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genetically modified wheat  This thread currently has 597 views. Print Print Thread
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JoanneO
Tuesday, September 30, 2008, 7:35pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I believe I have been preaching false doctrine.  I have for years since starting BTD in Jan. 04, been telling people to stay away from wheat because of the lectins that do harm to intestines and allow undigested proteins to get into to blood stream and do damage to other body parts.  When they asked why wheat today is so toxic and yet wheat of the past was "safe" even a revered staple, I would say something about genetic modification because that was my impression.    But....a search online revealed to me that the hard winter red and spring wheats currently in our food culture are not genetically modified but highly hybridized. Currently there has been developed a genetic wheat from the hybridized ones, that is resistant to Round UP that Monsanto is trying to push, but is not on the market yet.  Some safety groups are fighting it, thank goodness.
  
So, the harm that wheat does to us now and for the last 30 -40 years is really about over use of gluten and startch by way of putting it into literally every processed food on the market in many different ways.


I want more imput from those who know more about this than I do.  I want to strenghten my arguments.    


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Maria Giovanna
Tuesday, September 30, 2008, 7:43pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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Alas, there is also genetic weakness fot celiac diseases common in certain genotypes and in some ethnic groups as Sarahawi of North Africa, so the hybrids have more gluten and are more harmful, but for a good number of persons wheat would be toxic however. About Monsanto and processed food I agree strongly and much more !
Maria Giovanna


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TJ
Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 3:13am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Kyosha Nim
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True, modern wheat has much more gluten than even 100 years ago.  Genetic engineering isn't necessary to increase the gluten content, which is desirable because it makes for better texture in our baked goods.

You are still correct that the gluten can cause a leaky gut, and gluten levels have increased faster than we can adjust to the change.  Still gluten isn't the only baddie in wheat: you also have wheat germ agglutinin, which binds with insulin receptors (causing weight gain and blood sugar issues), among other unpleasant things.  WGA is present in pre-hybrid wheats.
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Caz B
Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 6:25am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from TJ

You are still correct that the gluten can cause a leaky gut, and gluten levels have increased faster than we can adjust to the change.  Still gluten isn't the only baddie in wheat: you also have wheat germ agglutinin, which binds with insulin receptors (causing weight gain and blood sugar issues), among other unpleasant things.  WGA is present in pre-hybrid wheats.


Drive, do you know if this also applies to spelt or just wheat?  The last couple of weeks it has finally   dawned on me just how much I need to heal my gut.  I am using a small amount of spelt at the moment to ease myself off my high carb/wheat diet.  


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Rebecca_C
Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 7:42am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Hybridisation is a form of genetic engineering.  For example, in cattle crossing one species with another subtely changes some expressions of temperament and their ability to cope with circumstances.  This essentially reduces the variability in nature through muddling the gene pool and thereby potentially losing some of the valuable traits that the "Pure" ones have.

An example is the american bison - there is a hypothesis that there are no pure bisons left in the wild.  All have been hybridised to some extent.  Another is the Poll Hereford.  Some theorise that Prince Charles' herd in England is the only pure one left in the world.  That means that we have potentially lost all of the great aspects that only purebreds of those species have.

Hybridisation can thus cause higher gluten levels because genes from one species are introduced to those of another.  Think about tomatoes.  Most of the ones you buy at the supermarket are hybrids - bred to be bigger and jucier than the ones of old.  Taste one of those, then taste a heirloom variety that has never been hybridised.  The flavour difference will amaze you.


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Caz B
Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 7:51am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Rebecca, do you grow your own heirloom tomatoes?  Now I know what to suggest to my friend who is about to start her own vegie patch  


Personality test ESTJ

Planning to overcome Asthma and Adrenal Fatigue with SWAMI.  

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John 14:6 - Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
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Rebecca_C
Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 10:29am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Yep, we have tomatoes, beans, old varieties of beetroot, carrots and snow peas.  If your friend is interested, have a look at Eden Seeds.  They are great.


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Caz B
Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 10:36am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Thanks Rebecca, I will let her know.


