Welcome, Guest.
Please login or register


Main Forum Page  ♦   Latest Posts  ♦   Member Center  ♦   Search  ♦   Archives   ♦   Help   ♦   Log In/Out   ♦   Admins
Forum Login
Login Name: Create a new account
Password:     Forgot password

BTD Forums    Diet and Nutrition    Eat Right 4 Your Type  ›  Deal with Vinegars?
Users Browsing Forum
Patty H, Towanda2, Yahoo! Bot and 13 Guests

Deal with Vinegars?  This thread currently has 1,042 views. Print Print Thread
1 Pages 1 Recommend Thread
tolondontoparis
Monday, June 11, 2012, 5:04pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

I just want to love and be loved
Autumn: Harvest, success.
Posts: 151
Gender: Female
Location: Stony Brook, New York
Age: 21
I understand that the reason some vinegars are poision is because of the sources they are formed from, but are there any acceptable for Os/ O nonnies? Like ketchup would be totes okay, and even mayonnaise, if I could eat vinegar. I mean it doesn't give me an upset stomach, but I am trying to stick to this BTD for my skin's sake. I may just take the risk and bloody well eat them.
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message
ABJoe
Monday, June 11, 2012, 5:18pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

34% Nomad
Sun Beh Nim
Moderator
Posts: 8,172
Gender: Male
Location: Orange County, CA, USA
Age: 51
The BTD rating for cider vinegar:
http://www.dadamo.com/typebase4/depictor5.pl?437

The BTD rating for other vinegar:
http://www.dadamo.com/typebase4/depictor5.pl?438
The list shows this to be a "gastric irritant", so repeated ingestion of this will probably cause constant digestive system irritation / inflammation / pain...
BTW, the food manufacturers use the cheapest they can find, so bet that any ingredients that show vinegar (with no further description) mean this.


RH-, ISTJ
Wonderful Wife = A+ Teacher; Darling Daughter = A- SWAMI Explorer
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 1 - 24
JJR
Monday, June 11, 2012, 7:22pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

33% Nomad, calories calories!!!!!!
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,960
Gender: Male
Location: Caledonia, WI
Age: 42
My doc says vinegar can also feed yeast.  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 2 - 24
ruthiegirl
Monday, June 11, 2012, 7:24pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI O+ Gatherer, Healing from Fibromyalgia
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 12,143
Gender: Female
Location: New York
Age: 42
It's not just about what the vinegars are fermented from. There's something about the vinegar-making process that turns healthy red wine into unhealthy red wine vinegar. I'm not sure exactly what though, if it's the acidity or something else.

When I'm overall feeling stronger, I'm not so picky about avoiding vinegar that's been fermented from compliant sources. I did use up the rice vinegar I purchased before starting BTD, and I've had the occasional sushi away from home, knowing it likely had rice vinegar in it. But I no longer purchase vinegar for cooking and I never used it regularly since starting BTD. I do buy corn-based distilled vinegar for household cleaning, and apple cider vinegar for body care (diluted as a hair rinse.)

Apple cider vinegar is neutral for O secretors. I have seen both mayo and ketchup made with apple cider vinegar in health food stores. Another option is to make your own ketchup and/or mayo with compliant ingredients, using lemon juice in place of the vinegar called for in the recipe. Lemon juice spoils faster than vinegar, so the resulting products probably won't keep as long as homemade condiments made with vinegar. Ketchup should freeze OK if you make a big batch and only keep a small amount in the fridge, but mayo gets a weird texture when frozen. That would need to be made frequently (once a week, if not twice) in small batches.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 3 - 24
Andrea AWsec
Monday, June 11, 2012, 7:26pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI INFJ Warrior Taster
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 7,678
Gender: Female
Location: Long Island, NY
Age: 51
Vinegar sickles blood type A cells.


