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Type Unknown
Monday, April 1, 2013, 4:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Hi, I'm back.

I don't know if any of you remember me, but I was sort of a skeptic troll on this message board a few months ago. But doing that helped me change my views on the BTD, so I hope you feel it was worth the abuse!

But I have realized I have another fundamental problem with the BTD, and I want to get your input.

I have noticed with the aging members of my family on the BTD this disturbing trend, which was at the heart of my issues with BTD to begin with:

For certain blood types, BTD places things that are normally considered very healthy, such as cabbage, olives, coconuts, papaya, etc in the Avoid list. Knowing that, if given the choice between a homemade cabbage stir fry and, say, chicken alfredo, they will go for the Alfredo every time.

In their perspective, according to what they read, a cabbage stir fry is just as poisonous to them as chicken Alfredo, but the Alfredo tastes way better.

Now, I know that Dr D'Adamo says it's more important to follow the Highly Beneficial list, and he argues to avoid processed foods. But the fact that things like cabbage are placed in the same category as white flour bothers me--I know in my heart these two are not equal no matter what blood type we're talking about.

What do you think?
Type Unknown
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ABJoe
Monday, April 1, 2013, 4:34pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I think you think that because cabbage is a fresh vegetable that it can't possibly be as toxic as chicken alfredo.  I say that it depends on the individual.
  
For me, chicken is one of the 2 worst foods I can eat, and cabbage is 1 of the best, so you're absolutely correct based on my lists.
  
For someone who both cabbage and the alfredo noodles and sauce are avoids, then you would have to weigh the quantity of each being ingested AND how dramatically each avoid affects the individual.  For many individuals that are weighing this, they aren't interested enough in their health to look for a better food, so they definitely don't care to do the evaluation...  Both foods are harmful for them, and with little effort, they could probably choose something better.  I guess it depends on whether they want to deal with thyroid issues or weight and diabetes issues...  


RH-, ISTJ
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Lloyd
Monday, April 1, 2013, 4:37pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Type Unknown


Now, I know that Dr D'Adamo says it's more important to follow the Highly Beneficial list, and he argues to avoid processed foods. But the fact that things like cabbage are placed in the same category as white flour bothers me--I know in my heart these two are not equal no matter what blood type we're talking about.

What do you think?
Type Unknown


I think you take things out of context for the purpose of argument.

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KimonoKat
Monday, April 1, 2013, 5:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Why are you worrying about what other people eat?  Their decisions don't really have anything to do with you or your observations about BTD.

Why do you give an example of someoneelse's diet, instead of your own?


Knowledge is power.  SWAMI gives you the diet that will unlock the key to better health, and it's all based on your unique individuality.
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2degreespisces
Monday, April 1, 2013, 5:15pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Type Unknown


Now, I know that Dr D'Adamo says it's more important to follow the Highly Beneficial list, and he argues to avoid processed foods. But the fact that things like cabbage are placed in the same category as white flour bothers me--I know in my heart these two are not equal no matter what blood type we're talking about.


What you "know in your heart" is one thing; the result of years of research based on blood type, geno type, human digestion and interaction with food, is entirely another thing.

You need to be clearer as to what you'd like to discuss.

If it's the fact that "in your heart" you just "know" that something can't be right, a frank discussion doesn't have much value, as there's no arguing with what a person happens to know in their hearts.

However, if you'd like to talk about specific and objective reasons why you feel cabbage isn't harmful for some and should therefore be taken off the avoid list for some types, then go ahead and give us some valid reasons for that, other than that you just know in your heart that it's not right.


Happiness is the highest form of wisdom.

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Andrea AWsec
Monday, April 1, 2013, 5:26pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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How did you change your views on the BTD?


Seems that you are still not willing to consider individuality versus what you know about food and health..

Here we follow individualized diets rather than one size fits all.

Pitting one food against another does not really work--

For me as an A I get wheat as a beneficial food and cabbage is an avoid.

Chicken is an avoid-- I would probably chose a salad over either option, but most of us do not follow everything 100%-- many eat " cheat meals' on occasion.


MIFHI

"Do not try to satisfy your vanity by teaching a great many things. Awaken people's curiosity. It is enough to open minds; do not overload them." Anatole France

"Healthy people have the least overt symptoms from eating avoid foods." Dr. D'Adamo
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Lola
Monday, April 1, 2013, 5:37pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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glad you are back!

have you had a chance to recheck your blood type and rh status?

finding out secretor status will not hurt one bit either


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
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Spring
Monday, April 1, 2013, 5:54pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Cabbage is like poison to some people and I am one of them! I would take the chicken any day but get rid of all the "Alfredo" I possibly could!.....And I love cabbage!


