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Dr. Appointment with M.D. that beleives in BTD  This thread currently has 2,631 views. Print Print Thread
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JJR
Wednesday, April 30, 2008, 10:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Well, my first round of testing is done and concluded.  He definitely found things that would be messing with me and told me so.  It's not "all in my head".  He said, "No, it's in your body, not your head."    Good news is he doesn't see anything really serious thus far.  

Bad things found:

#1 There is more bad stuff in my gut than good.  For some reason I have "No Growth" of Lactobacillus species and I should have more Escherichia coli and bifodobacterium.  I think.  Also I have other bad flora that the numbers are too high.  Pseudonomas aeruginosa and mucoid Escherichia coli.  Bad, bad flora, get out.  It's weird, I had been taking a Pro Biotic that my Chiro prescribed but it must have died or something.  Or wasn't any good.  I performed this test only a couple days after starting to take the Polyflora.  I may have to try taking it at night like someone suggested.  I do have a little yeast too but it's not terrible.  There's other stuff too that I don't quite get everything but the gist is I'm having a little bit of trouble digesting but my absorbing is OK.  

#2 My dopamine and seretonin levels are way too low.  This is probably being caused by #3

#3.  I have no glutathione-s-transferase in my system due to genetics.  I guess this acid, enzyme, whatever it is helps turn the heavy metals in your body into water soluble particles and get rid of them.  So in other words, for 36 years heavy metals have been building in my system and not getting flushed.    It's one thing to try and reduce them, but it's another to not have any ability to get rid of them.

#4 My immune system is in a mode of fighting something but apparently doesn't need to be.  I don't quite understand this one but he said it's locked and it creates antibodies and doesn't get rid of them very easily.

He said the main thing that is more than likely zapping me is the inability to detox heavy metals.  Because that can block all kinds of neurotransmitters and play havoc on every system in your body.

Good news is: there is nothing serious going on.  The immune test that shows if you're fighting cancer or lymphoma or AIDS or something shows all good.

The other good news is that he is prescribing supplements that should help fix what is ailing me.  In fact, I'm already taking heavy metal binder right now that he prescribed when I first got muscle tested for supplements.  I'm on about a dozen things right now and he has about a dozen more to muscle test me when I go back next week.  I may or may not need all of them, but that's what I'll find out.

Thank you all for listening.  Hopefully things will straighten out sooner than later. As far as diet goes, he said just follow the BTD.  There were some other things but my mind is blown right now and these I think were the main things.



The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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RedLilac
Wednesday, April 30, 2008, 10:34pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I heard that people who build up iron should give blood.  Would that work for heavy metal build-up?  I also have heard that Chlorella is good for pulling the metal toxins out of your body.

Anyway, Iím glad you found a doctor that can really help you solve your medical problems and get back on the road to health.


I am B- NON-Sec Explorer; my son is B+ SEC Nomad; my Mother was O+; and my Father was AB-
SWAMI Thanksgiving present 2008
Revised from Arlene B- NonSec to RedLilac on 3/31/06
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Mayflowers
Wednesday, April 30, 2008, 10:49pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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ABnoway you don't eat yogurt or drink kefir?
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Lola
Wednesday, April 30, 2008, 11:48pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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what if it turns out you are an explorer, and thus the detox issue....slow acetylator and thus 3.....interesting...


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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JJR
Thursday, May 1, 2008, 1:03am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from 815
ABnoway you don't eat yogurt or drink kefir?


Actually all the time.  I'm not sure whats up with that.  I don't think I asked him why it is, he just seems to think the supplement he has will help.  It may be because I'm not digesting like I should.  Therefore the benefits of the food aren't as great.  Or it may be that the bad flora has been winning.  I don't know.  Or maybe it has something to do with the build up of heavy metals.  Not sure.  Keep in mind though, I buy organic STORE bought yogurt and kefir.  It's pasteurized and I don't know if that kills those good guys too much or not.  I have yet to have any made from raw milk.  I do know someone that is supposedly doing it from raw milk.  I should call her.  But Dr.D's book says you are subject to other bacteria then, possibly.

Lola, I don't know exactly what you mean, but anything is possible.  I have not even cracked the book on the GTD.  I'm scared too.  I should probably but, one thing at a time.  But the genetics definitely point to the Absence of Glutathione-s-transferase.  According to him.  I did ask him about diabetes and he said even though the report said something about it, he doesn't think that's the problem.

Thank you guys for your support!!!!


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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JJR
Thursday, May 1, 2008, 1:42am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I just remembered, even 3 weeks ago when I took that test, it shows my PH was acidic.  Like 6.1 or something.  Now, when I've tested it the last week it hit 7.25.  The doc said that bad flora will live in the acidic environment better.  I guess some live in alkali too, but Dr.D says an AB should be slightly alkali.


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Chanur
Friday, May 2, 2008, 4:40pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from JJR
#2 My dopamine and seretonin levels are way too low.  This is probably being caused by #3

#3.  I have no glutathione-s-transferase in my system due to genetics.  I guess this acid, enzyme, whatever it is helps turn the heavy metals in your body into water soluble particles and get rid of them.  So in other words, for 36 years heavy metals have been building in my system and not getting flushed.    It's one thing to try and reduce them, but it's another to not have any ability to get rid of them.

#4 My immune system is in a mode of fighting something but apparently doesn't need to be.  I don't quite understand this one but he said it's locked and it creates antibodies and doesn't get rid of them very easily.

He said the main thing that is more than likely zapping me is the inability to detox heavy metals.  Because that can block all kinds of neurotransmitters and play havoc on every system in your body.

...Hopefully things will straighten out sooner than later.


This not only sounds like a GT4 (Explorer) like Lola mentioned above, but when that is combined with your doctor wanting you to take/eat artichoke (an AB bloodtype diet avoid that you were concerned about earlier) I have to wonder all the more about your staying with the BTD instead of switching to the GTD because artichokes are a Super Diamond food for Explorers.

I know that you told Lola (and me in another thread) that you do not want to get into the GTD yet because you want to do only one thing at a time. This is making me wonder if you understand that the GTD and the BTD are two different diets. The GTD is not just an extension or more complicated version of the BTD.

If you look into it now and find that the GTD would benefit you more than the BTD it would save you recovery time. That is the part that I am concerned about. Also, if you find out later that you would do better with the GTD than you will with the BTD you will have to relearn your food lists yet again.

If you'd like to try the free online test it's here. It takes less than five minutes to take and get your results.
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TJ
Friday, May 2, 2008, 4:44pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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As I understand, most of the good bacteria in cultured dairy or supplements never makes it to your gut, because it dies in your stomach (from the acid).  There is a process called microencapsulation(?) used in some probiotics that supposedly protects the most of the bacteria from stomach acid, so it makes it to your gut alive!
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Mayflowers
Friday, May 2, 2008, 4:54pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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What about Dr. D's probiotic? Have you tried that one?
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JJR
Saturday, May 3, 2008, 2:21pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Chanur, you could be correct.  I'm not taking "Artichokes".  It's artichoke leaf exract. And when he muscle tested me, my body said AOK.  Maybe there's a difference between the 2.  But I'm not saying you're wrong.  It could very well be that that's what I need.  Maybe I should read it.  It's sitting here, just waiting.

Drive55, thanks, that would explain it.

Mayflowers, I started taking polyflora about 3 days before I took that stool test.  So, it may be working, but didn't have enough time to show.


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Chanur
Saturday, May 3, 2008, 9:27pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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My point with the artichokes was that you need something in them...what exactly I have no clue, but the extract is obviously coming from the artichokes which means you need them even if it's in extract form. You said your body's feedback confirmed this. That is an over-riding of your AB core needs in favor of something else that is also a part of your own personal physical makeup. Maybe, what your AB core needs is a "blanket" or new wardrobe furnished by GTD like Dr. D was talking about in his most recent blog.

I went back and re-read your original post from back on March 10th. The more I read it the more it says GT4 (Explorer) to me.

Please forgive me if this sounds mouthy, but I can't think of any way to put it that sounds less abrasive: You assumed you were an A and have suffered the consequences because you are really an AB. Now, you have assumed that you need the BTD more than the GTD. Are you sure you really want to make another assumption that could be wrong when you could so easily find out for sure one way or the other?
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JJR
Sunday, May 4, 2008, 1:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Chanur,

Thank you for going out on a limb to try and educate me.  I appreciate it.  I know you are trying to help.  As I said before, you could be correct.  Maybe I need to read the book.     

