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So which O GT can survive Veganism better?  This thread currently has 5,814 views. Print Print Thread
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ruthiegirl
Friday, March 30, 2012, 4:08pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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There's a big difference between veganism and vegetarianism. Vegetarians still eat eggs and dairy products, while vegans do not. Plus there are pescatarians (people who eat  fish/seafood but not poultry or red meat) who use the "vegetarian" label. Type O pescatarians can do quite well, although not as well as an O who includes red meat.

Dairy products are a poor substitute for meat for an O, but it's still better for an O to get ample animal protein, even if it's not from the ideal sources.  Elaine- I hope you're eating ample quantities of Gatherer cheeses for the protein, especially since you're cutting back on eggs. Also, make sure to choose more beans and nuts and fewer grains, and emphasize vegetables over  fruits.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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StarPine
Friday, March 30, 2012, 10:36pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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I was a vegan or 5 years. Felt great for the first 4 but not after that. I had weight gain, I was sluggish, had brain fog and terrible digestion.
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Lola
Saturday, March 31, 2012, 3:24am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
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Aviva
Sunday, April 22, 2012, 11:56am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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This is an interesting thread from my perspective. I'm an O Gatherer and was vegetarian for 5 years, vegan for about half of that. I felt happier like this, as I seemed to prefer that kind of food. Even though I'm an O, I've never had any desire for meat and never missed it when I cut it out.

Anyway, irrelevant of what I consciously prefered or not, I stopped being vegetarian because I was ill. I had menstrual problems caused by fibroids and was badly anaemic. My mother, (an omnivore), had exactly the same problems at the same time, so it looks like what happened to me was genetic, although I accept that it was probably exaccerbated by diet as well.

So, I accept that as an O I should be eating meat and fish, and I do now, but I wonder why I don't have any lust for it? I was perfectly content eating veggie food. There's a euphoria that can come with that way of eating, a psychological sense of virtue or oneness, it's hard to explain, but it was a good feeling and I think that's why many people persue it, as well as the ethical perspective, of course.

During my 5 years of vegetarianism, I spent nearly a year being a raw food vegan and that's the only way I've ever achienved being as slim as I wanted, so I thought it was great at the time. However, 10 years later I now have IBS and the things that set off digestive pain are raw fruit and vegetables! So that period I spent as a raw foodist, thinking it was very healing, seems to have hurt my digestive system, as I can't tolerate that food now.
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Lola
Sunday, April 22, 2012, 4:35pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Aviva, small steps.....hope the guidelines will help heal

read about lectins and deflect

http://www.4yourtype.com/deflect.asp


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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kittykar1
Sunday, April 22, 2012, 5:52pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I ate mostly vegetarian while on weight watchers several years ago and became very ill. Points for meat were really high, so I ate more veggies, beans and grains, so I could eat enough to get full. Could hardly drag myself out of bed, in fact had to stop and rest several times a day bewteen household and working in the office. My hair fell out by the gobfulls (good thing it is really thick) and body held a lot of inflammation and fluid. Once a month as treat I would allow myself a double cheeseburger, using saved up weekly points and I felt so good after I ate it, that should have given  me a clue.

When I started the BTD I could not seem to get enough beef, it was all I wanted to eat.

Having lived it I would not recommend for either genotype.


"A dream you dream alone is only a dream. A dream you dream together is reality."John Lennon

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misspudding
Sunday, April 22, 2012, 7:06pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Aviva
Even though I'm an O, I've never had any desire for meat and never missed it when I cut it out.


I felt the same way. Your story is basically mine. Really awful menstrual problems when I was a vegetarian and really bad IBS, but I though for sure the hamburgers that I ate where what caused it. Clearly it was the bread.

Nowadays, I know that if I have a balanced meat + veggie/live food/fruit meal, as opposed to one high in carbs with little meat, I stay satisfied way longer and overall feel way better, particularly my clinical depression which disappears. I think a vegan lifestyle, at this point in my life, would kill me from the depression alone.




misspudding

---

Me: Celiac type gut problems; seizure disorder; MTHFR
DH: O positive
DS: O negative; "atypical" IBD - SWAMI 44% Explorer

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Sahara
Sunday, April 22, 2012, 8:45pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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I was never really "normal" in a lot of ways till I added meat back.  For years it was one sob story after another, would never suggest not eating meat to an O, just utterly ridiculous advice.
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Bekki Shining Bearheart
Monday, April 23, 2012, 1:15am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Interesting to re-read this thread again--- I still continue to feel my best doing the diet... this morning I was sharing my experience with a young friend. She was shocked when I told her I was going to be 58 at the end of may-- she was sure I was in my 40s! I certainly don't feel my age. I am grateful daily for this way of eating.
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Aviva
Monday, April 23, 2012, 11:37am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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So we're in agreement that meat eating seems to be an important factor to achieve good health for many people, epecially type O's.

But why do you think so many people are drawn to vegetarianism and veganism if it goes against their instincts regarding how to achieve good health? With me, it wasn't upbringing, or fashion following that lead me to it. Maybe it was a lust for more carbs but mostly I just didn't like the blood and viscera that comes with meat and fish.

