Welcome, Guest.
Please login or register


Main Forum Page  ♦   Latest Posts  ♦   Member Center  ♦   Search  ♦   Archives   ♦   Help   ♦   Log In/Out   ♦   Admins
Forum Login
Login Name: Create a new account
Password:     Forgot password

BTD Forums    Diet and Nutrition    The GenoType Diet  ›  What can a leaky gut let through?
Users Browsing Forum
Googlebot and 6 Guests

What can a leaky gut let through?  This thread currently has 2,600 views. Print Print Thread
2 Pages « 1 2 All Recommend Thread
Lola
Monday, July 12, 2010, 1:36am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT1; L (a-b-); (se); PROP-T; NN
Sa Bon Nim
Admin & Columnist
Posts: 50,988
Gender: Female
Location: ''eternal spring'' Cuernavaca - Mex.
Age: 57
Dr D
Quoted Text
'Liver work' will also help. Personally, I think non-secretors have problems controlling lipid peroxidation in their bile ducts. This may be because of some alteration to their 'reticuloendothelial' system (the white blood cells in the liver) to compensate for their lack of adequate Secretory IgA, a phenomenon producing what is often simplistically referred to as 'leaky gut syndrome.'

Maybe you should do a castor oil pack every now and then. Wear a yellow T-shirt.


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
Logged
Private Message Private message YIM YIM Reply: 25 - 47
Ribbit
Monday, July 12, 2010, 1:43am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

~W~A~R~R~I~O~R~ Defender, Survivor
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 8,156
Gender: Female
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Age: 36
Thank you, Lola.  You just put a tiny piece of my own puzzle together too.  It seems to all come back to this crazy nonnie-hood some of us live in.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 26 - 47
TJ
Monday, July 12, 2010, 10:25pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

54% Nomad
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,486
Gender: Male
Location: Midvale, UT, USA
Age: 39
Dr. D: Celiac Disease (Sprue), ABO and Secretor Blood Types
In contrast with having too much of that antibody, it is ten times more common in celiac patients to have a lack of IgA  (the protective antibody in mucus) than in the general population. There is a strong association between being a non-secretor  and having overt celiac disease, non secretors being about 200% more likely to have celiac than secretors  (1). This would make sense, since it has been noted for over 20 years that Non-secretors had lower levels of IgA than secretors.
Add this to what Lola just quoted, and to the understanding that the blood carrying nutrients away from the digestive tract goes through the liver before going anywhere else, and that does tie things together.

I.e. having "leaky gut"/celiac isn't a good thing, but it's even worse if you're a nonnie because the liver isn't as adept at mitigating the damage.  Is that correct?
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 27 - 47
Ribbit
Monday, July 12, 2010, 10:27pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

~W~A~R~R~I~O~R~ Defender, Survivor
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 8,156
Gender: Female
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Age: 36
I bet this attributes to the hyper-sensitivity we non-secretors appear to have.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 28 - 47
AKArtlover
Wednesday, July 14, 2010, 2:15am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

centered leaning INTP Explorer, Supertaster, SWAMI
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 2,121
Gender: Female
Location: Midwest, US of A
Age: 38
I'm hoping Dr. D will make a surprise appearance here. I'm curious...


"For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well." Psalm 139:13,14
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 29 - 47
TJ
Wednesday, July 14, 2010, 2:13pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

54% Nomad
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,486
Gender: Male
Location: Midvale, UT, USA
Age: 39
Maybe he already has...incognito!
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 30 - 47
PCUK-Positive
Wednesday, July 14, 2010, 2:16pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Gatherer Rh+, NN, (lewis a+ b-) [Duffy Fy(a+b+) ]
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,874
Gender: Male
Location: UK
Age: 53
I think you may all apreciate the following slide you may get bored mid wat through but persever and then the end bit will make sence. i have virus checker this but feel frree to double check.

