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narnia
Wednesday, May 12, 2010, 3:33pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I never knew that frozen foods were bad for me, due to polyamines.  All the animal proteins that we eat are frozen.  We get venison from local hunters in Janurary, and freeze all the meats.  There is no way around this part.

We live one hour from any place that sells "healthy" animal products.  We have to buy in bulk and freeze them, or go to the local market 10 miles away on a daily basis and eat the mainstream meats that are hormone and antibiotic laden.  

What can I do?  This is very discouraging for me, as I want to follow the diet in its purest form.  I do eat freshly squeezed garlic on my steamed veggies and even the meats almost daily.  I consume seaweed sheets and occasionally, seaweed soup.  

Are these enough polyamine blockers to make up for all the frozen meats, or do I need to do something else?  Selling out house to move into the city with the fresh grocers is not something that's feasible in the near future.


"Work like you don't need the money, love like you've never been hurt, dance like no-one is watching, sing as if no one were listening, and live every day as if it were paradise!!!  "

"A thankful and merry heart works like good medicine!"  
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C_Sharp
Wednesday, May 12, 2010, 3:39pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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The way food is frozen can influence the amount of polyamines that are developed.

Some people marinade fozen meats with cherry juice to counter the polyamines.


MIfHI                            I follow a SWAMI diet.
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Lola
Wednesday, May 12, 2010, 3:57pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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home freezing purchasing fresh, like you do, is better than flash frozen animal produce, purchased in the store.

simply do the best you can, and follow C s advice above.


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
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narnia
Wednesday, May 12, 2010, 4:44pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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We do our own freezing for everything but the fish.  We buy them frozen already.  

I have bought fresh fish and they were not very fresh.


"Work like you don't need the money, love like you've never been hurt, dance like no-one is watching, sing as if no one were listening, and live every day as if it were paradise!!!  "

"A thankful and merry heart works like good medicine!"  
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narnia
Wednesday, May 12, 2010, 4:45pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from C_Sharp
The way food is frozen can influence the amount of polyamines that are developed.

Some people marinade fozen meats with cherry juice to counter the polyamines.


How is that done?  For how long?


"Work like you don't need the money, love like you've never been hurt, dance like no-one is watching, sing as if no one were listening, and live every day as if it were paradise!!!  "

"A thankful and merry heart works like good medicine!"  
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Lola
Wednesday, May 12, 2010, 5:04pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
DNA mt/Haplo H; Y-chrom/J2(M172);ISTJ
The harder you are on yourself, the easier life will be on you!
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MileHighRob
Saturday, May 22, 2010, 3:47pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from narnia


I have bought fresh fish and they were not very fresh.

You should ask the counter person to allow you to smell the fish before they package it up for you.  If they won't allow you to smell then thank them for their time and politely walk away.  It's likely not fresh.  

Also they have to tell you, by law, which fish were previously frozen and which are actually fresh in addition to whether the fish was wild caught (preferably) or farm raised (less valuable in many ways).

If it's a lighter colored fish you should be able to see the red veins in the meat.  The fish closest to the display glass (closest to you) is usually the freshest.  They will try to grab whatever you request from the area furtherest away from you i.e. closest to them when they reach into the case.  Feel free to ask them to give you a piece that's got more color in it or to direct them to the exact piece(s) you'd like to purchase.

Hope these tips help you make better fresh fish decisions when visiting the market!
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Andrea AWsec
Saturday, May 22, 2010, 3:54pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I can get cod that is not previously frozen and is wild.


MIFHI

"Do not try to satisfy your vanity by teaching a great many things. Awaken people's curiosity. It is enough to open minds; do not overload them." Anatole France

"Healthy people have the least overt symptoms from eating avoid foods." Dr. D'Adamo
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MileHighRob
Saturday, May 22, 2010, 3:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Andrea AWsec
I can get cod that is not previously frozen and is wild.

mmmmmm Excellent!
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balletomane
Saturday, May 22, 2010, 4:33pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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It seems that all the organic/hormone-free meat I can get has been previously frozen. Does it mean it is all flash frozen? You see, local meat=meat from China. I wouldn't touch it. The nearest place from which we import good quality meat is Australia and New Zealand. So the meat must be frozen during shipping. Still, I find it safer to consumer this than hormone-laden Chinese meat. The lesser of the two evils.