MIFHI

"Do not try to satisfy your vanity by teaching a great many things. Awaken people's curiosity. It is enough to open minds; do not overload them." Anatole France

"Healthy people have the least overt symptoms from eating avoid foods." Dr. D'Adamo
Logged
Site Site Private Message Private message Reply: 4 - 24
cajun
Tuesday, June 12, 2012, 6:58pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Teacher/Explorer
Ee Dan
Posts: 2,452
Gender: Female
Location: Southern California
Age: 62
Andrea,
Please explain further as I want to understand and be able to pass on this info.


 Ao  ISFJ   Taster   Rh+  

"God gave us the gift of life. It is up to us to give ourselves the gift of living well." Voltaire
"Whisper words of wisdom. Let it be." Sir Paul McCartney
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 5 - 24
chrissyA
Tuesday, June 12, 2012, 8:26pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT3 Teacher 49%, super-taster,
Autumn: Harvest, success.
Posts: 475
Gender: Female
Location: Southern Cal
Age: 51
If you follow the BTD, and the brief answer to "why or why not" that is provided on the Food Values page is not satisfactory to you, you will have a tremendously difficult time following this eating plan.   I appreciate your frustration - I truly do - but another way to look at it is that Dr. D and his staff of amazing scientists have far more sophisticated questions and answers than we do, and that if with their combined knowledge and expertise, and the astonishing battery of tests that they put all of these food through, if they tell me I'd be better off not eating some of my favorite foods , then I simply trust the authority of the experts and believe in what they have learned. It's a choice I make.
Best of luck to you  


SWAMI
“Let thy food be thy medicine and thy medicine be thy food.” --Hippocrates (460-377 B.C.)
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 6 - 24
JJR
Tuesday, June 12, 2012, 8:40pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

33% Nomad, calories calories!!!!!!
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,960
Gender: Male
Location: Caledonia, WI
Age: 42
The Encyclopedia of BTD, or whatever it's called, does explain a little about why.  And so do some of the books. Not necessarily every single food.  It's just a process.


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 7 - 24
tolondontoparis
Tuesday, June 12, 2012, 8:57pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

I just want to love and be loved
Autumn: Harvest, success.
Posts: 151
Gender: Female
Location: Stony Brook, New York
Age: 21
Quoted from chrissyA
If you follow the BTD, and the brief answer to "why or why not" that is provided on the Food Values page is not satisfactory to you, you will have a tremendously difficult time following this eating plan.   I appreciate your frustration - I truly do - but another way to look at it is that Dr. D and his staff of amazing scientists have far more sophisticated questions and answers than we do, and that if with their combined knowledge and expertise, and the astonishing battery of tests that they put all of these food through, if they tell me I'd be better off not eating some of my favorite foods , then I simply trust the authority of the experts and believe in what they have learned. It's a choice I make.
Best of luck to you  


So True!
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 8 - 24
Andrea AWsec
Tuesday, June 12, 2012, 9:04pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI INFJ Warrior Taster
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 7,678
Gender: Female
Location: Long Island, NY
Age: 51
I can only tell you what I have learned from Dr. D. I am an A Warrior vinegar bothers my stomach that is enough of a reason for me not to eat it. But if you need a photo here it is.


Vinegar sickles the blood cells of A's here is a picture of the difference between the two cells.

http://www.healthopedia.com/pictures/sickle-cell-anemia.html


MIFHI

"Do not try to satisfy your vanity by teaching a great many things. Awaken people's curiosity. It is enough to open minds; do not overload them." Anatole France

"Healthy people have the least overt symptoms from eating avoid foods." Dr. D'Adamo
Logged
Site Site Private Message Private message Reply: 9 - 24
Lola
Wednesday, June 13, 2012, 6:26am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT1; L (a-b-); (se); PROP-T; NN
Sa Bon Nim
Admin & Columnist
Posts: 51,114
Gender: Female
Location: ''eternal spring'' Cuernavaca - Mex.
Age: 57
that ought to convince everyone!