Not eating flesh is an ideal, but clearly an unworkable ideal for many people, so I wonder why we're drawn to it if it hurts our health?
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ABJoe
Monday, April 23, 2012, 3:46pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Aviva
Not eating flesh is an ideal, but clearly an unworkable ideal for many people, so I wonder why we're drawn to it if it hurts our health?


Many vegetarian proponents talk about / visualize animal abuse and use it (on an emotional level) as justification for not eating animal flesh.  It is the emotional connection with the animals that pushes "us" against logic to choose that path.


RH-, ISTJ
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Maus
Monday, April 23, 2012, 4:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I guess it is just hard to believe that eating meat can be good.  There are so many doctors and nutritionist who advise against it.  That is what I am struggeling, too with.  So many say meat gives cancer etc.  How can one put those doubts out of their head?
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ABJoe
Monday, April 23, 2012, 4:15pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Once again, you have to study the references Dr. D. provides and realize that at this point, you know more about this specific truth than all of those other "advisors".

They use the emotional link of "cancer" to attempt to scare you away from the food.
The studies that they are referencing do not take into account specific physiology differences related to BT and the GT data Dr. D. uses.


RH-, ISTJ
Wonderful Wife = A+ Teacher; Darling Daughter = A- SWAMI Explorer
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Captain_Janeway
Monday, April 23, 2012, 4:42pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from paul clucas
Anemic pathologies would plague Vegetarian Explorers.


Yes, I can agree with this. I have tried to be vegetarian not so much vegan and it failed miserably for me as an A Explorer.


Rh Neg, Le(a+b-), NN, Fy(a-b+)

INTP/INTJ at work
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kittykar1
Monday, April 23, 2012, 8:27pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Aviva,

In my case it was listening to the wrong people. I had the food pyramid pounded into my head during Nursing School and later in the work place.  Meat is bad for your heart. I could not figure out why my Hubby and I were becoming fatter and sicker on less food a day.

He has high blood pressure and we have gotten him off of his loop diaretic, which was causing his kidney lab values to be quite a concern. We are using dandelion instead. Now I am giving him Hawthorne berry capsules and we  have been able to cut his BP meds in half. Will continue until he is totally off of the poison. He became very ill, bloated  and had hives on all his old meds last summer, meds were all changed around. but of course being on the same drug for over 10 years usually cause major side effects.

Unless I have a bone poking through skin or need urgent surgery, I am so fed up with traditional medicine and all the drugs they poke at people and horrible nutrional advice. I won't even work in a tradional setting as a nurse now, because I would have to give advice on something I did not believe in.


"A dream you dream alone is only a dream. A dream you dream together is reality."John Lennon

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Paula 0+
Monday, April 23, 2012, 9:14pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Aviva,
I am an Osec and I followed a vegan diet for only 2 weeks in January  a few years back.  Had lots of IBS type symptoms while on it and fatigue.  But the worst part was that my fibroids grew larger.  I am still battling them now.  But I do stray from my diet with caffeine, coffee and tea.  I am not supposed to have them.  Now I am finding that caffeine can cause fibroids to grow.  Every day is a struggle for me in this area.  
I heard you say you had fibroids while on a vegetarian diet.  Where you eating wheat and drinking caffeinated beverages?  I am asking more for curiosity sake.  I am also hearing that it's to do with
xenoeoestrogens in the environment, our skin care products, plastics, etc.  Have you and your mom looked at any of this?  I have cut alot out, except for the caffeine.  Also dairy is another source of hormones that we need to avoid, but that is part of the blood type also...
Just wondering if you are still anemic and still dealing with fibroids?
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RAW0+
Tuesday, April 24, 2012, 5:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Andreas Cahling bodybuilder and vegetarian did not avoid the stroke. So eat at least fish, please. Everybody need animal protein. He's genotype is Warrior




DNA mt/Haplo X2b4; Y-chrom/R1a1(M207);ESTJ

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ruthiegirl
Tuesday, April 24, 2012, 5:55pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Aviva
Not eating flesh is an ideal, but clearly an unworkable ideal for many people, so I wonder why we're drawn to it if it hurts our health?


It doesn't hurt everybody's health. A Warriors do  very well on vegetarian diets; one egg or a couple ounces of yogurt a day and they've got all the animal protien they need for the day. Even A Teachers do well on less meat than the typical American diet. So, when they cut down on meat, they feel better. Then they take that logic to the extreme and think "If less animal food is good, then cutting it out would be even better!"