Now that being said, I don't know if artichoke LEAF extract in pill form and artichokes are like eating the same thing.  But, possibly they are.  And quite possibly I'd be better off on the GTD.  I'm not trying to argue, but this stuff can be overwhelming.  There is SO MUCH information out there, and it's only good for you if it is correct.  I could tell that changing from an A to an AB made a positive difference in my body.  So, I was happy for that, making another leap is a little more scary.  I just want  to get better.  So maybe I will have to try something new.  I don't know.  I've had two different doctors now confirm that heavy metals are an issue with me and I'm not sure if changing the BTD would do anything to help me get rid of them or not.  Seems to me if I'm not getting rid of heavy metals, it doesn't matter what I eat, it's going to mess me up.  That doesn't mean I'm just eating whatever.  I realize that following the diet closely helps you get your body in the best order it should be.  Also, hopefully organic food have less toxins and metals but you can't avoid them completely.  They're in the air, water and foods.

I will probably be more open to reading the book now, because of this thread and you guys helping me.  It would be interesting if I could somehow see the link to the genetic test I've had done and the genetic theory behind my GTD.  Whatever GTD I am.  You guys have my interest piqued.

How did you see my original post?  I thought it was all, poooof!  

Thank you again.


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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TJ
Sunday, May 4, 2008, 2:55pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from JJR
Maybe I need to read the book.  


It can't hurt.  You do sound like an Explorer, and chances are strong that the GTD will be better for you than the BTD.

Quoted from JJR
I could tell that changing from an A to an AB made a positive difference in my body.  So, I was happy for that, making another leap is a little more scary.  I just want  to get better.  So maybe I will have to try something new.  I don't know.


I had to do a lot of changing before I got better.  BTD was an indispensably important foundation for those changes, but not enough by itself.  After some time on the BTD, I had to get secretor tested, and I changed to the nonnie diet.  Then I incorporated some big life changes from my adrenal fatigue book to get a bit better.  Then I cut out gluten, and I got even better.  Each of these steps gave me improvements in health, but I had to take the next step to get above the plateau.  GTD may be the next step for you!
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Lola
Sunday, May 4, 2008, 6:32pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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here s great advice on how to make that transition, gradually, for those in doubt.....
http://www.4yourtype.com/which.asp


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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JJR
Sunday, May 4, 2008, 6:45pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Thank you Lola.  I'll check it out.

Drive, believe me, the BTD is not the only thing I've changed in the last year and a half for my health.  There was a point when my candida numbers were "off the charts" according to my ND, that I did not eat barely any fruit besides lemons and Blueberries.  I figured blueberries didn't taste that sweet, therefore they must not have too much sugar in them.  Plus they're really good for you. It was the only treasure I allowed myself.  I also didn't eat ANY kind of bread for about 2-3 months.  I even changed jobs which was a monumental thing and affected my whole family.  These are not the only things either.

The resistance to change to GTD is more out of ignorance in knowing the science behind it, and being skeptical about that.  I don't see how things that are bad for your blood type are all of a sudden good because of GTD.  It seems to be a contradiction.  Again, I'm pleading ignorance, but yet it is a valid question.  And because I haven't read the book, I haven't had that answered yet.  Also, I'm a Bible believing Christian and have a different "theory" on the timeline of the earth.  With the BTD, I can overlook that because of the science behind how blood "reacts" with foods is completely scientifical.  I'm not saying GTD isn't.  I'm saying I'm ignorant and it's one of the questions that has kept me from devouring it right away.  

Along with the fact that again, change takes time sometimes.  I was just learning how to be good with the BTD.  Real Good.  It takes time and effort to learn how to prepare foods a certain way, buy new things, etc.  I feel like I have just started, now I may have to change again?  I'm not afraid of change if I think it will help and it's the right thing.  Obviously I'm not convinced yet, but again, it's out of ignorance.  I'm sure I will not remain in "ignorance" forever about the GTD, but as I said, my concerns that I have stated and have slowed it down a bit.     If my memory serves me correctly, you were trying to do a cross between the both of them, which is supposedly not recommended.  Nothing happens overnight.  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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JJR
Sunday, May 4, 2008, 6:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I see that on this page, http://www.4yourtype.com/prodinfo.asp?number=GT4-3P I seem to fit the description of 3 out of 4 of the explorer problems. Definitely not with being too heavy though. Just the opposite.

  But then when looking at the link that Lola gave me, there's definitely issues in my gut and it says to stick with BTD for that.

You tell me if I shouldn't be confused?????  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Lola
Sunday, May 4, 2008, 7:19pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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NAP s purpose is not to confuse but to help guide you through the transition.


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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JJR
Sunday, May 4, 2008, 7:21pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I know.  I started reading it already.  Just now.  Maybe I'll learn something this afternoon.     I'm reading with a skeptical eye though.  CHANGE YOUR GENES?????  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Chanur
Sunday, May 4, 2008, 8:07pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from JJR
How did you see my original post?  I thought it was all, poooof!  
Nope, no poofing was done. It's all right here.

ABNoWay + = a great big THANK YOU from Chanur for looking into GTD.

Revision History (1 edits)
Chanur  -  Sunday, May 4, 2008, 8:29pm
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Jenny
Sunday, May 4, 2008, 9:42pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Hi AB no way.. it wouldn't hurt to invest a few dollars in the GTD book, and keep it with you until your inner voice tells you it is time to look at it; re your beliefs, you do not have to ditch them, just move through to the chapters that have a practical application; I am profoundly grateful that I moved through and also found the answer to a very small (compared with yours) medical problem by doing so. As you have discovered there is a gang of friends here who will support you at every step.



Eating half and exercising double.
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JJR
Sunday, May 4, 2008, 11:21pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Thanks Jenny.  I have to admit, I'm on page 7 and I'm kind of excited.  What hit home is that blood type is only 1 gene out of 300,000 or something like that.  

If genetically speaking, I don't detox heavy metals well, especially if I'm absent of this glutathione-s-transferase, how can what you eat make it better?  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Spring
Monday, May 5, 2008, 12:06am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Fight a Specific Health Challenge Eat Right 4 Your Blood Type and add the super beneficial foods found in the eight specific diets in Dr. DíAdamoís health Library

AB, did you see this at the bottom of the page Lola pointed you to? GTD doesn't build a fence around you! You CAN make this work. I have had gut issues like crazy but the Geno diet is working all these things out for me. Just like magic!!!!!!!!!!!
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Lola
Monday, May 5, 2008, 12:08am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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once you determine your gt, it will help determine
if you are one of the gts which have trouble detoxing......the diet is aimed to balance each and every one of the gts and the food lists are specially designed to cope with those vulnerable spots.


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Spring
Monday, May 5, 2008, 1:11am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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#3.  I have no glutathione-s-transferase in my system due to genetics.

I would really like to know how he came to this pronouncement. It is my understanding that the liver produces glutathione and what makes him think your liver won't produce some more??? If you indeed had none when you were tested, that doesn't mean you forevermore won't have have it, I wouldn't think. To me, that is almost like saying, sorry, you don't have a head and it is due to genetics! Does he do genetic testing????

I do wish Dr. D. had something in the KnowledgeBase for Dummies that was clear enough for me to understand. There is something there about it all right but not anything that I could find that would tell a person what to do if they were "lacking" it. My guess is, though, if you get your body in better shape, you won't have any lack of  glutathione-s-transferase. Anyway, his saying that it is a "genetic" factor only makes it more critical that you get started on the Geno diet, IMO.
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TJ
Monday, May 5, 2008, 2:03am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from JJR
CHANGE YOUR GENES?????  


Ok, I'll fill you in a little bit on this.  GTD doesn't change your genes, it changes how they are expressed.  I mutes troublemakers and turns up the volume on good guys.  BTD takes an approach of affecting biological processes directly, for instance eliminating foods that contribute to inflammation.  GTD works at a deeper level, influencing those processes by fine-tuning the genes that are involved, for example turning up the volume on the genes that produce glutathione-s-transferase.  Certain foods that may cause trouble at the chemical or tissue level can also improve genetic expression on the intercellular level.  Once the genetics, or should I say epigenetics, have been corrected, the tissue-level troubles aren't as significant (ideally).