http://www.acponline.org/about_acp/chapters/central/celiac.ppt


Kind Regards PC. FIfHI Swami III Pro

Partner (F) is O+(Non) MN. Duffy Fy(a+b+),  Lewis (a+ b-) Gatherer.
DD ( is O+(Non)NN, Duffy Fy(a+b-) Lewis (a+b-) Gatherer
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 31 - 47
TJ
Wednesday, July 14, 2010, 2:17pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

54% Nomad
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,486
Gender: Male
Location: Midvale, UT, USA
Age: 39
On another note, I reran my SWAMI yesterday, unchecking digestive problems, and checking allergy/autoimmune (since that's what celiac is), fatigue, joint problems, and environmental sensitivity.  They are all tied together, so I figured that they wouldn't cancel each other out much.  I got fewer dairy products and vegetable proteins this way.
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 32 - 47
TJ
Wednesday, July 14, 2010, 3:28pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

54% Nomad
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,486
Gender: Male
Location: Midvale, UT, USA
Age: 39
Note: I renamed the thread in reflection of the true nature of the discussion here!

I recently came across the term bioavailability in reference to proteins.  High bioavailability means the food is absorbed through the intestine into the blood stream quickly.  It's interesting that eggs and whey are the highest bioavailable sources of protein.  It now makes sense to me why they would be so much trouble: they don't stay in my gut long enough to be digested.

High bioavailability is a plus for supplying your body with protein after a workout, but only if your gut is intact.
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 33 - 47
Dr. D
Thursday, July 15, 2010, 4:07pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Peter D'Adamo
Kwan Jhang Nim
Posts: 4,134
Gender: Male
Location: Connecticut
Age: 58
There are 150 unique mechanisms by which something can be endocytosed (gobbles) up by the cells of the intestines.


A whole system is a living system is a learning system.’ -Stewart Brand
Logged
Site Site Private Message Private message Reply: 34 - 47
AKArtlover
Thursday, July 15, 2010, 4:38pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

centered leaning INTP Explorer, Supertaster, SWAMI
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 2,121
Gender: Female
Location: Midwest, US of A
Age: 38


"For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well." Psalm 139:13,14
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 35 - 47
Chloe
Thursday, July 15, 2010, 5:32pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

42% Teacher Rh+ N1, N1b
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 8,961
Gender: Female
Location: Northeast USA
Age: 71
Quoted from TJ
I've read a lot that says otherwise.


This person agrees with Goldie

http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/dig12.php

TJ, can you find us another point of view to read?

And this refers to undigested nutrients but does not mention undigested foods.
http://www.merck.com/mmhe/sec09/ch125/ch125a.html


"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 36 - 47
ABJoe
Thursday, July 15, 2010, 5:37pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

34% Nomad
Sun Beh Nim
Moderator
Posts: 8,088
Gender: Male
Location: Orange County, CA, USA
Age: 51
Quoted from TJ
[i]I recently came across the term bioavailability in reference to proteins.  High bioavailability means the food is absorbed through the intestine into the blood stream quickly.  It's interesting that eggs and whey are the highest bioavailable sources of protein.  It now makes sense to me why they would be so much trouble: they don't stay in my gut long enough to be digested.

My opinion of high bioavailability is that they don't need as much processing in the gut to be in a usable condition.  Therefore, the shorter time in the digestive tract.  It also means that there will be a higher concentration in the bloodstream due to the quicker digestion pattern...

It may be that they cause problems for you because for some reason you are not able to handle a large influx of protein at one time.  Maybe for you it needs to be spread out over a longer time frame - which happens when other proteins remain in the gut longer - they will break down at different rates, so will be "metered" into the bloodstream.  Do you think this may have any merit?


RH-, ISTJ
Wonderful Wife = A+ Teacher; Darling Daughter = A- SWAMI Explorer
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 37 - 47
TJ
Thursday, July 15, 2010, 8:42pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

54% Nomad
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,486
Gender: Male
Location: Midvale, UT, USA
Age: 39
I think Lola's quote about doing "liver work" is really getting to the point now.
Quoted from Dr. D
There are 150 unique mechanisms by which something can be endocytosed (gobbles) up by the cells of the intestines.
Just when I thought I knew something....   I doubt I have the background needed to understand such detailed biochemistry!

