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Are we to expect detox reactions?  This thread currently has 3,320 views. Print Print Thread
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mm134684
Wednesday, January 16, 2008, 9:17pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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has anyone felt a bit grouchy or irritable..since starting I can't seem to shake my mood and I also have anxiety..and I have killer headaches...but my digestion is better than its every been!!!! so I must be a gatherer & thats a good sign!!..I'm just hoping my mood will improve and these headaches will dissapear
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Lisalea
Wednesday, January 16, 2008, 9:22pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Ee Dan
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Quoted from 260
has anyone felt a bit grouchy or irritable..since starting I can't seem to shake my mood and I also have anxiety..and I have killer headaches...but my digestion is better than its every been!!!! so I must be a gatherer & thats a good sign!!..I'm just hoping my mood will improve and these headaches will dissapear


Oh yes, it's part of the detox mm134684 ... sigh ...  

Hang in there ... at least  u KNOW that it's working ... woohoo !!  
and
such great news about ur digestion !!


The older I get, the more wide-eyed I become.  
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Melissa_J
Wednesday, January 16, 2008, 9:28pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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My emotions have changed, and I'm unable to hide my feelings as well as I used to (even from myself).  

My skin is less dry, softer, but also more oily (more normal)... I used to not have to wash my face or hair very often, and now have to include it in my daily routine.  

Overall, two good things, but both are taking some adjustments.

I wouldn't be surprised if gatherers can have some weird detox symptoms, since we store so many toxins in our bodies.  Days 4-6 I had some twitching eyelids and thumb, but that has since passed.


Type O+ blogger, secretor afterall. Gluten intolerant. With two gluten intolerant sons:  A+ Secretor 10 yo (also fructose intolerant and slightly egg allergic), and  O- 7yo.
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Olerica
Wednesday, January 16, 2008, 10:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from Melissa_J
My emotions have changed, and I'm unable to hide my feelings as well as I used to (even from myself).  

My skin is less dry, softer, but also more oily (more normal)... I used to not have to wash my face or hair very often, and now have to include it in my daily routine.  

Overall, two good things, but both are taking some adjustments.

I wouldn't be surprised if gatherers can have some weird detox symptoms, since we store so many toxins in our bodies.  Days 4-6 I had some twitching eyelids and thumb, but that has since passed.


I've experienced this too.  Softer skin, having to wash more.  

I've a headache today that I can't drink enough water to rid myself of, which usually works.  

I'm also grumpier lately and not being able to hide emotions as easily.  I hope that passes soon.  


"To be nobody-but-yourselfin a world which is doing its best, night and day, to make you everybody elsemeans to fight the hardest battle which any human being can fight; and never stop fighting." ee cummings
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mm134684
Wednesday, January 16, 2008, 11:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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can anyone tell me how long detox symptoms normally last..cuase yikes! not fun..I'm so happy someone posted his thread because I would have never thought I was detoxing and I would have thought I was going with the wrong genotype...but its good to know we're ridding our systems of all this junk!!
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OSuzanna
Thursday, January 17, 2008, 3:36am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Interesting thread, I almost never got around to reading it...
A week into my BTD life, I got the flu, and don't think it was really a simple detox, since I caught it from the Mr.  However, the coughing was deeper and more productive than ever before, and when I was better, I could breathe better than in ages. This time a week or so into GTD I caught the tummy bug, intestinal mostly and have had it about a week. Today I started actually feeling like I was turning the corner. Now I wonder about the role of diet-change detox in each case. Since I started a few days on the wrong GT diet, I experienced lots of objections from my body. I got the gut flu just as I was starting the gatherer diet, so have spent most of the last week not eating.
I'm taking a whole wait & see approach. I certainly feel more relaxed between the wider food choices and the supps I've started. Relaxed and optimistic.


OSuzanna
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TypeOSecretor
Thursday, January 17, 2008, 6:02am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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My bizarre symptoms fluctuate - I notice some good moments too.

Has anyone else experienced dyslexia?  I have noticed it in the last few days.  I somewhat wonder if it is deja vu - something I experienced in my past but worked hard not to let it happen.  I'm trying to be relaxed now and just let it happen.
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Melissa_J
Thursday, January 17, 2008, 6:25am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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dyslexia...not lately, but it has come and gone in the past.  Usually my problem is forgetting vocabulary, not being able to come up with a word for a week or two.  That problem has actually improved a bit lately.  It could have been a migraine aura, I've gotten mild ones from time to time, cutting out sugar like I have would help with that.  