Not the case for everybody, though, like me.  I'm already skinny, so when GTD made me lose more weight, I figured it was time to go back to straight BTD.  That, and the calculator said BTD was better for me!
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JJR
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Location: Caledonia, WI
Age: 42
Spring, the test that showed I have no GSTM1 IS a detoxigenomic Profile.  It IS a genetic test.  If I'm seeing it right, it says I have GSTP1, which is in your skin and brain, which I believe is glutathione-s-transferase.  But the GSTM1 is in your liver and kidneys and the test says it's absent.  DUE TO GENETICS.  Handed from my Mom and Dad.  As I understand it, it's absent from the beginning to the end, therefore it's not there, hasn't been there and I believe won't be there, short of a miracle.  Therefore he's going to muscle to test me for a Gel of Glutathione to take.  Again, it seems I have it in my brain and skin, which is good, but I don't think it can make a jump to the liver and kidneys.  That's how I understand it.

Drive, I hear what you're saying.  See above.  But the point is taken.  I understand that it can help vitalize what you got to work better.

  I also don't want to lose any more weight.  However, I don't know if it would change it that much, that I would lose more weight.


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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jayneeo
Monday, May 5, 2008, 4:56pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Rh- Gatherer
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 6,183
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Location: San Jose, CA
Age: 67
ABnoway,
you ask, what can you take for heavy metal detox? I once had this problem, tho a gatherer, (work related) and was put on high doses chlorella and cilantro, and the explorer diet has cilantro and garlic, and thyme, as diamonds.....hope you like cilantro, I love it! Its a super detox herb. Also fish oil (prescribed by naturopath, not sure what Dr. D. feels on that)
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Spring
Monday, May 5, 2008, 5:41pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Quoted from JJR
Spring, the test that showed I have no GSTM1 IS a detoxigenomic Profile.  It IS a genetic test.  If I'm seeing it right, it says I have GSTP1, which is in your skin and brain, which I believe is glutathione-s-transferase.  But the GSTM1 is in your liver and kidneys and the test says it's absent.  DUE TO GENETICS.  Handed from my Mom and Dad.  As I understand it, it's absent from the beginning to the end, therefore it's not there, hasn't been there and I believe won't be there, short of a miracle.  Therefore he's going to muscle to test me for a Gel of Glutathione to take.  Again, it seems I have it in my brain and skin, which is good, but I don't think it can make a jump to the liver and kidneys.  That's how I understand it.

Drive, I hear what you're saying.  See above.  But the point is taken.  I understand that it can help vitalize what you got to work better.

  I also don't want to lose any more weight.  However, I don't know if it would change it that much, that I would lose more weight.


Dr. D. says in the encyclopedia that L-glutathione supplements are good for liver support for all types plus detoxification for Type B, and is one of the body's most powerful antioxidants. I've been taking it for a year or two, and it is rather expensive. I wonder how your parents' health is at this point? And, I assume from what I've read of your posts that this condition has come on fairly recently? Wow, I wish Dr. D. could weigh in on this.....
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JJR
Monday, May 5, 2008, 6:01pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,960
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Location: Caledonia, WI
Age: 42
jayneeoo.  My dentist had me taking cilantro when they removed the old amalgams and put in the newer stuff.  I do believe it made me feel better.  Yes, I don't mind cilantro at all!!!  The doctor I'm going to has some Glutathione gel that I'm getting tomorrow when I go.  Among other things.  I eat garlic, daily.  There usually isn't a day that goes by that I don't eat garlic.  I usually chop 2 cloves up and put it in whatever I'm eating.  Etc. etc.  I can ask about chlorella though.  

Spring, my Mom had dealt with very poor health for about 3-5 years.  She is just starting to feel back to normal in the last 6 months or so.  In fact, she says alot of times she feels better than she did when she was younger.  She attributes this to all the things she's done to be healthy by reading and then the BTD put her over the top.  She rarely went to any doctors because of money, besides the chiro and just let her body get better.  But it took a long time.  She took a whole year off of work after doing tests that showed she was at a risk for having severe problems.  Really low adrenals, neurotransmitters and such.  The gal out our chiro's office did those tests.  So yes, she may have this problem and she is aware of what my tests show.  My Dad on the other hand, I doubt will do much.  But he is informed.  

As far as when this came on for me, I've had a real bad year and a half ever since being diagnosed with H.Pylori infection.  It did a number on me and I've never been the same since.  Up and down.  Good days, bad days.  But overall fatigued and other weird stuff.  So yes, fairly recent.


I know I'll probably be dropping a bunch of money on supplements and will probably always have to do something to eliminate heavy metals.  But as GI Joe said, "Knowing, is half the battle".


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Spring
Monday, May 5, 2008, 7:20pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Quoted Text
As far as when this came on for me, I've had a real bad year and a half ever since being diagnosed with H.Pylori infection.  It did a number on me and I've never been the same since.  Up and down.  Good days, bad days.  But overall fatigued and other weird stuff.  So yes, fairly recent.


ABNoWay, just reading your post there does seem to be some hopeful things about it. You apparently have made a lot of progress, albeit with set backs that are no doubt very, very discouraging.

I'm wondering about the H. Pylori infection. It seems that this stuff is very prevalent and many people show no symptoms. It reminds me of Candida. So I wonder if there was some other problem - maybe even overgrowth of Candida itself that gave this stuff a chance to take over.

That is really great news about your mother's recovery! And her experience has, no doubt, been an encouragement to you when things look so dark at times. You have been a great asset to this board and I'm sure there have been many times when you've posted that we didn't have a clue about how dark things actually were for you.   You have exhibited a tremendous amount of courage, and this thing is not going to keep you down, AB. Without question, your body is putting up a good fight, too, it just needs some help and a little more time.
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JJR
Monday, May 5, 2008, 11:22pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,960
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Location: Caledonia, WI
Age: 42
You trying to make me cry?  

Thank you for the kind words.  It has been tough.  But, whether you agree with this or not, God has blessed me through this whole ordeal.  Even though my health went to the pot, so many things in my life have been great and are for the better, that is hard not to mention it in the same breath.  

Anyways, besides all that, I'm on page thirty something in the GTD and am totally psyched about finding out what I am.  Maybe it will just be another piece of the puzzle to better health. Thank you guys for pushing me passed my skepticism.  

I don't know if I ever mentioned this but my left major pectoral muscle was missing at birth.  Which makes me very asymmetrical.  An Explorer trait.  Although I'm not left handed, nor am I RH-.  But he didn't say they "all" are.

About the H.Pylori and Candida; My ND was getting to the point where he was saying "something" is setting up a bad environment in me that is helping these guys thrive and it's possible it is the heavy metals.  He was starting to say it could be mental, like something deep emotionally, but personally, I don't think that's it.  Not that I poo poo that idea, but I had done a lot of growing and moving on with a rough childhood when I was in my 20's and I don't feel like I'm harboring anything like that.  I could be wrong, but my gut is telling me the metals is an issue because my new doctor is only confirming what my ND had been telling me before.  Every time I saw him the metals was an issue but it was in the background.  We were busy kiling candida because it was the accute thing at the time.

But thank you again for your help and words!!!!!!!!!!!!


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Spring
Monday, May 5, 2008, 11:51pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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It is no strange thing that good things so often happen when we are going through really hard times, AB. Some of the brightest moments of our lives come during the darkest times and as time passes the darkness fades and the brighter times are much more apparent. Of course, this is contrary to the usual relationship between darkness and light! You mentioned God. Reading in the Psalms shows us very well how He came to the rescue of David and others many, many times when they were crying in desperation and anguish for whatever reason.

I certainly agree that the heavy metals can cause bedlam in our systems. When I had Candida overgrowth I was checking out everything under the sun and was tested, of course, for heavy metals. I was considered to be at "normal" levels but I still had all my fillings removed and was taking every supplement available that would detoxify and eating a diet that was extremely strict. It took a few years but I finally got the Candida under control. I know all about the "mental" deal and allergies, adrenal exhaustion, etc., etc., etc...... But there is so much more help available today even than then. One thing you can't buy in a bottle, though, is patience. Think of your progress as an upward spiral. You will feel like you are going round and round but you are actually going gradually upward. Just don't lose your courage!