Instead of cherry juice, is there something else I can use to counter the polyamines? I don't get fresh cherry juice locally either, and imported cherry juice is as expensive as a cheap bottle of wine  !


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DenverFoodie
Saturday, May 22, 2010, 4:59pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Andrea AWsec
I can get cod that is not previously frozen and is wild.


I think the only cod you can get is "wild".  Cod is not farm raised.


Every morning create your day.  If you don't, life will for you!

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Fernando Boto
Saturday, May 22, 2010, 5:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from balletomane

Instead of cherry juice, is there something else I can use to counter the polyamines? I don't get fresh cherry juice locally either, and imported cherry juice is as expensive as a cheap bottle of wine  !


Would you buy a cheap bottle of wine, to drink, or marinade your meat? If so, then the imported cherry juice should not be considered expensive, seeing that it does serve a healthy purpose.


ISFJ

It's your life, live it wisely. Measure your words, and what goes in your mouth too.
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MileHighRob
Saturday, May 22, 2010, 5:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Berries are on high the dirty dozen list.  I only buy organic as the conventionally grown varieties notoriously test positive for pesticide residues.  Many of them test positive for up to 9 different types of pesticides.  
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AKArtlover
Saturday, May 22, 2010, 6:23pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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This organic cherry juice rocks. Don't buy it all up, I enjoy it so much.

http://www.edenfoods.com/store/product_info.php?products_id=103385


"For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well." Psalm 139:13,14
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Lola
Saturday, May 22, 2010, 10:09pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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try prune juice


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
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4thRabbit
Saturday, May 22, 2010, 11:48pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Synchronistic, baby! I get frozen lamb, it's local and I presume not flash frozen since this is a small farm operation, but on a whim I also bought some cherries (frozen) now I know what to do with them. I believe it is Ayurvedic theory that that freezing destroys the prana in a food, not sure if I am making that up, but it does destroy the biophotons....
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MileHighRob
Saturday, May 22, 2010, 11:57pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Lola
try prune juice

I've been thinking that will likely be my newest addition shortly.  
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balletomane
Sunday, May 23, 2010, 1:02am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Fernando Boto


Would you buy a cheap bottle of wine, to drink, or marinade your meat? If so, then the imported cherry juice should not be considered expensive, seeing that it does serve a healthy purpose.


I wouldn't use cheap wine to marinate... and I don't use wine to cook either  
But regarding cherry juice, how much of that is enough to marinate meat to reduce polyamine? The organic cherry juice that I get which is of high quality is from Germany and it contains cane sugar. Would that be not so good?  

Speaking of frozen fruits... we do get "fresh" blueberries and cherries (imported of course) but they are not organic, so they are probably filled with pesticides. On the other hand, they sell super expensive organic berries in the freezer section of the supermarket. If the organic berries are flash frozen, would that take away whatever good is left in them?


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grey rabbit
Sunday, May 23, 2010, 1:57am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Andrea AWsec
I can get cod that is not previously frozen and is wild.


You live on the coast and near (if not in?) a major metro area, many, if not most of us live a pretty long way from any large bodies of water, and many of us live very far from a city where fish is flown in every day. I consider myself lucky to find wild caught anything, frozen just has to do.


“Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It’s perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we’ve learned something from yesterday.”

John Wayne's last words
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Cristina
Sunday, May 23, 2010, 10:39am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from narnia
I never knew that frozen foods were bad for me, due to polyamines. ...

What can I do?  This is very discouraging for me, as I want to follow the diet in its purest form.  I do eat freshly squeezed garlic on my steamed veggies and even the meats almost daily.  I consume seaweed sheets and occasionally, seaweed soup.  

Are these enough polyamine blockers to make up for all the frozen meats, or do I need to do something else?  Selling out house to move into the city with the fresh grocers is not something that's feasible in the near future.


Knowledge is power, lets use that power to lift us up, not to beat us down.  If you are doing the best you can with the means at your disposal, then, pat yourself in the back.  You are doing a great job.  If you are eating more than your recommended sizes and portions for polyamines enhacing food, then I would try to compensate by upping the recommended ratio of the blockers and maybe next time keep within what is recommended for me.  If a food item is listed as fresh, but all we can get is frozen (like for us fish!!!), then from now on, I make sure I have extra portions of plums, or more garlic or seaweed as you suggested!!