Personality test ESTJ

Planning to overcome Asthma and Adrenal Fatigue with SWAMI.  

Husband 49yrs, A+ Sec * DD 19yrs, A+ Non * DD 14yrs O

John 14:6 - Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
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TJ
Friday, October 3, 2008, 6:16pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Caz B
Drive, do you know if this also applies to spelt or just wheat?  The last couple of weeks it has finally   dawned on me just how much I need to heal my gut.  I am using a small amount of spelt at the moment to ease myself off my high carb/wheat diet.  

I've never heard of spelt having such a lectin.  It's possible, but I doubt it.  Unsprouted spelt is fine for B and O secretors, whereas unsprouted wheat isn't.  The sprouting process destroys the WGA.

Quoted from Rebecca_C
Hybridisation is a form of genetic engineering.

Rebecca, I'll have to respectfully disagree here.  Cross-breeding different subspecies is something that can happen without any human involvement.  On the other hand, you have Alba, the fluorescent rabbit.  Alba is an entirely unnatural organism, and a good example of genetic engineering.  She was created by inserting jellyfish DNA into a rabbit.
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Ribbit
Friday, October 3, 2008, 7:40pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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DH extracted GFP (green fluorescent protein mentioned in the Wiki article) when he was at University of Miami.  They injected the GFP from coral (Cnidarian phylum, same as the above-mentioned jellyfish) into zebra fish.  Held under a black light, the zebra fish glowed.  Sometimes the gene would express itself in the fin, sometimes in the stomach, sometimes in the tail.  The fish were weak.  His doctoral thesis was on Green Fluorescent Proteins in Cnidarians.  One of the talks he gave at UM was called Mr. Green Genes.

Hybridization happens in my garden, or at least there is that potential.  Genetic modification is different from hybridization.  I won't inject fish genes into wheat (nor would I want to for the sake of those poor souls who have fish allergies) even if it means bugs don't eat the wheat.  But I can make my own squmpkins (not that I would want to, I just accidentally did it once) by planting squash and pumpkins too close to one another.


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Caz B
Friday, October 3, 2008, 9:57pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from TJ

I've never heard of spelt having such a lectin.  It's possible, but I doubt it.  Unsprouted spelt is fine for B and O secretors, whereas unsprouted wheat isn't.  The sprouting process destroys the WGA.




Thanks Drive.  I saw my naturopath on Wednesday and asked her if I was to choose which should I use, spelt or oats, and she said spelt.  It had something to do with the spelt gluten having a shorter chain something or other (can you tell I'm not highly educated and have brain fog here?  ) and the oats had a longer one.  The spelt would be gentler on my insides.   


Personality test ESTJ

Planning to overcome Asthma and Adrenal Fatigue with SWAMI.  

Husband 49yrs, A+ Sec * DD 19yrs, A+ Non * DD 14yrs O

John 14:6 - Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
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italybound
Monday, October 6, 2008, 3:36am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from TJ
... On the other hand, you have Alba, the fluorescent rabbit.  Alba is an entirely unnatural organism, and a good example of genetic engineering.  She was created by inserting jellyfish DNA into a rabbit.


http://www.elisidman.com/nature_of_neptune/2008/01/alba-the-fluore.html

Wild!!

Quoted from Caz B
spelt or oats...my naturopath ....said spelt...something to do with the spelt gluten having a shorter chain something or other ...and the oats had a longer one.  The spelt would be gentler on my insides.   


Tho if wheat truly bothers you, you may not be able to tolerate spelt ether. I'll keep my fingers crossed for ya tho.  



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Caz B
Monday, October 6, 2008, 4:37am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from italybound


Tho if wheat truly bothers you, you may not be able to tolerate spelt ether. I'll keep my fingers crossed for ya tho.  


Thanks Italy

I admit to having my doubts as to whether I can tolerate spelt.  I think it will become more obvious the more I improve my diet.  My hope is to just use it short term while I am weaning myself off wheat and dairy.  I have only been truly wheat free for 2 wks now - feels good that I'm actually sticking to it even during school holidays and all the socialising and outings that go with that.