Yes, this Genotype Diet is absolutely, uh, here is that word again, AMAZING!! Literally.
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Captain_Janeway
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 12:29am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

47% Explorer/Super Taster
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 1,400
Gender: Female
Location: USA
Age: 43
Quoted from JJR
If genetically speaking, I don't detox heavy metals well, especially if I'm absent of this glutathione-s-transferase, how can what you eat make it better?  


Hi AB, less than a month ago I did a paper on detoxification, it is a very complex subject. GSTM and GSTP are just some of the genes involved in detoxifying xenobiotics(substances in the body that should not be there).

If there is a variation in any or some of these genes it can affect the way your cells handle toxins. Some of the ways that you detox are being compensated for by the other detox genes.

These genes require cofactors in order for them to work at the optimum level. Cofactors are found in vitamins and minerals and I would think that the B vitamins are your friends they supply NADH and NADPH needed for them to work. These are compounds that supply the necessary energy for these enzymes to work properly.


Rh Neg, Le(a+b-), NN, Fy(a-b+)

INTP/INTJ at work
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Heidi
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 2:50am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT4Explorer
Autumn: Harvest, success.
Posts: 367
Gender: Female
Location: USA
Age: 43
Since you are Rh+ and a secretor you will not be an Explorer. I'm guessing you are a Teacher. It will be interesting to see what your measurements have to say  



Rh-, ISFP, Super Taster, Non-Secretor 52% SWAMI-XP'd Explorer.

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JJR
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 4:11am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Thank you again spring.  My body feels like it goes through a change every 2-3 weeks or so, at this point.  Sometimes it's for the better and sometimes for the worse.  And sometimes, a little of both.  But thank you for the encouragement!!!!!!

Cpt Janeway, Yes, I'm on methylation support (b12) at present and tomorrow they're muscle testing me for B3 too.  

Heidi, so you're not an explorer at all if you are Pos and Secretor?  I was thinking teacher could be me after reading more too.  But I sure have symptoms of an explorer.  I read all the way to the point of doing the tests and it's late and I'm tired so maybe tomorrow.  I flipped through the pages and it looks confusing.  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Spring
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 4:17am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Most of the stuff won't apply to you. Just follow the things that apply to you and it will make sense. If you are like most people, you will probably need help with the measurements. And don't feel bad if you have to do it three or four times just to be sure! Although some of them can be very close, it could make all the difference in your final determination.
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JJR
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 12:53pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Thank you spring.  I forgot to comment about the psalms but yes, I read one almost every day.  Have been for over 2 years.  Among other things but you are so right, in the hard times when we are crying out, he is near.

I'll probably be calling out when taking these measurements.  

I don't know my "taster" status either.


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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C_Sharp
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 1:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Teacher Rh+ Lewis: a+b-, NN,Taster
Sa Bon Nim
Administrator
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Quoted from JJR
I don't know my "taster" status either.


The taster status is easy to determine with the taster strips.
They are available in the Genotype Kit from NAP. The strips are also available form biological suppy companies.

But you will not need them!!

Since you know your bloodtype, rh factor, and secretor status you should be using the advanced calculator in the back of the book.

Taster status is only used for basic and intermediate calculators.



MIfHI                            I follow a SWAMI diet.
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Spring
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 2:20pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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You will need the taster strips to figure that one out. But you don't necessarily need that right away. Some of the things are simply for the "strength testing" for your type. I didn't get much benefit from that because I strength tested higher than a Warrior in every other group. The main things are the measurements, your blood type, of course, and secretor status which are all listed on page 95. Just concentrate on that list because you already know your secretor status and blood type. Good luck!
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Heidi
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 2:53pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT4Explorer
Autumn: Harvest, success.
Posts: 367
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Location: USA
Age: 43
Quoted from JJR
  

Heidi, so you're not an explorer at all if you are Pos and Secretor?  I was thinking teacher could be me after reading more too.  But I sure have symptoms of an explorer.  I read all the way to the point of doing the tests and it's late and I'm tired so maybe tomorrow.  I flipped through the pages and it looks confusing.  


That's right. You'd have to be one of the following to be an Explorer:

Rh+ and a non-secretor
Rh- and a secretor
Rh- and a non-secretor

Make sure you get someone to help you with the measurements. It is a lot more accurate with assistance then if you try to do it yourself. And for sure skip to the advanced charts in the back of the book since you already know your bloodtype and secretor status. Skipping over the strength tests might make things a little less confusing since your results may indicate a GT other then the one you measure for. And the one you measure for is what you are regardless of how high (or low) your ST results may be.

Good luck, you're almost there  




Rh-, ISFP, Super Taster, Non-Secretor 52% SWAMI-XP'd Explorer.


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TJ
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 3:22pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

54% Nomad
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,486
Gender: Male
Location: Midvale, UT, USA
Age: 39
Quoted from JJR
I was thinking teacher could be me after reading more too.  But I sure have symptoms of an explorer.


Dr. D has said that the six GenoTypes are archetypes. An individual should fit one type more than any other, but have traits of others.  The lines are blurry.  I'm fairly certain that I'm best described by the Nomad type, with my B blood and fatigue issues, but I also have some Hunter tendencies, like the inflammation and slender build, even though I can't be a Hunter.  You are probably a Teacher with Explorer tendencies.
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Captain_Janeway
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 8:00pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

47% Explorer/Super Taster
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 1,400
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Age: 43
When I go back and fill in all the possibilities for GT, I scored the highest for hunter even though I am not an O. Nomad was actually 2nd, and interestingly my fingerprints match the nomad profile.


Rh Neg, Le(a+b-), NN, Fy(a-b+)

INTP/INTJ at work
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Jenny
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 9:32pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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I agree with those above who have said that having assistance with the skeletal measurements is best; but nevertheless I was so keen to do it that I managed to do my own, and when I eventually had assistance I was confirmed the same.
Second, concentrate on the primary measurements, and just do the head shape, jaw, etc for fun later on.
In my experience, once I started the appropriate diet, and especially now that I am focussing on 'diamonds', I knew in my gut that it was right.If I were losing too much weight by over use of 'diamonds' I would switch to a diet of the other superfoods rather than return to BTD. Too confusing for me to turn back.



Eating half and exercising double.
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JJR
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 11:00pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,960
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Location: Caledonia, WI
Age: 42
Thank you guys a ton!!!  I had a "balancing" with my Dr. today and the glutathione that is a gel that you rub on your kidneys and it somehow pulls the toxins out through your bowls.  Don't ask me how, but I tested good for it and will be taking it.  I didn't end up with 2 dozen things, because some things I didn't need at all.  Like my minerals are maxed because I was taking a bunch from the first go around.  We also balanced my kids and I was amazed at what they all needed.  Both of them have problems with candida and my son has to do the same detox gel as me.  Among other things.

After looking at the charts, I think I'm going to end up being a Teacher.  With explorer tendancies as Drive55 points out.  But Just from doing rough math in my head using a pen on my fingers (one hand has the ring finger longer than the index and the other the index finger is longer).  Plus, I'm pretty sure my legs are longer than my torso.  I'll confirm this with the test, but my preliminary status is such.  The Gal in the Dr.'s office said if I figure it out, I should go for it.  

If I am a teacher, it does change my diet some.  Enough that I could see it might make a difference.  NO RICE!!!!!  WOW!!!!


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Spring
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 11:41pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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AB, Lola posted this link on another thread and it is a must read IMO!!! This man (Dr. D.) beats all, for sure!!! And Lola rates a prize for digging this one up!!!

http://www.dadamo.com/B2blogs/blogs/index.php/2006/03/21/polyflora-probiotics?blog=26
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Chanur
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 11:46pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI'd from GT3 to GT6
Ee Dan
Posts: 845
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Quoted from JJR
...NO RICE!!!!!  WOW!!!!


Sorry, ABNoWay, ya lost me there at the end when you said that. Do you mean your Dr. said you're not supposed to have rice? Your kids?  


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Spring
Tuesday, May 6, 2008, 11:51pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Quoted Text
If I am a teacher, it does change my diet some.  Enough that I could see it might make a difference.  NO RICE!!!!!  WOW!!!!