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
Logged
Private Message Private message YIM YIM Reply: 10 - 24
Brett650
Wednesday, June 13, 2012, 6:59am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Spring: Growth, Peace.
Posts: 37
Gender: Male
Location: San Francisco Peninsula
Age: 51
Try some Umeboshi Plum vinegar, also known as Ume vinegar.

It's delicious (and rather salty), and it's listed as a superfood for me.

Technically it's not really vinegar, or so I'm told. Go figure.


SWAMI 42% Hunter; was mostly vegan until March 2012
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 11 - 24
chrissyA
Wednesday, June 13, 2012, 2:11pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT3 Teacher 49%, super-taster,
Autumn: Harvest, success.
Posts: 475
Gender: Female
Location: Southern Cal
Age: 51
It's actually a brine


SWAMI
“Let thy food be thy medicine and thy medicine be thy food.” --Hippocrates (460-377 B.C.)
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 12 - 24
JJR
Wednesday, June 13, 2012, 5:05pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

33% Nomad, calories calories!!!!!!
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 4,960
Gender: Male
Location: Caledonia, WI
Age: 42
I've seen it at my store and have been tempted to get some.  


The poster formerly known as "ABNOWAY"

"Finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things." - Phillipians 4:8
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 13 - 24
Spring
Wednesday, June 13, 2012, 6:10pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI Explorer
Ee Dan
Posts: 3,125
Gender: Female
Location: Southeastern USA
Quoted from Brett650
Try some Umeboshi Plum vinegar, also known as Ume vinegar.

Avoid for me.....


"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -- Benjamin Franklin
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 14 - 24
Conor
Wednesday, June 13, 2012, 9:07pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT1 52%+GT4 ST INTJ E7
Autumn: Harvest, success.
Posts: 337
Gender: Male
Location: NG452319
Quoted from Brett650
Try some Umeboshi Plum vinegar, also known as Ume vinegar.

Although I don't think it's technically a true vinegar, have started using this as a compliant vinegar in fish marinades and in one vinaigrette. Quite good ... glad it's one of my superfoods so I didn't have to go totally vinegar-free. (:

As for tolondontoparis' original question, remember that vinegar is a mild acetic acid solution (better than Windex for cleaning grimy windows), and is created via the oxidation of ethyl alcohol by bacteria (Acetobacter). I've wondered before if vinegar didn't come about when someone let a bottle of wine go well beyond its drinkable stage but s/he was so hard up for a drink of wine that the thought process went something like this: "Yeah, it's really quite nasty but I'll drink it anyway." Then, somehow, this person convinced everyone else that it was good stuff (which is probably how the advent of 1,000-year-old pickled eggs in China came about, as well). <~; Seriously, though, I find it interesting that vinegar is essentially a fermented food or beverage item that has exceeded its 'best by' date and bacteria have metabolised the alcohol into acetic acid (a basic carboxylic acid). The food/beverage from which a particular vinegar originated is often considered to be healthy for human consumption, e.g., red or white wine, apple cider, honey and others, but possibly the process by which the good food is converted to vinegar ends up making the food item too caustic for normal, everyday consumption. Because, franky, vinegar is one of my regular go-to cleansers and disinfectants that I use around the house, and it works very well (but, believe you me, I also had a tough time kicking my 'Cesare' Aceto Balsamico Tradizionale out of the cupboard and to the curb ).

The ingestion of too much vinegar at once, e.g., 8-16 ounces (such as the amounts some people have consumed in belief that vinegar is a cure for cancer), has been reported to cause hemolysis (i.e., your red blood cells rupture), renal failure and/or internal burns/adhesions.

On the other hand, I read a research abstract in which it stated that the study found, from a prophylactic therapy perspective, taking two tablespoons of vinegar immediately prior to a meal appeared to help control post-meal blood sugar spikes in people with type-2 diabetes.

So, like most anything, it has good and bad elements. However, if it's listed as an avoid food, that's the end of the story as far as I'm concerned. It has no place on the menu.



