muscles are so much more tired whenever I go for a run. I was far much better off energy wise when drinking milk and exercising.

Quoted from Joeyy
… my doctor… was completely shocked to see how high my cholesteral and blood pressure had shot up

… I came across the "China Study", which I'm sure people have alot to say about. After reading that, it has totally changed my life, especially my health. After 6-7 weeks I re-visited the doctor and my tests are fully back to normal and healthy, just by giving up meat and dairy. While on the GTD I started to notice my skin was becoming dry and dark circles were very visible. I even noticed that my hair was starting to thin rapidly.. All that has been reversed since going vegetarian. Not to mention my energy levels have shot through the roof.

Because of this, I completely ruined my health in the short 5 months of eating saturated fatty, high cholestral, hormoned infected meat and now enjoy a health balanced cholesteral free diet.



Well I am glad you are now doing well without consuming milk.

You may want to read this article from the New England Journal of Medicine: http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/359/3/229/F4.  Possibly the most prestigious medical journal and the article on the link, although a one size fits all, concludes that a high saturated fat and meat diet does not necessarily give rise to cholesterol numbers, on the contrary. There are plenty other research studies with the same conclusions. You must be happy to have found out you are an odd one especially being an O.

Would you say the biggest change you have made GTD vs China Study is to change meat consumption for wheat?  If so, quite interesting.

Best wishes on your new health plan.


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Lola
Wednesday, November 9, 2011, 4:12am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT1; L (a-b-); (se); PROP-T; NN
Sa Bon Nim
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Quoted Text
I think I would rather listen to these people who have actually conducted tests over many years. Until there are long term trial conducted I remain skeptical


http://www.dadamo.com/B2blogs/blogs/index.php/2010/08/10/other-systems-of-diet-typing?blog=27

Quoted Text
'The disputes about “evidence based medicine and naturopathic treatments” are held on a quite low scientific level.'
-Georg Ivanovas


Quoted Text
'If I have not paid greater attention to my numerous critics, it is not that I have failed to study them ; it is simply that I have remained --obstinately it may be-- convinced that these views expressed are, relatively to our present state of knowledge, substantially correct.' ---
Karl Pearson, The Grammar of Science
Dr D:
"Medicine is, by nature, an inexact science.
So there."


good luck in your journey!
know we will always be here for you .....
if you find that you learn nothing and that the path you are on is the best, then this also serves to strengthen the resolve and confidence in your path.


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Lola
Wednesday, November 9, 2011, 5:33pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT1; L (a-b-); (se); PROP-T; NN
Sa Bon Nim
Admin & Columnist
Posts: 51,428
Gender: Female
Location: ''eternal spring'' Cuernavaca - Mex.
Age: 58


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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David
Wednesday, November 9, 2011, 6:23pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Hunter - INFp-INFj-eNFJ
Autumn: Harvest, success.
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Age: 62
Joeyy's experience sounds similar to another O Genotype dieter who discovered they have a rare genetic characteristic which has complicated their O GTD experience.

It sounds to me like Joeyy has a history of having previously decided to be a vegetarian and upon experimenting with the decision to attempt an O diet actually fought the idea of eating meat before he took the first bite. I think that is not a new story among O's. Almost every O I have heard of has responded quickly and impressively to the infusion of meat in their diet. It is clear that he really WANTS to be an vegetarian regardless of other's experiences and that is OK. It is also clear that he is following what he feels is his best path. That does seem to be the best way to learn authentic wisdom. Congratulations Joeyy! The mind is a powerful tool and determiner of personal reality. You are taking responsibility for your health and your experience. That is Great!

While I have not had any lab testing, I measure as Hunter, strength test high on Hunter and almost as high on Explorer.
I can say from my subjective experience with the food list from the Hunter diet and a few things from the Explorer diet has worked great for me and I have seen improvements in more ways than I had hoped or even knew that I needed. Wahoo


Thoughts Are Things... Think The Good Ones... and remember... Moderate exercise is the best mood elevator!
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Patty H
Wednesday, November 9, 2011, 7:13pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

HUNTER L(a+b-) NMg Prop Super Taster ENFP
Ee Dan
Posts: 2,449
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Age: 57
Joeyy, I recently found out that I have a genetic glitch that makes it difficult for me to break down dietary cholesterol, which would be counter intuitive for an O + nonnie Hunter.  It pained me to realize that I would need to take into account this fact and limit my consumption of grass-fed beef.  Funny thing is though, I had already come to this conclusion on my own several months before when my cholesterol went up as well.  When I went back and looked at my SWAMI, I have more than double the servings of fish to red meat per week, so in some respects my SWAMI had already factored this in.  If you were simply following the book and had not invested in SWAMI, you probably WERE eating far too much red meat.  I did a couple of different polls on this forum and found out that I was not unusual.  In general, Hunters get more fish than red meat in their SWAMI.  I think there is an incorrect assumption about O's being red meat eaters.  In general, most O's can digest meat better than the other blood types, but I do not believe that Dr. D meant for us to gorge on red meat at the expense of other, healthy animal protein sources.  I, for one, have been trying to change this misconception and have found that many other O's on this forum tend to do better with fish than with red meat, many of them Hunters.

While my cholesterol numbers are not perfect, all of my ratios are excellent!  I still do consume red meat in moderation, but it is mostly in the form of lamb rather than grass fed beef.  For some reason, lamb seems to be rated differently and I am not sure why.  I try to limit my beef consumption now to once or twice a month and only my own farm-raised grass-fed beef.