I keep thinking to myself "6 months to heal my gut and then I will start assimilating my iron better".  Once I'm off it for that long I'm hoping to never want to touch the stuff again - probably wishful thinking - but hey, it doesn't hurt to aim high and be positive - something that I'm finding a little easier now that spring is here for us and we're getting some sun - yay!


Personality test ESTJ

Planning to overcome Asthma and Adrenal Fatigue with SWAMI.  

Husband 49yrs, A+ Sec * DD 19yrs, A+ Non * DD 14yrs O

John 14:6 - Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
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Mayflowers
Monday, October 6, 2008, 1:46pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Ribbit
Monday, October 6, 2008, 2:24pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Photobucket

Photobucket

Isn't it beautiful?  That top one is coral.  I don't remember the Latin name for it--I used to know--and DH isn't around.  I'd post the pictures of the zebra fish, but I don't know if it's legal, so I better not.  DH got a patent on the RFP (red fluorescent protein), but there was some huge legal something-or-other with University of Miami about some of the royalties (they get most of it, grrr) so I better not even post the picture.

Ah, here's a red one:

Photobucket


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TJ
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Looks like somebody had a problem with the pics anyway.
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footprints.
Tuesday, October 7, 2008, 5:12am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Hello all BTD's.
Since we are on the subject here of wheat, I have developed an intolerance to wheat and wheat gluten and have to be careful not to eat it and avoid it at all costs. I would like to know if the ezekial breads made by natural life foods would be okay to eat since the grains are sprouted? I know that Dr. D advises for type A's that sprouted wheat bread is okay since the lectins(gluten) are destroyed in the sprouting process. Does anyone else who has a celiac problem ever eat the ezekial bread? I really like it cause it has sustenance to it.
I also found at my local krogers a bagel and cereal brand that is geared toward folks who have food allergies, especially gluten intolerance. I get it in the natural food isles. I find that to be very convenient, didn't know a food company made special foods for folks like us. That is quite nice.
Rveryone take care.
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Ribbit
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Quoted from TJ
Looks like somebody had a problem with the pics anyway.


Oh. Wait.  I might have accidentally done that.  I went back to photobucket and deleted the pictures, thinking they would stay here.  Oh, well.  I'll go post them again later when I have the time.


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Lola
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Quoted Text
for type A's that sprouted wheat bread is okay since the lectins(gluten) are destroyed in the sprouting process.

if you are celiac and have a noticeable wheat intolerance, you should avoid all gluten products.
sprouting only gets rid of the WGA and not the gluten.


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C_Sharp
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Quoted from Ribbit
DH got a patent on the RFP (red fluorescent protein),


I noticed that this years Nobel prize in chemistry went to some marine biologists (Osamu Shimomura, Martin Chalfie and Roger Tsien) for isolating GFP (green fluorescent protein) in jellyfish.

Besides the fame and glory the prize provides $1,400,000 dollars.

Just a little difference in color ...


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Ribbit
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I just read this to DH and he said, "Oh, yeah.  Their work lead to my PhD.  I'm surprised they didn't give it to the guys who cloned the protein."


ISTJ, BTD since 5/05.  Battling chronic Lyme disease since ~1985.

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Schluggell
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Quoted from JoanneO
...a search online revealed to me that the hard winter red and spring wheats currently in our food culture are not genetically modified but highly hybridized...


By definition: Hybridization, by means of artificial manipulation {such as man's crossing species from different bioregions or continents or F1 hybrids} is a weak Genetic Modification...
Unlike the gradual species deviation in natural hybridization that develops the various genus of a specie....



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italybound
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[quote=973  I'd post the pictures of the zebra fish, but I don't know if it's legal, [/quote]

why wouldn't it be?  



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Ribbit
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Ummmmm, well, because I know some of what they were doing at UM was sort of under the radar you might say.  I mean, UM knew about it, but...Maybe it would be safer not to.  UM might own those pictures, is what I'm saying.  Sure, they're on my computer, but maybe they're not supposed to be.  Does that make any sense?


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