You also see a whole lot of guilty vegans who succumb to a little dairy, eggs, or fish every once in a while. They think they're "having moments of weakness" but in reality these "cheats" are what holds their health together. Even more vegetarians are "vegan wanna-be's" who don't completely cut out all animal foods but wish they could.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


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Aviva
Tuesday, April 24, 2012, 7:41pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Aviva,
I am an Osec and I followed a vegan diet for only 2 weeks in January  a few years back.  Had lots of IBS type symptoms while on it and fatigue.  But the worst part was that my fibroids grew larger.  I am still battling them now.  But I do stray from my diet with caffeine, coffee and tea.  I am not supposed to have them.  Now I am finding that caffeine can cause fibroids to grow.  Every day is a struggle for me in this area.  
I heard you say you had fibroids while on a vegetarian diet.  Where you eating wheat and drinking caffeinated beverages?  I am asking more for curiosity sake.  I am also hearing that it's to do with
xenoeoestrogens in the environment, our skin care products, plastics, etc.  Have you and your mom looked at any of this?  I have cut alot out, except for the caffeine.  Also dairy is another source of hormones that we need to avoid, but that is part of the blood type also...
Just wondering if you are still anemic and still dealing with fibroids?


Hi Paula

I'm really sorry to hear of your struggle. I know only too well the sense of struggle that goes with fibroids and how you keep searching to find information about how to combat them. I had bad symptoms with them for nearly 10 years and got backed into a corner because the only solution was to have a hysterectomy. I was 41 in Dec 2010 when I had it, with no children, so it was a big step to agree to, but after all those years of struggle, and several blood transfusions to help the constant anaemia I had, it was the only solution that worked for me. I know that's a depressing statement but sadly it was the truth for me. The surgeon told me the fibroid he took out was the largest he'd ever seen. It was 5 pounds in weight. I have no idea why it kept growing.

So, I'm sorry, I genuinely have no good advice to give you because I still don't understand what created these fibroids. I can only assume it was genetics because my mother had a hysterectomy in her late 30s and so did her mother. When I was vegetarian and vegan, yes I was eating wheat and caffeine but I really can't say to what extent food has affected this condition, because when I stopped being veggie, for a long time I followed the type O diet and the fibroid situation didn't improve liked I hoped it would, but other things did seem to improve, like I lost a few pounds and lost dark circles under the eyes - things like that, so I definitely believe that diet can contribute to good health but in my case, I didn't see it cure this condition.

I tried hard to cure my fiboids through diet, through homeopathy, through visualisation, through herbalism but nothing had a long term effect. I felt like a failure for not being able to help myself. All I can say is that a hysterectomy wasn't as bad as I thought it would be in practical terms and that I'm well now, (with the exception of IBS after eating fruit and raw vegetables - a problem which started only in the last two years or so).

I'm sorry I can't be of more help to you.

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Lola
Tuesday, April 24, 2012, 9:35pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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nutrigenomics as well as lifestyle and type of exercise should be BT/GT specific.......Cahling did not know better, and still many simply do not get the message, until it is too late.....

to each their own


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
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The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Brett650
Tuesday, April 24, 2012, 11:39pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Aviva
So, I accept that as an O I should be eating meat and fish, and I do now, but I wonder why I don't have any lust for it? I was perfectly content eating veggie food.
Do you by any chance have any lust for grains, especially wheat? I've learned that this can be a protein craving in disguise.

I've been mostly vegan for the last two decades, often with a carb craving that no amount of bread could satisfy. Then I read Dr. D's advice (in LR4YT, I think) to the effect "if you as a Type O crave wheat, eat some meat" ... and by gosh, it seems to work.


SWAMI 42% Hunter; was mostly vegan until March 2012
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Lloyd
Wednesday, April 25, 2012, 12:53am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Brett650
Do you by any chance have any lust for grains, especially wheat? I've learned that this can be a protein craving in disguise.



Absolutely true. Wheat and meat are both tyrosine sources for craving O's.

Welcome to the forum!

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Kibble
Wednesday, April 25, 2012, 2:25am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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I remember reading a writing by Gandhi.  He said he was totally vegan for about 2 years and felt fine but then had an illness and couldn't regain his former health and strength.  Someone finally convinced him to add goat milk to his diet and he got better.  And I read that Sir Paul McCartney wrote the Dalai Lama calling him out about eating meat.  The Dalai Lama said his doctor told him he had to for his health.  
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Aviva
Wednesday, April 25, 2012, 8:55am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Brett650
Do you by any chance have any lust for grains, especially wheat? I've learned that this can be a protein craving in disguise.

I've been mostly vegan for the last two decades, often with a carb craving that no amount of bread could satisfy. Then I read Dr. D's advice (in LR4YT, I think) to the effect "if you as a Type O crave wheat, eat some meat" ... and by gosh, it seems to work.


Hi Brett, no I think the culprit has something to go with sugar rather than grains or wheat. When I was vegan I was eating a lot of biscuits, (ie: cookies), not so much for the wheat but for the sugar. I'm trying to eat sugar free now, basing my diet on the Gatherer one but not quite because I'm still using a little sucralose as a sweetner, and that's a forbidden. I can't eat any fruit or fructose because it upsets my digestion, so I can't use anything fruit derived as a sweetener. As a Gatherer, it would seem sugar, in all its guises, is the thing I crave. Maybe I felt I enjoyed veganism because it's a sugar/carb fest - you revel in huge amounts of carbs and minimal amounts of everything else.
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Lola
Wednesday, April 25, 2012, 3:18pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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aviva, fyi, wheat and other avoid carbs turn into sugar once metabolized......makes sense, no?


use vegetable glycerin for sweetener, make your body happy


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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