I also wasn't as clumsy this 'time of month' as I usually am.  I usually drop spoons and spice bottles, etc., all over the kitchen for a couple days out of each month.

My moodiness has leveled out, I'm still a bit softer around the edges, but not as emotional.


Type O+ blogger, secretor afterall. Gluten intolerant. With two gluten intolerant sons:  A+ Secretor 10 yo (also fructose intolerant and slightly egg allergic), and  O- 7yo.
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Peppermint Twist
Thursday, January 17, 2008, 2:08pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from OSuzanna
Interesting thread, I almost never got around to reading it...
A week into my BTD life, I got the flu, and don't think it was really a simple detox, since I caught it from the Mr.  However, the coughing was deeper and more productive than ever before, and when I was better, I could breathe better than in ages.

My experience is similar:  I think there are other reasons I got hit with this cold, yet it has been a very, very profoundly "deep" cold, very productive, as you describe, and exactly like you, I am now--even though I'm still congested, productive, can't taste anything (!), and I have a ways to go, obviously, until this thing clears out--able to breathe better than I have in ages and I feel really, really GOOD even though that sounds so paradoxical to say while I'm still coming out the other side of this thing.  I'm GLAD I got this cold, if that even makes any sense to anyone.  I feel it was really an opportunity and vehicle for some deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep detoxification to take place.  Somehow, it also seems to have cleared out a lot of stress hormones that I've had in the mix since an awful incident on Christmas Eve, plus from ongoing stressors.  It's just like.....gone...poooof....released, remainder muted...niiiiiiiice.

For my part, I've been focusing very intensely on superfoods, drinking a ton of liquids (seltzer, green and herbal teas, homemade soda of seltzer, elderberry, grapefruit and lemon), and taking:  elderberry (liquid and capsules), CoQ10 (I usually do anyway, but a little more, like 60 mg per day instead of my usual 30 mg), and a new kind of vitamin C that is called something like "React-C", by a company I trust (Solaray).  The source is something like "strontium calcium" and I figure, hey, last time I checked, strontium was radioactive (I thought)...so much the better!  Let's nuke everything that isn't nailed down in my system!  Everyone to the fallout shelter!

Seriously, even though I still have a lot of "stuff" left in my head, I can breathe pretty well and more comfortably than I have in ages with my sitch...hard to explain, but just trust me, this cold has gone in and done a deeeeeeeeep cleaning and 42-point lube.  There may have been a tire rotation and balancing included, too, I don't know for sure.

Also, as others have remarked, there is a feeling/sense of "relaxation" on the Gatherer diet.  Maybe it is because it is less restrictive than my former O non diet, but I think it is more than that.  There is something about the foods themselves on the diet that "put me at ease".  Maybe everyone on all the GTDs feel that way when they are on their right one.  I mean, I thought the BTD was customized, but this GTD is truly like Dr. D. sat there and somehow divined the foods that match my body's specific needs perfectly.

How does he do what he does?  I don't know, but I think that when you hit on a diet that makes the dietee feel very relaxed when on it, you have hit a home run.  The body does not relax when it faces threats and invasions.  It relaxes when friends come on in to support it.  All the GTD foods are friends.  Good friends.  BFFs!


"If you are on one of Dr. D's diets and it isn't joyful, you aren't doing it right." - moi

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Peppermint Twist  -  Thursday, January 17, 2008, 2:19pm
BFFs!
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mm134684
Thursday, January 17, 2008, 3:33pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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should we be exercising while we are detoxing..yesterday I attempted and was so exhausted while doing it that it made me wonder if I should wait until my body is done detoxing
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Lola
Thursday, January 17, 2008, 4:35pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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just don t overdo it, it has to feel right and relaxed.....but a sweat daily is a good thing!


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
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funkymuse
Thursday, January 17, 2008, 6:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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We aren't having much of a detox thing happening... but we were becoming really compliant with the ER4YT regimes before we embarked on this... so I think that's what has helped.

Now when we eat avoids we know it!!!  

And we are learning which of the new GT foods affect us badly just by eating them.  So simple... No need to go and have massive expensive food allergy testing done...
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Chloe
Thursday, January 17, 2008, 10:44pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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My first detox reaction was an awful sore throat.  Next day a runny nose.  Third day, incredible
stuffed up nose and a messed up digestive system.  Diarrhea and terribly bloated.  Fourth
day, coughing.  Lots and lots of coughing and lots of productive mucous.  BUT, I'm really bad on dairy and for two days, I ate quark cheese.  So, my reaction might have been dairy related and not detox symptoms. The thing is, how would any of us know if we're eating a food our bodies
are negatively reacting to OR are we having a detox symptom.  For someone who has avoided
dairy for years, I suddenly ate decent sized portions two days in a row.