I do understand your desire to be a vegetarian from a humanitarian point of view.  I struggle with this myself.  Last year I joined a local meat coop where I can go to the farm and see that the animals are humanely raised, free roaming and grass fed.  Even the chickens and other birds are running free on the farm.  I remember to be thankful for their sacrifice and am grateful that I have access to such a program that supports local, humane agriculture.

I support you in your desire to be a vegetarian.  However, if you do decide that you need some animal protein in your diet at some point in the future, I would highly recommend you consider starting with fish.  Salmon is an amazing fish that can actually help LOWER cholesterol.  Best wishes as you move forward in your journey towards health and wellness  


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weroflu
Sunday, November 13, 2011, 12:12pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

hunter
Summer: Realization, expansion.
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patty

have you tried raw meat?
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Patty H
Sunday, November 13, 2011, 4:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

HUNTER L(a+b-) NMg Prop Super Taster ENFP
Ee Dan
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Quoted from weroflu
patty

have you tried raw meat?


I have eaten steak tartare, but that is about it.  I eat a lot of sushi, so I am more used to eating raw fish.  Why do you ask?


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Sahara
Sunday, November 13, 2011, 5:15pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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The Ancel Keyes Lipid Hypothesis sure has a lot of challengers all over the Internet....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8WA5wcaHp4

Found this interesting article a few days ago that says heart disease is caused by a combonation of oxidation due to free radicals & endocrinoligcal problems due to normal aging/loss of metabolic integrity:

http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/cholesterol-longevity.shtml

Stress accelerates the oxidation of the polyunsaturated fatty acids in the body, so people who consume unsaturated vegetable oils and fish will have some oxidized cholesterol in their tissues. The constant turnover of cholesterol in the tissues tends to lower the proportion of the toxic oxidized degradation products of cholesterol, but in hypothyroidism, the use of cholesterol is slowed, allowing the toxic forms to accumulate.

Many antioxidant nutrients act like a thyroid supplement did in the 1934 rabbit experiments, preventing atherosclerosis even when extra toxic cholesterol is given to the animals. People who eat seafood get much more selenium in their diet than people who eat nothing from the sea, and selenium is one of the extremely protective nutrients that prevent atherosclerosis in animal experiments with excess cholesterol.

It is well established that several antioxidant nutrients are protective factors in heart disease. The medical establishment has expended a great amount of money and time in the last 60 years fighting the use of vitamin E or selenium for treating or preventing heart disease, though many physicians now take vitamin E themselves. But people who study free radical chemistry recognize that polyunsaturated fats are highly susceptible to oxidation, and that saturated fats tend to slow their degradation, acting to some extent as antioxidants. Several experiments and observations have shown that cholesterol itself can protect against damaging oxidation of polyunsaturated fats, protecting DNA and other vital components of the cell. A consistent program to prevent the oxidation of cholesterol would have to include all of the vitamins and minerals that are involved in antioxidant defense, avoidance of nutrients that exacerbate the destructive oxidations, and an effort to normalize the hormones and other factors, such as carbon dioxide, that have protective effects against free radical oxidation.  A low level of cholesterol might increase susceptibility to the oxidants.

The steroids in general, especially those produced in large amounts, progesterone and DHEA, are important parts of the antioxidant defenses. Cholesterol, either that produced internally by the cell, or taken in from the blood stream, is the precursor for all the steroids in the body. Several of the major steroid hormones are antiinflammatory, and cholesterol itself is antiinflammatory. (Mikko, et al., 2002; Kreines, et al., 1990). Cholesterol also protects against radiation damage, and many forms of toxin (saponins, cobra venom, chloroform--W.G. MacCallum, A Text-book of Pathology, 1937, Saunders Co.; many more recent studies show that it protects blood cells against hemolysis--breakdown of red blood cells--caused by heat and other harmful agents; e.g., Dumas, et al., 2002, Velardi, et al., 1991). Cholesterol, vitamin E, progesterone, and vitamin D are considered to be "structural antioxidants," that prevent oxidation partly by stabilizing molecular structures. One of the basic functions of cholesterol seems to be the stabilization of mitochondria, preventing their destruction by stress. Serious stress lowers ATP, magnesium, and carbon dioxide. When ATP and intracellular magnesium are decreased, cholesterol synthesis increases.......

In very young people, the metabolic rate is very high, and the rapid conversion of cholesterol into pregnenolone, DHEA, and progesterone usually keeps the level of cholesterol in the blood low. In the 1930s, a rise in the concentration of cholesterol was considered to be one of the most reliable ways to diagnose hypothyroidism (1936 Yearbook of Neurology, Psychiatry, and Endocrinology, E.L. Sevringhaus, editor, Chicago, p. 533). With aging, the metabolic rate declines, and the increase of cholesterol with aging is probably a spontaneous regulatory process, supporting the synthesis of the protective steroids, especially the neurosteroids in the brain and retina.
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weroflu
Sunday, November 13, 2011, 6:35pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

hunter
Summer: Realization, expansion.
Posts: 94
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to patty,

i don't know what your genetic problem is but eating raw can get around problems where certain enzymes are not produced. people usually associate this with fruits and vegetables but the same principle applies to raw meats where the lipase is preserved in the fat, the cholesterol has not been oxidized/denatured, etc etc.


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Patty H
Sunday, November 13, 2011, 7:34pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

HUNTER L(a+b-) NMg Prop Super Taster ENFP
Ee Dan
Posts: 2,449
Gender: Female
Location: Massachusetts
Age: 57
Quoted from weroflu
to patty,

i don't know what your genetic problem is but eating raw can get around problems where certain enzymes are not produced. people usually associate this with fruits and vegetables but the same principle applies to raw meats where the lipase is preserved in the fat, the cholesterol has not been oxidized/denatured, etc etc.




I just PM'd you.


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