To me it sounds like what you are aleady doing is great!!  Continue focusing on 'purest' but celebrate whatever you can achieve with the means and knowledge at your disposal.  Great job!  

BTW, it is great you asked, it made me assess my worries and analyse it this way ... help each other ...  





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balletomane
Sunday, May 23, 2010, 10:44am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Cristina

If you are doing the best you can with the means at your disposal, then, pat yourself in the back.


You're right, Cristina. I also pat myself in the back even though all animal protein available and acceptable to me in quality is either frozen or canned. I compare my health with the state I was in before switching to BTD and the stark improvements show that even if I choose the lesser of the two evils, there has been a net gain in health. So I wouldn't worry too badly as long as I'm following the guidelines I get through BTD/GTD/SWAMI.


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Wholefoodie
Sunday, May 23, 2010, 11:18am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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It's not a perfect world and some compromising allows for the ability to follow the diet.

Organic, grass fed beef available to me is often frozen. I order fish from Alaska, where the waters are tested for impurities, all frozen. Organic chicken I can usually buy fresh.

I understood that much of the fish sold at the fish counter has been previously frozen. Ever see that sign "not previously frozen."  It's posted selectively.

Spending a fortune on food and supplements, adding organic juice to marinate everything (especially as a type O) is just not feasible.

I have pushed  budget to the max to stay on track and just can't do everything optimally and that's OK, cause it's a lot better than it was!!

Lisa


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MileHighRob
Sunday, May 23, 2010, 5:26pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I'll admit the whole polyamine talk is actually new to me.  Do frozen fruits also fall prey to this process or is it just meats and pre-packaged frozen meals?  
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Lola
Sunday, May 23, 2010, 11:48pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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it s the flash frozen protein....
polyamines are everywhere though.....balance is key


''Just follow the book, don't look for magic fixes to get you off the hook. Do the work.'' Dr.D.'98
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MileHighRob
Saturday, June 5, 2010, 3:54pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Lola
try prune juice

I've finally gone through my 32oz jar of prune juice and can now say that I've not only gotten used to the taste of it I've actually begun to really like it.  Initially I thought I'd finish off the quart then try dried prunes but I'm sticking with the 4oz daily serving diluted with an equal amount of water.  Yummy.

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MileHighRob  -  Saturday, June 5, 2010, 6:16pm
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Cristina
Monday, June 7, 2010, 6:28am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Lisa, I think you have spoken for most people in this forum, we have to do the best we can with the resources we have and enjoy it!!  You are doing a great job!!  




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strato
Monday, June 7, 2010, 7:40am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Frozen veggies and fine? I use tons of frozen spinach, broccoli and berries in my smoothies every morning.
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Possum
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I was thinking, that as there is nutrient & enzyme loss each minute after picking, not to mention cutting of vegetables, (i.e a slice or two of pumpkin or whatever & refrigerating the rest) that maybe frozen vegs are better??
As there are only two of us & even though we are both 0's, we sometimes use different vegs... So, unless I bought or picked fresh every day, we could not be getting optimal nutrition from our purchased vegs once they got to be a few days old (& also who really  knows how long they sit on the truck or in the shop before I buy them...I always recall my FiL suggesting I "get fresh carrots from the garden" as the lot I was about to use "were yesterday's..."
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Marc121
Saturday, August 3, 2013, 4:26pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Local fishermans just add ice on the container before selling there fresh catch then delivered quickly to the market every morning where I buy. Is it consider flash frozen? How does or how can a polyamine be called bad when it occured?


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Lloyd
Saturday, August 3, 2013, 4:46pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Marc121
Local fishermans just add ice on the container before selling there fresh catch then delivered quickly to the market every morning where I buy. Is it consider flash frozen? How does or how can a polyamine be called bad when it occured?


No, in that case the ice is just a form of refrigeration.

Quoted Text
Flash freezing refers to the process in various industries whereby objects are quickly frozen by subjecting them to cryogenic temperatures, or in direct contact with Liquid nitrogen at -320.8F or -196°C.
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Marc121
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ty sir


What has surprised me? What has touched me? What has inspired me?  
              
We are closer than we think   , keep pushing                                     

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