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BTD Forums    Diet and Nutrition    Eat Right 4 Your Type  ›  Vitamin K Foods & Blood Thinners
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Vitamin K Foods & Blood Thinners  This thread currently has 582 views. Print Print Thread
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Michele
Thursday, December 14, 2006, 1:47am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Thursday morning I went in for a minor surgery, to smooth out a torn meniscus.  Two days on crutches, running in a month.  

I came out of surgery being told they found a micro-fracture in my femur, and 6 weeks on crutches.

Then, I developed blood clots behind my knee and in my calf.  Bedrest, injections and warfarin (rat poison).  I am now confined to bed until further notice.  

Because I don't want to take rat poison forever, I started a search about alternative medicines.  What I found on diet is that you shouldn't eat alot of Vitamin K foods if you're on bood thinners.  Here's a list of Vit K foods:

Kale, 1 c. raw
Swiss chard, 1 c. raw
Collard greens, 1/2 c. cooked
Spinach, 1/2 c. cooked
Brussels sprouts, 5 sprouts
Watercress, 3 c. raw
Endive, 2 c. raw chopped
Scallion, raw, 2/3 c. chopped
Broccoli, 1/2 c. cooked
Coleslaw with dressing, 3/4 c.
Cabbage, 2/3 c. cooked
Asparagus, 7 spears, cooked

My husband said since I started the BTD I have had more health problems than ever.  I kind of have to agree with him.  This has really thrown me for a loop.  He's convinced that my diet and the herbs I was taking, including Bromelain and NAG glucosamine.  I totally disagree, but I look at the list of food and it is mostly beneficials.

Has anyone had to work with this diet and blood thinners?  Has anyone gotten off blood thinners with alternative methods?

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Michele  -  Thursday, December 14, 2006, 1:48am
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resting
Thursday, December 14, 2006, 5:06pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

probable non-sec
Sam Dan
Posts: 1,797
Gender: Male
Location: Timmins, Ontario, Canada
Age: 67
Michele,

whoever put you on warfin should be shot .... fact: as an 0 we have thin enough blood already. warfin does not heal a blood clot ... just thins the blood ... stupid, stupid ... is what your docs are.  If they put you 'on' warfin - ask them for the protocol to get you 'off' warfin.  Warfin is the last-resort for blood thinners because of its multiple side-effects ........... never the first!

BTD is not meant to take like an alternative to drugs ...

drugs are BBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD (and deadly) NEWS!! perhaps, your hubby would prefer you dead .... if he bitches - ask him to take a hike!

The greatest blood thinner of all is raw garlic.  If you wish to heal, give magnetic energy a try ... google: Philpott magnet  you'll get thousands of hits

John

John


“The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane.” – Marcus Aurelius

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Michele
Thursday, December 14, 2006, 5:28pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Yes, I agree, drugs are bad and I don't like taking them.  That said, I'm not really in a position to refuse right now, as my situation is quite dangerous and I'm confined to bed.  I don't want to be on it any longer than I have to, but to tell my doctor I want to eat garlic and take Vitamin E rather than his protocol to get me over this hump, doesn't seem exactly smart either.

As soon as I get over this hump, I will be pushing the alternatives.  
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Thursday, December 14, 2006, 5:56pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sam Dan
Posts: 1,797
Gender: Male
Location: Timmins, Ontario, Canada
Age: 67
Michele,

there are many factors that affect blood coagulation.  Warfin is a bad, (did I say 'bad'?) shortcut.  Ask a specialist to find another way than this.  I was not joking about the magnets ... Wm. Philpott was a neurologist ...

This is no game .... it's not about garlic vs warfin ... both may not be appropriate.  Convalescence should have you rebounding + several nutrients.  Right now though, perhaps Kniepp therapy and acupuncture might prove more effective.  I would certainly go for TCM before any reliance on warfin.  

Get expert guidance though, someone who is reachable ....