Compliant, me?!? ... I even attended a university whose mascot is one of my ◆ Superfoods!
What is food to one man is bitter poison to others. ~ Titus Lucretius Carus
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 15 - 24
tolondontoparis
Thursday, June 14, 2012, 1:16am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

I just want to love and be loved
Autumn: Harvest, success.
Posts: 151
Gender: Female
Location: Stony Brook, New York
Age: 21
Quoted from Conor

Although I don't think it's technically a true vinegar, have started using this as a compliant vinegar in fish marinades and in one vinaigrette. Quite good ... glad it's one of my superfoods so I didn't have to go totally vinegar-free. (:

As for tolondontoparis' original question, remember that vinegar is a mild acetic acid solution (better than Windex for cleaning grimy windows), and is created via the oxidation of ethyl alcohol by bacteria (Acetobacter). I've wondered before if vinegar didn't come about when someone let a bottle of wine go well beyond its drinkable stage but s/he was so hard up for a drink of wine that the thought process went something like this: "Yeah, it's really quite nasty but I'll drink it anyway." Then, somehow, this person convinced everyone else that it was good stuff (which is probably how the advent of 1,000-year-old pickled eggs in China came about, as well). <~; Seriously, though, I find it interesting that vinegar is essentially a fermented food or beverage item that has exceeded its 'best by' date and bacteria have metabolised the alcohol into acetic acid (a basic carboxylic acid). The food/beverage from which a particular vinegar originated is often considered to be healthy for human consumption, e.g., red or white wine, apple cider, honey and others, but possibly the process by which the good food is converted to vinegar ends up making the food item too caustic for normal, everyday consumption. Because, franky, vinegar is one of my regular go-to cleansers and disinfectants that I use around the house, and it works very well (but, believe you me, I also had a tough time kicking my 'Cesare' Aceto Balsamico Tradizionale out of the cupboard and to the curb ).

The ingestion of too much vinegar at once, e.g., 8-16 ounces (such as the amounts some people have consumed in belief that vinegar is a cure for cancer), has been reported to cause hemolysis (i.e., your red blood cells rupture), renal failure and/or internal burns/adhesions.

On the other hand, I read a research abstract in which it stated that the study found, from a prophylactic therapy perspective, taking two tablespoons of vinegar immediately prior to a meal appeared to help control post-meal blood sugar spikes in people with type-2 diabetes.

So, like most anything, it has good and bad elements. However, if it's listed as an avoid food, that's the end of the story as far as I'm concerned. It has no place on the menu.


Wow! You know your stuff! Vinegar is just a crazy concoction, ahhahaa! We humans are crazy
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 16 - 24
ruthiegirl
Sunday, June 17, 2012, 6:43pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

SWAMI O+ Gatherer, Healing from Fibromyalgia
Kyosha Nim
Columnists and Bloggers
Posts: 12,143
Gender: Female
Location: New York
Age: 42
I'm sure that the "first vinegar" was a result of "wine gone bad" and then a frugal housewife found something to do with it. It's quite useful for preserving foods, and can be used in small amounts to improve the flavors of dishes. In a time when "having enough food" was nowhere near a sure thing, people weren't  going to waste anything that might be useful. Vinegar was likely used as a food preservative (making pickles) when there wasn't enough salt available for cultured vegetables. It's certainly healthier to eat foods pickled in vinegar than it is to eat moldy foods or to starve.

But most of us on this forum are lucky not to live in that kind of scarcity. We can improve our health by avoiding certain foods and eating others instead. According to Dr D's research, vinegar is NOT a healthy food for most of us- it's essentially a completely spoiled food. Never mind that it's been consumed for centuries and is a part of most traditional diets, or that it can be made locally in  any climate (a big deal for "localvores" who wouldn't want to regularly consume lemon juice when lemon trees don't grow where they live, or "homesteaders" who want to grow all their own food.) Although I do wonder if brine from other cultured foods (grown locally) could be used as a vinegar replacement if you don't want to buy "non locally grown" citrus fruits. Would beet kvass work in place of lemon juice in a salad dressing?