Day #5, I made an adjustment.  I followed the type A diet as my primary one, but didn't
eat poultry, dairy or gluten...I emphasized HB foods like soy and drank a lot of green tea and  within that same day my digestive system calmed down.

Day #6.  Digestive system back to normal.  Coughing but not a lot of mucous.  I was able
to add one new diamond food back....pine nuts and did fine.

And then I wondered....what if I'm NOT a Warrior at all.  I measured again.  I am a Warrior,
but a Warrior whose body can't tolerate dairy or gluten or eggs.  Plant foods and fish is
what worked for me on the type A diet.

Its day #7.  I slept great last night and although i have the remnants of what feels like I
had a bad cold, I haven't felt physically tired.  I haven't felt emotionally unstable either.

I'm keeping a food diary.  I think it will be helpful to track progress as I add new foods.



"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"
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Melissa_J
Friday, January 18, 2008, 4:18am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Gatherers- find a sauna, any sauna, and use it, it does certainly help.  I was feeling pretty gummed up, but feel much better after a sauna.  It wasn't an infrared sauna, as I can't find one, but I felt so much better after using it.


Type O+ blogger, secretor afterall. Gluten intolerant. With two gluten intolerant sons:  A+ Secretor 10 yo (also fructose intolerant and slightly egg allergic), and  O- 7yo.
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Curious
Friday, January 18, 2008, 4:49am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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How do you know that you are going through a detox as opposed to suspecting that something on the new diet is wrong for you?
If I eat some GTD foods (e.g. quark), I have more backpain.
When I ate some BTD foods (e.g cherries - which are now black dots) I felt better.
It seems to me that the new GTD diet (gatherer) does not work for me - or would more backpain be a detox reaction?
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greenfields
Saturday, January 19, 2008, 1:11am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I was relieved to find this thread! I have been a happy BTDer for many years now and I, too, have been having detox symptoms.

The good news is that my digestive system is moving, moving, moving! I honestly can't believe how much is coming out (in a good way). Sorry if that's TMI! I'm even wondering if I should be eating less.

I had the body odor until I switched to that crystal deodorant which seems to be much better for me. I've had a cough on and off - but it's almost seeming more like I'm more sensitive to avoids now that I'm refining my diet - rather than a total detox reaction, if that makes any sense.

What has helped, though, is loading up on the superfoods. I had a really healthy lunch that put me right back on track feeling good.

I still can't believe I can eat cheese!  
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Melissa_J
Saturday, January 19, 2008, 6:29am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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On the Quark front, I'm beginning to suspect that the smoother versions of quark don't have all the whey strained out.  If they did, it would be more like farmer's cheese or a dry cottage cheese.  I haven't actually found any yet, but the cheese lady at Wild Oats today said the Farmer's cheese they had is very much like quark.  It wasn't at all like sour cream, as some have described it.  There were also two kinds of farmer's cheese, one was hard and had rennet as an ingredient, the other was more like homemade...cottage cheese-like.  I got the cottage cheese/quarky one.


Type O+ blogger, secretor afterall. Gluten intolerant. With two gluten intolerant sons:  A+ Secretor 10 yo (also fructose intolerant and slightly egg allergic), and  O- 7yo.
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Melissa_J
Saturday, January 19, 2008, 10:06pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I had some trouble lately figuring out what type of cheese to buy, then I think I reacted with my corn allergy to the farmer's cheese I bought, I think the "enzymes" listed in the ingredients must have been corn derivatives.  I'll be making my own cheese for the most part now.

I always have to be careful introducing new foods (darn corn allergy, among other things) but the homemade is working out well for me.  I bought some goat milk, so will soon make goat milk farmer's cheese.