"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin
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Brett650
Monday, April 1, 2013, 6:02pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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If they're saying "cabbage and chicken alfredo are both avoids, so I'll have the chicken alfredo," then it's pretty clear they don't have the discipline to follow BTD. They will do better just trying to eat healthy in the commonly-accepted sense.

That's kind of the conclusion I'm coming to for myself as well. BTD/Genotype/SWAMI have motivated me to add some animal protein to my diet, which has been a very good change for me. But when I tried to follow it strictly for about 6 weeks, I got stressed about food. Honestly I feel better after letting go of the specifics that don't resonate with me.


SWAMI 42% Hunter; was mostly vegan until March 2012
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Type Unknown
Monday, April 1, 2013, 6:13pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Ok, I guess my main question was this--

Do you really think that ALL avoid types are created equal? As in cabbage vs. white wheat?

Let me add a question to this topic: have any of you had experience caring for aging relatives that are on BTD? My relatives are not on SWAMI, do not know their secretor status, have not been genotyped. Only own Cook Right 4 Your Type. If you have, was it difficult to encourage them to add variety to their meals?
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Type Unknown
Monday, April 1, 2013, 6:20pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Brett650
If they're saying "cabbage and chicken alfredo are both avoids, so I'll have the chicken alfredo," then it's pretty clear they don't have the discipline to follow BTD. They will do better just trying to eat healthy in the commonly-accepted sense.

That's kind of the conclusion I'm coming to for myself as well. BTD/Genotype/SWAMI have motivated me to add some animal protein to my diet, which has been a very good change for me. But when I tried to follow it strictly for about 6 weeks, I got stressed about food. Honestly I feel better after letting go of the specifics that don't resonate with me.


I appreciate your candid opinion. Honestly, I feel the same way, but getting them to change anything is extremely difficult.

Besides, it would be wrong to try to steer them off of a diet that has so much potential. But I do feel like staying on the diet adds more stress to an already very stressful part of their lives. Food shouldn't be stressful  
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Chloe
Monday, April 1, 2013, 6:22pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Type Unknown
Ok, I guess my main question was this--

Do you really think that ALL avoid types are created equal? As in cabbage vs. white wheat?

Let me add a question to this topic: have any of you had experience caring for aging relatives that are on BTD? My relatives are not on SWAMI, do not know their secretor status, have not been genotyped. Only own Cook Right 4 Your Type. If you have, was it difficult to encourage them to add variety to their meals?


What exactly in your opinion is the problem you're having with your aging relatives?  Are they not following the diet as well as you are?  Could you buy a copy of ER4YT?   Do they use the internet?
Ask questions here? Facebook?

No I don't think all avoid types are created equal.  Some people react to toxic foods more than others and differently depending on their health issues and specific genetic profile.
It's a personal thing.  One size does not fit all and not all people react in the same way to foods.

The heart and soul of these diets is the healing/beneficial foods....not the toxic ones.



"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"
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ABJoe
Monday, April 1, 2013, 6:25pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Type Unknown
Do you really think that ALL avoid types are created equal? As in cabbage vs. white wheat?

Let me add a question to this topic: have any of you had experience caring for aging relatives that are on BTD?

No - all avoids are not equal.

It is incorrect, however, to state that one avoid will be better than another for everyone.

Yes, I have tried to motivate older family to change diet to get better health.  They have to be willing to change something to get something.  If they aren't willing to make the changes, or give up some "favorite" food, it is no different than someone not giving up smoking even when they have lung cancer and emphysema...  

They still have the ability to exercise free will, even if we think or know that it would be better for them to change.  I recently had a friend who's cousin didn't want to live any longer so he refused food and a feeding tube and starved himself to death.  This is hard for family to understand, but it happens and doctors and the law are on their side, regardless of what we think/want.


RH-, ISTJ
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Henriette Bsec
Monday, April 1, 2013, 6:25pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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No I dont think all avoids are equal

Some I avoid 100 % of the time: corn, chicken, veg. Oils, soy etc
Others i migh enjoy a few times a year , prawns and lobster.
Other I might enjoy once in  a while mainly things like avocado, coconut milk, , olives ...
Since I dont react to them.and i find life oring without them.