In layman's terms, is it correct that in a "leaky gut", food material is absorbed prematurely (before digestion is complete)?  And that it's a bigger problem for non-secretors because the white blood cells in the liver aren't as effective at catching and removing that material from the blood before is goes on to the rest of the body?

----------
Quoted from ABJoe
It may be that they cause problems for you because for some reason you are not able to handle a large influx of protein at one time.  Maybe for you it needs to be spread out over a longer time frame - which happens when other proteins remain in the gut longer - they will break down at different rates, so will be "metered" into the bloodstream.  Do you think this may have any merit?
Spot on!
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 38 - 47
TJ
Thursday, July 15, 2010, 8:45pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

54% Nomad
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,486
Gender: Male
Location: Midvale, UT, USA
Age: 39
There's always a danger of not even knowing what questions you should ask when you talk to an expert!  But in the event that Dr. D doesn't disagree with my theory about leaky gut, I'll put this out there.
Quoted from Chloe
Let me respond thus:
Quoted from Possum
Goldie - I don't think anyone is talking about "actual food" - more the nutrients (or toxins) or whatever allergens our bodies react to...
I'm not suggesting that you're going to find heavily buttered and salted popcorn pumping through your hepatic vein an hour into the movie.

If I'm wrong, that's just more reason to avoid popcorn.
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 39 - 47
unveganista
Thursday, July 15, 2010, 9:30pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
Guest User
Quoted from TJ
There's always a danger of not even knowing what questions you should ask when you talk to an expert!  


I am most often simply dumbfounded when reading threads like this.
Logged
E-mail E-mail Reply: 40 - 47
Maria Giovanna
Thursday, July 15, 2010, 9:42pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Teacher
Kyosha Nim
Language Expert
Posts: 1,856
Gender: Female
Location: Italy
Age: 52
This laywoman understands that proteins not cut down to the essential aminoacids are allergizing, damages the gut mucosa and creates every sort of problems starting form a leaky gut, the example is celiac disease, all the side damages and the gut villi flattening , malabsorbtion and allergies. Lectins and gluten ffrom milk and wheat  created my sinusitis colds, otitis and terrible eye allergy. BTD and GTD solved 99 % of these problems for me.


INTJ Italy celiac��
Logged Offline
Site Site Private Message Private message Reply: 41 - 47
Possum
Thursday, July 15, 2010, 10:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh- Expluntherer... It means I'm an O...;-)
Ee Dan
Posts: 5,394
Gender: Female
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Age: 53
Quoted from TJ
There's always a danger of not even knowing what questions you should ask when you talk to an expert!  But in the event that Dr. D doesn't disagree with my theory about leaky gut, I'll put this out there.
Let me respond thus:I'm not suggesting that you're going to find heavily buttered and salted popcorn pumping through your hepatic vein an hour into the movie.

If I'm wrong, that's just more reason to avoid popcorn.
oh you crack me up TJ!!!!
I'll have to "digest" all this info before I comment further... which incidentally wasn't quite the intentional pun it appears...
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 42 - 47
AKArtlover
Tuesday, March 13, 2012, 2:51pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

centered leaning INTP Explorer, Supertaster, SWAMI
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 2,121
Gender: Female
Location: Midwest, US of A
Age: 38
Nice little book...
http://www.amazon.com/Leaky-Gu.....331649499&sr=8-2

Starting to put the big picture of my past together...
and understanding how my body works...
Clear vision of what I want in my future is making these choices easier as is my body taking a minute to scream "What a sec, I need more help!"
Reprioritizing. Look out yeasties and nasties, I'm coming for you!

Almost two years, TJ! I'm so happy you are getting it sorted (as am I).