Of course, you can have rice! Which diet are you looking at? My son is a Teacher.
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Ribbit
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 12:09am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

~W~A~R~R~I~O~R~ Defender, Survivor
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 8,156
Gender: Female
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Age: 36
Good grief.  I step away for a day and look what happens.  I miss all this.

ABNW, you need not worry about the GTD not "meshing" with religion--and that's coming from a scientifically-convinced young-earth Creationist.  Dr. D uses timelines and evolutionary terms because that's what he believes.  "Thousands" or "millions" (of years) doesn't much matter when it comes to diet, nor does it affect his research.  He tests the foods and comes to certain conclusions about what the types should eat based on his research.  Then he explains it by using his own terminology.  He could have easily called Explorers simply "Type 4" and not tried to explain how they "evolved" to where they are.  At any rate, his explanation shouldn't affect the outcome.  Fret not thyself.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O

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Caz B
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 2:58am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Yay Ribbit, well said!  


Personality test ESTJ

Planning to overcome Asthma and Adrenal Fatigue with SWAMI.  

Husband 48yrs, A+ Sec * DD 18yrs, A+ Non * DD 13yrs O

John 14:6 - Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
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JJR
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 3:21am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Ribbit, once I read the book, I'm not worried about that any longer.  He even said he's working backwards after finding the 6 types and the evidence is still largely circumstancial, as to how the devoloped.  And also that he's not qualified to say how or when.  Page 9 second paragraph, I was paraphrasing.  This is good enough for me.  As in the BTD, the science is good.  The timelines, I just won't worry about.

Sorry about the rice comment.  There was basmati rice and white rice that are avoid as a teacher.  But I see that they can have brown and something else.

Here's the kicker though.  Someone bust out the Guinness because after doing the measurements I'm nearly certain I'm a Nomad!!!!!!  What a roller coaster, I first thought explorer, then teacher, then warrior (I was looking at the wrong page when I finally did the measurements) now nomad.  My ring fingers are clearly longer, my upper legs are nearly an inch if not that longer, and my torso is quite a bit longer.  I do fit alot of the descriptions.  If I'm measuring everything correctly, which I think I am, Nomad it is.  My wife appears to be a teacher.  I can't believe Beer is a Diamond SuperFood.  I haven't had much alcohol in a year and a half, but I used to enjoy beer.  When I was a wild and crazy youngster I drank alot, but when I became born again, I quit it.  Then I eventually would have some here or there, usually only one at a time.  And enjoyed the taste very much.  Regardless of that, the Nomad diet looks pretty cool.  It opens up a few more doors over an AB secretor.  Liver is a Diamond Superfood.  I never liked it when I was young, but I could probably try again.

I'm not sure when I'll start, that's the other dilemma, but I'm probably going to.

Caz, are you doing the GTD?  What about you ribbit?  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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JJR
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 3:28am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

33% Nomad, calories calories!!!!!!
Kyosha Nim
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Another thing that is interesting that has to do with Lola's post is that my daughter tested out really well for the Polyflora.  I had ordered the B Polyflora and brought it with me.  It tested real good as well.(ab poly)  And this time the gal wrote down to take it away from meals.  That may make a difference, because I was taking it with my meals.  But, interestingly, last time I tested real good for nitricycle and now I didn't need it.  And Lola's link said the Polyflora will help make it.  I wonder if that's why I don't need it any longer.  I don't need intrinsa any longer either.  At this point.  I'll take them back next time I go to retest for them.  

I'm kind of excited about this GTD!!!!


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8

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Lola
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 3:44am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT1; L (a-b-); (se); PROP-T; NN
Sa Bon Nim
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Age: 57
I m looking forward on hearing your progress!
congratulations!


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Spring
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 3:51am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Lola
I m looking forward on hearing your progress!
congratulations!


This is the kind of thing that makes all your hard work worthwhile, right, Lola?!
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Lola
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 4:18am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT1; L (a-b-); (se); PROP-T; NN
Sa Bon Nim
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it sure is a pleasure!


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Caz B
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 6:55am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from JJR


Caz, are you doing the GTD?  What about you ribbit?  


At the moment I'm trying to go wheat free, I can't even say I'm following the BTD because the fatigue is making it hard to cope with the dietary changes (ie preparing things that I can eat)

I would like to follow the GTD but I'm totally depressed about the available fruit on the Gatherer diet.  We are just about to go into Winter here and there is almost nothing that I can have.  I also have the BTD Fatigue book  - so I want to get my act together enough to follow those guidelines for a while.

On another note - I am so excited for you, it seems you are finding out a lot that will help you with your health.  I can't wait to read of your progress.

Best wishes and God bless
Caz


Personality test ESTJ

Planning to overcome Asthma and Adrenal Fatigue with SWAMI.  

Husband 48yrs, A+ Sec * DD 18yrs, A+ Non * DD 13yrs O

John 14:6 - Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
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JJR
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 12:36pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

33% Nomad, calories calories!!!!!!
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,960
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Location: Caledonia, WI
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Quoted from Lola
I m looking forward on hearing your progress!
congratulations!



Lola, is this a surprise to you about the Nomad thing?  You're the one who had me thinking I'm an explorer.  Plus, I still tested good for Artichoke Leaf Extract.  But seems to me my Doc says it's not the same thing as eating an artichoke.  I don't know.  But Nomad's aren't supposed to have artichokes either.  Like I said, I'm pretty darn sure I did the measurements correctly.  I have white lines through all of my fingerprints.  I think I have some ulnar loops but I'm not exactly sure what that means yet totally.  I'll look.  And his whole story in the book is about a girl that had terrible fatigue.  Which is supposedly a trait of a Nomad.  Well I can relate to that.  I am skeptical of adding in the certain meats for Nomads like liver.  I've just been used to staying away from any red meats, besides a little lamb, that I'm kind of worried. Plus, I'm not exactly sure when I'm going to start this change.  Alot of the foods carry over anyways.  I can still have my Blackstrap molasses.  I can't really tell the status of Ezekiel Bread, but a Nomad is supposed to be gluten or wheat free it appears.

CazB, I'm really sorry to hear that.  I'll be praying for you.  I hope you figure something out to help you!!!!!!  It sounds like we have both had problems at similar times in life because were almost the same age.  I think I've said this before but, sorry.  I didn't look at the gatherer diet.  I'll have to see what you are challenged with.


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Lola
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 2:18pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sa Bon Nim
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measurements give us the final verdict!
all GTs have a certain detox issue to them during the resetting time.....I think it s wonderful you found out your real GT through measuring!


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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Ribbit
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 2:55pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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ABNW, the whole "testing" thing is kind of interesting.  I tested allergic to dairy 10 years ago, but it also tested good for me.  I couldn't figure out how that worked and neither could the man who tested me.  He just suggested I not eat it.  That has been confusing to me ever since.  But not anymore.  On the BTD I could not eat either dairy nor wheat because of all the problems it caused.  I can now eat both with no trouble.  I was skeptical about the GTD because I didn't measure obviously one genotype.  I'm more a Teacher, but I measure only slightly more a Warrior.  So after debating and discussing, I went with Warrior, thinking after a few months I might try the Teacher diet and see what happens.  But I've been happy enough with the Warrior diet that I haven't even looked twice at the Teacher list.  I might, at a later date, try it just to see how things go, but right now I'm a happy Warrior.  I'm losing weight slowly but surely (I'm down to 130--my prepregnancy weight--which is quite a feat I must say, with this being  my 3rd and she's just shy of a year old.  And that with no deliberate exercise).


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
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Heidi
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 3:04pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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It looks like Ezekiel bread would be a black dot food since  Essene/Mana bread and sprouted wheat are both black dots. Have you tried the flax bread recipe that is floating around the board? It might be a good substitue for you. When I make it for my family I use 1 c. brown rice flour in place of one of the cups of ground flax. They like it better that way and it still bakes up perfectly. It is super easy and quick to make. I have not tried it yet because it has too many black dots in it for an Explorer but I hear it really good, especially when made into French Toast  

I hope the Nomad diet will help with your health issues.



Rh-, ISFP, Super Taster, Non-Secretor 52% SWAMI-XP'd Explorer.

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JJR
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 3:55pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

33% Nomad, calories calories!!!!!!
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,960
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Location: Caledonia, WI
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Thank you Lola, and Heidi.  I'll have to check out the flax one!!!