ENFP -naturalist, visual/spatial and musical/verbal/chatty Dane- living with DD Emma age 19,
0 rh- secr ( Hunter or explorer )
Diamonds, superfoods, Neutral,*black dots, avoids
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Type Unknown
Monday, April 1, 2013, 6:55pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Chloe


What exactly in your opinion is the problem you're having with your aging relatives?  Are they not following the diet as well as you are?  Could you buy a copy of ER4YT?   Do they use the internet?
Ask questions here? Facebook?



No, they're following the diet much better than I am because I'm not on the diet. But my opinion is that, well...

I hear it's a common thing for older ones to lose a desire to eat. My relatives eat bc they know they should. So they end up eating only a few things over and over again. I do the grocery shopping for them, and I get them everything that they ask for (most things are compliant on their grocery list). But sometimes I will sneak in a fruit or vegetable in the highly beneficial category (they are type As) simply to add variety to their diet. This is almost always a terrible idea and ends with us having to scratch off yet another highly beneficial food from the list. Discussing diet now is sort of off limits bc of the emotional distress (so I am 99.9% sure they are not interested in doing research online). I want to give them as much autonomy and independence as possible.

In addition, they sometimes eat their staples to the point that they say they literally cannot eat them without gagging anymore. Little by little, their diets are narrowing. I'm afraid in the end all they'll want to eat is junk food--chicken alfredo and hamburgers, and that the BTD is only helping to narrow their options.

Please understand--I truly believe that the diet is great, even if I don't personally have the willpower to apply it to my own life. I really do not mean to smack down the diet. And I really do believe that the highly beneficial foods are great--IF you eat them!

I know I'm not giving a specific question. But I would appreciate hearing the opinions, suggestions, and experiences of the members of this board.

Thank you
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Lloyd
Monday, April 1, 2013, 7:00pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Type Unknown


But sometimes I will sneak in a fruit or vegetable in the highly beneficial category (they are type As) simply to add variety to their diet. This is almost always a terrible idea and ends with us having to scratch off yet another highly beneficial food from the list. Discussing diet now is sort of off limits bc of the emotional distress (so I am 99.9% sure they are not interested in doing research online). I want to give them as much autonomy and independence as possible.

Thank you


It sounds like you are doing everything you can.

People will not always do what is in their best interest. You can blame the diet, but it might just as well be anything. They are who they are.

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Adam
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When you reach the end of your life, sometimes you just want comfort food and don't care about the consequences.
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Chloe
Monday, April 1, 2013, 7:14pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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If I were you, I'd just buy the foods your relatives ask you to buy and let them be.  You can always
give them a copy of ER4YT, but to exert your will in order for them to eat better might not
be in your best interest.  And it sounds like they're not interested anyway.

It's nice that you can help them out in any way possible...but sometimes there are limits....and when you start to make a problem for yourself over something that isn't an issue for them, then the conflict is within yourself and the solution is to just give up the struggle.  In order for there to be any type of change, it would require an agreement that change is desired.  It seems like only you would like change.

We can always make wise choices for ourselves....but generally, we cannot make choices for others unless they are helpless.

Sorry....I'm sure this isn't what you'd wish were happening.  Sometimes we just have to live with
what IS~!  


"The happiest people don't have the best of everything.....they know how to make the best of everything!"
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ABJoe
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Some older people lose the ability to smell / taste different things, so most foods end up the same to them.  Either cooked so they are "mushy", fresh and crisp like radish or celery, or leafy and hard to chew like lettuce...

I have one friend so frustrated because the only thing her HH can taste is salt, and she knows too much isn't good for his heart...

This falls under the heading of "Know what you can change and have the ability to let the rest go."


RH-, ISTJ
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SquarePeg
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Quoted from Type Unknown


No, they're following the diet much better than I am because I'm not on the diet. But my opinion is that, well...

I hear it's a common thing for older ones to lose a desire to eat. My relatives eat bc they know they should. So they end up eating only a few things over and over again. I do the grocery shopping for them, and I get them everything that they ask for (most things are compliant on their grocery list). But sometimes I will sneak in a fruit or vegetable in the highly beneficial category (they are type As) simply to add variety to their diet. This is almost always a terrible idea and ends with us having to scratch off yet another highly beneficial food from the list. Discussing diet now is sort of off limits bc of the emotional distress (so I am 99.9% sure they are not interested in doing research online). I want to give them as much autonomy and independence as possible.

In addition, they sometimes eat their staples to the point that they say they literally cannot eat them without gagging anymore. Little by little, their diets are narrowing. I'm afraid in the end all they'll want to eat is junk food--chicken alfredo and hamburgers, and that the BTD is only helping to narrow their options.