"For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well." Psalm 139:13,14
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 43 - 47
D.L.
Tuesday, March 13, 2012, 3:34pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Explorer Swami 44%, INTJ, Haplo Kla2a
Ee Dan
Posts: 567
Gender: Female
Location: Jackson, Mississippi
Age: 68
I get sinus headaches, drippy nose, upset stomach, and elevated pulse almost immediately after eating/drinking anything dairy. I am also allergic to gluten, even in the smallest amounts. I spent 30 minutes this morning at the grocery store, trying to choose a high cacoa content bar as a test because chocolate is supposed to be good for you in small amounts (plus I LOVE(ed)chocolate). Well, I failed the test. Even one square gave me a headache and runny nose, flem in throat, coughing, and my stomach hurts, though it doesn't sound like Niagara Falls ...yet. So that was a learning experience. Still trying to learn about leaky gut, so your info was helpful, but I'm still a little confused.  
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 44 - 47
AKArtlover
Tuesday, March 13, 2012, 4:10pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

centered leaning INTP Explorer, Supertaster, SWAMI
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 2,121
Gender: Female
Location: Midwest, US of A
Age: 38
Nice little book that summarizes things.

Food allergies can make the gut leaky. Yeasties can make the gut leaky. You can get into a vicious circle with it. We often crave things we are allergic to. Not all allergies are apparent right after eating. Sensitivities could be thought of as allergies that could go away in time (often do on BTD)-- but you do need to avoid those things for a time. Heal the gut.

http://www.thecandidadiet.com/candidasymptoms.htm

Search "leaky gut" on Amazon and you will find several books.

Breaking a fast with reintroduction of foods can tell you some lower grade irritants-- often masked because the body is working on other stuff. I think I am reacting to egg whites. I had an aversion to them lately (gallbladder issue though, too) but when I reintroduced a multi-ingredient item-- immediate rash. Think I narrowed it down to that in the item.

I think I'm going to get the full blown IgG ELISA testing. I'm going to see if I can get a doctor to order it even if insurance doesn't cover it. Sick and tired of being sick and tired.

Here is a nice little PDF from Steve Nenniger's website...
http://www.stevenenninger.com/SteveNenninger/Order_Test_files/Allergens%202%206%202012.pdf

This company http://www.immunolabs.comclaims 95% reproducibility on their results (which I guess can be an issue.)  Jeffery Bland has some kind of quote on the man that runs it and I like him, so I will see if I can go through them-- 154 foods tested.

Don't mean to overwhelm, just leaving a trail.


"For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well." Psalm 139:13,14

Revision History (1 edits)
AKArtlover  -  Tuesday, March 13, 2012, 5:36pm
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 45 - 47
Spring
Tuesday, March 13, 2012, 4:15pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI Explorer
Ee Dan
Posts: 3,029
Gender: Female
Location: Southeastern USA
I don't remember my stomach and intestines not hurting throughout my entire life until I found the BTD. It was an amazing experience!! A fifty-seven year stomachache is a LONG time!!


"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 46 - 47
Victoria
Tuesday, March 13, 2012, 9:00pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Swami Nomad 56%
Sun Beh Nim
Moderator
Posts: 15,372
Gender: Female
Location: Oregon
Quoted from Spring
I don't remember my stomach and intestines not hurting throughout my entire life until I found the BTD. It was an amazing experience!! A fifty-seven year stomachache is a LONG time!!


Hmmmm . . I had one of those too!  I never could understand why everyone else seemed to enjoy socializing so much after meals, when I would be suffering.

And maybe galactose allows B's to be more in harmony with milk, but I would still be in pain if I drank a glass of milk.



Normal day, let me be aware of the treasure you are.
Let me not pass you by in quest
of some rare and perfect tomorrow.
~Mary Jean Irion
Logged
Site Site Private Message Private message Reply: 47 - 47
2 Pages « 1 2 All Recommend Thread
Print Print Thread

BTD Forums    Diet and Nutrition    The GenoType Diet  ›  What can a leaky gut let through?

Thread Rating
There is currently no rating for this thread