Ribbit, I know what you mean.  My son is supposedly highly allergic to fish, but he muscled tested really well for Cod Liver Oil.  I told them the issue and they found different oils to give him.  I think it's evening primrose and something else.  I'd have to look at the sheet.  But anyways, congrats on the weight!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  130 seems pretty light.  I feel like a feather weight and I'm a little more than you.  Although my wife says it looks good, so I'm not sweating it at this point.  At least I'm not still losing.  

I have a feeling some families are going to be adding more kids if they study this diet together.  I never had an easier time getting my wife to take her pants off!!!!!!!  (measured her legs).  OK, too much info, I know.  But I'm telling you, this diet has the potential for doing that with husband and wives!!!!!!!!  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Jenny
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 9:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Now we also have proof that the GTD increases your sense of humour as well as everything else!
ps what does your doc. think of what you are now doing?



Eating half and exercising double.
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TJ
Wednesday, May 7, 2008, 11:56pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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So you're a Nomad?  Neat.  And you say you're only a little bit over 130 yourself?  The book says that short Nomads tend to be more asymmetrical.
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Caz B
Thursday, May 8, 2008, 1:03am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ok Drive, now I'm confused!  Are you saying that AB is short?  Have I missed something?  He was saying he is 130 pds, wasn't he??  

Oh, wait a minute - are you being cheeky??

I'm going now, probably need something to eat to get my brain in gear  


Personality test ESTJ

Planning to overcome Asthma and Adrenal Fatigue with SWAMI.  

Husband 48yrs, A+ Sec * DD 18yrs, A+ Non * DD 13yrs O

John 14:6 - Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
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JJR
Thursday, May 8, 2008, 1:32am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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CazB, what he's saying is Dr.D said Nomad's, when taller, are usually symmetrical.  I am asymmetrical.  My left arm is a hair shorter and I'm missing my major pectoral muscle on my left side.  You can't really tell, but once I told you, you'd know if you were around me.  If I was real beefy with a pig Pec, it would really be evident.  But I'm pretty slender.  Especially now.  I'm only 5'8".  That's not tremendously small, but there I don't know a whole lot of people that are shorter than I.  Dr.D also said Nomads when smaller, tend to be more asymmetrical.  I'm sure drive knows this because he has probably read the Nomad stuff.  Seeing how he is one.  

Drive, also, I strength test very high for a Hunter from what I can tell. But it's impossible for me to even be one.  Strange.  Didn't you say you had hunter tendancies or was it warrior?  

Jenny, I just emailed the Doc about the Genotype.  His assistant said go for it.  I'm just making sure with him, but I'm hoping the answer is yes.  I see you're the only one that wanted to even address my off color comment.  Although I think it's true.  


Also, can anyone tell me how on God's green earth Beer could be a Diamond SuperFood for anybody?


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Caz B
Thursday, May 8, 2008, 1:47am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from JJR
CazB, what he's saying is Dr.D said Nomad's, when taller, are usually symmetrical.  I am asymmetrical.  My left arm is a hair shorter and I'm missing my major pectoral muscle on my left side.  You can't really tell, but once I told you, you'd know if you were around me.  If I was real beefy with a pig Pec, it would really be evident.  But I'm pretty slender.  Especially now.  I'm only 5'8".  That's not tremendously small, but there I don't know a whole lot of people that are shorter than I.  Dr.D also said Nomads when smaller, tend to be more asymmetrical.  I'm sure drive knows this because he has probably read the Nomad stuff.  Seeing how he is one.  




Ok now I get it - der!  I haven't read the nomad profile but I will get to it.  Sooner, rather than later now  


Personality test ESTJ

Planning to overcome Asthma and Adrenal Fatigue with SWAMI.  

Husband 48yrs, A+ Sec * DD 18yrs, A+ Non * DD 13yrs O

John 14:6 - Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
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JJR
Thursday, May 8, 2008, 2:14am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Caz, We're pretty sure my Mom is a Gatherer also.  I forgot to look at the fruits though.  Sorry about that.  Yeah, it's hard to know everyone's info.  There's even more than the BTD!!!!  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Chanur
Thursday, May 8, 2008, 2:43am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Quoted from JJR
I have a feeling some families are going to be adding more kids if they study this diet together.  I never had an easier time getting my wife to take her pants off!!!!!!!  (measured her legs).  OK, too much info, I know.  But I'm telling you, this diet has the potential for doing that with husband and wives!!!!!!!!  

WIVES!!! How many have you got??? After that comment I'm not sure I should let you in on the rest of this post...looks like you may have already figured it out for yourself...
Quoted from JJR
Also, can anyone tell me how on God's green earth Beer could be a Diamond SuperFood for anybody?

Simply put:
A long time ago, doesn't matter if you have a young Earth or an old one, it was found that:
In wine there is wisdom.
          In beer there is fun.
                    In water there are bacteria, prescription drugs, herbicide & pesticide run off, etc.,etc.,etc.

So, which shall we have? Wine or Beer?  
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JJR
Thursday, May 8, 2008, 2:53am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Well I never.....

Just kidding.

Yeah, sounds good about the beer!  If I do this diet, I probably won't drink much, but I will have one now and again.  I think.  I'm kind of worried.  I haven't had one in a long time.  I had a sip or two of red wine on Easter.  But not very much!!!


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Chanur
Thursday, May 8, 2008, 3:27am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ee Dan
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Maybe you would find this previous thread helpful.
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Ribbit
Thursday, May 8, 2008, 1:08pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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We have plenty of whine around here.  Make mine tall and red!

ABNW, are you thinking of more???  Or is your wife?  You know, I have plenty of friends who, after their youngest gets to be 4 or 6 or 8, suddenly they realize life just got a whole lot easier and they start thinking about little ones again.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
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JJR
Thursday, May 8, 2008, 2:27pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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My wife always wants more.  God made the first two happen.  Because I wanted kids but I kept putting off when.  "A little longer, little longer".  My wife was on the pill when she got pregnant both times.  maybe she forgot to take it.  I don't know.  She says, that's not the case.  He had this saying when we were kids, "Accidentally Purposely".  I don't know if that was it or not but now, I just had felt so terrible this last year and a half, just going through the labor would be crushing.  FOR ME!!!!!!  And I'm not doing barely any work!!!!!!!!!!!!  I know it's hard on you gals, but it isn't easy on us either.  The worry, the grabbing of my hands every 2 minutes and squeezing with strenght I've never seen her have.  The middle of the night leaving the house (both times).  Frankly, it scares the you know what out of me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


BTW, the nutritionist in the Doctors office said go for the Nomad thing!!!!!!  She said just keep track if anything seems to flare you up and they can muscle test me on that item.  Oh yeah!!!!!!!!!  Venison now appears to be a neutral.  YEEEEEEHAAAAAWWWWWW!!!!!  And then there's these other meats that I can have.  Moose!!!!  Emu!!!!  Ostrich!!!!!  Liver... well, I'll probably try it.

I've been eating cottage cheese lately, now I have to give that up though!!!!!  

Oh well, I'm excited!!


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Ribbit
Thursday, May 8, 2008, 11:46pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
Posts: 8,156
Gender: Female
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Age: 36
[quote=2879] I know it's hard on you gals[quote]

You have NO idea.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
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Ribbit
Thursday, May 8, 2008, 11:47pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
Posts: 8,156
Gender: Female
Location: Atlanta, Georgia
Age: 36
Quoted from JJR
I know it's hard on you gals


You have no idea.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
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JJR
Friday, May 9, 2008, 12:49am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Cmon, give me some slack.  I've had kidney stones!!!!!  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Mrs T O+
Friday, May 9, 2008, 10:42pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I actually think kindney stones are more painful. At least with labor, you know it will be over. I have had pain worse than labor. But, still labor is a strange thing. Why does it hurt so much? Yet, women keep wanting kids!!
S S & L,
Mrs "T"   O+  


Interested in nutrition, lactation, religion, politics; love to be around people; talkative, sensitive, goofy; a "fishy Christian" ><>; left-handed; lived on a farm, small town & big city; love BTD/GTD; A staunch La Leche League veteran; b. 10/1947 Check BTD/GTD on facebook!
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Spring
Friday, May 9, 2008, 11:03pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Kidney stones with the colic that goes along with them sometimes, are the pits. But I have never known anyone who actually thought they were going to die from the pain. My son's mother-in-law was trying to pass one as big as a large grape recently and the poor woman drove all the way back from seeing her son in Florida by herself in that state. How she did it I do not know. But on the other hand, I don't know any women able to drive several hundred miles in labor, period. My guess is, it ain't going to happen!! Mother-in-law had surgery to remove the stone after she got back home and is doing fine. I do have a very high regard for this great woman!