Type O+ blogger, secretor afterall. Gluten intolerant. With two gluten intolerant sons:  A+ Secretor 10 yo (also fructose intolerant and slightly egg allergic), and  O- 7yo.
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TJ
Wednesday, January 30, 2008, 3:53pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I'm gonna recommend stickying this thread: a lot of people are likely to experience detox symptoms when starting the BTD/GTD (I did!), and this thread will give them fair warning!
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ruthie
Wednesday, January 30, 2008, 5:15pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I have not had any detox on either diet.  I was sorta' lucky though, as I was a vegan when beginning the BTD.  Well come to think about it...not altogether since I had just returned from India and had been introduced to ghee.  So it was not too big a stretch for me to start eating eggs and chicken and fish in small amounts.
Shortly from returning from India and trying to go Ayurvedic, I discovered DrD's book at the library.  His stress on ghee struck a chord with me, as I was required to drink 1/4 cup of warm ghee on empty stomach according to Panchakarma healing.
When reading about the difficulties of some of the other people trying this way of eating, I feel lucky indeed.
namaste
ruthie


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Ron-A-Non
Thursday, January 31, 2008, 11:45am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Yeah, you can expect detox reactions.  

One thing that's happening, if I understand correctly, is that stored and neutralized toxins in your liver have to be de-neutralized to moveable intermediates in order to flush them out of your body.  

In the meantime, however, the body reacts to them immunologically.  At least this is my understanding... I read about this before I ever discovered Dr. D, in a series of books by a colon-care naturopath named Brenda Watson.
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ruthie
Thursday, January 31, 2008, 1:57pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Maybe I don't know what detox reactions are supposed to feel like.  Am I detoxing and not realizing it?
namaste
ruthie


arrived on planet earth 1928ad/began btd 2001ad
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Peppermint Twist
Thursday, January 31, 2008, 4:12pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Quoted from Melissa_J
Gatherers- find a sauna, any sauna, and use it, it does certainly help.  I was feeling pretty gummed up, but feel much better after a sauna.  It wasn't an infrared sauna, as I can't find one, but I felt so much better after using it.

Can't.  I would get terrible nosebleeds if I went near at sauna at this point.  Even just a night or two with low dew points and my heat on results in a bloody mess...literally.  (Sorry if that was "TMI").

Too bad, because I remember enjoying saunas in the past, on the rare occasions when I had access to one.  Never tried the infrared sauna, though.  Does the infrared method of heating the air leave the humidity intact?  Does anyone know?  That would be news I could use.



"If you are on one of Dr. D's diets and it isn't joyful, you aren't doing it right." - moi

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Peppermint Twist
Thursday, January 31, 2008, 4:23pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Gatherer; iNfj; BTD/GTD aficionado; lost 97 lbs
Kyosha Nim
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I just had, like, a lightbulb moment:

I think, even though it might sound counterintuitive,* that perhaps BTDers go through more detox when starting the GTD than regular old SADers (standard American diet eaters).  Why?  Well!  It has dawned on me that:

They (SADers) are going from a junk-laden diet to a pure diet.  Thus, while detox symptoms are certainly possible, since they are, in fact, detoxifying, they are more likely to experience what most of us experienced when starting the BTD:  nothing but positive things happening, as the junk load lifts and the pure, health-bestowing manna is infused into their systems.  But us BTDers going to the GTD are different:  we are going from an EXTREMELY pure, hypoallergenic, anti-inflammatory diet to a diet that allows a few more inflammatory, "reactionary" (in different ways, some via lectins, some via other avenues) foods into the mix.  The trade-off for this is that these foods have been determined to be good for us an an individual overall, even though they may have specific components that are a little irritating to us.  Like, take cottage cheese for Gatherers, or being allowed to have more grains in all the GTDs than O nons were allowed on the BTD or whatever example you like.

The GTD in some ways "challenges" our systems more, yet at the same time is even more individually tailored than the BTD.

But at first, our systems which are used to a VERY low-lectin, anti-inflammatory diet, might be SHOCKED to the max to have a few "challengers" enter the mix.

Did the above make any sense?  Bottom line:  if we stick it out and get through the rough surf and big breakers near the shoreline when we first enter GTD waters, we will eventually get past that to calmer, deeper waters.  Our BTD-bods just need to get re-acclimated to a few more lectins, et al., and then they will even out, reaping the many, many benefits of a diet tailored to multiple elements of our individual profiles.

* dang, that is the second time I've used the word "counterintuitive" in posts today, what are the odds?


"If you are on one of Dr. D's diets and it isn't joyful, you aren't doing it right." - moi

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focused
Thursday, January 31, 2008, 6:03pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I didn't think I had any detox going on until I read the posts about colds with coughing, Wah-lah!! I experienced the same symptoms but never attributed it to a change in diet. This is indeed a good thread.


SWAMId  Gatherer then Nomad then Gatherer. Currently 40% Nomad - Again.  
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