John


“The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane.” – Marcus Aurelius

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Michele
Thursday, December 14, 2006, 7:03pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Right now I can't go out and look for alternatives or get acupuncture, or other therapy.  If I move, I might die.  When I stand up, my leg feels like it will explode.  I appreciate your comments, and I will ask if there is anything else besides warfarin.  Right now I don't believe it is a shortcut, it may just be saving my life.  Yes, you've said it's bad and I'm telling you I am bedridden and don't have alot of choices right now.  Your comments seem a bit insensitive to my situation.

I'm more interested in what to do AFTER I get over this hump, and specifically asked about Vitamin K rich foods being on my beneficial list, but they are foods to be careful with when you're having clotting problems.
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Thursday, December 14, 2006, 7:29pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sam Dan
Posts: 1,797
Gender: Male
Location: Timmins, Ontario, Canada
Age: 67
Hi Michele,

I purposely  wrote the way I did because (unlike you) I believe warfin to be the CAUSE of the EXTREMNESS of your plight.  If you are so ill that you believe death-is-a-knockin, get thee to a hospital and have a specialist put you on meds via an IV.  Warfin will not take you over this hump, but it will make your molehill into a mountain.

John


“The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane.” – Marcus Aurelius

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Peppermint Twist
Thursday, December 14, 2006, 8:11pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

Gatherer; iNfj; BTD/GTD aficionado; lost 97 lbs
Kyosha Nim
Posts: 11,030
Gender: Female
Location: Florida
Age: 52
Michele, I preface everything I am about to say with a hearty CHECK WITH YOUR DOCTOR before changing anything s/he has told you to do based on anything you read in this thread.  Also, maybe get a second opinion if you can, because I agree with John that Warfarin is serious business and if there is ANY natural way that they could thin out your blood, such as the vitamin E, bromelain or whatever, without Warfarin, it should be tried, imho.  Even perhaps mega-doses of certain fish oils might work.  I don't know, but you went in there pretty healthy except for the knee tear thing and now it seems that their cure is worse than the disease, as often happens when one agrees to let western medicine "do their worst" (literally) and try to help with something.  I speak from bitter personal experience with the healthcare system, so I'm really "feeling you" as the slang goes.

That said, yes many beneficials are rich in O-friendly vitamins such as K, so if you are dealing with blood clots, you will want to limit those bennies that are high in K during that time.  Just as when I was dealing with a second-degree burn, I chose to supplement with Vitamin E, even though E is a supplement that a healthy O should typically avoid.  Sometimes, when we are dealing with a specific disease, we have to temporarily (or longer, if the problem is a chronic challenge) customize and individualize our diet in a way that may contradict what the BTD recommends for most healthy members of our own blood group.  When I had my burn, for instance, I really optimized my O diet to mostly beneficials, ate a lot of beneficials that are healing for burns, yet I did also take the vitamin E because I figured its beneficial qualities for burns temporarily eclipsed/overrode the concern about it thinning our already thin blood.

So, since you have developed these post-surgical blood clots, you do need to limit your K-containing bennies just temporarily until this resolves (it sounds like this won't be a chronic thing, happily, it is a post-surgical complication that hopefully will completely resolve...right?).  As far as Warfarin goes, again, I would definitely ask the doctor if you could try using natural substances such as vitamin E or bromelain or fish oil or SOMETHING other than such a serious drug.  If he says no, I might ask for a second opinion.  For all I know, you might absolutely need Warfarin, but I'm with John, it is definitely something to pipe up and ask about.

Best of luck to you and I'm so sorry that you went in for something relatively simple and have had these complications.  Hang in there, kiddo!!!

(((HUG)))


"If you are on one of Dr. D's diets and it isn't joyful, you aren't doing it right." - moi

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Revision History (4 edits)
Michele  -  Thursday, December 14, 2006, 8:28pm
Michele  -  Thursday, December 14, 2006, 8:18pm
Michele  -  Thursday, December 14, 2006, 8:15pm
Michele  -  Thursday, December 14, 2006, 8:14pm
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jayney-O
Thursday, December 14, 2006, 9:40pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
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Michele,
your husband's  idea that the btd may have brought on this situation....well, a torn miniscus? hmmmm, I don't think so.  He just wants what's best for you....so sorry to hear about your problem....don't eat those foods with so much vit.K, good thought. I agree that you might ask your doc if there is a safer med. Blessings to you, and get well soon.
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