But there is labor and then there is labor. No two people have the same set of variables. It took me two solid days to have both my sons, but my mother had a maid who told me that she had one of her babies fall out on the hearth in her home and she hadn't even noticed that she was in labor!!  
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JJR
Friday, May 9, 2008, 11:26pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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God said so.  Plus, trying to push that head....  aaaahhh....  It just can't be easy.  Give's me the shivers!


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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TJ
Saturday, May 10, 2008, 12:15am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

54% Nomad
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,486
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Age: 39
Quoted from Mrs T O+
I actually think kindney stones are more painful. At least with labor, you know it will be over. I have had pain worse than labor. But, still labor is a strange thing. Why does it hurt so much? Yet, women keep wanting kids!!
S S & L,
Mrs "T"   O+  


"A woman when she is in travail hath sorrow, because her hour is come: but as soon as she is delivered of the child, she remembereth no more the anguish, for joy that a man is born into the world." (John 16:21)
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Ribbit
Saturday, May 10, 2008, 1:09am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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That's right.  You preach it, brother.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
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JJR
Saturday, May 10, 2008, 2:50pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I forgot about that one.  I was thinking more OT about when man sinned God said we'd work and labor would hurt, etc. etc.


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Mrs T O+
Saturday, May 10, 2008, 9:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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I still don't understand that verse in the NT that talks about 'women being saved in childbearing.'
Any imput from you ><>y friends?
Sea Salt & Light,
Mrs "T"   O+  


Interested in nutrition, lactation, religion, politics; love to be around people; talkative, sensitive, goofy; a "fishy Christian" ><>; left-handed; lived on a farm, small town & big city; love BTD/GTD; A staunch La Leche League veteran; b. 10/1947 Check BTD/GTD on facebook!
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JJR
Saturday, May 10, 2008, 10:07pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Which verse?


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Spring
Sunday, May 11, 2008, 12:19am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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(1 Tim 2:14-15)  "And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. {15} Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety."
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TJ
Sunday, May 11, 2008, 1:07am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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In a nutshell, I believe that verse specifies woman's duty to bear children (provided that she is able to do so).

Of course, women get off lucky.   Child-bearing only can happen during a certain period their lifetime, whilst the man is commanded the eat bread by the sweat of his face all the days of his life!
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Ribbit
Sunday, May 11, 2008, 2:35am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Ha.  Child bearing is not just labor.  You bear the child for 9 months, which is very hard, before you even "bear" them in labor.  Then, if you stay home with them, you bear them around on one hip or the other for another year at least, till they get interested in eating crumbs off the floor.  You bear them through waking up many, many, many times during every night (while your husband sleeps on the couch, blissfully unaware that you've had all of one whole sleep cycle in the last two weeks.)  Then you bear them through their hurts and fears and trials and troubles and bad dreams for years.  It's tiring.  It's painful. You worry and fret over them and bear their burdens with them and for them.  Then they turn around as young adults and all but slap you in the face, unless you have one of those rare relationships where they actually respect you.   Childbearing isn't just about labor.  I think it's pain throughout your/their entire lives.  My husband, after watching me "bear" three small children, and have more pain on a day-to-day basis than he's ever had in his life, readily says I have the more difficult job.  (Of course, I had to leave them with him while I ran to the grocery store a few times before he had a small appreciation for what I do.)

Spring, I finally formed an opinion about what that verse means.  I've wondered about it for many years and have never heard a satisfactory answer about it.  After having three, I begin to understand (if I'm right about my ideas).  This is going to be very controversial among us ><> because it broaches on several iffy topics.

1.  The man (Adam) wasn't deceived.  He knew he was disobeying God.  He chose to do it anyway, knowing the consequences.  Eve was deceived.  She really thought she was doing right.  She honestly believed she was making a good decision.  After all, she just wanted to be like God.  Satan knew she would more likely believe him, which is why he went after her.  Adam was standing right there and saw what was happening (the account in Genesis says, "she gave to her husband with her").  Instead of asking Adam what he thought, or instead of going to God to check again, she believed a lie and disobeyed.  This is iffy because most Christians don't like to talk about women being more easily deceived than men, and men being more likely to knowingly sin, and not care.

2.  Most of us believe the Bible teaches that salvation is not by good works (what we do to earn salvation) but by the grace(undeserved mercy and favor) of God.  But this verse states rather plainly that a woman's salvation comes through childbearing if she continues in faith, charity (love), and holiness with sobriety.  Is this a contradiction?  No, the word "salvation" obviously doesn't mean "eternal salvation" from Hell.  It has to mean that in some practical sense of the word, she's "saved" (kept from) from something.  What could that mean?  And that comes on the heels of the verse about Adam and Eve's sin.  Huh.  This point is iffy because some would argue about the roles of a woman.  I'm not talking about the stay-at-home moms vs. the working moms.  I'm talking about the choleric-type women (and these can be stay-at-home moms) who tend to run the Sunday schools, pastoral positions (in some denominations), the prayer meetings, Bible studies, and this, that and the other.  They leave their children with their husbands or a babysitter while they go to do their churchy stuff, often neglecting the sober-minded faith, charity and holiness that is necessary to Christian child-rearing.  This point (point #2) is about doctrine vs. practise.  I would venture to guess that a woman with children would do well to leave the deep doctrinal stuff to the men and worry more about keeping their homes and raising their children.  This is coming from a girl who used to really soak up the doctrine.  Boy, I'd be in there with the men, learning Greek roots and the 5 points of Calvinism and studying Eschatology.  I was bored with my life, really, even while working a fulfilling job.  I had nothing to do except study Eschatology.  Then I got married and had children.  I totally lost interest in doctrine.  I don't even want to hear it now.  I have more important things to do.  I have little people to feed and take care of and encourage and sing "Jesus Loves Me" to.  I'll leave the doctrine to the men.  I need to figure out how to be charitable when I'm exhausted.  I need to figure out how to explain faith to a 5-year-old.  I need to practise and teach holiness in a profane, sensual environment.  I will be "saved" in childbearing.  How?  I will be "saved" from having to worry about doctrine--I have more important things to do.  I will be "saved" from having to work for a living--my husband works so I don't have to provide for my children.  I will be "saved" from having to worry about food and clothing.  I will be "saved" from fear of people taking advantage of me.  I am saved through childbearing when I do my job--continuing in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety, not in making the huge decisions of life.  I can leave that to my husband.  I'm more likely to believe a lie ("This is a perfect car," lies the used car salesman.  "Your fridge can't be fixed.  You'll need to buy a new one from my company," lies the fridge fixer/seller.  "Your husband doesn't really love you, or he would....." lies the sexy man in the next cubicle over.  Many a woman has been taken advantage of in this way.  --Okay, okay, to be fair, sometimes men are taken in by stuff like this too.  But often they can see through it and they know what's going on.)

In short, Adam wasn't deceived.  He understood the consequences of his actions. But he shied away from his responsibility of leadership, as men are wont to do, and Eve took up the slack and made the decision, as women are wont to do. I am saved from worry, saved from work (meaning, being the bread-winner), saved from decision-making, saved from temptation of men in the workplace, saved from all sorts of things, when I'm home tending to my children.

I know this is going to raise not a few eyebrows, especially to those of you un-churchy-type people who regret reading this post and now think I'm insane and that all ><> are.  I hold a very unpopular view.  And I might be wrong.  But I'm very happy. And now the verse makes sense to me.  I am saved.  Not in an eternal sense (oh, well, yes, I'm saved in that sense too), but in a practical sense.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O

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Ribbit  -  Sunday, May 11, 2008, 12:49pm
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JJR
Sunday, May 11, 2008, 1:43pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Drive, you stuck your hand in a blender there boy.  He doesn't have kids, cut him some slack.  

I don't totally disagree with you ribbit.  I would be interested to know what the original meaning of the word "saved" in that passage is.  I agree that it's probably not an eternal salvation from hell meaning, but I don't know.  Maybe I'll ask today.