Please understand--I truly believe that the diet is great, even if I don't personally have the willpower to apply it to my own life. I really do not mean to smack down the diet. And I really do believe that the highly beneficial foods are great--IF you eat them!

I know I'm not giving a specific question. But I would appreciate hearing the opinions, suggestions, and experiences of the members of this board.

Thank you
My daughter started her vegan diet the very day that we put a plate in front of her with fish on it.  She used the diet to get out of eating foods that she did not like.  There's a fine line between veganism and eating disorder (ED).  Unfortunately, the medical community is convinced that being vegan is healthy, so for some individuals, veganism is a medically sanctioned ED.

Frankly, the concern about BTD you're expressing will be true of many food-restricting diets that your relatives could follow.  In which case it might be a good idea discussing their diet with their PCP.  Especially since most of the folks here seem (to me) to be convinced BTD / GTD / SWAMI are infallible, even when the diets are slightly contradictory.



My SWAMI diet is a blend of BTD and GTD Explorer, but I'm not totally compliant.  Also I try to choose foods that have a Low Glycemic index.  DW and DD are A+, probably also Explorer.
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ABJoe
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Quoted from SquarePeg
Especially since most of the folks here seem (to me) to be convinced BTD / GTD / SWAMI are infallible, even when the diets are slightly contradictory.

The diets are different, which appears to be contradictory, but it wouldn't do any good to have identical diets attempting to get different results...

I know these diets may have shortcomings - I haven't found any yet with SWAMIXpress, however.  It is just that I haven't found anything else that has less shortcomings than these...      I have been empowered to rid myself of symptoms that have bothered me for 40 years, whereas, nothing tried before did anything more than slow the pace at which I was feeling worse.  
I think they are pretty powerful.


RH-, ISTJ
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KimonoKat
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I think Lloyd is right. You will take things out of context just to argue.  This will be my last reply.

Avoids are avoids for different reasons.  Not all avoids are equal.  It depends on the micro-nutrients and the lectin in the food.  Not all lectins are alike or do the same thing.  Dr. D'Adamo has documented the largest lectin database anywhere of known food lectins.

Dairy affects me differently than wheat.  Wheat is a joint killer for those prone to arthritis... or are Type O. The lectin in wheat has been shown to survive an autoclave.  It also makes me gain weight, become physically sluggish and have brain fog.  Dairy just makes me constipated.

It's all about... individuality.


Knowledge is power.  SWAMI gives you the diet that will unlock the key to better health, and it's all based on your unique individuality.
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Averno
Monday, April 1, 2013, 8:10pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Type unknown, your initial post buried the lead. Are you really asking us whether your aging relatives following BTD are in any danger from eating the exact same food every single day?

Or is it the same foods rotated around a weekly schedule? Or that they're just not exploring enough? Are you concerned for them, or is this about the validity of BTD and the claims of it's adherents?

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C_Sharp
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Quoted from Type Unknown


I have noticed with the aging members of my family on the BTD this disturbing trend, which was at the heart of my issues with BTD to begin with:

For certain blood types, BTD places things that are normally considered very healthy, such as cabbage, olives, coconuts, papaya, etc in the Avoid list. Knowing that, if given the choice between a homemade cabbage stir fry and, say, chicken alfredo, they will go for the Alfredo every time.


I do not know your relatives.

But I do know the BTD. After eating it for several years I was able to tell how my body was going to react to certain foods and then balance my hunger, risk of social alienation, ... with how sick I was going to get if I ate those avoids.

The things you listed I would never make myself, so it is just how big a deal I would make about the food if someone else served it to me.

If I scraped off the sauce from the chicken and did not eat the pasta, there would be a fair chance that I would not feel too badly from having eaten the chicken.

Depending on the stir fry it might be more work and more error prone to sort out what I can eat in the stir fry from the avoids.

Olives I sort need to know whether they were cured with brine or vinegar before deciding what to do with them. Some times it is more work to ask about the olives so it is simpler just to not eat them.

I would presume you relatives have figured out what works for them and what does not. Even though it may not make rational sense without knowing all the details.


MIfHI                            I follow a SWAMI diet.
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Type Unknown
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Quoted from KimonoKat
I think Lloyd is right. You will take things out of context just to argue.  This will be my last reply.


I'm sorry, I didn't mean to be argumentative. I don't mean to bait you into replying again. But which things am I taking out of context?
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