If you want to follow Dr D's food advice, vinegar is something to avoid (with a few exceptions.) if you want to combine Dr D's advice with other dietary ideals, then you need to decide for yourself about vinegar.


Ruth, Single Mother to 19yo   O- Leah , 18yo O- Hannah, and  12yo B+ Jack


Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 17 - 24
gulfcoastguy
Sunday, June 17, 2012, 8:20pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

B to Bnonnie to Nomad, the journey continues
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 2,434
Gender: Male
Location: Ocean Springs, MS
Age: 54
I'm glad I still have apple cider vinegar as a neutral. Lemons and limes are nice but a pain to squeeze.
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 18 - 24
Conor
Sunday, June 17, 2012, 8:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT1 52%+GT4 ST INTJ E7
Autumn: Harvest, success.
Posts: 337
Gender: Male
Location: NG452319
Quoted from gulfcoastguy
Lemons and limes are nice but a pain to squeeze.

They used to be, I agree. Now I just use this beast:

Can press the juice out of about 20 limes/lemons in three minutes or so (of course, I really like lemons).



Compliant, me?!? ... I even attended a university whose mascot is one of my ◆ Superfoods!
What is food to one man is bitter poison to others. ~ Titus Lucretius Carus
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 19 - 24
grey rabbit
Sunday, June 17, 2012, 8:36pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

swamix 47% Teacher-INFP
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,303
Gender: Female
Location: Seattle
Age: 57
That is a fancy juicer Conor, but if I were going to spend that kind of money on one, I'd buy this one


“Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It’s perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we’ve learned something from yesterday.”

John Wayne's last words
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 20 - 24
Debra
Sunday, June 17, 2012, 10:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Here to learn
Autumn: Harvest, success.
Posts: 155
Gender: Female
Location: UK - near Maidstone
Interesting thread guys. thanks for starting it, tolondontoparis  
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 21 - 24
Conor
Monday, June 18, 2012, 2:37am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

GT1 52%+GT4 ST INTJ E7
Autumn: Harvest, success.
Posts: 337
Gender: Male
Location: NG452319
Quoted from grey rabbit
That is a fancy juicer Conor, but if I were going to spend that kind of money on one, I'd buy this one

Too funny ... your juicer's designer, Philippe Starck, is the same person that designed a club in Dallas' West End District called the Starck Club. Some school mates and I used to make regular weekend roadtrips to Dallas from Austin to hang out there in the late '80s.



Compliant, me?!? ... I even attended a university whose mascot is one of my ◆ Superfoods!
What is food to one man is bitter poison to others. ~ Titus Lucretius Carus
Logged
Private Message Private message Reply: 22 - 24
paul clucas
Friday, June 22, 2012, 12:44am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Swami-fied Explorer! INTP
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 1,794
Gender: Male
Location: Niagara Peninsula, On
Age: 47
I don't remember how I learned this, but vinegar does the opposite action of green tea.  It would therefore demethylate the "front" parts of the genes that can encode for powerfully pathological weaknesses.

Unless it is neutral you might be better off living without it - and don't forget to drink some green tea.


My weight loss goal: 220 lbs.  A 6'4" dyslexic oddball: the size of a line-backer, the silhouette of Winnie-the-Pooh.
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 23 - 24
grey rabbit
Friday, June 22, 2012, 12:52am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

swamix 47% Teacher-INFP
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 3,303
Gender: Female
Location: Seattle
Age: 57
Conor, my daughter is a graphic designer and thinks Philippe Starck is awesome. I think the juicer looks really cool and alien.

Paul, thanks for the info. I've given up on everything except ume.


“Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It’s perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we’ve learned something from yesterday.”

John Wayne's last words
Logged Offline
Private Message Private message Reply: 24 - 24
1 Pages 1 Recommend Thread
Print Print Thread

BTD Forums    Diet and Nutrition    Eat Right 4 Your Type  ›  Deal with Vinegars?

Thread Rating
There is currently no rating for this thread