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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TJ
Sunday, May 11, 2008, 4:14pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Well, it was said tongue in cheek, but I guess that didn't come through.
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Spring
Sunday, May 11, 2008, 6:56pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Quoted from TJ
In a nutshell, I believe that verse specifies woman's duty to bear children (provided that she is able to do so).

Of course, women get off lucky.   Child-bearing only can happen during a certain period their lifetime, whilst the man is commanded the eat bread by the sweat of his face all the days of his life!


There are millions of women in this country "eating their bread by the sweat of their brow" all the days of their lives married or not. I haven't seen any men bearing children, though. If I see a young couple in town with the young working mother lugging one child around and another hanging onto her skirt and the man walking a few few away from her blithely going along like he has not a worry in the world, I want to give him a good kick to wake him up! Clueless wonder!   You still want to try the blender???  
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Kyosha Nim
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You gals are deserving of so much.  I pray that I can be a good man to my wife and not let her carry all the burdens.  Happy Mother's day to all of you wonderful mothers!!!!!!!!!!!!!  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Mrs T O+
Sunday, May 11, 2008, 8:40pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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WuHuu! Ribbit, that was a great explanation.  Some may misinterpret it, but I know what you mean. There will be time later for more doctrine or career things. Meanwhile, you have so much to do to raise those kids! [BTW, are you a 3, 4, or 5 point Calvinist? I was a 4-pointer for years, but have made up a doctine called 'progressive Calvinism,' kind of a humorous answer to the big debates on it. When my son went to Dallas, there was a doctrine called progressive dispensationalism...
Dallas is more straight dispensationalism. Really, these doctrines don't change our salvation!!!!]
Hey, Double Nickel(55)! Your first sentence was the best explanation I think I have ever heard. Yes, it is a wonderful thing to have kids & it is natural for normal folks to want a family. In response to a blog, I had commented that I didn't want kids as I had a relatively unhappy childhood, but was willing to change. When I was 26, I had the strong desire to have kids(I think I said 'the bug bit me!'). It is within most of us. The messed-up society has dulled that instinct, but even the toughest yuppies usually develop the interest. It is a very strong thing & I'm sure the human race will keep going.....
Spring, thanks for the reference. I thought it was in Galatians. My memory of verse locations is so bad. I wasn't raised religiously & it is harder to learn certain things as an adult. I retain principles well, but forget dry facts. (No, the Word is not dry, but I hope you know what I mean!)
Back to Ribbit...yes, I think we women are often more vulnerable to temptation as we are more relational & need feedback or 'strokes' more often than men. A few men are very sensitive/relational like my sons, but since I didn't have brothers, I learned more about the non-relational psychology of men in adulthood. But male children are a delight & aren't as 'bad' until they are adults. I am so glad I had sons & they were good talkers like me. I have a good relationship with them, but see some changes. They are 32 & 28.9 now.
Now that we got so waaaaaaaaaaay off topic, let's all go to our MDs that believe in BTD!
Sea Salt & Light,
Mrs "T"      O+


Interested in nutrition, lactation, religion, politics; love to be around people; talkative, sensitive, goofy; a "fishy Christian" ><>; left-handed; lived on a farm, small town & big city; love BTD/GTD; A staunch La Leche League veteran; b. 10/1947 Check BTD/GTD on facebook!

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Mrs T O+  -  Sunday, May 11, 2008, 8:49pm
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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from 2330
There are millions of women in this country "eating their bread by the sweat of their brow" all the days of their lives married or not. I haven't seen any men bearing children, though. If I see a young couple in town with the young working mother lugging one child around and another hanging onto her skirt and the man walking a few few away from her blithely going along like he has not a worry in the world, I want to give him a good kick to wake him up! Clueless wonder!   You still want to try the blender???  


Spring, my comment was COMPLETELY sarcastic.   Like I said, it apparently didn't come across that way, but that was the intention.  I have watched my own mother and many other mothers who worked two full-time jobs: one for the money, and one for love (i.e. being a mother), and by no means do I believe women have it made on that account.
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Spring
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Drive, I have always said that we need a tongue-in-cheek smilie! I was teasing you, too, about the blender and the big grin was the nearest to a tongue-in-cheek. Some people have used this --) but a smilie would work better if someone could figure out a good one. BTW, I have two sons and they both learned a loooong time ago how I feel about men who don't value their wives! They are good to their wives now, too. That makes me very happy! Just now I was talking to one son on the phone and suddenly I could hear his wife doing a mild scream in the background. He got right off the phone to see about her. Later, he told me that nothing was wrong she had just seen a spider in the bathroom. I said, what do you mean, don't you know that is a major crisis????? I do NOT like spiders!!! NOT, I tell you!  
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Kyosha Nim
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Sure, backtracking now.

Just kidding.  I believe you.  It's apparent us guys have to stick together.  Hehehhehhahahahhah  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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Ribbit
Monday, May 12, 2008, 5:16pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Oh, whew!  I thought I was going to start a big spat with that one.  Drive, I didn't know you were being sarcastic.  I'm sorry.  Of course, had I known it, I probably wouldn't have written that whole long post, and I really like a couple of things I said, so I'm glad I wrote it out.

The word "saved" there, according to Strong's Concordance, means protected, like I assumed it must.  Here we go (It's #4982 in the Greek Dictionary if you want to look it up):

to save, i.e. deliver or protect (lit.or fig.):-heal, preserve, save (self), do well, be (make) whole.


So a woman would be delivered, protected, healed, preserved, made whole (fulfilled?) in child bearing/rearing.  I have certainly found that to be the case.  

I appreciate y'all's comments.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
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Mayflowers
Monday, May 12, 2008, 5:34pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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I'll stay out of this one. I'm in enough trouble.
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Spring
Monday, May 12, 2008, 10:06pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Whut trouble you talking 'bout, Mayflowers? I ain't seen no trouble!
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Kyosha Nim
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All's well that ends well.  I should know by now that sarcasm isn't transmitted effectively via the written word, yet occasionally, I have to stick my hand in the blender again to see if the blades are still turning.
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Quoted from Ribbit
Oh, whew!  I thought I was going to start a big spat with that one.  Drive, I didn't know you were being sarcastic.  I'm sorry.  Of course, had I known it, I probably wouldn't have written that whole long post, and I really like a couple of things I said, so I'm glad I wrote it out.

The word "saved" there, according to Strong's Concordance, means protected, like I assumed it must.  Here we go (It's #4982 in the Greek Dictionary if you want to look it up):

to save, i.e. deliver or protect (lit.or fig.):-heal, preserve, save (self), do well, be (make) whole.


So a woman would be delivered, protected, healed, preserved, made whole (fulfilled?) in child bearing/rearing.  I have certainly found that to be the case.  

I appreciate y'all's comments.


That must explain why us guys now feel like we're run down after having kids and not "saved".  JUST KIDDING!!!!!!



The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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funkymuse
Tuesday, May 13, 2008, 3:37am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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I feel it means that when you have a child that your heart and soul open in a way that does not happen when you don't.  So many women talk of how they are changed when they have that little one and many talk of how their lives were saved.

My husband says his son saved his life, as he was on a downward spiral in life and having that little boy gave him a whole new outlook.

It's someone to love and cherish in a way that you just cannot know until  you have one yourself.  It's a true gift to be able to birth a new life.  
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Spring
Tuesday, May 13, 2008, 4:12am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Amen, Funky!!
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Ribbit
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Kyosha Nim
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Very true.  Having a baby is a very healing thing.  We have an 18-y.o. girl in our church who was adopted at the age of 4.  Her mother had severely  neglected her and spent a lot of time gone or passed out on the couch drunk.  Anyway, she loves my children and I let her play with them and carry the baby around after church all the time.  I think it's healing her.  I told her last week, with tears in my eyes, that she has an opportunity to undo all the hurt that was done to her as she shows love to other small children.  She stared hard at me and nodded a little.  I know it's done a world of good for me.  As much as I complain about the lack of sleep and as hard as my job is, I wouldn't have it any other way.  The sweetness of a baby heals something deep inside you.


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

"Everything is permissible for me, but not everything is beneficial..."  I Corinthians 6:12

Family: 3 As, 1 B, 1 AB, 1 O
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Yes, agreed completely!


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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BTT for italybound


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
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